ICC Cricket World Cup 2019

FlawlessThaw said:
No Doubt?! I mean surely there has to be a little doubt since they just finished 30 runs behind.

Also India were pretty much on track with England's score until Pandya got out. The game got away from India towards the end because the players left remaining weren't good enough not because there is absolutely no doubt they decided to collectively get together and throw the match away.
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I’m not saying they planned on such a thing from the outset. I’m saying they threw the match away at the end. There was no intent to win that game towards the end despite it being winnable.

I think Kohli wanted to win it but I wouldn’t say everyone was singing off the same hymn sheet.
 
Does Dhoni do this kind of thing often or is it just when it's against England?

He did the same thing last Summer, in fact it was even worse then.
 
Raees said:
I’m not saying they planned on such a thing from the outset. I’m saying they threw the match away at the end. There was no intent to win that game towards the end despite it being winnable.

I think Kohli wanted to win it but I wouldn’t say everyone was singing off the same hymn sheet.
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Now instead of saying "India definitely threw that match" which would have to emcompass Kohli or else he's as supposedly dumb as Steve Smith, it's "Maybe Dhoni and a couple of others decided they'd rather throw the game". Still doesn't sound plausible let alone absolutely the only logical reason behind this.

Given Dhoni's recent history of slowing down as he comes in and deciding to protect his average, perhaps that might be at the very least one option to at least put some doubt to Indian collusion.
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
Does Dhoni do this kind of thing often or is it just when it's against England?

He did the same thing last Summer, in fact it was even worse then.
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He does it alot. He is just not the kind of finisher he used to be.
 
FlawlessThaw said:
Now instead of saying "India definitely threw that match" which would have to emcompass Kohli or else he's as supposedly dumb as Steve Smith, it's "Maybe Dhoni and a couple of others decided they'd rather throw the game". Still doesn't sound plausible let alone absolutely the only logical reason behind this.

Given Dhoni's recent history of slowing down as he comes in and deciding to protect his average, perhaps that might be at the very least one option to at least put some doubt to Indian collusion.
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If you look at my initial post at no stage did I say they definitely threw it because of a particular reason. I merely speculated as to what that reason may be. Your Dhoni angle might indeed be the most reasonable and it would still lead to the same conclusion - he didn’t go out there to win when batting at the end. That’s still the same as throwing the game even if it is for a more selfish personal reason.

Kohli, Bumrah just to name but a few played at their normal level and I’m sure the same can be said for others.
 
Raees said:
If you look at my initial post at no stage did I say they definitely threw it because of a particular reason. Your Dhoni angle might indeed be the most reasonable and it would still lead to the same conclusion - he didn’t go out there to win. That’s still the same as throwing the game even if it is for a more selfish personal reason.
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Not really the same as that sort of thing happens in cricket all the time. Once a team realises that the chase is beyond them they don't always go for it and crash out all out. I mean Bangladesh and Afghanistan against England never once decided to go for the score they were set.

Maybe I misinterpreted the level of your accusation as I thought you had accused India of going full Cronje because of their sheer hatred of Pakistan. But saying a team threw a match definitely is much worse than saying the lacked the intent to win. It's not quite black and white. India disappointed but they disappointed because they are so reliant on their top 3 making a mammoth score. That didn't happen.
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
Does Dhoni do this kind of thing often or is it just when it's against England?

He did the same thing last Summer, in fact it was even worse then.
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What gets missed is that even at his peak Dhoni wasn't winning a lot of games chasing down 10 an over for a long period. Dhoni started off as a guy who could hit big shots,run crazy fast and was incredibly smart thus keeping the required run rate always in check . Then he developed this other style where he would just try to take games deep and hit big in the end . Now he still tries to take it deep but his hitting ability has gone down and he can't win too many games . At no point though was he really winning games from 100 needed from 10 and stuff
 
This is exactly why people like Waqar shouldn't be fools and say such stuff on social media . Why try to destroy the sport that gave you a career . It just makes people question such stuff even more when in reality there is no chance India would throw a game like that
 
If you play like gutless cowards then expect that people (ex-cricketers, fans, pundits) will raise a few eyebrows. If India got all out for 250 or 300 in an attempt to win the game there would no complaints from anyone.

At the end of the day, that game is not why Pakistan got eliminated but because of their own doings. Unlucky with their washout compared to New Zealand's but in the end that NRR destroying defeat to Windies is the difference between SF and elimination. Just needed a couple of calm heads that day dragging the score up to 200. Would still have lost but that way the NRR wouldn't have taken such a hammering. That's what NZ did so well vs Pakistan, at one stage they looked like scoring less than 130 but ended up getting a respectable score and persevering their NRR which is the reason why they'll qualify.
 
