As long as we in the right direction. Once it turns sour like Van Gaal and Mourinho then its time to go. People shouldn't forget he wasn't exactly backed in the last summer window.
If you're Ole in, how much time will you give him?
- Thread starter horsechoker
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran are here to talk about a frustrating 2 points dropped at Crystal Palace. They then discuss the regeneration of Old Trafford. Finally, Nik is joined by special guest Michael Statham from the Football Oranje podcast - who gives us a more in depth look at our EL opposition FC Twente, and then runs through the (many) Dutch connections currently at United.
He deserves the season to see if he can make CL football again for Next season (unless the team completely free fall and he loses something crazy like the next 4 games)
Going out of CL is a blow (and what really cost us is the loss in Istanbul). But we weren't going to win it with our defence. Europa League however is going to badly affect us especially as Ole will take it seriously
It does seem like two steps forward, one back.
Going out of CL is a blow (and what really cost us is the loss in Istanbul). But we weren't going to win it with our defence. Europa League however is going to badly affect us especially as Ole will take it seriously
It does seem like two steps forward, one back.
When Ole got here it was to be a three year journey to get back to challenging for the league.
Ownership has not provided the players that were wished for, holding back some team development.
I think Ole has the right ideas overall for the club, but may lack some tactical genius.
Give him to the end of the season. If the team continues to improve keep him.
If they run off the road and into a ditch, look what is around to replace him.
Do not return to 2 - 3 years of a manager, replace and start over again.
Make Ole the Director of Football and bring in a manager that is better tactically using the system started by Ole.
It is currently better than having to listen to Jose and not the borefest is was under VG.
Ownership has not provided the players that were wished for, holding back some team development.
I think Ole has the right ideas overall for the club, but may lack some tactical genius.
Give him to the end of the season. If the team continues to improve keep him.
If they run off the road and into a ditch, look what is around to replace him.
Do not return to 2 - 3 years of a manager, replace and start over again.
Make Ole the Director of Football and bring in a manager that is better tactically using the system started by Ole.
It is currently better than having to listen to Jose and not the borefest is was under VG.
Admire your patience and don't worry he will find a way to survive that long,convinced he has more lives than a cat
God another 5 months of him making strange tactical decisions is a really bitter pill to swallow but will happen as know how this board operates
I still support Ole, but I agree with you on the assistant coaches. I would like to see a coach who could do something with this defense. I don't want a defensive minded manager, but an experienced defensive assistant would probably help our current situation. Many world class managers have relied on good assistants. Ferguson has, Jose has, etc. I don't think Ole has to carry the full load in coaching defensive tactics, and I'm not sure his current assistants are good enough to supplement Ole's deficiencies.
Its weird, but when he was interim manager he mostly stuck with one style / formation and didn't play around. He also seemed more proactive with his sub's and timing of them
But since then he plays around so much before the game then waits a long time to change it
Forty days and nights. Send a snake after a couple of weeks to test his progress.
How long before we actually start demanding results? How is top 4 enough after two years and the players bought?
How can anyone call this progress when we struggle to reach the same goals we achieved before?
When will we actually start demanding titles? We've wasted enough time already, this "rebuild" has gone for 2 years now and we are in the same, if not worse place, that what we were.
How can anyone call this progress when we struggle to reach the same goals we achieved before?
When will we actually start demanding titles? We've wasted enough time already, this "rebuild" has gone for 2 years now and we are in the same, if not worse place, that what we were.
we crashed out of the CL group stages a few times with fergie too. It happens.
Stopped reading there. Labelling people Iners and Outers is quite childish to be honest. I try to at least hold myself to a bit of dignity.
Ole has to win at least a cup this season and a top 4 finish or top 2 in the premier league if we don't win anything. Failing either one of this, I think we will see a new manager next season.
Poor answer to evade the argument.Stopped reading there. Labelling people Iners and Outers is quite childish to be honest. I try to at least hold myself to a bit of dignity.
Exactly how I've been feeling until today. He makes poor decisions. On the weekend he made poor decisions and some how it ended up working for him. Today he made poor decision after poor decision from the starting line up, to the tactics, to waiting until half time to change his defensive set up, to poor subs. And his worst offense of all, playing Pogba. That POS should rot on the bench until he is sold...
