How many City players get into Pep Guardiola's Best XI?

matsdf said:
That's just straight up lying.
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Yet not a single team posted has Kyle Walker at RB. Amazing huh? Because guess what, Pep has managed better RBs. Philip Lahm says Hi.

Unless you're going to tell me Walker is a better RB than Lahm...?
 
Fortitude said:
There's nothing breaking up the most successful midfield triumvirate of all-time; I don't think you even do that for a true all-time great (which KDB is not) because the synergy, understanding and fluidity of that 3 is the benchmark for midfields and there's no evidence KDB can play that kind of football, let alone to that degree. Besides that, all the numbers in the world can't put KDB over Iniesta for productivity. Why? Because he scored or assisted on literally the biggest, most decisive occasions, and outside of that, his ball retention and ability to probe a backline for exploits that enable others to do their thing is almost unrivalled. Iniesta might have been moved around some, but at the peak of peaks, that midfield unit was set in stone, and that's the one presented in a thread like this.

The above might sound like a slight on KDB, but the truth is that Iniesta is the benchmark for a certain style of play, just as Xavi is in his position, and Busquets in his. Combine the three, and it's the pinnacle the game has seen of that style, and it would be the style the team is wedded to because of them (and Messi) with all other pieces having to conform and fit in.
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At the peak of peaks, Pep and Del Bosque moved him to the left (though he he drifted inside more often) for players (Fabregas and Alonso) who aren't greater than KDB, why do you think Pep wouldn't do the same with KDB?
 
footballistic orgasm said:
Good thing no one has said this then. But there's a reason City has a more negative record without him than with him. He's been their best player the past 2 seasons.
Rodri offers everything Busquets does (maybe a bit less control) and more physical and offensive input.


Alves and Lahm (especially the former) offered way more offensively and to their teams general play than Walker. The only thing Walker has over them is speed.
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This is exactly my point. He receives far more credit than his contribution deserves. DM is an important role, it doesn't automatically make the DM the best player in a given team, people have just seen their record is better with him and automatically assumed he's their best player when football doesn't really work like that.
 
WeePat said:
Which speaks to the kind of clubs Pep has chosen to manage. They're so stacked that even KDB can't get a look in.

KDB, Aguero, Kompany, David Silva, Ederson, Rodri, Robben all just chilling in the reserves.
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I actually think you could make 5 or 6 world class XIs. Off the top of my head (the 5th and 6th teams would be struggling a bit defensively, but still):

CF:
Aguero, Lewandowski, Zlatan, Haaland, Eto'o

Wingers/wide forwards:
Messi, Henry, Ribery, Robben, Villa, Mahrez, Sterling, Sane, Pedro, Rafinha, Coman

Midfielders (absolutely wild):
Iniesta, Xavi, De Bruyne, Foden, Muller, Gundogan, D. Silva, Kroos, Y. Toure, Busquets, Rodri, B. Silva, Fernandinho, Mascherano, Alonso, Schweinsteiger, Thiago, Fabregas, Vidal

Defenders:
Puyol, Pique, Hummels, Kompany, Alba, Alaba, Lahm, Alves, Walker, Dias, Otamendi, Boateng, Rafinha, Stones, Kimmich, Zabaleta, Ake

Goalkeepers:
Neuer, Ederson, Valdes, Hart, Caballero
 
footballistic orgasm said:
At the peak of peaks, Pep and Del Bosque moved him to the left (though he he drifted inside more often) for players (Fabregas and Alonso) who aren't greater than KDB, why do you think Pep wouldn't do the same with KDB?
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Barcelona's peak, Cesc wasn't even at the club. Spain is about finding a perfect synergy for the collection of players at their disposal, just as NT always is.
 
harms said:
As for Rodri/Busquets — if we go on merit and proven chemistry it’s a bit early to pick him ahead of Busquets in these kind of teams… but his last two seasons were better than Busquets’ best seasons — which is saying something, as the latter was bloody amazing.

I don’t think that Busquets was ever in contention for being the best player in the world (even if we exclude Messi & Cristiano from the equation) while Rodri of the past 2 seasons certainly is. Whenever he would suit Xavi & Iniesta (who are the obvious choices for Pep’s starting XI) better than Busquets is another question that I’m struggling to find the answer to at the moment.
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I don't think Busquets was ever in contention for being the top 10 best players in the world, never mind the best. He was never in the top 20 of the Ballon d'Or and never proved himself at elite international level without Xavi or Iniesta (never got a Euros, World Cup or CL final without those two after the age of 27 despite it supposed to be his peak and his time to dominate). He was also never the best player in La Liga, or any tournament of note.

