Marchisio is trying to fly away!
Yeah Chief, we're all idiots, we're all lost, the pundits and ex pro's are lost. Its just a shame the world of football can't be enlightened with your pearls of wisdom
Iniesta - Is there another? | Announces retirement
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Marchisio is trying to fly away!
Yeah Chief, we're all idiots, we're all lost, the pundits and ex pro's are lost. Its just a shame the world of football can't be enlightened with your pearls of wisdom
Iniesta 2010 was better than Zidane 1998. Zidane 2000 and 2006 werethough.
Iniesta did feck all in 2010 except for that goal in the final. I remember saying at the time that everyone will forget his poor performances up to that goal and of course everyone did. In 2008 he didn't do much either and was the poorest attacking player in that side yet the wank fest commenced despite that.
I'm quite stunned at the reputation he enjoys, shouldn't even be compared to Zidane in the first place.
Thats not entirely accurate.
He was decent at the World cup, one of his sides better performers though he didnt exactly light it up. Thats similar to Zidane, who wasnt particularly great in 98, but its not remembered that way because he scored in the final.
Thought he was excellent at Euro 2008 though.
Fair point, but with Zidane I felt he could take that to a new level of making the game look effortless, moreso than Iniesta.
With his performances so far in the tournament Iniesta is starting to get there (Zidane). Took on a visible new leadership mentality where he's actually organising and talking to players around him, telling them where to go and what to do at times and making more of an effort to do something in the final third as well. Still a ways to go
Iniesta 2010 was better than Zidane 1998. Zidane 2000 and 2006 were
I don't think there's much between them, if anything I'd still side with Zidane there on the account of him setting up about 4 one-on-ones in that final alone. Iniesta didn't really bring his A-game to any of the games in the World Cup, iirc.
Iniesta more industrious? To be fair, that is a terribly wrong assessment. The one thing Zidane had over Iniesta was physique. On the stuff that makes you "easier to watch" like passing, dribbling, movement, etc Iniesta is evidently better whereas they were about the same on ball control. So I'm struggling to see the basis on which one would determine Zidane played with more grace and was easier to watch.
Its close between Iniesta and Zidane because they were both great players with superb CV's. Iniesta has more flair, but Zidane compensates for that in other respects like physique and the fact that he was a more dangerous goal threat. But after WC 2010, Iniesta surpassed Zidane for me. I had already considered him a better player, but that achievement and his performances took him above Zidane with accomplishments factored in.
Its close between Iniesta and Zidane because they were both great players with superb CV's. Iniesta has more flair, but Zidane compensates for that in other respects like physique and the fact that he was a more dangerous goal threat. But after WC 2010, Iniesta surpassed Zidane for me. I had already considered him a better player, but that achievement and his performances took him above Zidane with accomplishments factored in.
I think you're slurring greatness with actual ability here. Too much emphasis on people's perception of players, which is absolutely irrelevant when it comes to measuring ability.
Zidane was a player who could grab hold of a game on any stage, and single handedly win it for his team. Iniesta is a great player, who plays in great teams and more often than not produces the good. IMO they are both great players, though Zidane sits on the table above iniesta.
Snatching headlines is also an ability. The ability to make one's mark on the biggest of occasions repeatedly. I find it mind boggling that anyone would attempt to deny it by claiming 'its slurring greatness''.
Talk of 'headlines' in a literal sense is slurring greatness with ability. Iniesta is also a big game player, Chief - it is irrelevant whether he gets the headlines for it when we're talking about who is actually better. He's shat us out in two European finals, has had a fantastic Euros (2008) and was decisive in the world cup final. This is not to mention the consistently fantastic performances he puts in against everyone in his own league. Who you find to be more of a big game player is a matter for debate, but I just don't see how you can argue the case for Zidane here when there is so much else going for Iniesta.
Again, I wouldn't really like to try and properly argue the case that Iniesta has surpassed Zidane (although that is my opinion), but it just seems quite a challenge in my opinion to place Zidane above Iniesta.
Again, I wouldn't really like to try and properly argue the case that Iniesta has surpassed Zidane (although that is my opinion), but it just seems quite a challenge in my opinion to place Zidane above Iniesta.
zidane is the best of all time...iniesta isn't in the same league...sorry barca nuthuggers
Zidane's not even the best player I've seen in my lifetime, as good as he was. I'd say Messi and Ronaldinho are/were superior footballers, and that's just from the last decade.
Certainly.
He's just being romanticized as he's a retired great player... in the same way Messi, Xavi, and Iniesta will be romanticized when they're done - although for them you can be certain in will be severe.
There'll be cults formed and shrines assembled all over the world in honour of Messi at this rate.
...and I'll be assembling them.
...and I'll be assembling them.
What I thought the thread was about was is there another player currently playing like him?
You are just missing the most obvious and most simple of things. Zidane has always been the superior big game player. Because at his best in a big matches he always decided the fate of the match one way or another. This notion that grabbing the headlines is a small matter is frankly stupid.
Zidane's respect wasn't garnered from amazing consistency through out a season. It was garnered from consistently showing up on the biggest stage to make the most telling of contributions. He also had the amazing knack of making the teams he played for almost solely dependent on him. Even a great side like the French national set up he played in.
