I'd add Will Keane in there as well. I was convinced he was going to make it until he got that ACL just before his contract expired. One of the unluckiest players out there between injuries and managerial changes. He's at Ipswich now so you never know.
I really thought James Wilson and Nick Powell would make it at a high level
- Thread starter bazalini
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In fairness, he went on to be a good player and perhaps even a very good player at Villarreal. I’d need to look into it, but I recall him doing really well early doors for Fiorentina, before injury struck again. I’d have been around 12-15 years old when he was with us and, for whatever reason, I envisaged him going on to score an incredible amount of goals for Utd. If I remember correctly, he signed the signed the same year as Piqué and I was high on both of them. Hyped them up to anyone who would listen!
Agreed, absolutely loved him. Didn’t mean he failed, he was just among the talents I can remember coming trough our ranks since the early 2000s. And just from the top of my head, I’m sure there is more.
Thanks for the shout out, @bazalini but I’m genuinely clueless compared to the youth football experts you mentioned. There’s a bunch of others who are way more clued in than I am. @limerickcitykid , @Classical Mechanic , @jb8521 to nam but a few. My youth football expertise began and ended with an impulsive MUTV subscription for a few years in the mid 00s (and a brief but passionate infatuation with Guisseppi Rossi and Rodrigo Possebon)Are you referring to one of Magnus Eikrem or Mats Moller Daehli?
Eikrem had a decent-ish European career. His best spell was in Scandinavia with Malmo and Molde (currently there in his 2nd spell). He was okay at Heerenveen as well before Ole brought him into Cardiff where he, ultimately, didn't work out. He even had a spell with the Seattle Sounders in MLS before returning to Molde.
Daehli has had a better European career. He had a few more games at Cardiff under Ole before moving onto Freiburg where he barely played. He then moved to St. Pauli where he played more often, and he's now at Genk.
Still remember his red card against Arsenal and just knowing we were going to struggle in midfield in the CL final without him.
Looking back now, nothing was stopping that Barca team. But as you said, really good player, and a good goal threat from midfield too.
I got Rossi and Adnan badly wrong
To a lesser extent I overhyped Wes Brown I thought he was going to be world class . Injuries didn’t help him.
To a lesser extent I overhyped Wes Brown I thought he was going to be world class . Injuries didn’t help him.
Maybe Mads Timm.
There are a bunch of young Scandinavians who came through our Academy and Reserve sides over the years (Timm, Djorjic, Nevland, Hussain, etc.), but out of all of those names, I remember being quite excited about Daehli. It's sad to see him not kick on, but at least he has a decent European career going for him.
I did have the name Moller Daehli at the back of my mind but Eikrem was the one I was thinking of that I couldn't then remember if that makes any sense? Thanks for the reminder and for bringing me up to speed on their respective careers!
Hang on, I thought the narrative was that we’d have won the final if Fletcher hadn’t been erroneously dismissed. Get wit the story!
I remember watching Eikrem live for the Sounders against Toronto FC at BMO Field. For the most part, he looked incredibly disinterested, but he did provide one assist that contributed to their win over us. I'm glad that he's gone back to Molde; he never looked comfortable outside of Scandinavia for the most part.
I honestly thought Rodrigo Possebon was gonna be a world class midfielder.
Januzaj and Macheda are two that spring to mind that were the most disappointing.
Was never convinced on either Powell or Wilson. Always thought Wilson was a decent poacher but lacked technical ability.
Powell seemed limited, but he had some strike on him from range!
It's so hard to judge youth players. Only the very cream of the crop make it into the first team straight from youth level, and even at that it can go either way.
The ones that make it usually have ironclad mentality. Greenwood and Gomes are two examples, Greenwood has that elite mentality, whereas to me Gomes lacks that mental fortitude to deal with the pressures of being a Man Utd player.
Gomes needed to move away from that pressure to develop, but it can really go either way for guys like him. I think the first year after youth players realise they aren't going to make it and move are the most critical. How they deal with that change defines their career.
Problem I see with a lot of young guys is that they leave it too late to make that jump. If you're not in and around the first team by 18/19, then you have to look to move on. Even leaving it till 20/21 is too late.
It's fascinating to look back at players who make it/dont make it and try to determine the definitive quality that sets them apart.
