How good was Ronaldo #9?

[OutlawGER]

Please just stop that 'Ronaldo de Lima' or whatever crap.

He's just 'Ronaldo' - the real one. Cristiano is 'C.Ronaldo' or 'CR7'. So just stop calling him de Lima.

 

[Enigma_87]

Numerous? How many times did he finish top scorer in the league he played in during his entire career?

He didn't have Xavi, Xabi, Modric, Iniesta, etc creating chances for him tho.

I think L Ronaldo gets remembered being a higher calibre than he was because people liked to imagine what could have been, he was phenomenal before his multiple injuries, but that was that.

Ronaldo teared up 4 leagues by the time he hit 22.

He was top scorer in the Brazillian and Dutch league when they were actually good and competitive at the time. He went to Barca and scored 47 in 49. Then 34 in 47 in Inter in Seria A's heyday.

Ronaldo did things till 22 which are I'm yet to see (even)Messi/C.Ronaldo doing at their own. When he played for a top team with top team mates (Brazil) he was their top goalscorer in all big tournaments - WC 98, WC 2002, Copa 97, Copa 99, etc...

It's not what could have been, because minus the injuries and keeping the same explosiveness he'd be undoubtedly the best ever.

 

[Cal?]

Please just stop that 'Ronaldo de Lima' or whatever crap.

He's just 'Ronaldo' - the real one. Cristiano is 'C.Ronaldo' or 'CR7'. So just stop calling him de Lima.

On the contrary, Ronaldo = Cristiano Ronaldo whether you like it or not?

A simple google search of Ronaldo and the top results are ALL about Cristiano.

You search "fat Ronaldo" and the top result is about Luiz.

 

[Cal?]

He didn't have Xavi, Xabi, Modric, Iniesta, etc creating chances for him tho.


Ronaldo teared up 4 leagues by the time he hit 22.

He was top scorer in the Brazillian and Dutch league when they were actually good and competitive at the time. He went to Barca and scored 47 in 49. Then 34 in 47 in Inter in Seria A's heyday.

Ronaldo did things till 22 which are I'm yet to see (even)Messi/C.Ronaldo doing at their own. When he played for a top team with top team mates (Brazil) he was their top goalscorer in all big tournaments - WC 98, WC 2002, Copa 97, Copa 99, etc...

It's not what could have been, because minus the injuries and keeping the same explosiveness he'd be undoubtedly the best ever.

Poor him, he just had to make do with the likes of Zidane & Figo, Guardiola & Stoichkov and the likes.

Plenty of players tore up the Brazilian & Dutch leagues in those years, no one gets mentioned amongst the very best ever based on achievements in those leagues.

Cristiano Ronaldo & Messi have simply been so much better for most of the past decade that any season by either compares favorably to Luiz Ronaldo's best ever season.

It is very much what could have been, there's no need to guess/predict/fantasize about what happens "minus the injuries", because the injuries did happen, and with those injuries, he's nowhere near one of the best ever.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

for me i think he is the best number 9 ever!

 

[OutlawGER]

On the contrary, Ronaldo = Cristiano Ronaldo whether you like it or not?

A simple google search of Ronaldo and the top results are ALL about Cristiano.

You search "fat Ronaldo" and the top result is about Luiz.

Obviously google is all about CR7, ffs. When Ronaldo played, there was no google.

 

[Cal?]

Obviously google is all about CR7, ffs. When Ronaldo played, there was no google.

And back then, Ronaldo = Luiz Ronaldo.

We live in 2017, Ronaldo = Cristiano Ronaldo.

 

[Enigma_87]

Poor him, he just had to make do with the likes of Zidane & Figo, Guardiola & Stoichkov and the likes.

He played with Stoichkov when he returned at Barca after unsuccessful season with Parma. He was past his prime at that time and that Barca team was on the slide after Cruyff's dream team. Zidane and Figo were obviously great players, but that was Ronaldo after the injuries and was still good enough to put individually great displays like at OT.

Plenty of players tore up the Brazilian & Dutch leagues in those years, no one gets mentioned amongst the very best ever based on achievements in those leagues.

Not in the same way, whilst also being teenagers.

Ronaldo hit 30 goals in 94/95 in Eredivisie. That year Ajax won the CL and the next in line at the top goalscorers charts were Kluivert with 18 goals and Litmanen with 17.

In the previous decade only Marco van Basten hit 30 goals in one season and no one else did up until 98. Even Romario in 3 seasons couldn't do it if we're going based only on stats.

