Err no. The City way has already brought them several trophies. And it brought them a brilliant manager too.
Isn't it time we moved away from 'the United way'?
- Thread starter wolvored
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Good post.
Take all or any of this out of the club and we are just another ordinary club. Apart from location, for those who live in Manchester, what other reasons could there be for supporting the club? Why would you want to change it?
If it’s just continued success fans crave, they may as well just change teams to whoever is on top at the time.
The United way is pretty much the Busby way, not all managers followed it, the last years of SAF were pragmatic and not an example of enthusiastic Football. It should be a goal for this club but people should keep in mind that it means that United should avoid the vast majority of managers, Ole included. In theory United should focus on the likes of Bosz, Ten Hag, Bielsa and all the other adventurous managers that fans mock but will do everything in their power to play exciting Football even if it means getting spanked from time to time.
Man Utd is about entertaining attacking football, exciting players, flashy wingers, giving young players a chance and a never say die attitude.
No idea why anyone would want to change any of that, it's more than just what you see on the pitch. It's the whole ethos around the club
It's why LVG and Jose were disliked so much, even though they won a few trophies. They were two negative personalities, the football was utter shit, they wanted it too slow and methodical.
It's something that is failing Ole now, he's reverted to a negative don't lose attitude rather than a win at all costs attitude.
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No idea why anyone would want to change any of that, it's more than just what you see on the pitch. It's the whole ethos around the club
It's why LVG and Jose were disliked so much, even though they won a few trophies. They were two negative personalities, the football was utter shit, they wanted it too slow and methodical.
It's something that is failing Ole now, he's reverted to a negative don't lose attitude rather than a win at all costs attitude.
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Decent post. Not much I can add, the day of calling SAF the gaffer, while you are being paid to be the gaffer, of continually harking back to past glories, of smiles and backslapping, and football is a simple game. Over. Game over, Ole.
If you don't fancy the United Way, and you don't fancy the manager. Why fancy the club? What is left of the club if we just act is we are City? Is it success at all costs? What LVG did ruined so many things for the club. He restructured the way the club worked, and the club was all the worse for it. Rebuilding United fitting into a "United Way" is one of the greater things Ole has done. Now he needs to get the team to gel. We have a habit of starting off slowly and then finding our feet. Luckily we are only two points behind, so the situation is not dire. Hopefully we can up our game against the big dogs, which I have hopes that we can.
The United Way is much more than a style of play.
What exactly is the United way? For me it's an excuse, arguments like " he brought back the DNA to the club" are just being tossed around, I mean what the feck is that? By "United way" I think what you all mean is "not playing totally negative football".
There's no such thing as the "United way" just play attractive football and win.
There's no such thing as the "United way" just play attractive football and win.
This 'United Way' for me is largely about continuity. Continuity is having an academy player in every matchday squad since 1937. Its about having Sir Bobby in the stands every week, and now Sir Alex. Its about playing at Old Trafford and having that stadium completely full of our supporters every single time we play.
What it definitely is not about is online fans spreading negativity because we aren't the best team in the country at the moment. It's fine to feel a change of manager is needed. Everyone's made their feelings perfectly clear on that, but try to remember we've gone from someone all about himself who ripped the clubs history apart after losing to Sevilla, to a guy who bleeds red and is giving it his all. Its hard to tell the difference in how these two are spoken about. That's not really the United Way is it? There's a reason United are spoken about fondly in ways that City & Chelsea for example never are. We've had far worse times than this and still come out of it a great football club.
What it definitely is not about is online fans spreading negativity because we aren't the best team in the country at the moment. It's fine to feel a change of manager is needed. Everyone's made their feelings perfectly clear on that, but try to remember we've gone from someone all about himself who ripped the clubs history apart after losing to Sevilla, to a guy who bleeds red and is giving it his all. Its hard to tell the difference in how these two are spoken about. That's not really the United Way is it? There's a reason United are spoken about fondly in ways that City & Chelsea for example never are. We've had far worse times than this and still come out of it a great football club.
