James Garner

carpy said:
Garner isn't slow either so I'm not sure why you keep commenting as if he is. I'm not suggesting he's rapid but I've never watched him and thought he looks painfully slow.
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I have not said that he is painfully slow but as you have watched him play tell me who is the slowest out of Garner, Fred and Scott?
 
Bondi77 said:
I always think of box to box as a midfielder who can score goals and Scott fits the bill but Fred simply cannot shoot a ball FFS!
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Neither of these players are going to be a Gerrard or a Scholes. McTominay's physical stature and more consistent technical skills make him great for running up the pitch with or without the ball and just adding general momentum and physicality if he's allowed to do that. But Fred is easily the better ball winner and runner, and basically has more to his all round game bar heading and goalscoring. Fred wins the ball, passes sideways to McTominay and we're out of ideas. Fred wins the ball, passes sideways to Garner or Rice, then moves up because he's allowed to.
 
Bondi77 said:
I have not said that he is painfully slow but as you have watched him play tell me who is the slowest out of Garner, Fred and Scott?
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I don't know between McTominay and Garner and neither do you. I do know Garner was faster than McTominay in those speed stats Lukaku put on Twitter though.
 
Bondi77 said:
I have not said that he is painfully slow but as you have watched him play tell me who is the slowest out of Garner, Fred and Scott?
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Garner and McTominay are probably similar in terms of speed, Fred's obviously faster than both. I feel Garner would make a much better partner of Fred though.
 
Mctominay can drive forward up the pitch and make opponent get yellow card, but it's very rarely.
On goal scoring, James Garner is as good as Mctominay for shooting outside the penalty area.
On passing ability, James Garner is obviously better on passing range, key pass and free kick.
On Defensive ability, in my opinion, James Garner is much better in tackling, intercepting, and cutting ball from danger area. Aerial ability is very closed.
 
After witnessing today’s game and watching our youngsters, I think Garner is ready for our first team and he can offer something very different than we have now. We do need to add another CB to help the case.
 
TheReligion said:
You must be buzzing about Elanga mate
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Sure thing! I actually think he has adapted better than Amad in the first team football at the moment. Amad needs to get used to the high tempo of this level. Decision making and the perception must be quicker. He will get there.
 
bsCallout said:
Just a reminder, this is a Garner thread, not a thread to talk about Fred and McT.

Back to Garner, he offers something none of our CMs do and would be great in the squad next year, he seems to deal with the physicality of the Championship well too.
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Learn to read then. I was directly replying to a comment which was about them both players being in direct competition with Garner.
 
Alemar said:
It’s likely that Garner may get Matic minutes next year, if we don’t buy a good CDM.
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I'm all for it actually. I'd rather he get 10-15 games here and learn from his teammates. Than warm the bench at a relegation fodder club.
 
Ekeke said:
I think McTominay and speed is one of the least important things for a passing midfielder
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Speed or more importantly acceleration over the first three, 4 meters and dynamism is very important aspect of midfielders game. That's where you win important duels without being tall and strong, that's how you cover for your teammates when they lose the ball, very important pressing-wise and forcing other team to make a mistake.

Going forward super important to be able to quickly drop off and make yourself available for a pass and angle for a quick one two, or just to have a space and time to get take a good pass yourself.

That's why we struggle a lot with Matic and McTominay more often than not. With Pogba it can be also very tough but he showed to have some excellent world class games from deep too being just superb passer and playing with incredible vision and ball covering when he's not too lazy and have an easy escape. However he needs legs and himself be fit and motivated.

With Garner I don't think we're getting a fast player, certainly not but he's got that good acceleration over the first couple of meters and if he builds his stamina and strength further we'll have very good midfielder playing at pivot providing a lot of things I mentioned to be crucial to be playing there.

He will probably end up being as fast as Herrera if we directly compare them in the end but not even for Ander it was that important to be fast nor that strong to match Kante's defensive statistics in interception/tackles in a season or two.

Think in current set up he would be easily best paired with Fred who would provide immense workrate and and overall great defensive contribution along with some quick short passing bewteen the lines while Garner more vision, passing range and perhaps shooting ability/goal threat. I think we would be more solid and get more control and certainly more creative than any combination I can think of on the paper.

But we'll have to see at preseason if it can work or if Ole takes a gamble and not sign a CM/CDM we desperately need to give Garner a chance. Still a huge step up but looking at Matcior McTominay don't think he would do much worse.
 
Poborsky's hair said:
Speed or more importantly acceleration over the first three, 4 meters and dynamism is very important aspect of midfielders game. That's where you win important duels without being tall and strong, that's how you cover for your teammates when they lose the ball, very important pressing-wise and forcing other team to make a mistake.

Going forward super important to be able to quickly drop off and make yourself available for a pass and angle for a quick one two, or just to have a space and time to get take a good pass yourself.

That's why we struggle a lot with Matic and McTominay more often than not. With Pogba it can be also very tough but he showed to have some excellent world class games from deep too being just superb passer and playing with incredible vision and ball covering when he's not too lazy and have an easy escape. However he needs legs and himself be fit and motivated.

With Garner I don't think we're getting a fast player, certainly not but he's got that good acceleration over the first couple of meters and if he builds his stamina and strength further we'll have very good midfielder playing at pivot providing a lot of things I mentioned to be crucial to be playing there.

He will probably end up being as fast as Herrera if we directly compare them in the end but not even for Ander it was that important to be fast nor that strong to match Kante's defensive statistics in interception/tackles in a season or two.