Cristiano Ronaldo & Messi have simply been so much better for most of the past decade that any season by either compares favorably to Luiz Ronaldo's best ever season.

It is very much what could have been, there's no need to guess/predict/fantasize about what happens "minus the injuries", because the injuries did happen, and with those injuries, he's nowhere near one of the best ever.

Ronaldo and Messi didn't play in dysfunctional teams at their peak, neither after their prime selling Makelele, because he isn't 'shiny' enough.

Suarez came to Barca even without Xavi in the picture and scored 59 goals in 53 games in all comps. Ronaldo at his peak is at least level above. I have no doubt with all the protection and the defensive quality of La Liga and generally these days in Europe that he'd hit Messi's or C.Ronaldo's numbers provided he's healthy.

 

[Cal?]

He played with Stoichkov when he returned at Barca after unsuccessful season with Parma. He was past his prime at that time and that Barca team was on the slide after Cruyff's dream team. Zidane and Figo were obviously great players, but that was Ronaldo after the injuries and was still good enough to put individually great displays like at OT.



Not in the same way, whilst also being teenagers.

Ronaldo hit 30 goals in 94/95 in Eredivisie. That year Ajax won the CL and the next in line at the top goalscorers charts were Kluivert with 18 goals and Litmanen with 17.

In the previous decade only Marco van Basten hit 30 goals in one season and no one else did up until 98. Even Romario in 3 seasons couldn't do it if we're going based only on stats.



Ronaldo and Messi didn't play in dysfunctional teams at their peak, neither after their prime selling Makelele, because he isn't 'shiny' enough.

Suarez came to Barca even without Xavi in the picture and scored 59 goals in 53 games in all comps. Ronaldo at his peak is at least level above. I have no doubt with all the protection and the defensive quality of La Liga and generally these days in Europe that he'd hit Messi's or C.Ronaldo's numbers provided he's healthy.

He also had Figo in the side in his Barca season. Also it's not like the likes Djorkaeff at Inter were very poor players. If you want to talk about a dysfunctional team, what about Cristiano's first couple of seasons at Madrid? Lassana Diarra was their bloody number 10.

Would anyone consider Van Basten near an all time great if not for his exploits in Milan? Ruud Geels scored 30 in that league a few times in the 70s, anyone remember him?

Healthy as in, not injured (aka his Real Madrid days), or healthy as in didn't suffer all those injuries?

In the first case, he's proven that he couldn't, in fact, Makaay and Forlan finished ahead of him in the scoring charts.

In the second case, we'll never know, and I believe you can't rate him based on "what could have been".

 

[redspoony]

He was unreal.

For someone of his size to have such blistering speed, balance and grace made him unique.

I've never seen a player quite like him before or since.

 

[Jim Beam]

I beg to differ, how much of his Barca season or first 2 Inter seasons did you watch to arrive at that conclusion?

With him being the most exciting thing in world football as much as I could. Enough to know that he was a unique player, a combination of power, explosiveness, pace, speed, and skill with the ball which made him practically impossible to mark. Or he would be double marked on many occasions and tackled all game long. The buzz when he received the ball even on the halfway line and went sprinting towards goal was unmatched even until today.

You're talking about his off games. When he had an off game like in that final against France people couldn't believe it. That's how many off games he had. Still having a World cup on the level Messi or Cristiano never got close.
Maybe you can name those other games at his peak with him being marked out since you "beg to differ" and being first to make the claim about choosing Suarez over Barcelona version of Ronaldo.

As for the 3 seasons AFTERhis injuries, I assume you mean the first 3 seasons at Real Madrid? Where he finished the seasons scoring fewer goals than Roy Makaay and Diego Forlan in 2 of those?

Yes, Roy Makaay and Diego Forlan were better at the time. It's quite pointless to go on.

 

[Cal?]

With him being the most exciting thing in world football as much as I could. Enough to know that he was a unique player, a combination of power, explosiveness, pace, speed, and skill with the ball which made him practically impossible to mark. Or he would be double marked on many occasions and tackled all game long. The buzz when he received the ball even on the halfway line and went sprinting towards goal was unmatched even until today.

You're talking about his off games. When he had an off game like in that final against France people couldn't believe it. That's how many off games he had. Still having a World cup on the level Messi or Cristiano never got close.
Maybe you can name those other games at his peak with him being marked out since you "beg to differ" and being first to make the claim about choosing Suarez over Barcelona version of Ronaldo.

