Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now

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Clique said:
Statistically Martial being inconsistent is a myth

Let's compare him internally - with Rashford - given that the supporter population see them as rivals (unfairly if I may so add). But be that as it may,

For this season, in the premier league -

Both Martial and Rashford have played 31 games, scored 17 goals and while Rashford has 7 assists, Martial has 6 assists.

Using whoscored statistics, I tried to see if who between the two of them were inconsistent, if at all.

You'll notice that Martial's rating has a ever so smaller band for a good chunk of his performance, while Rashford has a slightly larger band (0.02) - honestly there's nothing in it.

You'll have to view these stats within the context that we've had performance issues within the team, our midfield wasn't giving our attackers enough to work with for most matches till Bruno was signed.

It is also relevant that both of these players are quite young (24 and 22 respectively) and are getting used to a system. While this analysis unfortunately won't dissuade any of our supporters to stop the myth, it hopefully puts his performance in context. We're a young and learning team, we do have slight inconsistencies - but overall our attackers have done an admirable job this year and if nothing else both Martial and Rashford deserve more time basis what they've shown us this year.

The detailed results are as follows:
ParameterMartialRashford
Average Rating7.367.35
Std deviation of rating0.870.89
# of matches - poor performance (Rating < Mean - 1 SD)5 (16%)5 (16%)
# of matches - great performance (Rating > Mean + 1 SD)5 (16%)6 (19%)

Just for assuring that what we're seeing with these two isn't too far for Best-in-class. I ran the same analysis for Sadio Mane and the results are as follows

Average rating - 7.49
Std. deviation - 0.80 (~0.07 and 0.09 better than Martial and Rashford - meaning Sadio more often than not had a smaller performance range set)
# of matches (outside of boundary - lower end) - 8
# of matches (outside of boundary - higher end) - 6

Taken in absolute terms, Sadio Mane had more poor performance in this year than either of Martial and Rashford. But when he performs, he performs within a very narrow range.

Not sure if this all makes sense to everyone or I just wasted a half an hour of my life - but this myth of inconsistency has to be laid to rest.
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I'm not saying Martial is inconsistent or even a bad player, but I think Greenwood's ceiling is higher and will be a better striker.
 
Goku23 said:
Thats true didnt think if him rotating with Rashford I think thats the least of oir worries though we have Greenwood who can be striker or winger if need be priority is CB and DM for me after Sancho is done
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I agree but I fear the board won't see it that way. Matic has 2 years left so they will stick with him till at least next year. Ole will argue he doesn't have any decent backup to Bruno so we're more like to go for Grealish. As for a CB, I'm still not convinced we will get one despite the rumours about Gabriel. Smalling is coming back since Roma won't pay up and if they Glazers can save money, they won't see why we need another CB. Personally, I do hope we sell him to the highest bidder as he seems to play better abroad than for us.
 
manuchamp88 said:
I'm not saying Martial is inconsistent or even a bad player, but I think Greenwood's ceiling is higher and will be a better striker.
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I agree.but if we do that and we have Sancho on the right then ole has a big decision to make either rashford or martial has to be benched
 
Sorry not Jadon related, but it seems that some of our supporters have seem to have forgotten that Daniel James lost his father shortly before his move.

If that does not effect you as a young as a 22 young male adult than obviously you would have some sort of psychological illness.

He came across to me as someone who was running on pure adrenalin when he first came.

We will see in the up and coming season if he can regroup and kick on
 
imamuppet said:
Sorry not Jadon related, but it seems that some of our supporters have seem to have forgotten that Daniel James lost his father shortly before his move.

If that does not effect you as a young as a 22 young male adult than obviously you would have some sort of psychological illness.

He came across to me as someone who was running on pure adrenalin when he first came.

We will see in the up and coming season if he can regroup and kick on
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That's fair enough but it appears to me that this level is a bit too far for him.
But he deserves time and hoping he improves next season.
 
Getting 3 attacking options in one window seems absurd, but if it pans out, squad depth would be impressive.

Martial/Jimenez

Rashford/James Sancho/Greenwood

Fernandes/Grealish
 
imamuppet said:
Sorry not Jadon related, but it seems that some of our supporters have seem to have forgotten that Daniel James lost his father shortly before his move.

If that does not effect you as a young as a 22 young male adult than obviously you would have some sort of psychological illness.

He came across to me as someone who was running on pure adrenalin when he first came.

We will see in the up and coming season if he can regroup and kick on
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When everyone was hurt he was literally ran into the ground. He needed rested. I think he will be a decent spark plug for us next year and maybe have it figured out in 2 seasons.
 