I dunno how people can say he was the best DM when compared to someone like Rijkaard for example, who was third place in Ballon d'Or twice, Serie A player of the year and won European Cups with multiple teams.
 
Martial said:
For me personally it would be:

Neuer
Alves Puyol Pique Alaba
Xavi Busquets Iniesta
Messi Lewandowski Villa​

Any Man City players actually make it into your Pep Guardiola's Best XI?
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Pique was overrated and trash.
 
AltiUn said:
This is exactly my point. He receives far more credit than his contribution deserves. DM is an important role, it doesn't automatically make the DM the best player in a given team, people have just seen their record is better with him and automatically assumed he's their best player when football doesn't really work like that.
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Or maybe people actually watch them play?
You're saying it as if it's just few random people here and there praising Rodri's and saying he's been the best player, it's way more than that which should actually mean something.

Fortitude said:
Barcelona's peak, Cesc wasn't even at the club. Spain is about finding a perfect synergy for the collection of players at their disposal, just as NT always is.
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I said Iniesta's peak. They got Cesc after they won the CL and were still dominating, but Pep still went out of his way to accommodate Cesc and move Iniesta to the left. As for the NT, Del Bosque could have just kept the Barca midfield trio and benched Alonso, but he also chose to move Iniesta to the left too.

PSV said:
Busquets is massively overrated.
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I don't think he is. But I i think Rodri offers more than Busquets did.
 
None, for me.

Neuer
Lahm, Boateng, Puyol, Alaba
Xavi, Busquets, Iniesta
Robben, Messi, Ribery

De Bruyne on the left or even centrally, with Messi on the right, wouldn't be absurd, but I think the Bayern's wingers were better as...well, wingers, and I'm not sure if De Bruyne matches up nicely with Messi. Going just by the players' level, the Belgian is up there with any of them, except Messi, though.
 
I think Dias gets the nod over Pique personally. But that's literally the only way I can squeeze a City player in there which is funny.
 
Should we make a team, or just put the best players in?

Neuer-Walker-Pique-Alaba-Busquets-Xavi-Ribery-Messi-Lewandowski-De Bruyne-Robben
 
Neuer
Alves Pique Puyol Abidal
Busquets
Xavi Iniesta
Robben Messi Henry
​
Henry in 08/09 was still a beast. I'd also take Abidal over Alba/Alaba/Lahm out of position.
 
Hummels did not play for Pep
Also Kompany played 1 uninjured season under Pep
 
Fair shouts for Walker in for Alves and rodri in for Busquets, but it's tough. De Bruyne in for David villa and move Iniesta to the left is the obvious move as Iniesta actually played in the left often.
 
The real question is could Pep win a league with this team?

Bravo
Rafinha - Dante - Ake - Mendy
Nunes - Rode
Cuenca - Nolito - Hleb
Bojan

('worst XI' that played more than 30 games in a season for Pep)
 
KeanoMagicHat said:
The real question is could Pep win a league with this team?

Bravo
Rafinha - Dante - Ake - Mendy
Nunes - Rode
Cuenca - Nolito - Hleb
Bojan

('worst XI' that played more than 30 games in a season for Pep)
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Would be lucky to make the top 4 with that.
 
----------------Messi
Ribéry-------------------Robben
----------Iniesta----Xavi
--------------Rodri
Lahm--Puyol-Kompany/Dias-Dani Alves
-----------------Neuer
 
We've had this discussion before a few months ago:

The Barcelona midfield 3 is untouchable. The rest of the forward line is there to get the best out of Messi (the greatest player of all time) - and for that you need 2 forwards who are great off the ball. Constantly stretching that backline for Messi to pick them out, or to reduce the congestion in the middle of the pitch for him to just dribble his way through the middle of the pitch.

Alves is also untouchable because he again also stretches the pitch like no other fullback of his generation, and had almost a perfect partnership with Messi.

------ Eto'o ---- Messi ---- Robben
--------------Iniesta ---- Xavi
----------------------Busquets
----Alaba --- Dias --- Pique ---- Alves
-------------------------Neuer

That's my XI.
 
Freak said:
You have to put KDB in that best XI. No way can you leave him out.


Neuer
Alves Puyol Pique Alaba
Xavi Busquets Iniesta
Robben Messi De Bruyne
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I don't see how he gets in ahead of Iniesta or Xavi and wide he's far lesser a player than some of the names Pep has managed there; Ribery, Henry in particular.