Yes, Roy Makaay and Diego Forlan were better at the time. It's quite pointless to go on.

Against France it wasn't an "off" game, it was as if he wasn't even there, I cannot name any examples of him playing as badly as he did that game (or many examples of anyone being as bad in any game as he was in that final). But for "off" games where he just couldn't get it right, where his dribbles led down blind alleys or when his finishing was just slightly off, there were plenty even before those injuries. They just don't make youtube highlights of those.

I wasn't suggesting that Suarez 15/16 was definitely better, but there have been plenty of players who's had ONE great season and don't get mentioned as one of the best ever, that was the point I was gettting at.

As for World Cup at a level Cristiano or Messi never had, it helps to be born in the all time most successful WC country, whilst Argentina have traditionally been one of the stronger and successful sides, the same cannot be said of Portugal. Between the Eusebio led 3rd place and Cristiano led 4th place in 2006, they only qualified twice out of 9 tournaments and exited at the group stage on both occasions, despite having the likes of Figo, Rui Costa, etc, etc.

 

[Jim Beam]

I wasn't suggesting that Suarez 15/16 was definitely better, but there have been plenty of players who's had ONE great season and don't get mentioned as one of the best ever, that was the point I was gettting at.

The reason is quite simple. For many, looking at his peak years, he was and still is the best young player they've seen. Certainly best pure striker. That along with his high likeability and brilliant comeback with WC2002 sealed legendary status.

 

[matherto]

On the contrary, Ronaldo = Cristiano Ronaldo whether you like it or not?

A simple google search of Ronaldo and the top results are ALL about Cristiano.

You search "fat Ronaldo" and the top result is about Luiz.

No shit. Cristiano came about in the age of the internet and he's the most popular athlete in the world, Google doesn't prove a thing.

Ronaldo is still the original Ronaldo. Cristiano is Cristiano or as he wants, CR7.

You search fat Ronaldo and of course it's gonna be about the Brazilian one because he got fat and people called him that. Nobody has called Cristiano fat because he's never been fat. How hard is that to comprehend?

 

[DOTA]

He'll be talked about a lot less in ten years, when us twenty somethings who tend to dominate these environments are replaced by those who grew up watching Messi and Cristiano rather than him.

 

[Jim Beam]

He'll be talked about a lot less in ten years, when us twenty somethings who tend to dominate these environments are replaced by those who grew up watching Messi and Cristiano rather than him.

Looking forward to 30 more years of Messi against Cristiano discussion.

 

[DOTA]

Looking forward to 30 more years of Messi against Cristiano discussion.

Possibly. It was Pele/Maradona for a bloody long time.

 

[Cal?]

The reason is quite simple. For many, looking at his peak years, he was and still is the best young player they've seen. Certainly best pure striker. That along with his high likeability and brilliant comeback with WC2002 sealed legendary status.

That's exactly the point, he was maybe the best player at that age in those couple of years at Barca/Inter. So people form the idea that he belongs to the very best. However, the issue is that, whilst other 19/20yo get better towards their mid-20s, he never did, in fact, due to the injuries, whatever, he got steadily worse.

 

[palavra_united]

That's exactly the point, he was maybe the best player at that age in those couple of years at Barca/Inter. So people form the idea that he belongs to the very best. However, the issue is that, whilst other 19/20yo get better towards their mid-20s, he never did, in fact, due to the injuries, whatever, he got steadily worse.

People these days tend to focus entirely on club football and ignoring the national teams competitions which up untill this decade I would say were regarded as the highest scene a player can perform at. And Ronaldo did perform phenomenally at that stage. Getting to #1 goalscorer for all times in world cups is definitely what could get you a legendary status. Winning a world cup with scoring 8 goals in the tournament is something that makes you legend like it or not. This is what keeps Messi for example for not being yet consodered as GOAT i.e. the fact that he is underperformer in the world cup final stage.

 

[Cal?]

People these days tend to focus entirely on club football and ignoring the national teams competitions which up untill this decade I would say were regarded as the highest scene a player can perform at. And Ronaldo did perform phenomenally at that stage. Getting to #1 goalscorer for all times in world cups is definitely what could get you a legendary status. Winning a world cup with scoring 8 goals in the tournament is something that makes you legend like it or not. This is what keeps Messi for example for not being yet consodered as GOAT i.e. the fact that he is underperformer in the world cup final stage.

Miroslav Klose?

 

[palavra_united]

Miroslav Klose?

I meant becoming #1 at that time