Samid said:
If you play like gutless cowards then expect that people (ex-cricketers, fans, pundits) will raise a few eyebrows. If India got all out for 250 or 300 in an attempt to win the game there would no complaints from anyone.

At the end of the day, that game is not why Pakistan got eliminated but because of their own doings. Unlucky with their washout compared to New Zealand's but in the end that NRR destroying defeat to Windies is the difference between SF and elimination. Just needed a couple of calm heads that day dragging the score up to 200. Would still have lost but that way the NRR wouldn't have taken such a hammering. That's what NZ did so well vs Pakistan, at one stage they looked like scoring less than 130 but ended up getting a respectable score and persevering their NRR which is the reason why they'll qualify.
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Trust me had India got all out under 250 and lost in ahuge margin the same.people would still have complained. People would have criticized india's performance irrespective of how we lost. This performance was no different to what Australia did against India with warner and his slow innings.

Again we were poor no denying that and fans have right criticized them but now I think people are overreacting and overexagerrating. If anything it's a disrespect to England's team by saying India threw away the game or did not give their 100 percent. We lost because of poor strategy and not because of lack of efforts.
 
AshRK said:
Trust me had India got all out under 250 and lost in ahuge margin the same.people would still have complained. People would have criticized india's performance irrespective of how we lost. This performance was no different to what Australia did against India with warner and his slow innings.

Again we were poor no denying that and fans have right criticized them but now I think people are overreacting and overexagerrating. If anything it's a disrespect to England's team by saying India threw away the game or did not give their 100 percent. We lost because of poor strategy and not because of lack of efforts.
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It's completely disrespectful you're right.

England played really well on Sunday and Edgbaston has become a fortress so it's not easy to beat England there.

Anyone can have a bad day and get outplayed and it happened to India that day. There's no shame in that, India are still in a great position.
 
Samid said:
If you play like gutless cowards then expect that people (ex-cricketers, fans, pundits) will raise a few eyebrows. If India got all out for 250 or 300 in an attempt to win the game there would no complaints from anyone.

At the end of the day, that game is not why Pakistan got eliminated but because of their own doings. Unlucky with their washout compared to New Zealand's but in the end that NRR destroying defeat to Windies is the difference between SF and elimination. Just needed a couple of calm heads that day dragging the score up to 200. Would still have lost but that way the NRR wouldn't have taken such a hammering. That's what NZ did so well vs Pakistan, at one stage they looked like scoring less than 130 but ended up getting a respectable score and persevering their NRR which is the reason why they'll qualify.
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So NZ did well to get to a score that preserved their RR but India should have got 250 all out chasing 340 thereby losing by 90 runs or whatever? Seems a sound logic

Chasing 340 in a World Cup is a completely different ball game altogether. India came close (lost by 31 runs). Yes it wasn’t a good performance but embarrassing? No. I mean they still won 4 other games. Convincingly too.
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
It's completely disrespectful you're right.

England played really well on Sunday and Edgbaston has become a fortress so it's not easy to beat England there.

Anyone can have a bad day and get outplayed and it happened to India that day. There's no shame in that, India are still in a great position.
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Exactly. People should watch a rerun of the last 10 overs of India batting. England had us completely tied up. You can criticize Dhoni for giving up, but we'd have lost either way imo
 
AshRK said:
Trust me had India got all out under 250 and lost in ahuge margin the same.people would still have complained. People would have criticized india's performance irrespective of how we lost. This performance was no different to what Australia did against India with warner and his slow innings.

Again we were poor no denying that and fans have right criticized them but now I think people are overreacting and overexagerrating. If anything it's a disrespect to England's team by saying India threw away the game or did not give their 100 percent. We lost because of poor strategy and not because of lack of efforts.
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India didn't throw the game, but you could see that the intensity wasn't there. We are in a good position to qualify even without winning this game, as long as the run rate was high. You could see how this played into Dhoni's calculations when things became really diffcult. If India was desperate then you would've seen Dhoni slogging much before the last over instead of taking inane singles.
 
I feel, for once, they've actually got the format right.

I was really worried at the start that India, England, Australia and New Zealand would win too many games but it hasn't happened. It's been exciting. So much so that England may not yet make it.
 
Here I am cursing the windies Australia game. That was such a winnable game that could have changed the course of the tournament. Windies should have won against Australia, New Zealand and Sri Lanka. Woe is me. feck sake
 
Skills said:
They're ran very poorly. Their leadership especially is extremely poor.

