Has political correctness actually gone mad?

:lol: I was wait-listed at my state's school of science and math because I was a white dude. The two girls (Korean and black) who got in had lower grades, lower test scores, and fewer extracurricular activities. I didn't think anything of it until the black girl said it was probably because I was male and white (even though I was a first generation college student). They called eventually asking if I still wanted to come, but I'm glad I didn't go. None of my friends who did got into "elite" schools despite being ridiculously smart. Although I would have gotten a much better education there and probably done better early on in college. The school's diversity weighting system was apparently changed the next year because they admitted like 5 white dudes from my school. All of the kids who went there before me were basically doctors' kids.

I'm not against affirmative action as long as it doesn't put those admitted under it in an unfair situation (i.e. kids from terrible schools who won't be able to cope with the work). Certain schools admit unqualified applicants for athletic reasons despite the fact that they are not prepared for college.

Eh, I think women are discriminated against, though. They generally do better in academics, meaning that to achieve a truly representative sample you need to expect higher scores from them: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/09/education/09college.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

"At Brown University, men made up not quite 40 percent of this year's applicants, but 47 percent of those admitted.

Women now outnumber men two to one at places like the State University of New York at New Paltz, the University of North Carolina at Greensboro and Baltimore City Community College."

You make a good point about the fact AA screws over a minority of completely unprepared kids - its pretty unethical, particularly if the university is making money off them from football and stuff.
I'm against the quota systems, per se. It only serves to enhance the differences.

How so, EAP?
 
Huh.
Try applying to a state-funded graduate school as an international student. UCSF takes 1 foreign student out of ~40 admitted for the program I was interested in.
The program I am in now also takes 1 (but out of 6 total :p )


*I'm aware this is apples and oranges; it has nothing to do with race/PC but everything to do with funding which is (rightly) tough to justify for non-citizens.


:lol: I was wait-listed at my state's school of science and math because I was a white dude.


If this is the NC school of science and maths, we're supposed to volunteer teach those kids about genetics next semester :lol:
 
I thought everyone in America either loved heavy metal or country and western.

If they're white, absolutely. That's a scientific fact. All black Americans only ever listen to hip-hop. Another scientific fact.

Although there's also a whole bunch of Americans that only just discovered dance music. They've re-named it EDM, call pills "molly" and are generally failing to accurately recreate something that we did much better, 20 years earlier.
 
If they're white, absolutely. That's a scientific fact. All black Americans only ever listen to hip-hop. Another scientific fact.

Although there's also a whole bunch of Americans that only just discovered dance music. They've re-named it EDM, call pills "molly" and are generally making a terrible hash of recreating something that we did much better, 20 years earlier.
Sweeping under the carpet for one moment that the whole scene started in San Francisco. But that is basically an outpost of Europe on the West Coast, same as Boston is on the East.
 
Sweeping under the carpet for one moment that the whole scene started in San Francisco. But that is basically an outpost of Europe on the West Coast, same as Boston is on the East.

I always thought Detroit was the spiritual home of techno. Anyhoo, let's not let that get in the way of taking the piss out of yanks and the way they've completely ruined a scene that once used to be quite cool.
 
I always thought Detroit was the spiritual home of techno. Anyhoo, let's not let that get in the way of taking the piss out of yanks and the way they've completely ruined a scene that once used to be quite cool.
You might be right. I heard a story a long time ago (and I may well therefore remember it incorrectly - though I dont think so) that Paul Oakenfold and Pete Tong discovered e in SF in the 80s and brought it back here. So it would be the spiritual home of the drug, rather than the music.

On the other hand Im sure that is also a massive simplification. Im sure it all came over by other routes as well.

Anyway, yeah. PC. You cant open your mouth without offending someone these days. GGgrrrrr.
 
You might be right. I heard a story a long time ago (and I may well therefore remember it incorrectly - though I dont think so) that Paul Oakenfold and Pete Tong discovered e in SF in the 80s and brought it back here. So it would be the spiritual home of the drug, rather than the music.

