[Marwood]

He started 3 games, Partizan, Astana and AZ Alkmaar, he also made a sub appearance in the second game against Partizan

So we've got three games in Europa(in mostly weakened teams) and 8 mins in the Prem League.

As an 18 year old. Three years ago.

And this is what we're critiquing and using to say yeah let's be ok with selling him.

Sure don't rate him but there's nothing to comment on in terms of his appearances in our first team. It's needlessly negative stuff.

 

[TwoSheds]

This lad is saleable, not quite good enough for a top 4 team and almost certainly wants assurances about his game time that he won't get. No surprise he's being sold and will hopefully work out well for all parties. Should be a £20m player though, no less unless we get a massive sell on fee / cheap buyback clause or what have you.

 

[miked99]

Bizarre how much people are overrating him. Based on what? Having a half decent season in the Championship? Is that all it takes now?

If he wasn't a United player and we were going to sign him based on the above, this place would go mental.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Finally we are proactive on transfer market. He has talent but never will be more than rotation plsyer here (at best). We can get good fee so it is best time to sell.

 

[Marwood]

Bizarre how much people are overrating him. Based on what? Having a half decent season in the Championship? Is that all it takes now?

If he wasn't a United player and we were going to sign him based on the above, this place would go mental.

But we don't have to sign him. He's already here for free. That's the whole point of youth development.

Also we signed Dan James based on less and I think most felt it was worth a gamble.

 

[Cassidy]

So we've got three games in Europa(in mostly weakened teams) and 8 mins in the Prem League.

As an 18 year old. Three years ago.

And this is what we're critiquing and using to say yeah let's be ok with selling him.

Sure don't rate him but there's nothing to comment on in terms of his appearances in our first team. It's needlessly negative stuff.

No, don't put words in other peoples mouths. I answered a question.
If you want to know why I am ok with selling him, it has to do with watching plenty of his games on loan.
He is a good player, but not what we need and isn't good enough in my opinion, he has talent but not the mentality, mainly he does not impose himself on the game and that has been something I have seen over a number of years watching him.

I'm more livid we let Levitt go who in my opinion is a much better player

 

[Marwood]

No, don't put words in other peoples mouths. I answered a question.
If you want to know why I am ok with selling him, it has to do with watching plenty of his games on loan.
He is a good player, but not what we need and isn't good enough in my opinion, he has talent but not the mentality, mainly he does not impose himself on the game and that has been something I have seen over a number of years watching him.

I'm more livid we let Levitt go who in my opinion is a much better player

I didn't say you were judging him based on United appearances. I said "we" as in the discussion me and others were having about said appearances. Which to be fair you joined in.

He hasn't imposed himself on games yet you're right. Not at senior level anyway.

Dare I saw that's because you've been watching him at 20 and 21 years old?

How much authority can be expected of a midfielder at that age? I think you're asking too much.

This is the whole point of player and youth development. Of course he's not yet dictating games. It's a rare breed of midfielder who do that at his age.

The vast majority of young players need time and coaching. You don’t give them forever but equally you shouldn't write them off for not having things like authority on a game. Things that can only come with experience.

 

[Cassidy]

I didn't say you were judging him based on United appearances. I said "we" as in the discussion me and others were having about said appearances. Which to be fair you joined in.

He hasn't imposed himself on games yet you're right. Not at senior level anyway.

Dare I saw that's because you've been watching him at 20 and 21 years old?

How much authority can be expected of a midfielder at that age? I think you're asking too much.

This is the whole point of player and youth development. Of course he's not yet dictating games. It's a rare breed of midfielder who do that at his age.

The vast majority of young players need time and coaching. You don’t give them forever but equally you shouldn't write them off for not having things like authority on a game. Things that can only come with experience.

I have watched plenty of younger players impose themselves or get more involved in the game. He is passive by nature in the way he plays and he's been that way for a long time.
You need to have a certain mentality to make it at United and passivity in the midfield isn't it.

He may have a great career in the PL, I hope he does, its just my opinion that I don't think he will be good enough for us.

I have not written him off, I have simply said I don't think he will be good enough for United, as a viewer I am entitled to have that opinion, he may well prove me wrong and that's fine.