Was never convinced on either Powell or Wilson. Always thought Wilson was a decent poacher but lacked technical ability.
Powell seemed limited, but he had some strike on him from range!
It's so hard to judge youth players. Only the very cream of the crop make it into the first team straight from youth level, and even at that it can go either way.
The ones that make it usually have ironclad mentality. Greenwood and Gomes are two examples, Greenwood has that elite mentality, whereas to me Gomes lacks that mental fortitude to deal with the pressures of being a Man Utd player.
Gomes needed to move away from that pressure to develop, but it can really go either way for guys like him. I think the first year after youth players realise they aren't going to make it and move are the most critical. How they deal with that change defines their career.
Problem I see with a lot of young guys is that they leave it too late to make that jump. If you're not in and around the first team by 18/19, then you have to look to move on. Even leaving it till 20/21 is too late.
It's fascinating to look back at players who make it/dont make it and try to determine the definitive quality that sets them apart.
That would have been me....
He had no clue what was going on. He was in my work (I played golf with him only a few months back so know him) - I got a load of these signs and think @Gaz. Got one for his bedroom wall.
I also got Rory McIlroy to open a redcafe account on 2006
Fair play to you guys. It great to go back and read up on these guys. It's surprising how many play lower league football and Sri in the game.
I came across some guy who played international football for Libya but only ever played 3 clubs his entire career. He had a club career of 8 clubs. That's some going.
I cry every morning reminding myself of how good Adnan Januzaj once was.
James Wilson - Bad luck and Injury, He was still a great player at Brighton but couldn't even play for 90 minutes because of his knees, then everything was going wrong with his match fitness. In the same boat: Will Kean and Guiseppe Rossi
Nick Powell - Attitude, He also got worse injury record but he loves that period as he was in holiday. I still remember his tweet moaning the traning session after a long rest. In the same boat: Ravel Morrison
Adnan Januzaj - Pressure, some of the fans expecting him to be Ronaldo or Rooney. Not every youngster had that tough mentality to handle the pressure. He is still a good player for Sociedad though. In the same boat: Memphis Depay.
Nick Powell - Attitude, He also got worse injury record but he loves that period as he was in holiday. I still remember his tweet moaning the traning session after a long rest. In the same boat: Ravel Morrison
Adnan Januzaj - Pressure, some of the fans expecting him to be Ronaldo or Rooney. Not every youngster had that tough mentality to handle the pressure. He is still a good player for Sociedad though. In the same boat: Memphis Depay.
I thought Januzaj was certain to be a good player for us. Since that was not the case, now I always predict youth players to be crap and well, I am mostly right.
Rossi could have a top United player so I think we were right about him. Too injury prone. Wilson could have made it but maybe his personality wasn't strong enough when things didn't go well. His finishing was very good but perhaps he lacked the strength. Adnan didn't make it for united but I don't think he had the goals in him. I do think he would have been a good central creative midfielder. tunnicliffe/Pearson very industrious. Harrop in his one game for United was quality but he lacked the belief maybe that he could get regular games. There's been a number but there is no reason why we cannot produce our own talent. There's a ton of luck involved.
I remember when we had Brandy, Cofie and Drinkwater in the same time. You sort of knew who’d make it professionally ...
Alex Notman was my first taste of the soil, as we say up north. Scored bucketloads at u16, u18 and reserves. Alex The Great was never to be his nickname, as he was rather midgety. Wouldn’t claim he was ‘not man’ though.
Another shout for Januzaj, he really looked like a world-class talent. He carried our attack in several games throughout the Moyes era and was the only positive thing to come out of that doomed season. Such a shame his attitude seemed to stink so much.
I think we were all excited about Pereira when he first burst onto the scene too. Again, a shame it hasn't worked out and he seems to regress a little bit more every year.
I think we were all excited about Pereira when he first burst onto the scene too. Again, a shame it hasn't worked out and he seems to regress a little bit more every year.
You know it's sometimes easy to forget -
players dont just one day progress to the top by fulfilling their 'potential' like they do in Fifa or Football manager.
