Listened to a few general football podcasts recently and the participants were making it absolutely clear that they're loving the current state of the team. Was quite interesting that.
I see the 'ABU' Media are back in full voice...
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Yeah. It just makes things that much harder to turn around. People inside the club, and the fans needs to realise the reality of that and become united again. It's the only way, block out the noise and the tune will change with time and due to our size all that will be drowned out. Right now if you are a level headed United fan, not angry at the world, you're in the minority and probably a bit weird to most United fans. There is probably a similar effect that have reached the players at this point, the nervousness and spectacular ways of underperforming is like some sort of spell they are not allowed to break free from.
In terms of performance, I don't think fans truly understand how big of an issue the midfield has been or how much importance that position and the full back position have on the ability of the team to perform. Teams no longer build up directly, they play out from the back. In the past, a scrap in midfield with physical players and quality attackers would lead to countless victories...today that occurs very rarely...it's something United have never adapted to imo. Players in those positions are responsible for providing energy in the team ( both in attack and defence), whilst also being the prime agents of building up.
In 16/17, Conte was able to turn Chelsea completely around by adopting a 343 after starting the season with a 433. It allowed them to not have to build up intricately through the middle, whilst being able to cover their flanks, giving Hazard and Pedro freedom in attack without needing to cover their wing back defensively. The energy of the team came from both Kante and the wing backs. They won the league due to this.
Prior to Thiago's arrival, Liverpool's midfield on paper looked pretty ordinary. Henderson and Wijnaldum, both good players but were never truly spectacular. However they were able to build up to the attack spaces due to having both Robertson and TAA willing to spray passes from the flanks, constantly switching play and creating space for Henderson and Wijnaldum to get further forward. They were dominant in many games with that team. The full backs being able to heavily support the build up allowed Salah, Mane and Firmino to cause havoc consistently.
This is to say that, more than simply just nerves, our inability to dominate games has almost exclusively been a result of being technically and physically poor at both full back and central midfield positions.
Fred has been unable to win possession back consistently despite boatloads of energy due to lack of size, positioning and tackling ability. He is also not great at holding unto the ball which is why our defenders find it difficult to get the ball to him.
Mctominay is a genuinely horrible player. He doesn't offer much on the ball outside of a bit of dribbling ability. His off the ball movement is also particularly terrible, he never helps to get the ball from the defenders and that is a massive issue in our build up since he came into the team. Where Fred can find situations where the opposition isn't heavily pressing him so he can recieve the ball and move it forward at times, Mctominay doesn't offer this at all. Off the ball, his positioning, anticipation, marking and tackling ability are completely off the mark. His only defensive attributes are his height and strength, but with his lack of balance, even when he wins duels, he's not able to sustain the advantage.
Shaw is a decent player. However his lack of athleticism, poor work rate and poor awareness are never highlighted as much as they should be. He constantly stops in possession which completely halts our build up play. His energy levels are very poor. Where other full backs help the midfield cover ground with their athleticism, Shaw usually offers very little support, which is why we get so many gaps when we are out of set or getting countered. Those attacks usually come from the left side, not because of Rashford, but because of Shaw.
Really good write up
Which is why people predicting us winning the league before last season was ridiculous and the following crash wasn't all that surprising. Ole was being used as a tool to get the fans off the owners backs, then when things inevitably turned to shit after being told to use what he has, he got most the blame. People believed a good manager could get a tune out of these players, totally forgetting about the negative energy within the team before Ole came in and turned that around. Now we have a new manager, not such a happy lad as Ole, but faced with a similar challenge in building a positive attitude, mitigate the negative energy, perform every season whilst also building for the future. We can't get rid of players, or don't want to, and struggle to buy at the right moments... so the power of this manager seems to be limited to only performing the role of captain on a sinking ship.
Hyperbole
Never seen a club in the bottom 3 buy a £60m CDM in January before, plus possible additional af Anthony.
To be very honest, Ole, Jose and LVG all had the power to fix these issues.
This is not to say that the Glazers aren't bad owners, but the kitty was there.
Our mistake post-Fergie in the markets has been twofold: a. trusting that managers would have the interest of the club. b. Awarding contracts based on trying to be as player friendly as possibly despite poor results, seemingly to keep the culture of loyalty that Fergie has in players ( doesn't work so well when lacking overall quality.
These were not Glazer decisions, but rather that of Woodward and the managers.
