How have we done post-Fergie, in your assessment?

Up until Jan 2018 we did alright I think. Things didn't work out, but there was obvious sound logic behind the majority of signings. Even the ones that didn't workout were quite obviously good players. Matic i think was the quite obviously bad signing in the face of the available younger options, and that the first sign of unnecessary managerial over indulgence.

Then from then on we lost our collective fecking minds. Mourinho should've been sacked about 4 times between then and the time he actually was. Signing Sanchez and then using him to replace your inform forward in your attack, Seville, Mourinho's dour mood the entire pre-season, him turning the place into a toxic shithole that entire first half of the season. That turned the entire trajectory of the club from one that had stagnated into the meme we are today.

From then on our fanbase has become more vocal and the weak ownership has been egged on into doing some of the stupidest things that any club has done in the last 10 years. The back him or sack him chrouses have resulted in us making Harry Maguire the most expensive defender of all time and that entire Ole tenure was the biggest and most expensive waste of time in the history of top level football - that's until ETH came along.

We've happily written off 2 seasons in 21/22 and this one, for some weird emotional attachment to the manager. And that stupidity has continued - utterly humiliating losses that Ole introduced us to, have become normalised and now part of our identity under ETH. The stupidity in the transfer market has just gotten worse, with Antony somehow topping the Maguire signing. The worst part is since then the fanbase at every given opportunity turned the place into a toxic shithole - and that all started with Mourinho's fallout.

So I'd say up until Jan 2018 - meh. We tried, it didn't work.

Jan 2018 - what in the name of holy feck are we doing.
 
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Skills said:
Up until Jan 2018 we did alright I think. Things didn't work out, but there was obvious sound logic behind the majority of signings. Even the ones that didn't workout were quite obviously good players. Matic i think was the quite obviously bad signing in the face of the available younger options, and that the first sign of unnecessary managerial over indulgence.

Then from then on we lost our collective fecking minds. Mourinho should've been sacked about 4 times between then and the time he actually was. Signing Sanchez and then using him to replace your inform forward in your attack, Seville, Mourinho's dour mood the entire pre-season, him turning the place into a toxic shithole that entire first half of the season. That turned the entire trajectory of the club from one that had stagnated into the meme we are today.

From then on our fanbase has become more vocal and the weak ownership has been egged on into doing some of the stupidest things that any club has done in the last 10 years. The back him or sack him chrouses have resulted in us making Harry Maguire the most expensive defender of all time and that entire Ole tenure was the biggest and most expensive waste of time in the history of top level football - that's until ETH came along.

We've happily written off 2 seasons in 21/22 and this one, for some weird emotional attachment to the manager. And that stupidity has continued - utterly humiliating losses that Ole introduced us to, have become normalised and now part of our identity under ETH. The stupidity in the transfer market has just gotten worse, with Antony somehow topping the Maguire signing. The worst part is since then the fanbase at every given opportunity turned the place into a toxic shithole - and that all started with Mourinho's fallout.

So I'd say up until Jan 2018 - meh. We tried, it didn't work.

Jan 2018 - what in the name of holy feck are we doing.
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Agree with most of that

I'd also say that at some level, it's a simple return on investment question

We have by far the highest net spend in the PL over that period and yet we have radically underperformed our peers

For example, at the end of this season, it will be true that Arsenal (2nd highest net spend, way behind us) finished above us 7 of the last 10 years

It's a terrible decade. You couldn't make a credible case it's more than a 2/10
 
This is depressing reading and it is hard to argue with any of the comments. I know its been said before - losing Sir Alec was a downer but losing David Gill at the same time was the icing on the cake IMHO.
 
The absolute grade is as low as possible. 0/10. Considering where sir alex left the club globally, and the amount of money that we've managed to burn through.

On the other hand, looking back, it makes sense as we are in a brutal league competing with clubs that have ambition of on-field success, whereas our club was run blindly. All the decisions made in the past decade are questionable, be it appointments, recruitment, contract renewals, wages etc.

The only silver lining at this point would be if the new structure the owners are trying to implement actually manages to turn it around for us.
 
It's been so bad that we could've had our own Sunderland til I die style documentary and it would've almost eclipsed theirs.
 