These players are humans like me and you all are. We could have all the ability to A certain thing in the world but we might have other things that just dont link up for us like the next door neighbour seem to do. Whos to say that if SAF had stayed for an extra year that Wilson wouldnt have settled and breaking records like he was doing before? That didnt happen and he eventually leaves to a different city. Whose to say they dont settle in the city (we cant just move around random cities in our life and expect to work to the same standard).Maybe these players have other problems in their life that interferes with their problems (emotional, physical, mental).
For all we know there are players all over the players like Vardy & Kante that never get to move up from the lower leagues because the scout called in sick one day.
It's just easy to forget sometimes that a talent may or may not always be there but a life or career is completely has a random chance to come out the way you want.
I was better than my brother in all my a levels and studies - he & me did the same postgraduate medical degree because he got to live with his girlfriend & other advantages whilst I didnt and struggled.
These players could still be great as we once thought they were; however something might have not just gone the right way to help their career out in the end.
players dont just one day progress to the top by fulfilling their 'potential' like they do in Fifa or Football manager.
These players are humans like me and you all are. We could have all the ability to A certain thing in the world but we might have other things that just dont link up for us like the next door neighbour seem to do. Whos to say that if SAF had stayed for an extra year that Wilson wouldnt have settled and breaking records like he was doing before? That didnt happen and he eventually leaves to a different city. Whose to say they dont settle in the city (we cant just move around random cities in our life and expect to work to the same standard).Maybe these players have other problems in their life that interferes with their problems (emotional, physical, mental).
For all we know there are players all over the players like Vardy & Kante that never get to move up from the lower leagues because the scout called in sick one day.
It's just easy to forget sometimes that a talent may or may not always be there but a life or career is completely has a random chance to come out the way you want.
I was better than my brother in all my a levels and studies - he & me did the same postgraduate medical degree because he got to live with his girlfriend & other advantages whilst I didnt and struggled.
These players could still be great as we once thought they were; however something might have not just gone the right way to help their career out in the end.
It seems I am in the minority but I always found Januzaj overrated. He had a few good games when everyone else was just bad and that’s it.
I got the feeling that the hype around him came mostly from the anger about having lost Pogba for free and the fear of not making the same mistake with him.
I got the feeling that the hype around him came mostly from the anger about having lost Pogba for free and the fear of not making the same mistake with him.
Looking back I was spot on about Wilson and Januzaj. Dont really remember what i thought of Powell, but I knew one of his friends who always said he didnt care about football.
I never rated Daehli, Eikrem, Wilson, the other striker who was a bit like a poor man's Berbatov?, Pereira, Lingard and a few others after watching them a lot in the youth teams. Macheda, Januzaj, Morrison, Pogba I did rate.
The week before Macheda's debut vs Villa when he scored that goal, he played another amazing game for the u21s and I was desperate for him to get a chance. Then he came on and scored, one of my best experiences at Old Trafford. The same with Januzaj, he was tearing it up in the u21s and I thought he was a cert to make it. I still think LVG ruined him by giving him the no11 then dropping him like a stone after a slow start and sending him on loan. He never got that chance to be brought through properly, he was relied upon so much and had to perform. We let him down big time as a club and I'll always believe that.
Ravel will forever be my biggest "regret". I'd never been so excited about a player at United and he was in our youth team. I remember watching him in the youth Cup with Pogba and they were unreal. It sounds daft but it feels like some sort of alternative reality not ever seeing him just get that chance in the first team to show the world what he could do, I feel like we've really been robbed of a special chapter at Old Trafford. We should have been talking about him as one of the greats.
The week before Macheda's debut vs Villa when he scored that goal, he played another amazing game for the u21s and I was desperate for him to get a chance. Then he came on and scored, one of my best experiences at Old Trafford. The same with Januzaj, he was tearing it up in the u21s and I thought he was a cert to make it. I still think LVG ruined him by giving him the no11 then dropping him like a stone after a slow start and sending him on loan. He never got that chance to be brought through properly, he was relied upon so much and had to perform. We let him down big time as a club and I'll always believe that.
Ravel will forever be my biggest "regret". I'd never been so excited about a player at United and he was in our youth team. I remember watching him in the youth Cup with Pogba and they were unreal. It sounds daft but it feels like some sort of alternative reality not ever seeing him just get that chance in the first team to show the world what he could do, I feel like we've really been robbed of a special chapter at Old Trafford. We should have been talking about him as one of the greats.