I suppose I have never seen the possibility of a major turn-around in just two years time. For my own part, I look at progress as having a longer arc than that. We were basically an upper mid-table club a few years back. Becoming a sure bet for the top four is therefore progress. Now, admittedly, I'm not 100% sure we are a sure bet at this point. The PL is extremely competitive these days, but we seem to be close to this level. From there I hope we make further progress and become a title contending team. I don't think we are there yet, nor did I expect it at this point honestly. I think many people think two years is enough time to turn the post-SAF MUFC mess around. Fans want us to go from upper mid-table to title in a year or two. I have never held this opinion. Therefore, I have a lot more tolerance for the ups and downs along the way.
For what it's worth in American sports, the general sentiment is that a coach should be given 3-4 years time to implement their system before it is deemed a success or failure. I think it's weird to think that 2 years is enough time for any rebuild of substance.
Ole has been managing for 10+ years.
Unless he really goes into seclusion and taught by football deities I'm afraid what we see is what we get.
Can he get better result if we buy sancho grealish and halaand? Question is who doesnt.
But the problem isnt that. The problem is can ole take us to the level where sancho grealish and halaand sees us as a prospect and would come and give us their all?
At this rate they would think twice. And if they come eventually in 2 or 3 years time by that time maguire martial has become deadwood. Shaw will be the next Jones. De gea would be past it. And we're back to rebuilding phase.
Saf rebuild on the fly. His initial built took him 6 years but from then on it's a continuous and smooth transition. He's never given blank season. The time we dont won in 3 in a trot due to chelsea doesnt mean we underperform. Some teams just did better.
Now would giving ole 2 or 3 more years improve him by folds? Or would the improvement be marginal.
We're waiting for the rainbows at the end of the tunnel, but the tunnel only ends when we're actually moving forward, not staying in place.
Unless he really goes into seclusion and taught by football deities I'm afraid what we see is what we get.
Can he get better result if we buy sancho grealish and halaand? Question is who doesnt.
But the problem isnt that. The problem is can ole take us to the level where sancho grealish and halaand sees us as a prospect and would come and give us their all?
At this rate they would think twice. And if they come eventually in 2 or 3 years time by that time maguire martial has become deadwood. Shaw will be the next Jones. De gea would be past it. And we're back to rebuilding phase.
Saf rebuild on the fly. His initial built took him 6 years but from then on it's a continuous and smooth transition. He's never given blank season. The time we dont won in 3 in a trot due to chelsea doesnt mean we underperform. Some teams just did better.
Now would giving ole 2 or 3 more years improve him by folds? Or would the improvement be marginal.
We're waiting for the rainbows at the end of the tunnel, but the tunnel only ends when we're actually moving forward, not staying in place.
While I'm upset we were knocked out of the CL, I half expected it with the draw. The early results gave me hope.... but don't forget we don't have the experience or drive within most of the players to sustain big Euro nights. Not much CL experience in our current side outside of a few.
Here's where I'm at:
- still 2 points off the top (unreal this is true with how we've played in the league)
- still in the cups
Decisions that would show Ole should be sacked at the end of the season:
- Prioritize anything above PL. We're in a good spot. Don't send the strongest 11 to who knows where for a Thursday EL tie when we need the 3 points Sunday.
- Doesn't learn from his tactical mistakes (formations and subs). He clearly got it wrong but was too slow to change. Let's face it he's a young manager and there is alot to learn. But he needs to LEARN vs repeat the same mistake over
Here's where I'm at:
- still 2 points off the top (unreal this is true with how we've played in the league)
- still in the cups
Decisions that would show Ole should be sacked at the end of the season:
- Prioritize anything above PL. We're in a good spot. Don't send the strongest 11 to who knows where for a Thursday EL tie when we need the 3 points Sunday.
- Doesn't learn from his tactical mistakes (formations and subs). He clearly got it wrong but was too slow to change. Let's face it he's a young manager and there is alot to learn. But he needs to LEARN vs repeat the same mistake over
Ridiculous we will give him that long when it's so clear that he isn't up to managing this club any longer
I respect your opinion. Carry on.
He should definitely not get another 4 weeks let alone another 4 years
It's not even about how much time I'd give him anymore. I don't think he has the skills or the personality to take us any further than he has.
Keeping him on will just result in more of the same. Some good days, some bad days but never consistently great days.
Ole did his job and lifted spirits after the Mourinho mess but If we want this team to go to the next level we need a next level manager. A Poch or a Tuchel.
We need to get on with the inevitable and move Ole on.
P.s Thank you for your service legend.
Keeping him on will just result in more of the same. Some good days, some bad days but never consistently great days.
Ole did his job and lifted spirits after the Mourinho mess but If we want this team to go to the next level we need a next level manager. A Poch or a Tuchel.
We need to get on with the inevitable and move Ole on.
P.s Thank you for your service legend.
