Well said.
How to fall in love with the club again?
- Thread starter Maciej
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Well said.
OGS coming in has been like your girlfriend's mum leaving after a visit and her place being taken by a young number that's up for a threesome. Seriously though, from about 1995 onwards to about the Sevilla game, I watched virtually every game unless there was some real exigency. No matter what, the game was a priority. Then, it began to drag. Late night games were given a clear miss as the morning workouts were more important; taking my son to his football class took precedence over some games too. Under Ole, I've not missed a minute. Late nights or whatever, the game takes priority. I even shuffled my son's football class around to ensure we could watch the game together - he's 4, but has started following the games too and even learned a couple of chants.
That's not because of the wins (though they help). It's because of the mentality and the style of play. I feel excited again while watching the games and that is something no manager after Fergie (and before Ole) managed. It's also about how Ole speaks to the media and how he behaves in every aspect. For most fans, "the club" is quite simply the face we see - the manager, the players and their interactions. Only a handful feel the community impact or have kids in the academy. For everyone else, the club is about these public faces. And Jose had me feeling miserable each time there was an interaction - leave aside the games. I never fell out of love with the club, but the oxytocin levels had dipped to an all-time low.
Glad to report that the oxytocin levels are off the charts right now.
@fishfingers15 Optimists uniting? We go for the treble now!
That's not because of the wins (though they help). It's because of the mentality and the style of play. I feel excited again while watching the games and that is something no manager after Fergie (and before Ole) managed. It's also about how Ole speaks to the media and how he behaves in every aspect. For most fans, "the club" is quite simply the face we see - the manager, the players and their interactions. Only a handful feel the community impact or have kids in the academy. For everyone else, the club is about these public faces. And Jose had me feeling miserable each time there was an interaction - leave aside the games. I never fell out of love with the club, but the oxytocin levels had dipped to an all-time low.
Glad to report that the oxytocin levels are off the charts right now.
@fishfingers15 Optimists uniting? We go for the treble now!
But that's the thing. Most I know didn't stop feeling as much love and connection because of results. Jose managed an EL and Cup. He got us up to second too. But people were talking about this feeling then too. It was not the results. It was because of the love and connection they felt. When Jose spoke, he demeaned the club and its history (Sevilla). He demeaned the academy (pre-season) and publicly shamed the team and players (all season) apart from leaking his disdain about the Board (when talking of signings). Sorry, but if anyone that loved the club didn't feel put off by that, that's when I'd question whether they really love the club, or just the trophies.
Nobody I know wanted the team to lose. Everyone wanted us to win, but the feeling that Jose was sucking the life out of the club was real and frankly, specially with hindsight, well-founded too. So no, people were not asking for the moon. People weren't demanding that we win the title every season or they stop supporting the club. United remains the world's best-supported club almost 6 years after we last won a major honour. That's not because most fans are "fair-weather merchants".
Edit:
When did Fergie publicly slam the club? When did he humiliate the club to the extent that Jose did? Please don't even try to equate Jose's antics with The Great Man.
Unlike what many folks here have stated, I didnt quite fall out of love with the club. I dont see how that would ever be possible since it is an indispensable part of life now. I did however find myself more willing to miss certain games and deprioritizing them much like what has been said before. I dont think it was because of the style of football or even Mournihos demeanor. I reckon it was simply down to the attitude he tried to inflict upon the club. Getting 2nd last year was his biggest achievement footballing wise, the press conference after the loss to Sevilla etc. Those are the things that did it for me. He just didnt get the club similar to Moyes (remember when he wanted us to aspire to be like the berties ?). OGS is the first time after SAF, that someone at the helm gets the club. And no, I dont think you need to have played for the club or been a part of it to get it. Loads of observers get the club better than the likes of Moyes or Mourinho.
I didn't specifically say "results," I said the team "doing well," and as I've said several times, that's inclusive of of more than just results.
However, you're naive if you this thread would be bumped, if these good vibes would have returned, if we were getting whipped every week under Ole. If supporting the club, not the manager or the players but the club, during a difficult is a sign of a lack of love for it, I think you've got everything a bit backwards. Call me old fashioned, but a period of relative tribulation shouldn't have you questioning your love for the club. Feel frustrated or having less enthusiasm than usual is fair enough, but those are different things.
As the divisive Johnny Vaughn says: don't let the football get in the way of a good day out at the football. I wonder how you'd explain the passion still shown by fans of Sunderland, Plymouth, Wimbledon etc. who have had a torrid time over recent years, but still follow their club around the country rain or shine.