An absolute shambles.
The Glazer's have defined the blueprint of how NOT to run a football club.
Total incompetence at every level throughout the club.

I honestly think that we have about 5 or 6 players in the first team squad that that are actually worthy of being here, and yet we have burned through a Billion, and are paying astronomical wages to players that can't even be arsed to break sweat.

To fix this fiasco, there has to be a mass exodus of 20 people, being in various footballing positions including players and medics.
 
I remember talking about my expectations for the first season post Ferguson and I said, I expect a drop off, 3rd probably and if it's a disaster 4th.

I never seen united going from winning the league by a country mile dropping to mid table in one season.

Then LVG took over I thought he'd have us challenging with good football, again completely wrong.

Then Jose took over and this guy wins the league in his first two years everywhere he's been. Some good signings and we'll be up their again. Whoops once again I was wrong.

Then after that I accepted our time is over and it's going to take a proper project, with proper structures and also needs patience. Unfortunately every time we have a bad period the patience disappears and the continuous circle of failure continues.
 
Overall, It’s been below average. A real lack of direction everywhere from the c-levels, to the mangers down to the players.

Money was spent, but wasted time after time. So in terms of managerial signings, it’s been shocking.

Managers hired were different each time. Each of the managers had different play-styles, from whatever Moyes tried to play, to LVG’s possession based football, to Mourinho’s defensive style, to Ole’s counter attacking, to Rangnicks Gergen pressing (last one game) and to ten Hags play style which I can’t identify.

This leads in the reset button being hit each time, a majority of the existing players not fitting to the new playstyle meaning more money wasted on new signings. Hope with the new football directors we can fix this.

Player recruitment has also been poor for the larger part. Playing style as mentioned above, with players not fitting in with the new playstyles. Too many stop gap signings (Ronaldo, Zlatan, Schweinsteiger, Cavani, Falcao etc) and big name signings that should have had some further personality and background checks (Di Maria, Sancho, Pogba, Martial, Sanchez, Depay). Some bad luck with some players, like Eriksen starting well before Carroll broke him; Maguire after the incident in Greece and Greenwood. Good/world class players became worse after joining United (most started well, then fell off - Mata, Varane, Matic, Casemiro, Di Maria, Martial etc. ) still pains me that we reportedly had agreed transfers for Thiago and Kroos, only for Moyes and LVG to veto the transfers. Players like Mane were also repeatedly rejected by Woodward.

Results wise, it’s actually not too bad despite all the issues. I think we’re way off City and Liverpool - but we still managed some decent league finishes and some cups during the time. It could have been more and I would like a proper title challenge, but given everything, it could have been worse. Ole should have won at least a cup too.
 
There will be a few documentaries of a “how to completely bollocks it up” persuasion in the coming years.
 
Its been diabolical since Fergie left in 2013

There was of course to be an expected drop off once Fergie left but to go from 1st to 7th in that first season was unacceptable, but in reality it was never the same again. You had total inexperience throughout the club at that stage with Woodward coming on board after Gill left as well.

We have had some great moments and a couple of trophy wins but during Fergies era to go one or two season's without winning or coming close to winning something it was deemed a crisis of epic proportions.

Every manager we went through had an entirely different way of playing, we've burnt through over a billion quid in transfer fees on some terrible signings and made next to nothing back. Made stop gap signings because desperation kicked in, now we are pretty much skint and have to sell before we can buy realistically. As one poster said above it would be one hell of a Neflix documentary on how to completely mismanage a multi-billion pound football club.
 
fecking terrible and it just keeps on getting worse. The trend is downwards and as I see it, still going down.
 
If Fergie time was a sunny day with the occasional cloud, then since then its been the blackest night, interspered with the moon occasionally showing through the gloom.
 
Captmfla said:
It's decent if you did not count the money spent on transfers. United is always playing for UCL qualification and almost every manager won trophies except for Ole who choked in semi-finals or finals.
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Losing 10-11 on penalties is the manager choking ?
 
It was the perfect storm of shite. We lost arguably the greatest club manager there ever was, which already sets enormous pressures on who follows him.