This and @TrustInJanuzaj nailed it. Its not just the style (although style is most important), its about youth, traditions, being a kind of family club, traditions, being different to all other clubs (I know it sounds snobbish
) Its much more than style and while I agree Ole has brought us back to those values we have as a club and which attracted many fans I'm not sure if he has more in his locker to take the club further. Not only that but our way of playing has degressed over time and you cant be sure if we're playing offensive football or not.
Whatever United way means it shouldnt stop the club from evolving and be a problem instead of solution nor should be an argument in appointing that and that manager or not. Although on the other side of the coin both LVG and Mourinho were the exact opposites of the everything United as a club stands for.
There's 2 elements of romanticism that I've found bizarre since Ferguson retired.
The 1st being United should have a British manager. How this xenophobic attitude was ever socially acceptable in the first place I've no idea, Gary Neville used to spout this on Sky ever week around the time SAF left, and this attitude was one of the reason we ended up with David fecking Moyes. I can't be convinced that if Moyes was French he'd have been anywhere near the United job, we were literally trying to recreate Ferguson's reign right down to his nationality. Thankfully the Moyes disaster put an end to this idea.
The 2nd being forcing the involvement of former players at every level. From our coaching staff being made up of ex players, to pushing LVG towards appointing Giggs as his assistant, to giving Ole the job because he brought back the feel-good factor.
The 1st being United should have a British manager. How this xenophobic attitude was ever socially acceptable in the first place I've no idea, Gary Neville used to spout this on Sky ever week around the time SAF left, and this attitude was one of the reason we ended up with David fecking Moyes. I can't be convinced that if Moyes was French he'd have been anywhere near the United job, we were literally trying to recreate Ferguson's reign right down to his nationality. Thankfully the Moyes disaster put an end to this idea.
The 2nd being forcing the involvement of former players at every level. From our coaching staff being made up of ex players, to pushing LVG towards appointing Giggs as his assistant, to giving Ole the job because he brought back the feel-good factor.
It's a bit of a myth stylistically to be honest, that's not being negative or contrarian for the sake of it but we don't have a monopoly on attacking or exciting football. As long as we try to be proactive in how we play, that is all fans want stylistically to be honest.
If you can promise me entertaining/offensive football in 7/10 games, youth players coming through and an intensity/aggression to how we play, I'll be happy.
If you can promise me entertaining/offensive football in 7/10 games, youth players coming through and an intensity/aggression to how we play, I'll be happy.
This is exactly what I meant and imo what is holding us back having ex players in every nook and cranny
And Oles does none of it.
The only thing we need to move away from is the blind devotion that we show our managers even after knowing that they are not up to the task. We have to accept the fact that there won't be anyone else like SAF. No manager at Manchester United needs his own squad, two or three transfer windows to make our team play better.
I somewhat understand the need for Neville for a British manager, Manchester United is an English club but it should be for someone who is capable. But this giving away jobs to ex-players definitely have to stop, what about the people who work hard, do their badges and learn stuff about coaching? Why are prime jobs being handed out to ex-players? Sure they have been around coaches but that doesn't make them coaches, especially at the level we are trying to compete.
I am not sure what is United way.
Attacking football? Well most big clubs want that. Nothing specific to us.
Giving managers time? That's just common sense, but the way we give time till top 4 is out of question is down to the ineptitude of the management, dont have much confidence in them that they are doing in depth analysis.
Then only real thing is giving our players lots of chances, tbf we have continued that and should continue that. Btw that's again not exclusive to us, Barca, Bayern, Real etc all do it no?
Attacking football? Well most big clubs want that. Nothing specific to us.
Giving managers time? That's just common sense, but the way we give time till top 4 is out of question is down to the ineptitude of the management, dont have much confidence in them that they are doing in depth analysis.
Then only real thing is giving our players lots of chances, tbf we have continued that and should continue that. Btw that's again not exclusive to us, Barca, Bayern, Real etc all do it no?