On the other hand Im sure that is also a massive simplification. Im sure it all came over by other routes as well.

Anyway, yeah. PC. You cant open your mouth without offending someone these days. GGgrrrrr.

You're probably right about the SF/MDMA link. Isn't that where yer man Timothy Leary is from?

But yeah, political correctness. None of that in my day!
 
Calling MDMA and pills 'molly' is up there with the worst things I've ever heard of.
 
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-s...ates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/

“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here. I think that it’s important for us to create that distinction and create a space where we can all learn from one another and start to create a place of healing rather than a place where we are experiencing a lot of hate like we have in the past.”
 
“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here. I think that it’s important for us to create that distinction and create a space where we can all learn from one another and start to create a place of healing rather than a place where we are experiencing a lot of hate like we have in the past.”

Smith-Lezama doesn’t say so directly, but one of the immediate implications of her response is that the First Amendment rights she’s tired of hearing about are responsible for “creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment.”




Uh, what? My diagnosis? Bad writing.
 
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-s...ates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/

“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here. I think that it’s important for us to create that distinction and create a space where we can all learn from one another and start to create a place of healing rather than a place where we are experiencing a lot of hate like we have in the past.”

If anyone ever wants to properly wind me up, start saying stuff like that... when will these little feckwits understand that university isn't for them to feel good? Its for learning. Feeling good will be the result of being 20, drinking every weekend and having irresponsible sex.
 
all the best insults have been obliterated by PC.

just waiting for the time when calling someone "fat" will get you arrested
 
http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=1829

phd102115s.gif
 
If anyone ever wants to properly wind me up, start saying stuff like that... when will these little feckwits understand that university isn't for them to feel good? Its for learning. Feeling good will be the result of being 20, drinking every weekend and having irresponsible sex.

Unless you're the male. Then you'll have to worry about the female regretting the sex and claiming you raped her when you were both drunk but consenting. The school would assign guilt to you as the male.
 
So with current events being what they are, I ventured back into this forum. Perhaps foolishly, knowing the steaming piles of ordure to be found on these threads.

Lo and behold, the appalling rose to greet me.

Bloomingdales' ad. In which it is apparently amusing and cool to suggest someone undertake date rape. Given the hetero couple in the pic, I think we can safely take this to be the implication.

This is an obscene trivialization of rape. Someone that is a harrowing, brutal and emotionally-scarring experience for far too many women, is apparently just something to make fun of. That's why people are entirely within the bounds of good sense to protest about it. That, rather than any notion it might directly lead to more rapes, is surely the issue in play here.

Oh. But it seems that the presence of these totally justifiable condemnations of the ad manages to annoy the oh-so-delicate sensibilities of those who might infrequently encounter those protests in their online activities. That, it seems, also counts for far more than the real-life problem women still face. Because that is just so apparently trivial compared to the anguish of encountering valid criticism (not even directed at the reader!) on line when you are not in a mood to do so.

Personally, I rate the totally self-absorbed whining of those complaining about protests against the ad as rather lower in importance than the survival of a bacteria. That they too feel it incumbent upon themselves to likewise trivialise rape compared to their notional inconvenience is a sad indictment of their lack of any reasonable moral compass.


Merry f*cking Xmas!
 
Still can't believe that ad got approved. I can only imagine what the ones they rejected were like.
 
Tbh, that article manages to almost totally obscure the actual issue that seems to have been raised. As far as it is possible to read between the lines, there seems to have been a suggestion that in running a 'yoga' class that calls itself that, there should be some explanation of how the practice came into being and its purpose when embedded in those originating cultures.

Rather similar to acknowledging a quotation rather than portraying it as your own perhaps.

The texts of the relevant emails would probably make much more sense than that poorly structured article.
 
To bring a serious note into this discussion: PC is an entirely western concept.

An Example: As good PC people, it is PC to us that we do not force our culture on other people’s culture. That's PC, right?