1. Jose chose to spend big on a few big names who he didn't have a plan for when they came in ( signing Dalot, Bailly, Lindelof, Fred) to supplement those signings in attacking areas, almost totally neglecting to sign quality in those positions. He also chose to sign aging players that had already shown evidence of being past it ( Sanchez and Matic)
2. LVG was completely irresponsible in the market. He sold a lot of the quality we had or could have used and replaced them with average players across the board. He bought and sold players based on an initial formation he only used for 5 months. He convinced fans that with the likes of McNair and Blackett, he could still win (therefore selling most of the useful squad options we had that we could get money for). He bought the likes of Darmian, Rojo, Blind, Falcao, Memphis, Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger. He bought Di Maria, only to isolate him. In the time period, we did not sign a modern full back or good midfield players- yet the funds were given to him to do so.
3. Ole was given options as well. Maguire and AWB were signed for far too much money, neither have proven to be able to play the modern game. To his credit we signed our best players under him - Varane, Sancho, Bruno, Ronaldo....but then we also gave ridiculous contracts to the likes of Mctominay during this time. He decided to hold on to Pogba who barely featured under him. He's the one who promised first team opportunities. He also had the opportunity to sign a DM, but never did so during his time.
My point here is, we can sit here and blame the Glazers, but it's not true that our managers have not been backed.
We just gave far too much trust in managers that didn't think of the club long term.
Ole was the only one who did, but simply didn't have the ability to manage a club of our size.
Woodward and Judge made it also very difficult to let go of the poor players that were signed due to quickly handing them massive contracts.
This has made selling and rebuilding off of those sales pretty difficult.
If the Glazers knew more about football, maybe they question those decisions
Unfortunately leaving a guy like Woodward in charge for so long, who cared about protecting assets rather than success on the pitch has its consequences. That is why we are where we are, not the Glazers.
When a club is failing, everything they do is bad. Every signing is stupid, every tactic is ridiculous, every player is bad, every fan is unrealistic. Glazers are turning United into a joke but Casemiro is actually a good signing.
This is incorrect. Owners who want their football club to win do not handicap transfer spending by annual interest payment (due to the debt they loaded onto the club) and dividends to themselves. This analysis that it's Woodward's fault and not the Glazers is lazy - Woodward was appointed by the Glazers. Also, most reliable sources indicate that Joel Glazer is heavily involved in the day to day running of the club.
Re: it's the managers fault: Please show me a manager who has never failed with transfers!? On average, only 50% or so transfers are successful. A club as revenue-rich as United should be able to overcome these failures by ruthlessly replacing players who fail, and not indulge them to preserve their value or for commercial reasons.
That article by Oliver Holt today is shocking.
He obviously hates us.
He obviously hates us.
That's been obvious for about the last 15 years or so. An absolute cnut of a man.
Again not to defend them, but when you shell the kind of funds we have done over the last ten years, how can you even say its the owners.
I just gave examples of failures from the different managers.
However if we put it that way, how come our 50% of transfer failures are this costly. That has to do with who was brought, the wages they recieve and their resale value. You can't be ruthless if no one wants what you're selling which has been a constant theme over the last ten years, again down to Woodward.
It also has to do with the players we have gotten. Most of them are barely mid-table players, yet managers like LVG, who had a heavy hand in bringing in those players aren't to blame? It's not like he doesn't have a track record of this ( Barcelona 2003) or that Jose's 2016 meltdown didn't forewarn us of what was to come.
The fact remains that as much interest payments that are made, as a club we have outspent other clubs on poor transfers with poor returns both on the pitch and resale. Unless they directed the club to sign the players they did ( which clearly they don't have the knowledge to do), then they can't be at fault for the failing transfers.
From all accounts, the Glazers are rather passive owners (overly passive imo). Aside from a few instances like the 2019 Martial situation, they don't get involved.
Do I like the Glazers...No
Do I feel they are good owners....No
Do I feel that we have had windows where they chose not to spend much....yes
However when the purse strings were opened up we did nothing with it and you cannot blame that on them
On paper Casemiro looked a good buy albeit the price and salary is too much. However given the style ten Hag wants to play I’m not sure it’s a great signing. It’s a classic United signing. Big name but there is a lack of though on the squad build and how players compliment each other.
What’s he said? And isn’t he a Liverpool fan?
Considering the early rumours of interest in Kante and that Ajax played Edson Alvarez in DM I don’t see a problem with signing Casemiro. He’s genuinely one of the world best midfielders. We still need more of a playmaker but he’s a clear upgrade.
If the Glazers cared about the football side they would have sacked the likes of Woodward for wasting millions of ‘their’ money.
This is why I can’t support them. We’ve spent enough but we all know how poorly that money has been spent. After LVG or Mourinho was sacked or Lukaku was bought and sold they should be sacking key personnel for being incompetent. Instead Woodward leaves on his own timeline and others have been promoted.
