How do we sell Harry Maguire?

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Kush said:
These clubs are already forking out top wages, financials are strong for these clubs. Villa pay Ings 120k a week, Everton pay Yerry Mina 120k a week, West Ham pay Zouma 125k a week. Palace pay Zaha 130k a week, 120k a week to Benteke, Leicester pay Schmeichel 130k a week, Vardy 140k a week... You get the gist.

Maguire won't be making £190k a week elsewhere, but these mid-table clubs can pay 80% of the wages for likes of him and Rashford who's on 200k a week. Rest can either be a pay cut or subsidized by us. This is without considering Newcastle who'll have deeper pockets than anybody else. Main issue when it comes to moving these players, would be convincing them to move not that there would be any suitors capable of paying them.
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I understand what you are saying but for a club to go from 120-130 up to 190, the incoming player would have to be exceptional.
Would Maguire be the best player at Villa, West Ham, Palace or Leicester ?? I think not.
The other problem would be that half of the team would want the same money. I'm saying that he's unmovable but any deal would be very difficult. The interest would be limited !!
 
Sunk-Cost Fallacy (noun) -- the phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial.
 
Maguire is still a regular England starter, ye are talking like he is absolutely useless, he won't want to be a sub on a team as it will harm his chances for England, he doesn't imo seem that type of player, I think people look at the fee and judge him, Dalot and awb are worse players than he is,
 
jeff gurr said:
I understand what you are saying but for a club to go from 120-130 up to 190, the incoming player would have to be exceptional.
Would Maguire be the best player at Villa, West Ham, Palace or Leicester ?? I think not.
The other problem would be that half of the team would want the same money. I'm saying that he's unmovable but any deal would be very difficult. The interest would be limited !!
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Just because Maguire isn't good enough for a Top 6 club, that doesn't mean he won't be good enough for mid-table clubs. He isn't a bad player per se, he just isn't suited to the system here and he certainly doesn't have the mentality to cope with the pressure/expectation of playing for us. And, that's fine. And, I'd argue he'd be best defender at every single club you mentioned. He just isn't suited to an open system, you place a quick CB around him and couple of mids to protect them and he'd start looking like a good player.

Players from Utd always attract interest, moreso when they are English internationals. Main issue with moving these players, is getting them to agree to move in first place. Because, I don't think any club in PL would match the wages we pay. So, it'd have to be a pay cut/subsidy and them to swallow their pride that they aren't cut out for us. You are really really under-estimating the lure of signing Utd "surplus" players. They have historically carved out decent career, just look at Jonny Evans at your club. He legitimately was worst CB at the club in his final year here.
 
jeff gurr said:
I understand what you are saying but for a club to go from 120-130 up to 190, the incoming player would have to be exceptional.
Would Maguire be the best player at Villa, West Ham, Palace or Leicester ?? I think not.
The other problem would be that half of the team would want the same money. I'm saying that he's unmovable but any deal would be very difficult. The interest would be limited !!
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Any deal will have United paying half of his remaining contract at least depending on what he's going to earn at his new club.

If United decides to sell him, they will find a way to move him.
 
Unfortunately we can't, he has too high a salary and he probably won't accept going to a lower tier club , no one can really afford him and those who can won't.
We must hope he gets back to his best if there ever was one.
 
Bench him for rest of season and say he has no future at the club. He'll go to a mid table club for 20 mil and take a paycut as he'll want to play for England in the winter. That seems to be all a lot of these guys care about and are rancid for the club that pays their wages week in week out.
 
Wonder if Jose would take him at Roma? Suggestions are they are happy with the job he is doing there and he will be backed in the summer and we know he was a fan of Harry when he was here. The way Jose sets up his team to play with 3 at the back and a deeper line would play to his strengths and it might just do him good to get out of the country and rebuild his reputation away from the English media.
 