Think in current set up he would be easily best paired with Fred who would provide immense workrate and and overall great defensive contribution along with some quick short passing bewteen the lines while Garner more vision, passing range and perhaps shooting ability/goal threat. I think we would be more solid and get more control and certainly more creative than any combination I can think of on the paper.

But we'll have to see at preseason if it can work or if Ole takes a gamble and not sign a CM/CDM we desperately need to give Garner a chance. Still a huge step up but looking at Matcior McTominay don't think he would do much worse.
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Did you never watch us with Keane, Carrick and Scholes? They're no faster than Garner is
 
Ekeke said:
Did you never watch us with Keane, Carrick and Scholes? They're no faster than Garner is
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it's like you didn't read my post, Garner is fast enough over the first few meters to play there. That's my whole point. Just need a bit more athletic partner in the best case scenario. Otherwise it will look like this today...
 
Poborsky's hair said:
it's like you didn't read my post, Garner is fast enough over the first few meters to play there. That's my whole point. Just need a bit more athletic partner in the best case scenario. Otherwise it will look like this today...
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This was said about Kroos but in midfield if you can position yourself and have a very good first touch then you don't need to be athletic.
 
I think the best option is get him loaned out for 1 more year then come back to directly replace Matic in the squad.
 
Does he have a contract that expires end of next year ? I hope we don’t mess his renewal
 
Tallis said:
Does he have a contract that expires end of next year ? I hope we don’t mess his renewal
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Expires in June 2022 but United have an option for an additional year.
Hopefully he goes on loan to a premier league team where he will play the majority of the time, if that’s an option. Put a recall clause in for January if he doesn’t hit a specified number of minutes/appearances and if he’s being underutilized loan him back to Forest where they love him and he’d certainly start.
Activate one year option next summer and then hand him a new contract if he continued his progression over the course of the season. If so, slot him into the squad in place of Matic for 2022-2023.
 
Garner needs to be integrated into the 1st team next season. If he can get stronger he has all the hallmarks of an outstanding midfielder, he also a leader and a great reader of the game. It's time to move on matic to create room for Garner. He has far more talent than McT and Fred. Our most important signing should be a new DM who will play with Garner and McT.
 
According to TransferMarkt, Matic (1,996) and McTominay (3,424) have a combined season total minutes in all competitions of 5,420 minutes. I would like to see these minutes go to Garner and Mejbri. For the amount of games McT plays, he's not consistent enough. Whilst I don't think Fred is very much better than McT, at least his contributions are more consistent. McT has 4/5/6s then the random 8/10 performance where everybody on here goes crazy and says he's our midfield saviour before returning to his 4-6/10 performances for an extended period.
 
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Garner is a little bit like Gilmour with Chelsea: you can't count on him to perform up to his level unless assign with him a world class "shield" player like Kante. The situation also applied to Angel Gomez back then: yes he was super talent , but just can't perform without the customized setup, which has been too luxury for a youth player . On the other hand, Greenwood can perform on his own. He can dribble, versatile to play at any attack positions, without the ball he can press well and distract the defense with his run. So the type of Greenwood would be much easier to break through into the 1st team.
 
afatzp said:
Garner is a little bit like Gilmour with Chelsea: you can't count on him to perform up to his level unless assign with him a world class "shield" player like Kante. The situation also applied to Angel Gomez back then: yes he was super talent , but just can't perform without the customized setup, which has been too luxury for a youth player . On the other hand, Greenwood can perform on his own. He can dribble, versatile to play at any attack positions, without the ball he can press well and distract the defense with his run. So the type of Greenwood would be much easier to break through into the 1st team.
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I'd agree with what you have said as Garner needs a WC DM along side him. Keane had it with Robson and Ince, Scholes had it with Keane and Carrick had it with Scholes etc. IF we could get one of Ndidi/Rice/Bossumo it would transform this team and give the likes of Garner the chance to excel.
 
Mylock said:
I'd agree with what you have said as Garner needs a WC DM along side him. Keane had it with Robson and Ince, Scholes had it with Keane and Carrick had it with Scholes etc. IF we could get one of Ndidi/Rice/Bossumo it would transform this team and give the likes of Garner the chance to excel.
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None of Ndidi, Rice, Bissouma can be called "world class". None have a world cup medal, European cup, nor even a top league win.
 
We have to buy a world class holding midfielder to play with Garner, but there’s no need if we play McFred?! Doesn’t make any sense to me. I think a holding midfielder is a key position to fill this transfer window regardless of whether Garner stays with the first team or not next season.
 
Think he'll impress enough in preseason to be kept around, just hope it's at the expense of Matic rather than at the expense of a new DM.
 
P-Nut said:
Think he'll impress enough in preseason to be kept around, just hope it's at the expense of Matic rather than at the expense of a new DM.
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Would much rather he went out on loan again, 40 odd games in the Championship is much more useful for his development than a couple of league cup appearances. Gilmour at Chelsea was kept by them but then barely ever played, which is a waste as he could easily have gotten a full season of starts somewhere.
 
Hopefully he makes the grade and we sell Matic whilst also signing a proper DM.
 
jeepers said:
According to TransferMarkt, Matic (1,996) and McTominay (3,424) have a combined season total minutes in all competitions of 5,420 minutes. I would like to see these minutes go to Garner and Mejbri. For the amount of games McT plays, he's not consistent enough. Whilst I don't think Fred is very much better than McT, at least his contributions are more consistent. McT has 4/5/6s then the random 8/10 performance where everybody on here goes crazy and says he's our midfield saviour before returning to his 4-6/10 performances for an extended period.
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I wish people would stop trying to push Mejbri. He’s 18 and has a lot to learn
 
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