He’s a disgusting toad-like creature, with a deep-seated bitterness towards United. I guess he must be a Liverpool fan. His pieces on us for 15-20 years draw from his psychosis around us. I think he believes they’re subtle, but unfortunately when your writing age is primary school level it’s pretty easy for non-Mirror readers to identify the bias.
Mail on line were an arrogant cesspit of a club basically
Yes you can. Their whole philosophy is 'make money' so they put bankers and money makers in key positions who are out of their depths football wise and are just their puppets there to make them money, Woodward being the obvious case. He appointed the wrong managers and helped them make some wrong decisions in the transfer market as he was clueless. It's why fans have been screaming for a proper DoF, to stop this happening, but the Glazers chose to ignore this and were happy with Woodward plodding on.
We are actually seeing a classic example of Glazernomics in action literally (correct usage for once!) right now as we try and buy Antony for twice the price he was a few weeks ago. Why? Because the Glazers/their puppets didn't want to spend money so we were looking in the bargain buckets. Now they realise they simply have to spend so it's back to a loads of money period. The wallet's open, help yourself. Utterly ridiculous mismanagement from the owners, board and the decision makers they appoint. The whole way the club is structured and run is responsible for the mess we're in and that is 100% down to the Glazers. Actually, it's football, so it's 110% their fault.
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I agree with you. This is where they should be blamed. Being so passive as to allow Woodward hurt the club for years. We legitimately did not have a modern footballing side until recently just based off of Woodward's ego. To allow that level of mismanagement go unchecked for as long as they did, only stepping up after protests to exact change was criminal from them which is what made them poor owners.
Bayern Munich would not have allowed that, Chelsea would not have allowed that, Barca would not have allowed it to go on for as long as it did, Madrid would not have allowed that and City would not have allowed it. But we did and that's why even though we have improved our methods, we are going to play catch up.
Well he's not wrong but feck him anyway
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&s...DKAB6BAggEAE&usg=AOvVaw3WzwwaSlhEUAVR_sIhsgjZ
Comparing us to giggs deary me
Comparing us to giggs deary me
Giggs is in the news so making the comparison allows him to say "United are bad" and make it look vaguely new and insightful
What ridiculous contract is McTominay on? Also, Pogba didn't feature because of injuries, not like Lingard where he was a benchwarmer.
Why would Bruno be sent off? It was Utds ball and Bruno kicks off for us who had the ball!
fecking insane that I’m seeing this everywhere
Mate their heads are gone. They've properly lost it.
Wow. They’re really upset that we won against their team the other day. Bitter bellends.
Neville squeals when Chelsea score to go to the CL final - Ha, hilarious. A meme that will live on for years. Classic Neville. A national treasure.
Neville squeals when United score against Liverpool - No Gary, stop that. Stop that right now.
Neville squeals when United score against Liverpool - No Gary, stop that. Stop that right now.
I don't get it either. It's not their ball. Why are they suggesting Bruno is obligated to give the ball to the opposition for a dead ball that isn't even theirs, to the extent that he should be sent off for not doing so? It's bonkers.
A stronger referee would have shooed Salah and Firmino away, and booked them if they persisted. But it was soft touch Oliver and he did neither.
So they will say the same when Jamie Carragher does exactly the same?
Exactly. Its times like this you're reminded how many Liverpool supporters work in football.
Exactly. It was our restart. Surely if Fernandes takes an age to restart the game, which is seemingly their beef, more stoppage time gets added. Oliver added five minutes. Its not like he raced to finish the match.
I remember Carragher basically smashing one out when Mo Salah scored against us a couple years ago at Anfield. Calling him a little dancer or some crap like that. Not a peep from the ABU media.
But this is fine
Ex-Liverpool players are more professional in their approach to punditry, to be fair.
This is not Phil Thompson celebrating Liverpool grabbing a late equaliser against United a few years back.
More reasons to wish nothing but misery on Liverpool. I dislike City, complete antichrist of football IMO, but fans are sparse and nobody actually cares that much so the reaction isn't as insufferable.
Agree what are we missing. UTD ko after conceding a goal. Did Salah run into the net to pick up the ball last season for UTD to ko?. Cascarino is a stupid man and comes out with utter garbage, if he's got nothing sensible to say say nothing you tool.
Head's gone
Amazing. Liverpool get one voice being biased against them in one moment and articles are written
Did he ever reply to explain what’s wrong with the stadium getting some paint?
A proper big club has 3-D printed polyvinyl facades that shoot out of slots in the ground and replace the existing ones instantly. Paint? Paint is so twentieth century.
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