I think you can add Stones fairly in place of Pique, I don't think Rodri is as good as Busquets was, KBD is great but he'd either have to replace Iniesta or Messi, basically he's managed a lot of class players.
 
Its very hard but I think I'd pick Rodri over Busquets just going on top level (as Rodri's career is only halfway over).

Busquets was such a fantastic player and a perfect foil for Xavi/Iniesta in that midfield, but he also benefited a lot from playing within that team. Rodri does many of the same things for City that Busquets did for Barca in terms of positional screening and distributing the ball but also many of the things Xavi did in terms of controlling tempo, probing space, and chipping in with goals and assists.

I think broadly speaking those Barcelona teams benefited a lot from the relative novelty of Pep's tactics at the time. Other sides simply just didn't know how to deal with them. And this probably made the role of the holding/controlling midfielder a little bit easier in that context than it is today, with a whole generation of managers having spent over a decade thinking about this kind of positional play and what it means for midfield tactics.

I love Busquets as a player and appreciate him greatly. But take Busquets out of that Barca midfield and put him in the PL and I don't think anybody would be talking about him as being the best player in the league.
 
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Neuer
Lahm-Hummels-Puyol-Alaba
Xavi-Busquets-Kroos
Robben-Messi-Iniesta

Everyone else can go kick rocks.
 
It would be interesting to compare it to the best Ancelotti team. I think those two have managed by far the best players this century.
 
Powderfinger said:
Its very hard but I think I'd pick Rodri over Busquets just going on top level (as Rodri's career is only halfway over).

Busquets was such a fantastic player and a perfect foil for Xavi/Iniesta in that midfield, but he also benefited a lot from playing within that team. Rodri does many of the same things for City that Busquets did for Barca in terms of positional screening and distributing the ball but also many of the things Xavi did in terms of controlling tempo, probing space, and chipping in with goals and assists.

I think broadly speaking those Barcelona teams benefited a lot from the relative novelty of Pep's tactics at the time. Other sides simply just didn't know how to deal with them. And this probably made the role of the holding/controlling midfielder a little bit easier in that context than it is today, with a whole generation of managers having spent over a decade thinking about this kind of positional play and what it means for midfield tactics.

I love Busquets as a player and appreciate him greatly. But take Busquets out of that Barca midfield and put him in the PL and I don't think anybody would be talking about him as being the best player in the league.
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Good points. I'd be also curious about Xavi and how he'd be viewed if he played in the PL at the time. This is not because I think the PL was harder or anything, just that it asked midfielders to make the play more which in my view is a reason why some of the PL's teams looked ordinary when they faced the best in the continent. I think Xavi would have stood out now as more teams are focused on providing options and playing as a collective. Iniesta on the other hand would have been an all time great any time anywhere. Only second to Messi among Pep's players.
 
Theonas said:
It would be interesting to compare it to the best Ancelotti team. I think those two have managed by far the best players this century.
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Ancelotti team is pretty hard to pick, could pick 4 or 5 teams tbh by this point that could win the Champions League.

But two others that would compete with him would be Luis Enrique and Del Bosque. Enrique would have Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta Barca except also with Neymar, Ter Stegen, Suarez, then he'd have Ramos, Rodri and others from Spain and then he'd have Mbappé from PSG.

Del Bosque would have the whole golden period Spain team from 2009 to 2014, and then he'd have the Galacticos on top. So imagine that dominant Spain team but also the possiblity of Makelele, Zidane, Figo, Raul, Carlos, Ronaldo etc on top to iron out any weakness they had/lack of goalscoring to go with their possession.
 
Theonas said:
It would be interesting to compare it to the best Ancelotti team. I think those two have managed by far the best players this century.
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Ancelotti feels far more difficult to pick if you ask me. Maybe something like this?

Cech
Cafu-Terry-Nesta-Maldini
Lampard-Kroos-Modric
Kaka
Shevchenko-CR7
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Ancelotti feels far more difficult to pick if you ask me. Maybe something like this?

Cech
Cafu-Terry-Nesta-Maldini
Lampard-Kroos-Modric
Kaka
Shevchenko-CR7
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I'd have Benzema ahead of Sheva. What he did 2 years ago when led Real to a CL trumps anything Sheva did. For the rest, it just feels wrong to leave out Zidane, Pirlo, Seedorf, Ronaldinho, R9. Crazy selection!
 
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