I know we all want SAF v2 to manage us but realistically a manager like that will never exist again, and people need to make compromises around what they want from the club and stop romanticising the idea of “The United Way”. The true “United Way” is just winning trophies, are there really people who would not have taken someone like Pep at the club when SAF retired because he does not fit these super rigid confines that some people impose upon any prospective coach?
Simpler question. Is having ole the united way?
He looks more like the definition of chequebook manager to me
He looks more like the definition of chequebook manager to me
What's united way about ole reign?
I don’t believe this is the case, and I have not seen any evidence that this is the case. What he has done is reinstate a few core values and a set of principles that the club has long held, but got a little lost in the years after Sir Alex and David Gill retired. Nothing wrong with that. The ex-players that Ole has appointed around him simply help to reinforce these principles and hold the current players to the high standards the club held historically and still expects today.
As for the ‘United way’, it’s not an idea I subscribe too. As you say yourself, football has moved on so to talk about an old style of play would be meaningless. We certainly don’t play 442 with attacking wide wingers anymore. I think ’the United way’ is more of a philosophy than a set style of play.
I’d take Eric Cantonas lead when he said United are about winning but through being entertaining, and that has kind of morphed into win at all costs for some, especially when Mourinho was here. I do believe Ole is trying to put the entertainment back into our style of play - just consider the players he has signed, the likes of James, Fernandes, Cavani, Sancho and Ronaldo - but I think he is struggling to fit them all together, and find the right pieces in between to complete the whole jigsaw.
The United way is something created by Busby and followed with perfection by Ferguson. It could happen again, but maybe not in our lifetimes.
It's not only about promoting youth and having an exciting style of play. That's part of it, but it's also about being a ruthless team who not only want to win every game but dominate opponents.
It's about having a massive culture and philosophy of living inside the club. Without managers such as Busby and Ferguson and the right group of players, there's no ''United way''
Sometimes you can have a good squad like we have today, but player recruitment can't be done in only one window. We got Ronaldo Sancho and Varane on this one, but to build long term sucess Ole would need to send away the players he thinks are not good enough and buy ready-made replacements of better quality who could either be here in the long term or make a great difference in the short term.
We need a vision and a plan executed over an extended period of time not only in regards to one season but to alot of seasons.
It's not only about promoting youth and having an exciting style of play. That's part of it, but it's also about being a ruthless team who not only want to win every game but dominate opponents.
It's about having a massive culture and philosophy of living inside the club. Without managers such as Busby and Ferguson and the right group of players, there's no ''United way''
Sometimes you can have a good squad like we have today, but player recruitment can't be done in only one window. We got Ronaldo Sancho and Varane on this one, but to build long term sucess Ole would need to send away the players he thinks are not good enough and buy ready-made replacements of better quality who could either be here in the long term or make a great difference in the short term.
We need a vision and a plan executed over an extended period of time not only in regards to one season but to alot of seasons.
I've only been a fan for 12 years so I can't pretend I'm entrenched in the longterm values of the club or understand what it was like decades ago, but I've been around the NFL as a fan for 25 years. During those things there was some myth about the "Patriot Way" about how the club was run and teams around the league have tried emulating it and failed every step of the way. That's because there's no such thing. It's just a incomprehensible way to attribute success for something when it really was down to hard work and correct decision making. Sounds a lot like how United is run. The United Way is described differently by like every person in this thread so I think it's similar. SAF was simply the best manager ever and trying to emulate what he did (or what Busby did even earlier) is a huge disservice to both of them. You cannot recreate or mimic that magic. Hell look at all the trash managers United has had outside of them even to this day because fans and ex-players of the club are determined to see the club act and function the same way. It can't. You have to move on and start fresh and then maybe there will be another Busby/SAF down the road.
As for "playing free flowing attacking football". Did you watch United under Fergie especially during his last few seasons? We certainly didn't play that way all the time and no one really complained because we still won.