If you have a different opinion that's also fine, telling people what they shouldn't do though...

 

[Marwood]

I have watched plenty of younger players impose themselves or get more involved in the game. He is passive by nature in the way he plays and he's been that way for a long time.
You need to have a certain mentality to make it at United and passivity in the midfield isn't it.

He may have a great career in the PL, I hope he does, its just my opinion that I don't think he will be good enough for us.

I have not written him off, I have simply said I don't think he will be good enough for United, as a viewer I am entitled to have that opinion, he may well prove me wrong and that's fine.

If you have a different opinion that's also fine, telling people what they shouldn't do though...

He's 21. He hasn't done anything for a long time. Not convinced you've watched much of him for U23's if that's really your opinion.

I don't think I'm teing you what to do. I just disagree that a 19 and 20 year old CM should be expected to have authority and dictator qualities about his game at quite an already high level.

If you can list CM's who were doing so at that age I'd like to see it.

Because we've had incredible all time great midfielders at this club who weren't even playing at Championship level at the equivalent age.

 

[Cassidy]

He's 21. He hasn't done anything for a long time. Not convinced you've watched much of him for U23's if that's really your opinion.

I don't think I'm teing you what to do. I just disagree that a 19 and 20 year old CM should be expected to have authority and dictator qualities about his game at quite an already high level.

If you can list CM's who were doing so at that age I'd like to see it.

Because we've had incredible all time great midfielders at this club who weren't even playing at Championship level at the equivalent age.

I have. And you did tell me what to do, or at least what I should not do

He was good in the U23s many players have been
Again he is talented
Again I don't think he has what it takes to play in the midfield for United
Again I think Dylan Levitt and even Galbraith are better than him
Again you are entitled to disagree

 

[Litch]

I think we hated McFred that much that this lad for the fans was seen has one of the solutions to breaking that partnership up. The world turned a few times since ETH has arrived and the chances of him getting anywhere the first team is remote. We now have 5 players in front of him, 6 if you include Bruno and I’m sure we will continue to pursue Frankie even after the window has closed.

When would he play?

 

[Adnan]

It doesn't seem like he impressed ten Hag and it's good to see we've then made a quick decision to move him on with a buy back clause, according to Fabrizio Romano.

I think a new midfielder will be bought at some point, and we also have some very good young midfielders coming through the ranks. So I think it was a good decision to move him on with a sell on and buy back clause inserted.

 

[Adnan]

 

[VanDeBank]

Well you said he was shite in a United shirt. Sounds very similar to you not rating him.

Here's what he's played in a red shirt.

Prenier League: 1 minute in 2019 as a 17 year old.

Europa League: 83 minutes against Partizan, also 2019.

A handful of appearances here and there in pres season. Mostly as an 18 year old.

Maybe I've missed a 20 min app somewhere but you surely get my point.

He hasn't played. There's nothing to call shit.



One I think against Partizan. Unless I'm mistaken. Could have been an odd sub appearance on top of that here and there. Three years ago.

Yes and in the same post I said I thought he was good for Forest and deserved more chances before being sold. You're willfully leaving out context, even after having it pointed out to you.

Do you think he has been good in a United shirt? Did you see him come on under ETH or in Ole's last pre season and think "wow class" in the same way the consensus was surrounding Savage in pre season or Garnacho in his sub appearance?

If not, do you agree he was shit in a United shirt?

Again this doesn't mean his apps for us are a good gauge of his ability, but it doesn't magically mean he didn't play for us and wasn't shit.

 

[Marwood]

Yes and in the same post I said I thought he was good for Forest and deserved more chances before being sold. You're willfully leaving out context, even after having it pointed out to you.

Do you think he has been good in a United shirt? Did you see him come on under ETH or in Ole's last pre season and think "wow class" in the same way the consensus was surrounding Savage in pre season or Garnacho in his sub appearance?

If not, do you agree he was shit in a United shirt?

Again this doesn't mean his apps for us are a good gauge of his ability, but it doesn't magically mean he didn't play for us and wasn't shit.

I don't think anything about his time in a United shirt.

Because he's barely been in a United shirt.

That's my whole point. Ridiculous to form any opinion on 8 mins in the Premier league and three Europa games. When the lad was 18.