Reckon this week is where we start hearing some proper news? You’d think Ed would be dying to have him for the kit launch but I guess it’s too late for that now.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
I'm in the wait and watch camp. Many a mediocre player have a good start and then faded into nothingness. I would say I saw enough from him from that early spell to have a lot of faith in him. I think he's very limited and has a lot of work to do. He'll probably get next season to prove his worth.
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Yeah, I mean he’s a good outlet and is rapid, it’s just about using him where it suits off the bench.

He’s never going to be Ronaldo but if he can be a decent utility player for rotation and chips in with a goal here and there then that’s all we can ask from the relative low fee paid for him.
 
imamuppet said:
Sorry not Jadon related, but it seems that some of our supporters have seem to have forgotten that Daniel James lost his father shortly before his move.
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It’s not about losing father, it’s about footballing ability.
We saw a lot of James to be able to judge on his skills (consistency and psychological state are a different thing).

So, in terms of abilities and skills:
Pace - top
Acceleration - top
Shooting - poor
Passing - average
Technique - average
Dribbling - poor

He is very fast as an athlete, but not very skillful as a footballer. Do you really think he will improve on the above? Given that he is already 22, I wouldn’t be so sure. So he may be very easily upgraded upon.
 
Bit random, but seen that apparently he is 5ft 11. He doesn't seem that tall when watching him on tv, he seems really quick and nimble for 5ft 11.
 
Alemar said:
It’s not about losing father, it’s about footballing ability.
We saw a lot of James to be able to judge on his skills (consistency and psychological state are a different thing).

So, in terms of abilities and skills:
Pace - top
Acceleration - top
Shooting - poor
Passing - average
Technique - average
Dribbling - poor

He is very fast as an athlete, but not very skillful as a footballer. Do you really think he will improve on the above? Given that he is already 22, I wouldn’t be so sure. So he may be very easily upgraded upon.
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I disagree on the dribbling. He was inconsistent in that aspect but some of his dribbles left defenders trailing miles behind, many more were stopped by fouls worthy of a yellow card, but refs always let him get thugged.
Other than that, I agree with you. Still, he's got the opportunity to improve. He doesn't need to be born again, if he improves his decision making alone and polish his shoots and passes he's already going to be a very efficient player.
It's frightening how many caftards think players can't learn nothing new past 23 (not talking about you @Alemar, you didn't write it off).
 


Not sure what's going on, we seem to be going in circles. But Bild saying something similar to what Daniel Harris said.
 
manuchamp88 said:
I just don't think he offers much apart from his pace. We need someone to make Rashford look over his shoulder, otherwise he won't push himself. Maybe James will get a loan away next summer. Either way, I don't see it as a priority position for this summer. RWF, CF, CAM, CB, LB are the positions we should be looking at for now. But of course, we will end up with just: RWF, CAM, maybe CF.
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Frankly, this theory that every player needs someone to threaten their place for them to feel motivated is bullshit.
Some players might benefit from that, surely, also it doesn't hurt to have a healthy rivalry within the squad, but to suggest a player needs to have his place under threat for him to be arsed has no ground in reality.
Rashford has worked very hard for years and I don't see him getting fat and lazy because his place in the team is not under threat.
 
Le Red said:
Frankly, this theory that every player needs someone to threaten their place for them to feel motivated is bullshit.
Some players might benefit from that, surely, also it doesn't hurt to have a healthy rivalry within the squad, but to suggest a player needs to have his place under threat for him to be arsed has no ground in reality.
Rashford has worked very hard for years and I don't see him getting fat and lazy because his place in the team is not under threat.
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In fact the biggest improvement in his performance came this season - where his first team spot was guaranteed and shockingly, he got regular gametime.
 
Fooza said:


Not sure what's going on, we seem to be going in circles. But Bild saying something similar to what Daniel Harris said.
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If this is guaranteed payments and not triggered bonuses, this will get accepted. €120m works out at £108m, on a balance sheet United will spread over the terms of the contract so its easier to manage.

We’re almost there muppets!
 
I've been following Utd since the 90's. I'm 38. And the Sancho transfer is definitely one of the most exciting I've looked forward to. It will be a joy to watch him play with our current attack.

The transfers I was this excited about previously were probably Veron. Ruud Van Nistelrooy, Ferdinand and Ronaldhino (even though this was a heart breaker!)
 
Don’t know how widely available the statistics are but I was under the impression the vast majority of deals were structured with instalments over various years (with the exception of buy out clauses). Wasn’t the Maguire transfer a little different because Leicester insisted they wanted it all up front?
 
Riz said:
Don’t know how widely available the statistics are but I was under the impression the vast majority of deals were structured with instalments over various years (with the exception of buy out clauses). Wasn’t the Maguire transfer a little different because Leicester insisted they wanted it all up front?
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Not many deals are all the money up front, no. Maguire was, as was CR7 to Madrid back in the day.
 
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