Salus Populi Suprema Lex said:
Unthinkable. I would even take the nuclear option and come to an agreement to terminate his contract by mutual consent. It won't come to that, some team would take him......perhaps. I'm not bothered by fee, just his massive wages and his massive head out of the club. We must make significant improvements in the squad; he isn't the only one who needs booting out the door.
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This aged well...

was it you? :nervous:
 
Gandalf said:
Wonder if Jose would take him at Roma? Suggestions are they are happy with the job he is doing there and he will be backed in the summer and we know he was a fan of Harry when he was here. The way Jose sets up his team to play with 3 at the back and a deeper line would play to his strengths and it might just do him good to get out of the country and rebuild his reputation away from the English media.
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Would love to see this happen just to be able to answer the debate of whether he's actually better than Smalling...that and the fact we'd be rid of him.

Straight swap for Spinazzola? :D
 
::sonny:: said:
Leicester wouldn’t take him back
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No I don't think so. We have Wesley Fofana who is a real talent & Jonny Evans still has a year or two left in him. He would be the highest paid player at the club & wouldn't start.
 
jeff gurr said:
No I don't think so. We have Wesley Fofana who is a real talent & Jonny Evans still has a year or two left in him. He would be the highest paid player at the club & wouldn't start.
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You lot really did take the possible out of us didn't ya.
 
jeff gurr said:
No I don't think so. We have Wesley Fofana who is a real talent & Jonny Evans still has a year or two left in him. He would be the highest paid player at the club & wouldn't start.
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I still find it laughably frustrating that you replaced him with Fofana for a mere fraction of what we paid you for him. But that's United for you.
 
Surely Newcastle would go for him if available? Maybe Athletico if he fancied a foreign move.

The main thing the club need to do is make him aware he won't be a starter and that if he wants regular first team football he needs to go elsewhere.
 
In the space of 12 months ( some )fans have had a PL game cancelled , stormed Woodwards house and sent Maguire a bomb scare.
 
I know everyone can see his downfalls, but! the only glimmer I have to cling to, is that a fully functioning midfield duo in front of him might mask some of his flaws. Its something he hasn't had yet at United so it would be good to give that a go before trying to bin him.
 
RuudTom83 said:
I know everyone can see his downfalls, but! the only glimmer I have to cling to, is that a fully functioning midfield duo in front of him might mask some of his flaws. Its something he hasn't had yet at United so it would be good to give that a go before trying to bin him.
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His flaws mostly this season are inability to play offside or lack of understanding of what offside is, zero awareness of what going on around him, like a train turning, and mostly being a Trainwreck when it comes to simple defending basics.


I'm not sure how you mask that up, his form total nosedived this season when we added big names to the squad, I don't think he has the mentality for it. Being captain has put him right in the spotlight even more and now he's damaged goods
 
Gandalf said:
Wonder if Jose would take him at Roma? Suggestions are they are happy with the job he is doing there and he will be backed in the summer and we know he was a fan of Harry when he was here. The way Jose sets up his team to play with 3 at the back and a deeper line would play to his strengths and it might just do him good to get out of the country and rebuild his reputation away from the English media.
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Another 10 million sale with a long loan thrown in. :(
 
I'm, like, 90% confident Maguire isn't going to be sold this summer. He has been diabolically bad this season but then so has essentially the entire fecking team. The reason I still have some faith in Maguire is that in actually competent set-ups he has proven to be an asset, and a pretty bloody good one at that. Some people on here make out that he has been as crap as he's been this season throughout his entire career, but that is simply bollocks.

If his confidence is irrecoverable then Maguire is a lost cause. Right now he's a rabbit in the headlights, and there's no way he's ever going to play well like that. If, however, he can recover some of that confidence (and I think removing the captaincy is a necessity), I envision him being OK under Ten Hag.
 
RuudTom83 said:
I know everyone can see his downfalls, but! the only glimmer I have to cling to, is that a fully functioning midfield duo in front of him might mask some of his flaws. Its something he hasn't had yet at United so it would be good to give that a go before trying to bin him.
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No, you are looking at it wrong, you should not have to have a great midfield to cover for a flawed cb, we need a great cb to cover for us going full out attack.
 
mattsville said:
No, you are looking at it wrong, you should not have to have a great midfield to cover for a flawed cb, we need a great cb to cover for us going full out attack.
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Even the most attacking of the great sides in football have a good defensive midfielder. Liverpool have the best centre-half in world football in their backline and Klopp still plays Fabinho and Henderson in his favoured line-up because midfield cover is always essential.
 