Which American sport? I watch basketball and the reason rebuilds take 3-4 years is because the best odds at the best prospects are given to the worst teams. When teams aren't trying to manipulate their draft odds they are as ruthless and trigger happy with firing coaches. No team trying and failing to make the playoffs is going to stick with a coach for 3-4 years
Also we have also been top 4 candidates. This upper mid table thing isn't right. Our worst position under Jose and LVG was 5th and guess what, it got them fired because we most certainly did not believe that was our level even for one season. Dropping standards can't be the only way to make Ole look good
We finished 2nd the literal season before Ole took over.
We’re becoming schrodingers football team. Simultaneously a rag tag bag of misfit toys Ole is doing brilliantly to haul back to respectability, and also a pulsating progressing side on the up that outplayed PSG and could be in the title race, entirely depending on which one is more flattering/forgiving in the circumstances.
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I never said he should get another four years. However, I am perfectly fine with another four weeks, yea, even another four months at least. I wouldn't be that upset with a total of four years, assuming a decent performance during those years. It's literally a 2+2=4 approach (2 years so far + 2 more). I'm not saying Ole will certainly take us to the promised land. That said, I also don't share "the sky is falling with Ole" sentiment that is so prevalent in here.
I get it that many think this would be "wasted time." I disagree. If Ole could bring some level of stability, stability we have simply not had since SAF, then it would not be time wasted. Now if it all falls apart completely, then I will understand making a change sooner.
I was happy for him being appointed on a interim basis two years ago,however should have been thanked for his service at the end of that season and brought in someone more experienced
Season finishes since SAF in reverse order:
3rd (Ole)
6th (Jose/Ole)
2nd (Jose)
6th (Jose)
5th (LVG)
4th (LVG)
7th (Moyes)
3 out of 7 years in the top four. Looks upper mid-table to me. Jose even said that the 2nd place finish was his best achievement.
Source: https://www.premierleague.com/clubs/12/Manchester-United/season-history
Surely the only people Ole in should really be rival fans but looking at the poll clearly that's not the case
He deserves a full 3 years as full time manager. He has just finished 1.
I was mainly thinking of football, but it would apply to baseball and hockey as well. I don't follow basketball closely enough to know about that. Maybe it's an exception. I do think most teams who hire a coach in the US give them at least three years. I'm sure there are exceptions, but I think the rule stands. My St. Louis Cardinals stuck with Mike Matheny as manager for 6 years. Matheny had a total 0 years prior experience managing an MLB team. He took over a World Series winning team and eventually led them to 3 straight seasons without making the playoffs before they finally fired him.
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Haha don't make me laugh
Fair enough. I'm not even disagreeing with your sentiment. However, since he was hired and has, at least in my view, started moving the ship in the right direction, I think he should be given a little more slack than you seem comfortable with. That's fine. I don't mind the disagreement.
Feels like you included Moyes unfinished season (7th) and Ole's first season (6th) to pad those figures. Under LVG and Jose we were not an upper mid table team, we were perennial top 4 contenders. When we failed it was marginally and the managers were sacked
Hardly making a case there for you buddy.
Yeah I am definitely uncomfortable with him getting more slack as have seen enough to tell me he isn't the man to take us forward
Thats not a fair comparison, in american sports the teams are feeded by a draft and have salary caps, thats why teams take so long to rebuild. On the other hand we have the financial muscle to get proper players fast. No coach in any club is going to get 3-4 years fo implement his system never mind in a top club, thats nonsense.
2 years is more than enough for a rebuild, Im not talking about wining trophies but we should be challenging at least.
For some reason the point of comparison is always the lower point we had under Mourinho as if that was our standard. People say he'll leave the club better than when he took it, well that would be something isnt it? Leaving the club in a worse state than Mourinho who was actively seeking to get sacked would be quite an achievement.
Before that implosing, with Mourinho we finished second with 81 points how is us ending 3rd with 66 points any kind of progress?
I swear if it was Moyes instead of Ole no one would defend him. This double standard is ridiculous, no manager had been cut so much slack as Ole.
Its as if we must lower our standard so he's not called a failure. No system, no consistency, no trophies, no proper league challenge, keeps breaking all kind of negative records and still people defend him. I just dont get it.
Till end of the season. If he dosen't get op 4 then needs to go.
Could understand waiting if Poch wasn't available but he is so go and get him before someone else does
We should let him make top 4 and bid him farewell before he has the chance to get us knocked out of next year's CL group stage. What's top 4 supposed to do if we're just going to end up playing Europa league
Pretty much this. I think the board must feel the same too. Top 4 is a much better ruler of progress rather than CL