I absolutely thought James Wilson will be a great player and I'm pretty sure many United fans at this time were thinking the same time. Shite happens, unfortunately.
Brown was world-class in 07/08. His performance in the CL semi against Barca was legendary.
Just to add a new name, I liked Tyler Blackett... yeah I know.... things like these is why I am still a newbie haha
I liked him until he gave the ball back to Bony (I think) too quickly before we could set our defence up and Swansea scored. Genuinely do not remember another thing he did after that moment.
I’m with you. I wanted him to be good so bad that I hyped up his performances just to have some hope that season but in all honesty I didn’t think he was mentally or physically fast enough
James wilson i was never that impressed by. I wasnt a youth team watcher and all is saw was when he came on for the first team. He never looked like he had anything to his game to me. Posters would say how much of a sharp shooter he was but i never saw it atleast. Nick powell was just bad. IMO and i'll get flogged for it here but Scott Mctominay will be seen as the same in 4 years time
Thought Matty James would become a fixture in the midfield.
James Wilson - We didn't really have a stat showing his goal rate compared to others. So while we knew he had scored like 23 in 29 matches or something (not counting Dallas Cup I think), we had no way to compare just how good it was to his fellow strikers at youth level. He was quite limited in technical ability, but he had a handful of solo goals that made me think those limitations might not be enough to deter him from having a good career up top. His speed was outstanding and he had a great ball striking technique with his left.
Example: Here are his goals against City
The only comparison I could directly compare him to was Keane, and Dembele. I don't think Keane had the record that Wilson had, so Wilson was seen as our pinnacle since Rossi. Dembele was superior. Superior technique and goal scoring record as Fulham have a wiki that tabulates statistics for their youth teams.
Turns out his limitations were enough to stop him from being a top striker. On the other hand, Rashford didn't have the same goal scoring record (when converted to striker), but did have superior technical ability and that was enough to succeed at first team level.
Greenwood put it in perspective. Superior technique (added bonus to that being that he's 2 footed), and superior goal scoring stats. 23 goals in 29 appearances doesn't compare to Greenwood's record who did it at a younger age too. Plus, you can now compare Wilson's goal scoring record with Tammy Abraham, Balogun, and a few others and his goal scoring record isn't all that special at youth level. Greenwood separates himself by being at the top bracket where Abraham and Dembele were, but with great technique. Easy to see why he succeeded and why James Wilson didn't now.
Januzaj was great. Great balance, good vision, held the ball up well when played up top (rotating with Lingard as we had no striker), and was pretty much our man of the match every match during his initial string of u21 performances. He was a very unselfish player who even if he didn't fill up the stat sheet, helped the team win with brilliant play to advance the play, or set up the assist, or hold the ball up, etc...
Then Moyes came in with Giggs. They were adamant in turning him into the next Ryan Giggs. Since that summer, he was a more dynamic player where he would run at players in ways he didn't before. And he succeeded in going past players, but this made his decision making far more selfish which crept into his first team career, and he was never the same unselfish player he initially was with United.
Naturally as fans, we simply thought he added that part of the game into his locker and made him an even more dominant talent. Just look at how he toyed with Liverpool. Sets up the 2 goals without getting the assist is another example of him being a net positive.
But then his lack of pace got to him, and he has had to build up that part of his dribbling game up. He's pretty decent now in that area, but his decision making has deteriorated and he's far more selfish, making him not the outstanding player we thought he would be. He's no longer the same attacking midfielder many thought he would turn out to be. He is a winger. And that's fine, but his initial strength was his decision making.
Example: Here are his goals against City
The only comparison I could directly compare him to was Keane, and Dembele. I don't think Keane had the record that Wilson had, so Wilson was seen as our pinnacle since Rossi. Dembele was superior. Superior technique and goal scoring record as Fulham have a wiki that tabulates statistics for their youth teams.
Turns out his limitations were enough to stop him from being a top striker. On the other hand, Rashford didn't have the same goal scoring record (when converted to striker), but did have superior technical ability and that was enough to succeed at first team level.