No, I'll call you completely deluded.
Get the feck out
Nice of you to pop over from the City Forum.
Thanks for being a fan
Yep, I love Fergie to bits but he was a complete megalamoniac and a tosspot.
Stick to your 'Is football forum safe again' safe space buddy
I'll message you if we win tonight chap so you'll know whether to watch the highlights later. I wouldn't want you to fall out of love withYep, I love Fergie to bits but he was a complete megalamoniac and a tosspot.
Stick to your 'Is football forum safe again' safe space buddy
You just:
1. Compared Fergie to Jose
2. Failed to read what I’d posted
So no, you’re not old-fashioned. You’re just either low on comprehension OR so stuck with an idea that you’re not even listening any more.
Says the bloke whose opening paragraph rambled on about "results," despite it featuring no where in the post he responded to. What was that about comprehension? Me thinks I might have touched a nerve...
Man, I tought shitting on Fergie to defend Mourinho would stop now that the odious prick has been fired. But apparently it's still a thing.
Open your eyes. I haven't defended Jose in there whatever. Fergie did some dickish things in his time here. Don't be a bloody idiot and pretend none of it ever happened.
Do pardon me, O ye that said “results” are independent from a club “doing well” about a club that’s also raking in record profits. Mayhaps I lack your wisdom, but worry not, for if there is one emotion I don’t feel upon realizing this, it’s envy and if there is one that I do, it’s relief.
Just give us some examples. The whole racehorse bullshit is the only thing I can think of that was genuinely damaging.
And to be clear: I don't mean examples when he was a dick to referees or the press. I mean things like Mourinho's post-Sevilla press conference.
I mean, we are winning. As a fair weather fan, I would be watching the match hoping for glory. However, when we hit a mean patch, I'll employ you as my watcher, you can tell me when we are winning again.
I just don't understand equating the great man to Mou. It's one thing to say Fergie has been a dick to opposition and refs and it's completely another thing to say 'Fergie has been as big of a douchebag like Mou'. Someone bitchslap Rivaldo with a dildo please
what was that about being stuck on an idea.Yeah lets get that out of the way to begin with. Imagine Jose chucking a boot at Martial, you lot would want him arrested.
stop digging a hole for yourself Fergie can absolutely kick a boot at Martial now and he doesn't even need to be the manager for it
Urgh, that's the point?!
Fergie can absolutely kick a boot at Martial now and he doesn't even need to be the manager for it
You might want to take a breather.I honestly can't remember a single time Fergie publically undermined the club or any of our players. In fact, he regularly put himself in the line of fire to shield players from criticism. Every time he acted like a twat it was against referees, the media or opposition players and managers to wind them up.
Mourinho routinely shat on the board and the squad at press conferences and through media leaks. There is no comparing the two. Fergie was our cnut. Mourinho was just a cnut.
Mourinho routinely shat on the board and the squad at press conferences and through media leaks. There is no comparing the two. Fergie was our cnut. Mourinho was just a cnut.
Urgh, that's the point?!
then what's the point? That Fergie kicking a boot at Becks is him being as bad as Mou? It's probably the worst post I've ever read in this forum and that includes the Trump thread morons.
That they were both capable of being dicks. The fact you would find it acceptable for one manager to do it and not the other just vindicates my point. Thanks!
Pretending a couple of years of Jose's antics is somehow justification for undoing your apparent lifetime passion and love for our club is delusional bullshit. You keep telling yourself it's all fine though.
The difference is Fergie did that behind closed doors. His angry hairdryer side is well known, but he always kept it inside the dressing room. Mourinho leaked the virus stuff to the media, said Luke Shaw couldn't use his own brain when he played, said United had no heritage and much more. The worst I can remember Fergie saying in public was that Bosnich was eating like a horse at a buffet, and that was in his autobiography, well after they had both retired.
Don't bother. An analogy about mud-wrestling comes to mind...
Next you know he'll be talking about how Fergie playing down a loss was the equivalent of Mou saying that the club should be used to losing that that Sevilla (and later Everton?) had a better squad...
We are still aware of it though. Because Jose did it publically that's justification for falling out of love with the club? Nah. Not buying it.
You keep telling yourself Jose airing his dirty laundry in public is reason enough for you to fall out of love with the club. We are lucky to have you!Don't bother. An analogy about mud-wrestling comes to mind...