We won't sell him as no one would take the risk. The only hope is he puts this arrogance aside and whilst learning Ten Hags system he starts to get the basics down again.
 
Stop defending our mistake on signing him, he is not good enough, are we going to build a team around him to save face, feck that, yes he wins most of his defensive headers, but they are headed out randomly to nowhere, he does not have the quality find his own teamates, not good enough, he has no pace which dictates how the team sets up, no goal threat at the other end either. Captain? Captains lead by example.
 
Smores said:
We won't sell him as no one would take the risk. The only hope is he puts this arrogance aside and whilst learning Ten Hags system he starts to get the basics down again.
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What is that even based on? It's not like he's renowned for refusing to take part in training or anything.
 
When does he get his new bumper salary extension for those couple decent months in 2020? The signing would have been manageable if Ole ddin't screw over his successors by making him captain. Rotating a player with squad level talent becomes a political situation. Sooo unnecessary, backing ourselves into a corner where there should be none is like our signature move.
 
Greck said:
When does he get his new bumper salary extension for those couple decent months in 2020? The signing would have been manageable if Ole ddin't screw over his successors by making him captain. Rotating a player with squad level talent becomes a political situation. Sooo unnecessary, backing ourselves into a corner where there should be none is like our signature move.
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It made zero sense at the time and has aged more poorly than a pint of milk left out in the Sahara over time...

Truly arguably the most headscratching move Ole made.

They tried forcing Maguire possibly being a VVD/Vida caliber player on us, strictly due to his record fee, so hard and so soon before earning even a fraction of the cache prior to handing him the armband.

It was ridiculed by our rivals at the time and now it's ridiculed by the entire footballing world as a sharp and poignant reflection of where we stand as we've entered laughingstock status recently.
 
Mmm-Qatarian said:
I'm, like, 90% confident Maguire isn't going to be sold this summer. He has been diabolically bad this season but then so has essentially the entire fecking team. The reason I still have some faith in Maguire is that in actually competent set-ups he has proven to be an asset, and a pretty bloody good one at that. Some people on here make out that he has been as crap as he's been this season throughout his entire career, but that is simply bollocks.

If his confidence is irrecoverable then Maguire is a lost cause. Right now he's a rabbit in the headlights, and there's no way he's ever going to play well like that. If, however, he can recover some of that confidence (and I think removing the captaincy is a necessity), I envision him being OK under Ten Hag.
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He was crap his whole career, relegated like 3 teams before?

Never was special or even very good
 
Jippy said:
What is that even based on? It's not like he's renowned for refusing to take part in training or anything.
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I think he's repeatedly shown he believes he's better than he is across most interviews. He hardly ever takes blame and in some post match interviews where he's been at fault he's blamed others. Never mind his latest interview....

His general attitude is a huge chip on his shoulder, believing that criticism isn't deserved and his talent is being undermined. It's not an helpful attitude when in reality you need to be humble get your head down and focus on the basics again.

He's not the only one, we've had such issues for years and we're an arrogant team. There isn't a manager this lot haven't ignored and undermined, each manager post Sir Alex has faced it.
 
If we attack as a team and defend as a team, I suspect our defenders will look a lot better. Even Maguire. He has a chance with the new manager.
 
Ace said:
Sunk-Cost Fallacy (noun) -- the phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial.
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This is all the more reason to look at NPV of the next 5 years. This is very hard to do in football.

What you can do in football is instead look at what success in football is. Smart modelling would look at Man City, Liverpool, Real Madrid and Villarreal. Champions League semi finalists. What are the characteristics of their players, what style do they play. How closely aligned are our players to each of them.

Even if we are closely aligned to one we might still decide another option if we know the quality of those most closely aligned are just not good enough so we can instead work towards another model via transfers.

Forget history and what used to work, we need to look at now and forward trends.
 
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