But worst of all, we had one of the worst owners in terms of operating a football club. Despite them being there close to a decade at that point, they did not have a fecking clue about what they were doing. They foolishly put one of their takeover buddies in charge of everything despite zero experience at that level and no additional appointments to assist him.

It was just straight up replace Gill and Ferguson and hope for the best. Moyes wasn’t exactly the most exciting appointment either. I honestly wouldn’t have had him in my Top 5 picks back then. I had to convince myself into liking him as probably 90% of everyone else did back then.
 
The truth is the press have done a better job of building a squad than the glazers or people they have hired have. Your average fan with more than a passing interest would have done a lot better given our budget, especially if they were actually allowed to sell when it was most advantageous. Also no stupid contract renewals

If we’d managed to get some of these players that we were very heavily linked with but failed to secure we’d be in a much better position.

Vidal, Thiago, Kroos, Bellingham, Camavinga, Fabinho, Haaland, Caciedo, Enzo, Mane, the ajax lads when they were in the EL with us and so on. It’s mad the amount of talent we’ve let slip away post Fergie. It’s all about recruitment and then management. That’s all it is. We’ve turned it into something far more hazardous and difficult.
 
The post Busby to Ferguson era was much worse, I would hazard a guess that in todays terms we spent just as much money on players, and had just as many flops, both on the field and off it.
The Cliff was practically a holiday camp during Atkinsons era.
At least we haven't been relegated.
 
I don’t think many of us expected it to be this bad.

I don’t think many of us fully appreciated what SAF was doing. He WAS Manchester United…the technical director, the sporting director, the head of recruitment and scouting. He held it all in his head…which is crazy when you look at where football is now.

and whilst others around us were putting new modernised structures in place, we just lost a phenomenon and replaced him with another manager who the glazers hoped could just carry on where SAF left off.

throw Ed Woodward into the mix who was happy spending the national debts of small countries on transfer fees and wages…and it’s become an absolute shambles we’re still trying to recover from.

Hopefully ineos, with their new structure/staff and their reluctance to bow to silly monetary requests, we can get back on track.
 
Skills said:
Up until Jan 2018 we did alright I think. Things didn't work out, but there was obvious sound logic behind the majority of signings. Even the ones that didn't workout were quite obviously good players. Matic i think was the quite obviously bad signing in the face of the available younger options, and that the first sign of unnecessary managerial over indulgence.

Then from then on we lost our collective fecking minds. Mourinho should've been sacked about 4 times between then and the time he actually was. Signing Sanchez and then using him to replace your inform forward in your attack, Seville, Mourinho's dour mood the entire pre-season, him turning the place into a toxic shithole that entire first half of the season. That turned the entire trajectory of the club from one that had stagnated into the meme we are today.

From then on our fanbase has become more vocal and the weak ownership has been egged on into doing some of the stupidest things that any club has done in the last 10 years. The back him or sack him chrouses have resulted in us making Harry Maguire the most expensive defender of all time and that entire Ole tenure was the biggest and most expensive waste of time in the history of top level football - that's until ETH came along.

We've happily written off 2 seasons in 21/22 and this one, for some weird emotional attachment to the manager. And that stupidity has continued - utterly humiliating losses that Ole introduced us to, have become normalised and now part of our identity under ETH. The stupidity in the transfer market has just gotten worse, with Antony somehow topping the Maguire signing. The worst part is since then the fanbase at every given opportunity turned the place into a toxic shithole - and that all started with Mourinho's fallout.

So I'd say up until Jan 2018 - meh. We tried, it didn't work.

Jan 2018 - what in the name of holy feck are we doing.
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Most annoying thing about Ole time…was that he was only ever in place as an interim manager. And of course, the upper echelons at the club got all excited after a promising run of games…against lesser opposition it has to be said and felt it necessary to offer him the role permanently.

He was ill equipped and whilst he might have brought back some enjoyment for the players (as he was tasked with) he just didn’t hold the dressing room. Honestly watching him on the overlap, whilst interesting, it was equally infuriating. Any player asking not to be captain for a specific game…should have been thrown under a bus, benched and not be playing for a long time. It sounded like there was no accountability. They had over 100k racked up with fines. And instead of perhaps that going to charity, they just paid for the Xmas party. What the actual feck!
 