Point is, get a manager on the upswing with credentials to actually manage this club, it's an embarrassment Ole was ever given the opportunity permanently, and keep trying until you get it right like every other club does in world football.
As for "playing free flowing attacking football". Did you watch United under Fergie especially during his last few seasons? We certainly didn't play that way all the time and no one really complained because we still won.
Point is, get a manager on the upswing with credentials to actually manage this club, it's an embarrassment Ole was ever given the opportunity permanently, and keep trying until you get it right like every other club does in world football.
What is this 'United Way'? Vague things like attacking football, youth, wingers etc are actually pretty meaningless.
Let's be honest, when we say the United Way, we mean let's play like we did in specific sub-eras of Ferguson and Busby's reigns. Because sometimes even their teams were dull or ineffective.
Maybe at a pinch you could mention Docherty or Atkinson as they had a certain zest and energy to the way they approached things.
But I bet that United have not played in the 'United Way' for most of their history... So what exactly is 'United' about it?
The only genuine principles that you could say are relatively unique to us are youth and trophies. Our academy history is close to being unique and I believe we should invest heavily in that. Trophies - well we are the most successful team ever in domestic competitions. But neither of those actually dictate how we play.
Let's be honest, when we say the United Way, we mean let's play like we did in specific sub-eras of Ferguson and Busby's reigns. Because sometimes even their teams were dull or ineffective.
Maybe at a pinch you could mention Docherty or Atkinson as they had a certain zest and energy to the way they approached things.
But I bet that United have not played in the 'United Way' for most of their history... So what exactly is 'United' about it?
The only genuine principles that you could say are relatively unique to us are youth and trophies. Our academy history is close to being unique and I believe we should invest heavily in that. Trophies - well we are the most successful team ever in domestic competitions. But neither of those actually dictate how we play.
There’s nothing wrong with it but we more than someone who can just say it. You need to know how to achieve it. I want to make a cake like. Bake Off winner, doesn’t mean that me saying “The bake off way” makes me a competent baker.
Also trying to emulate Ferguson’s team of 15 years ago when if the man was still managing he’d have evolved himself past that 3 or 4 times over, is a bit strange
Also trying to emulate Ferguson’s team of 15 years ago when if the man was still managing he’d have evolved himself past that 3 or 4 times over, is a bit strange
Thank you for your posts! I wish anyone who doesn't understand what the "United Way" is (in other words, what differentiates United from other clubs) should look at these posts.
I understand the frustration of not doing as well as we should with the squad we have but you have to realize the magnitude of the re-build the club had to undergo after Moyes, LVG, and Mourinho. It's lost on so many of our fans, who seem to conflate "supporting a football club" with "wanting the club to win at any cost". It's nothing but a dick-measuring contest for them.
People seem to forget a football club is, after all, its peoples. Now that doesn't mean turn to ex-players only - that's ridiculous. However, it does mean loyalty to the people who want the best for the club. And not blind loyalty, mind. But having the patience and the respect for people who "get" the club and want only the best is not too much to ask, surely. Have some perspective, zoom out a little bit, progress was made last 2 seasons, and this season has just begun.
I am not even saying stick with Ole (or whoever the manager is) until they finish outside of top 4 - the club can, and maybe should, definitely start looking for a new manager if United don't win a trophy this season or the next, even if Ole finishes 2nd in the league. But as fans, as long as he (or any other manager) is here and trying his best and not destroying the club, we should be backing the manager. Don't be so naive to assume fan discontent on social media won't translate to serious pressure in mainstream media for Ole and the players - it's very real. Having said that, I definitely acknowledge that Ole and the players need to be able to withstand this pressure regardless - that's part of working for United. So yeah, criticize the manager and the players but also celebrate and enjoy the wins. Just don't make it an endless stream of negativity and criticism and disrespect just because you didn't get to feel good about yourselves because your team didn't win a trophy. It's a football club that means much, much more.