 

[TwoSheds]

I didn't say you were judging him based on United appearances. I said "we" as in the discussion me and others were having about said appearances. Which to be fair you joined in.

He hasn't imposed himself on games yet you're right. Not at senior level anyway.

Dare I saw that's because you've been watching him at 20 and 21 years old?

How much authority can be expected of a midfielder at that age? I think you're asking too much.

This is the whole point of player and youth development. Of course he's not yet dictating games. It's a rare breed of midfielder who do that at his age.

The vast majority of young players need time and coaching. You don’t give them forever but equally you shouldn't write them off for not having things like authority on a game. Things that can only come with experience.

We don't necessarily need midfielders that aren't a rare breed though. For the now we've got the likes of McT, Fred and Donny for that. And for the future I'd hope that we can find some rare breeds in the likes of Hannibal, Iqbal, Mainoo, Gore, maybe even Shoretire or Hansen. I think they're all more talented than Garner but just not as advanced in their development.

He's a great lad far as you can see and certainly has ability - easily a Prem player to my mind. I just don't think we need him and I don't think his value will increase sat on our bench, good time for everyone for him to move on. We should just ensure we get a decent price for him as he's a talented and versatile player at a good age. Everton or Leicester would be very lucky to have him for £20m.

 

[AaronRedDevil]

Buy back clause is probably the smartest thing united have done in a decade of selling.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Buy back clause is probably the smartest thing united have done in a decade of selling.

Probably our smartest sale overall in years! Actually selling a player after an impressive loan spell for a decent fee.

Usually we'd just let him become a nothing squad player before flogging him for 1 million.

 

[devilish]

Because the manager has seen him in training and decided that he won't be playing on a regular basis, if that weren't true he'd be staying and we'd be selling someone else.

McTomminay is the only midfielder we've got over 6ft. Whether people like it or not we need his size and physicality otherwise we're soft in the middle. He doesn't offer much else but he offers that, Garner isn't the same kind of player and the manager obviously feels Fred, Eriksen, VDB and Bruno are all ahead of him in that position.

I hope you're right and its not a matter of the Glazers cashing in to balance the books.

 

[VanDeBank]

I don't think anything about his time in a United shirt.

Because he's barely been in a United shirt.

That's my whole point. Ridiculous to form any opinion on 8 mins in the Premier league and three Europa games. When the lad was 18.

So you don't judge individual performances of players?
You've never submitted player ratings or commented on performances threads then?

and before you use a straw man, no I don't use his shite (albeit limited) performances to draw conclusion about Garner's overall quality, in fact it's the opposite.

But to pretend he never played or wasn't shite is a fantasy that's best confined to the Donny thread.

 

[Marwood]

So you don't judge individual performances of players?
You've never submitted player ratings or commented on performances threads then?

and before you use a straw man, no I don't use his shite (albeit limited) performances to draw conclusion about Garner's overall quality, in fact it's the opposite.

But to pretend he never played or wasn't shite is a fantasy that's best confined to the Donny thread.

I mean you literally said his performances in a United shirt were shite in a discussion about him being too good to sell or not.

If you weren't using his performances to say wether he's good enough why bring them up at all?

You're backtracking now.

I don't draw conclusions on 10 minutes of football. I judge a young player who I think has potential over half or a full season. Even then I think that's pretty short term.

You must be changing your mind on players on a game by game basis if you think Garners first team appearances for us are even worth mentioning.

 

[VanDeBank]

I mean you literally said his performances in a United shirt were shite in a discussion about him being too good to sell or not.

If you weren't using his performances to say wether he's good enough why bring them up at all?

You're backtracking now.

I don't draw conclusions on 10 minutes of football. I judge a young player who I think has potential over half or a full season. Even then I think that's pretty short term.

You must be changing your mind on players on a game by game basis if you think Garners first team appearances for us are even worth mentioning.

Again for the 3rd fecking time:

Yes, after stipulating that I thought he was good at Forest and deserved more chances before being sold, based on those performances and also in response to a question from someone regarding his minutes for United to which I gave the correct, factual answer.