So, if we think that discrimination on women is terrible and not PC, then we would like to say that loudly, correct? HEY, THAT IS NOT PC!! But if a whole country, let's say Saudi Arabia, is not PC? Women over there may not even drive a car by themselves! Then..., then..., then... we have to say ------- what? In fact, we do accept the fact. Probably because that’s PC too, just over there. Poor women over there in Saudi Arabia, unfortunately they are not living in our glorious PC world.

And that in essence puts the whole PC-concept to what?

My guess would be: PC is a Western problem. A problem of societies who feel they are so advanced that they have no bigger problems. In a vacuum that’s cool. But the world outside is cold. Really cold.
 
So with current events being what they are, I ventured back into this forum. Perhaps foolishly, knowing the steaming piles of ordure to be found on these threads.

Lo and behold, the appalling rose to greet me.

Bloomingdales' ad. In which it is apparently amusing and cool to suggest someone undertake date rape. Given the hetero couple in the pic, I think we can safely take this to be the implication.

This is an obscene trivialization of rape. Someone that is a harrowing, brutal and emotionally-scarring experience for far too many women, is apparently just something to make fun of. That's why people are entirely within the bounds of good sense to protest about it. That, rather than any notion it might directly lead to more rapes, is surely the issue in play here.

Oh. But it seems that the presence of these totally justifiable condemnations of the ad manages to annoy the oh-so-delicate sensibilities of those who might infrequently encounter those protests in their online activities. That, it seems, also counts for far more than the real-life problem women still face. Because that is just so apparently trivial compared to the anguish of encountering valid criticism (not even directed at the reader!) on line when you are not in a mood to do so.

Personally, I rate the totally self-absorbed whining of those complaining about protests against the ad as rather lower in importance than the survival of a bacteria. That they too feel it incumbent upon themselves to likewise trivialise rape compared to their notional inconvenience is a sad indictment of their lack of any reasonable moral compass.


Merry f*cking Xmas!

Yeah, that didn't happen.

There's a lot of self-righteous bollox in the rest of your post but the bit in bold is the obvious error on which the rest is built.
 
Tbh, that article manages to almost totally obscure the actual issue that seems to have been raised. As far as it is possible to read between the lines, there seems to have been a suggestion that in running a 'yoga' class that calls itself that, there should be some explanation of how the practice came into being and its purpose when embedded in those originating cultures.

Rather similar to acknowledging a quotation rather than portraying it as your own perhaps.

The texts of the relevant emails would probably make much more sense than that poorly structured article.

Even if we accept your tortuous logic in coming up with the most charitable explanation possible it's still an absolutely fecking absurd reason to block these classes from happening. Exactly the sort of precious nonsense this thread is about.
 
Yeah, that didn't happen.

There's a lot of self-righteous bollox in the rest of your post but the bit in bold is the obvious error on which the rest is built.
Adding his own 'steaming pile of ordure' to the CE cesspit.
 
Yeah, that didn't happen.

There's a lot of self-righteous bollox in the rest of your post but the bit in bold is the obvious error on which the rest is built.
So what do you take the import of Bloomingdale's wording to be? Increase the safety of people this holiday period by encouraging sobriety?
 
Even if we accept your tortuous logic in coming up with the most charitable explanation possible it's still an absolutely fecking absurd reason to block these classes from happening. Exactly the sort of precious nonsense this thread is about.
It is ridiculous that such an issue has resulted in the temporary suspension of the classes I agree, but I never actually it wasn't did I?

In actual fact what seems (we must guess) to have caused the problem, is the inability of either the teacher to provide the cultural context of yoga, or the admin and teacher being unable to agree on an alternative title whose translation into French works. Weird, but that seems to be what the article itself implies.
 
I mean, male/female couple, drink-spiking... What could possibly go wrong? What scenario is likely to appear in the mind of the reader?