Next you know he'll be talking about how Fergie playing down a loss was the equivalent of Mou saying that the club should be used to losing that that Sevilla (and later Everton?) had a better squad...
Fergie allowed himself certain privileges managing us, like giving his son enough games for a league medal, let his brother be our chief scout for years, loaning academy players for friends and family, but he never demeaned us the way the past 3 managers have, either because he felt a genuine deference to the club’s history and those who went before, or because he considered the club synonymous with himself as a person.
The man was underpaid for years, got transfer budget limit imposed upon him by the old PLC and the biggest bust up we ever heard about was over a bloody horse. Comparing Fergie with Mourinho was completely ridiculous since it would never even occur to him to say his players are not good enough publicly and United didn’t have a ‘football heritage’ compared to Se-fecking-villa.
The man was underpaid for years, got transfer budget limit imposed upon him by the old PLC and the biggest bust up we ever heard about was over a bloody horse. Comparing Fergie with Mourinho was completely ridiculous since it would never even occur to him to say his players are not good enough publicly and United didn’t have a ‘football heritage’ compared to Se-fecking-villa.
Ultimately you're free to support whoever you want however you want but this idea that "most fans" subscribe to your way of thinking about football is absolute nonsense. If "most fans" thought the way you and most of the posters clambering to justify their questionable relationship with the club did, the entire English football system would collapse.
Perfect analogy. This "falling out of love" tripe is like claiming you married an Instagram model for her personality and how she makes you feel only to file for divorce a couple of weeks after she suffers some kind of disfiguring accident because "it just doesn't feel the same anymore". Like come on man, if you're that shallow, own it and move on with your life – don't batter your mates with endless rants about how good of a guy you are and that people just don't understand your special perspective. It's insecure and hollow.Yeah, thats the same as dropping to 6th in the league and only winning 3 trophies.
More like, your wife got hit by a car, and although she's going to make a full recovery, you don't visit her in hospital because her hip can't handle a romp in the hay yet.
You seem to have gotten this about face. It's not the "top reds" that are fuming, it's the fairweather merchants.
Broadly agreed, though I wouldn't put Sir Alex in the Mourinho bracket, there were some uncomfortable times with the way he acted. I had no problem with the pragmatic football. Mourinho didn't have to play Glazernomics to the extent Sir Alex did. While we were happy to take one-nils throughout several periods of Fergie's tenure, we never showed the cowardice of Mourinho.
There was a thread here about people not even being arsed to turn on the TV to watch United just a few weeks ago. It was pathetic then and pathetic now.
If you can't handle a few shit years after twenty of wall to wall success, I suggest you hop off and support Real Madrid... though this season you might be struggling to make the effort to turn on your TV again...
I wouldn't say I enjoyed Mourinho's time, but it had it's moments and it was quite fascinating to watch unfold.
Passion dimming or undimming, I just can't look past your 'Fergie could have been a dick' point. It's like that Mummy side villain telling Brendan Fraser that he could have kids in the future. Completely mental.
Perhaps I should've tempered my comparison a little more than I had. Put it this way, if Jose had done the things that Fergie done: bootgate, nepotism, the feud with the club owners about a personal matter etc. he would be roundly criticized for it. For Fergie however, it's largely forgotten because of what he produced on the pitch.
Those point towards it as a reason for falling out of love with the club are kidding themselves.
Nice sidestep. You could've focused on the crux of the point but instead you've gone down this route. Frankly, if Jose had done what Fergie did then you would have been the first to condemn him on here. My comparison was perhaps a little too simplistic, but the meat of it is still there to chew on. You absolve Fergie of what he did because he had unprecedented success on the pitch. Trying to vindicate your flippancy about your feelings for the club based upon a kind of moral standing is just a smokescreen. If Jose had the same level of impact on the field as Fergie you would have absolved him too.
How do you fall out of love with the club, to fall back in love with it again? I’m sure that question has already been asked and answered to but I just can’t fathom how one does this?!
Fergie could be a bit of a dick. How is that surprising to anyone who's followed his career for half-a-second? I mean I love the guy to bits but he let a silly tiff with John Magnier and J P McManus jeopardise the future of the football club for crying out loud which is more questionable than anything Mourinho has ever done. I mean I appreciate that none of this really matters to a lot of fans in the grand scheme of things given his success on the pitch but @ivaldo is 100% correct here. Not sure why you're getting so worked up over this.