Greenwood put it in perspective. Superior technique (added bonus to that being that he's 2 footed), and superior goal scoring stats. 23 goals in 29 appearances doesn't compare to Greenwood's record who did it at a younger age too. Plus, you can now compare Wilson's goal scoring record with Tammy Abraham, Balogun, and a few others and his goal scoring record isn't all that special at youth level. Greenwood separates himself by being at the top bracket where Abraham and Dembele were, but with great technique. Easy to see why he succeeded and why James Wilson didn't now.
Januzaj was great. Great balance, good vision, held the ball up well when played up top (rotating with Lingard as we had no striker), and was pretty much our man of the match every match during his initial string of u21 performances. He was a very unselfish player who even if he didn't fill up the stat sheet, helped the team win with brilliant play to advance the play, or set up the assist, or hold the ball up, etc...
Then Moyes came in with Giggs. They were adamant in turning him into the next Ryan Giggs. Since that summer, he was a more dynamic player where he would run at players in ways he didn't before. And he succeeded in going past players, but this made his decision making far more selfish which crept into his first team career, and he was never the same unselfish player he initially was with United.
Naturally as fans, we simply thought he added that part of the game into his locker and made him an even more dominant talent. Just look at how he toyed with Liverpool. Sets up the 2 goals without getting the assist is another example of him being a net positive.
But then his lack of pace got to him, and he has had to build up that part of his dribbling game up. He's pretty decent now in that area, but his decision making has deteriorated and he's far more selfish, making him not the outstanding player we thought he would be. He's no longer the same attacking midfielder many thought he would turn out to be. He is a winger. And that's fine, but his initial strength was his decision making.
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Youve got to separate these into categories. Many of these players were seen as having the potential to be solid squad players, very few were seen as being big time first team regulars. That said....
Fletcher was brilliant before his ulcerative colitis, so doesn’t deserve to be on your list.
Richardson, Eagles, Campbell and Simpson were seen as good players with potential to be squad players, but I don’t think there was any hype about them being the next big thing.
Januzaj was hyped to the heavens but not just our fans but also the media, and will go down as a major disappointment. That was a mentality rather than talent issue.
Cleverly was one of those players who was seen as being good, not great, but was being schooled in the dojo of SAF, so anything was possible. He spent most of his career here taking shit from fans, aside from a few heady days when he was involved in that goal against City in the Community shield and the 8-2 thumping of Arsenal.
Welbeck had this unique mixture of flair and work rate. After we played Madrid back in 2012/13, the Spanish media went nuts over him. It was widely seen that all he needed to add was more end product because when he was on, he had it all, but he was still very inconsistent. If SAF had stayed, I believe he would’ve had a great career here. He’s gone on to have a good career, albeit one destroyed by injuries.
Wilson looked electric in the academy and banged in two on his debut. But his mentality and loss of pace killed his career. I think many had high hopes for him but they were internal to the club. He wasn’t recognised as a big talent outside our fan base.
Macheda is a cult icon for that goal against Villa. And he had all the tools, bar pace, to be a top clinical striker. Another cautionary tale of work ethic being as, or more, important as talent.
McTominay has been the target of fan ire for ages, with most believing he’s not good enough. I’d say he’s made it despite expectations rather than failing to live up to them. Think he’ll be a solid squad player for us for several years. Which is a great achievement in its own right.
Greenwood is a massive talent is widely recognised across the country as such. If he doesn’t make it you can file that along with Ravel and Januzaj for the scale of disappointment. He’s already down more for the first team than any of the players mentioned here bar Fletcher, who shouldn’t be included.
Rashford has already put up massive numbers for a player his age. That’s obvious just by comparing him to players like Kane and Ronaldo at his age. If he doesn’t goon to be a huge player for us moving forwards it’ll be a disappointment. He is currently suffering from that capital crime as a young United player, of not being world class every game. He gets so much criticism from people expecting him to be the finished article already despite having gone through 3 managers already, being very young, moving across positions, and suffering a serious back injury. My hopes are high for him.
Rossi would’ve had a superb career if he wasn’t made of glass.
Of our current players coming through, Mejbri is probably the obvious candidate for the next hype train.
Rossi is a great shout, he was very unlucky coming through when he did along with those injuries. Still he had a pretty good career.