They're stacked full of talent and should be dominating like the Aussies were, but their leadership lets them down. Putting all of their eggs in the Dhoni basket after 2015 was extremely poor
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It will take another generation to completely get rid of seniority mentality. MSD should have hung up after 2017 CT. Pains to see someone like who has already established in Tests and T20s not given any opportunities in ODIs and now thrown into it at the end moment . And on the other hand Raydua and Rahane are nowhere to be seen who were supposed to the leading personnel for middle order.
 
fishfingers15 said:
Here I am cursing the windies Australia game. That was such a winnable game that could have changed the course of the tournament. Windies should have won against Australia, New Zealand and Sri Lanka. Woe is me. feck sake
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They can only manage to stay awake for 10 overs before getting dazed again. Should stick to T20s.
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
Does Dhoni do this kind of thing often or is it just when it's against England?

He did the same thing last Summer, in fact it was even worse then.
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Strike of 77 last year as a finisher (may have been 2017).

@MJJ remember when you called him a big hitter not too long ago?
 
Ayush_reddevil said:
This is exactly why people like Waqar shouldn't be fools and say such stuff on social media . Why try to destroy the sport that gave you a career . It just makes people question such stuff even more when in reality there is no chance India would throw a game like that
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I mean he is saying its poor sportmanship from India which I agree with, not even trying to win the game counts as exactly that. He isn't saying that they fixed the match unless that was said in another tweet?
 
prath92 said:
So NZ did well to get to a score that preserved their RR but India should have got 250 all out chasing 340 thereby losing by 90 runs or whatever? Seems a sound logic

Chasing 340 in a World Cup is a completely different ball game altogether. India came close (lost by 31 runs). Yes it wasn’t a good performance but embarrassing? No. I mean they still won 4 other games. Convincingly too.
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newzealand were 83 for 5, you guys needed 100 odd runs with 6 wickets in hand from the last 10 overs on a batting pitch with a short leg-side boundary. Which side would not fancy that equation? Not even trying to chase it is embarrassing.

As per cricinfo India got booed off the pitch and only scored 26 runs off 25 balls from overs 45 to 49.
 
Di Maria's angel said:
Strike of 77 last year as a finisher (may have been 2017).

@MJJ remember when you called him a big hitter not too long ago?
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There were a lot of non-Indians who rated Dhoni, thankfully everyone has seen what we've been watching for the last two years.
 
prath92 said:
So NZ did well to get to a score that preserved their RR but India should have got 250 all out chasing 340 thereby losing by 90 runs or whatever? Seems a sound logic

Chasing 340 in a World Cup is a completely different ball game altogether. India came close (lost by 31 runs). Yes it wasn’t a good performance but embarrassing? No. I mean they still won 4 other games. Convincingly too.
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What a baffling comparison. NZ went from a certain loss at 80/5 in 26 overs to put up a highly competitive score of 240. They showed spirit and fight in the second half of their batting innings and gave themselves a half decent chance of winning the game. In the end they were only a wicket or two in the middle overs away from winning it. They lost in the final over, compared to 25+ overs if they had been crumbled out for 130. Completely opposite to India's lackluster approach in the final 10 overs.

Again, losing to England in their own backyard isn't embarrassing. Failing to chase down 340 isn't embarrassing. What's embarrassing is the obvious lack of desire and intent trying to chase down the score. If you don't think the final 7-8 overs of the chase were embarrassing then either you didn't watch those overs or you're wearing blue-tinted glasses. Just 24 hours later we saw another team being set the same target and they were actually trying and fighting desperately to win the game, right until the final over. At least some people seem to understand it:





India's approach in that chase can be compared to Conte's approach vs City in his final Chelsea season. There is no shame losing 1-0 to City but the manner they lost in was embarrassing. They were heavily criticised for it and rightly so. Same with India after this game.
 
I don't know how anyone can defend India's approach against England. It was cowardly. Pakistanis are paranoid about India at the best of times so can totally understand some of their reactions.
 
Day 34: Bangladesh vs India
Imagine the meltdown if Dhoni starts hitting sixes today.

High doubt it would happen (he's pretty much finished) but that would be funny, seeing some of the meltdowns so far.
 
Like the look of this team tbh. Much more balanced provided DK can find some form. Also brings some experience to the middle order. Bhuvi is also a good inclusion, I would start with Bumrah and Shami and end with Bumrah and Bhuvi. Shami can bowl in the middle overs
 
Best team we could've picked. Lack of 6th bowler is a concern.
 
Casually playing with three recognized WKs in the team with Rahul very decent as a wicket keeper.

Good team though, I'm happy with this
 
That strike rate..

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