It's been really poor and poor decision after poor decision over the years have cost us badly

such a waste of money and talent at times undermined by key factors (wrong manager and coaching team, poor player aquisition, not backing managers at key times, culture issues) with the Glazers the key undermining factor obviously.....

it kills optimism in many ways even for the future..... I am feeling quite positive about SJR and the new regime but when you hear rumours of the likes of Southgate* you have to realise we are only a couple of bad decisions away from being shit for another 3/4 years and wasting more money.

*listening to NQAT podcast and Dan Harris suggests there's something in Southgate rumours - hope it's bullshit
 
Horrific. I think 0/10 is fair.

My mum, a man city fan, always used to say that once saf left we would fall from grace and she was right, but she shouldn't have been. We should have been unstoppable but we have completely mismanaged ourselves for a decade.

We are lucky we are as big commercially as we are to still have a chance of coming out the other end of this in a good place but time is running out on that.
 
Jose Mourinho's first season was fairly good.
Last season was ok

The other seasons range from average to poor for me
 
The points totals are appalling in the post Sir Alex years and to go from champions with 89 points in his last season to what we sank to is ridiculous. I think with the benefit of hindsight, some of the progress made wasn't as convincing as we thought it was at the time:
​
Moyes, 13-14: 7th place, 64 points. Moyes sacked.​
LVG 14-15: 4th place-70 points- improvement on Moyes. "We're back"​
LVG 15-16: 5th place, 66 points, awful season despite FA cup win. Sacked​
Jose 16-17: 6th place, 69 points, two trophies.​
Jose: 17-18: 2nd place, 81 points, in hindsight, we're not the second best team in England, Liverpool are on a far better trajectory. "my greatest achievement to get this team to 2nd place"​
Jose/Ole 18-19: 6th place, 66 points, awful season, Jose sacked​
Ole 19-20: 3rd place, 66 points, a bit lucky to get into top 4 perhaps with our form from the first part of the season.​
Ole 20-21: 2nd place, 74 points, probably not the second best team in England considering the state of Liverpool's season but progress none the less.​
Ole/Ralf 21-22, 6th place, 58 points, statistically the worst season in our Premier League history yet. Ole Sacked​
EtH 22-23, 3rd place, 75 points. League cup trophy. Progress.​
EtH 23-24. probably 6th or 7th. 60-66 points? Sacked?​


Just seems an endless cycle of moderate progress for one or two seasons followed by a terrible collapse.
 
Irwin99 said:
The points totals are appalling in the post Sir Alex years and to go from champions with 89 points in his last season to what we sank to is ridiculous. I think with the benefit of hindsight, some of the progress made wasn't as convincing as we thought it was at the time:
​
Moyes, 13-14: 7th place, 64 points. Moyes sacked.​
LVG 14-15: 4th place-70 points- improvement on Moyes. "We're back"​
LVG 15-16: 5th place, 66 points, awful season despite FA cup win. Sacked​
Jose 16-17: 6th place, 69 points, two trophies.​
Jose: 17-18: 2nd place, 81 points, in hindsight, we're not the second best team in England, Liverpool are on a far better trajectory. "my greatest achievement to get this team to 2nd place"​
Jose/Ole 18-19: 6th place, 66 points, awful season, Jose sacked​
Ole 19-20: 3rd place, 66 points, a bit lucky to get into top 4 perhaps with our form from the first part of the season.​
Ole 20-21: 2nd place, 74 points, probably not the second best team in England considering the state of Liverpool's season but progress none the less.​
Ole/Ralf 21-22, 6th place, 58 points, statistically the worst season in our Premier League history yet. Ole Sacked​
EtH 22-23, 3rd place, 75 points. League cup trophy. Progress.​
EtH 23-24. probably 6th or 7th. 60-66 points? Sacked?​


Just seems an endless cycle of moderate progress for one or two seasons followed by a terrible collapse.
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Exactly. That’s the thing. We always revert back to shit. We never seem to be able to make proper progress, it’s always a false dawn. It’s been like this for ten years, it’s extremely deflating and upsetting.
 
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