So much of our focus as a club seems to be “wasn’t the past lovely” and yeah it was. But it was lovely because we had a manager constantly evolving. I remember Sir Alex saying many times in interviews that when he won a trophy the feeling of joy very quickly subsided and he quickly turned towards the challenge for the following year.
As pointed out Ferguson had teams that were a tour de force, teams that were pragmatic, teams that relied on individual brilliance, teams that relied collective resolve. He was here for 27 years and created six different teams with different identities and styles who achieved success. Because he constantly evolved even when successful he never spent too long impressed with himself. If was still managing today the suggestion he should be trying to replicate the characteristic of his past successful teams, as opposed to forging new teams with new ways to achieve, would probably make his skin crawl
As pointed out Ferguson had teams that were a tour de force, teams that were pragmatic, teams that relied on individual brilliance, teams that relied collective resolve. He was here for 27 years and created six different teams with different identities and styles who achieved success. Because he constantly evolved even when successful he never spent too long impressed with himself. If was still managing today the suggestion he should be trying to replicate the characteristic of his past successful teams, as opposed to forging new teams with new ways to achieve, would probably make his skin crawl
1) Mason Greenwood, Amad Diallo, Will Fish, Anthony Elanga, Hannibal Mejbri, Shola Shoretire, and others I’ve probably forgotten all say Hi. They also thank Ole for promoting them to train with the first team and giving them their debut.
2) We are also capable of exciting attacking football. Admittedly not consistently but it’s a damn sight more entertaining than watching LVG or Mourinho-ball.
3) The trophy is a work in progress, to be reviewed in May!
Nice try!
What? The only one he's done anything for is greenwood. That's a terrible defense of ole.. If anything he's keeping youth out of the club keeping players like Mata around
Why is that the city way? Chelsea, Real, PSG are also examples. Barca tried and failed miserably.
What stage of grief is this considered? ffs
Stage 6: Testing of the Kubler-Ross model. Seeking realistic solutions, asking questions about your unhappiness but being able to see some positives whereas before there were none. This points to final step, Acceptance, being next.
No such thing as the United way. It was Busby’s way and then Sir Alex’s way. They were managers for so long it felt like it was the club’s way.
Are you just listing names for the sake of it ? The reality is the only young player whom Ole has developed in his 2.5 years is Greenwood, nothing else. LVG actually gave youngsters more chances, as ridiculous as it sounds.
And we don't play any thing resembling exciting attacking football. We play shit football with some moments of brilliance here and there thanks to our quality.
There's nothing about Ole's United that resembles whatever meaning one can give to "The United Way".
If you say so…..
What are these values and principles ?
If you don't know where you are going, you might wind up someplace else. (Yogi Berra)
Since nobody really knows what the "United way" is, we may already be far away!
Since nobody really knows what the "United way" is, we may already be far away!
Absolutely. Surely this is the only thing that can be described as the 'United Way', as it precedes Busby and has continued after Fergie to this day.
The Utd way is bringing players through the youth system and letting them live out their dream, turning them into world beaters and all the while spending very little because we’ve ‘grown our own’.
We need to abandon certain aspects of the Utd way. Chelsea and City’s throw enough money until you have an elite team is the perfect counter to our lack of spending and bringing players through. The Glazers also hide a lot behind the Utd way. Fine to bring through our top talents, the likes of your Greenwoods and Rashords, but we have to start spending some money to fill out the squad rather than relying on the best we have in that position in the academy like McTominay.
We need to abandon certain aspects of the Utd way. Chelsea and City’s throw enough money until you have an elite team is the perfect counter to our lack of spending and bringing players through. The Glazers also hide a lot behind the Utd way. Fine to bring through our top talents, the likes of your Greenwoods and Rashords, but we have to start spending some money to fill out the squad rather than relying on the best we have in that position in the academy like McTominay.
The United way itself, if it exists, beyond an idea, has already undergone a big transformation. The working class football club of Busby that pioneered English football involvement with European competitions was a far cry from the club that alongside others broke away from the football pyramid to form the PL, and definitely not the global corporate entity that is the modern day Manchester United.