I've restated this 3 times, yet you keep ignoring it and making the same flawed point.

edit: actually, you asked me that question, I said 300 minutes. Then you asked if I remembered the games or how he did in them
You're a funny guy, Sally.

 

[Kag]

I’d have wanted a higher fee (probably closer to £20 million), but this is an understandable sale. It’s the kind that Chelsea and Liverpool do really well. The reality is that Garner is currently sixth choice midfielder here at best, and we’ll still be looking for sign another midfielder next summer. Take the money and buy him back if and when he is the real deal. If he isn’t the real deal then we’ve done well to make a good profit off an academy graduate. Most importantly, Garner himself is getting a really good move.

 

[crossy1686]

I hope you're right and its not a matter of the Glazers cashing in to balance the books.

I doubt that, it would make more sense to renew his contract, play him then sell him for £50m in a season or two if that was the end game. There was this reaction when Gomes left also, not every player that comes through can play for United at the top level, and if they can we buy them back.

 

[devilish]

I doubt that, it would make more sense to renew his contract, play him then sell him for £50m in a season or two if that was the end game. There was this reaction when Gomes left also, not every player that comes through can play for United at the top level, and if they can we buy them back.

I retracted my complaint the moment I learnt that a buy back clause had been inserted in the deal

 

[NoPace]

Bizarre how much people are overrating him. Based on what? Having a half decent season in the Championship? Is that all it takes now?

If he wasn't a United player and we were going to sign him based on the above, this place would go mental.

Eh, he was one of the 3 exciting young players who helped make Forest the best team in the Champo. Johnson obviously has more potential (attitude not so sure about, he reacts to missed passes or not getting the ball real dickishly) and Spence probably too, but signing any of them for 15M would have been a fairly standard move.

 

[Gordon S]

Eh, he was one of the 3 exciting young players who helped make Forest the best team in the Champo. Johnson obviously has more potential (attitude not so sure about, he reacts to missed passes or not getting the ball real dickishly) and Spence probably too, but signing any of them for 15M would have been a fairly standard move.

Agreed, not sure if i have watched the same games as some on here. I thought he looked good whenever i saw him play last season. Good vision, good long range passing, really good set piece delivery, looks rather composed out there for a young player. Still lots of room for improvement of course but could easily see him develop into a really good player. Hopefully Romano is correct about the buy back clause.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Christ, the club did a good bit of business for a sale. 15 million for a player only proven at championship level isn’t bad, buy back too. He was good for Forest but he never wowed. His stock is high at the minute so you cash in. I’ll be very surprised if we’re buying him back in a few years mind. Doesn’t look special to me.

 

[MrBest]

Maybe ETH saw more in Savage and Zidane. Is the 15m guaranteed fee? Glad with the buy back, wonder how much that is? 50m?

 

[Adnan]

Christ, the club did a good bit of business for a sale. 15 million for a player only proven at championship level isn’t bad, buy back too. He was good for Forest but he never wowed. His stock is high at the minute so you cash in. I’ll be very surprised if we’re buying him back in a few years mind. Doesn’t look special to me.

I think it's important to be decisive in the decision making process when it comes to evaluating the youth players at the club. Garner at 21 years should either be part of the first team or be sold imo. And it seems the decision was made to move him on and that can only be a good thing for the development of the player, and our own approach to pushing through the next batch of youngsters. Chelsea are about to sell Billy Gilmour to Brighton for £9m according to the telegraph, and he's someone that was seen to be a more established midfielder in comparison to Garner, as well as being a Scottish international.

I personally hope there's a sell on clause inserted in the deal rather than a buy back. I wish the lad the best and hope he does well at Everton.

 

[Yagami]

Everton really don't have a clue about any of our players.

First Donny, now Garner. Two championship level players they've wasted time on. Just a shame they didn't buy Donny.

 

[Alemar]

Officially left Manchester United now. Thank you and good bye Jimmy.

 

[Robertd0803]

Still a bit miffed about this one.

 

[lex talionis]

Still a bit miffed about this one.

Agreed. Absurd that we're keeping McTominay, who's had four seasons to develop into something, and we get rid of a younger player who has shown more potential than McTominay at the same age and is already better on the ball than the Scot who doesn't even play in midfield for his national team.