Look what I found: https://www.redcafe.net/f7/fabregas-better-than-iniesta-301252/
Zidane was world class for almost a decade. Why the rush to compare him with someone who hasn't finished playing?
Probably because as much as I hate him he is just that good. He also has decided some big matches. I think the "headline" arguement is interesting but unfair to him. Iniesta plays with Messi who many would consider one of the best of all time, so naturally Messi will take a lot of these headlines away from Andres. As good as Zidane's teammates have been, I can't think that any of them have been considered on the Messi/Ronaldo/Pele/Maradonna level.
Zidane would have taken a fair few headlines away from Messi too.
Not missing a thing. You're saying that Zidane is the superior big-game player, which is possible (not certain, as Iniesta is also a brilliant big game player - he's often fantastic against Madrid which I don't think has been mentioned yet). Iniesta is, without any shadow of a doubt whatsoever, more consistent.
You keep going on about grabbing headlines, but it's actual performance that matters. Clearly, Zidane's actual performance in big games was impressive, as is Iniesta's. I can't remember Rio Ferdinand grabbing many headlines, but he may well be the best defender I've seen at his height. Likewise, Ronaldo grabbed all the headlines in 06/07, but Scholes was magnificent that season. Different players have different roles, and receive different media attention as a result. Iniesta's productivity in terms of goals isn't outstanding, which is why he doesn't get these headlines you keep alluding to. It doesn't matter though...his contribution is immense.
Like I say, headlines are irrelevant. Headlines are produced by the media and, as we all know, pretty much everyone involved in the media is an absolutely clueless arsehole. Am I taking you too literally when you talk of headlines, or are you just talking about big game performance (which is still debatable, as previously stated)?
Barry is more consistant than Carrick. Certainly wouldnt say hes a better player
Oh For crying loud. Grabbing the headlines DOES matter. If you put in the performance and grab the headlines you will definitely be rated higher than he who just puts in the performance.
And headlines are not merely created by the media. They are usually created by players who steal the show. Think Zidane's goal vs Leverkursen. Or Messi's header against us. Or Ronaldinho's strike vs Chelsea.
Zidane is a player who made a habit of grabbing those moments in big games.
A bit of a myth specially when playing for France.Zidane's always had great teammates (in 06 he had Viera,Makelele in midfield, in 08 he had Deschamps,Djorkaeff, Petit ...)
Every great player needs to have a very good supporting cast
This need for comparing players and rating who is better is a tedious and pointless exercise, IMO. I've also noticed a couple of Barcelona supporters in this forum bigging up their players. There's a surprise.
Proper Ronaldo played with Zidane.
Again, confusing greatness/reputation with ability. This is going nowhere.
It's as if his literally went to his corner shop and grabbed headlines. That's Zidane for you...headline grabber, something he's been doing since he first set his sights on the Sunday Sport.
And that Ronalo was nowhere near the same level he was at earlier.
Zidane's almost mythical status greatly surprises me.
Yep just recently the headline in the newspaper read.
'The U.S. elecZIDANEtion race.'
This was one of the crazy things about the 1986 World Cup and why Maradona at that tournament was at the peak that any player has ever achieved, he only had Valdano then the quality of the side fell off a cliff. It is astonishing that they did what they did, the rest of that squad was incredibly average.
Ronaldo won the World Cup (man of the match with both goals), was awarded the Ballon D'or, the Onze D'or, World Soccer Magazine World Player of the Year, and the FIFA World Player of the Year the season he signed for Madrid. He also scored 83 goals in 127 appearances for Madrid. It's fair to say he was still pretty good when he played with Zidane.
You're surprised that Zidane is widely regarded as one of the greats of the game? Seriously?
Nope never said that now, did I?
Explain what you meant then. What is this mythical status you think Zidane unfairly holds?
Another football myth. While Maradona was clearly THE influential figure in that team, his teammates were far from "incredibly average". The team was full of Independiente and River players who both won the Copa Libertadores and the Intercontinental Cup in 84 and 86. Independiente even beat the great Liverpool side of the 80s with Dalglish, Ian Rush, Phil Neal etc. while keeping a clean sheet which no other team in Europe managed that year when Liverpool won the European Cup. Only reason that the 86 Argentina team is considered "poor" in Europe is because most of the players didn't play in Europe at that time.
Look around the comments here only and you might understand what I mean.
No doubt he was a great player, a legendary player but so many comments here are over the top.
Now he certainly has done a lot of this on the biggest of stages but so has Iniesta who still has a long way to go and this is a little over the top.
I dislike Barcelona but even in the 90's there was a player who was more naturally talented than Zidane before losing his best level because of injuries.
I was not only talking about this website but many people talk about Zidane in a greater awe than the one he generated.
He is one of the greatest of all time and for me better/greater player than Iniesta but my point is that Iniesta most definitely has it in him to surpass him.
It was a good team and it is not fair when so many of them are not given proper credit but never has a world cup been dominated by a single player.
I've watched every game Argentina played in that tournament around 3 years ago (one of my friends still has the VHS's recorded off the TV and lent me them, I was less than 6 months old when the tournament was played), its a myth that its a myth. That team were very technically average apart from the front two..