Why might a retailer that would surely rely on an aspirational market try to be associated with any given image? Success? Popularity? Humour? Cool?

So what image of the implied date-rape scenario did the advertiser thing it was portraying?
 
It's a terrible strapline but - as usual - the twitterstorm is massively hysterical and over the top.

An ad that alludes to "really irresponsible behaviour"? Oh noes. Won't someone think of the children?!?

In the context of some of the adjoining images from that catalogue, it looks as though it might have been part of series of images/lines about the "kerazzy" stuff people do during the festive season. Out of context and beside a photo of a rapey looking dude leering at a woman it's incredibly crass.

Nobody in their right mind could assume that Bloomingdale actually intended to suggest people should start raping their friends though. It was clearly a silly error. Nothing more than that though. Nonetheless, the twitter hordes are demanding boycotts and that they send all their profits to rape charities.

Not that anyone should feel sorry for Bloomingdale but it feels as though there's an awful lot of people out there with a constant burning desire to be outraged about something, anything, all the fecking time.

Surely the dude leering at the woman is the context?

Also I think you are inflating the "Twitter hordes" into a larger issue than it actually is. We're talking about a website with hundreds of millions of users - how many people have actually demanded a boycott?

That's a standard response to this sort of thing and impossible to answer. You don't expect me to give an actual number, do you?

Suffice is to say it's blown up enough to be widely reported on in most (if not all?) major media outlets. Which obviously reflects some sort of critical mass in terms of outraged masses. It's sufficiently poorly judged that you'd expect it to blow up a little. Something along the lines of "oops, what were they thinking?" wouldn't bother me at all. It's the fact so many people (and it's clearly a lot of people) that take it so damn seriously which makes me die inside a little.

Re context. There's a bit more in this image (and probably even more in the actual catalogue)

0ymFfCh
So here we have Pogue's complaint. He has to (potentially if he can be bothered to go and find them) endure a 'Twitter-storm' of complaint about a tasteless ad that deserves censure in any sane world. Except there really isn't that much of a storm it seems.

Still enough to get his PC-phobic knickers in a twist.

I think many complainants, like me, don't actually make Pogue's strawman complaint... that Bloomingdale's are actually encouraging rape in that ad. Instead we are entitled to wonder just why that type of action seems to be being portrayed with some poisitivity? As cool? Or fun? Or just another 'crazee' thing that people do?

Certainly, when I showed the ad to my wife she was appalled at the ad and that anyone might object that people were complaining about it.

If we are looking for ordure on the CE forum, then alongside the frequent racism and prejudice, suggesting that complainants in this case are massively in error is a big steaming pile compared to my pissing on Pogue's parade.
 
Oh well if your wife is offended then you must be right...

Re the ad. Date rape doesn't need to involve any spiked drinks. Spiking a drink (presumably with booze) isn't necessarily a prelude to rape.

It's a shit ad but only an idiot could think the intention was to portray rape as cool.
 
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I don't believe those figures. No way Poland and Italy are more PC than UK and France.
In terms of the right for the government to censor hate speech, I'm sure it's 100% correct. WWII and fascism are still a bit too recent in the histories of Germany, Poland and Italy for them to loosen the reigns on free speech issues. It worries me that Britain and France are leaning more to the freedom of speech side since the speech we're generally talking about legislating against is racist, homophobic, islamophobic crap but it's hardly surprising given the increasing sway of parties like UKIP and Front-Nationale.

Not sure why the OP thinks Europe being more in favour of restricting hate speech is a bad thing though, I know America loves to bang on about how freedom of speech is some divine right, "sticks & stones..." etc. But what Europe is generally legislating against is the most outlandish hate speech and incitement that has no place in a modern multicultural society and needs to be stamped on.
 
In terms of the right for the government to censor hate speech, I'm sure it's 100% correct. WWII and fascism are still a bit too recent in the histories of Germany, Poland and Italy for them to loosen the reigns on free speech issues. It worries me that Britain and France are leaning more to the freedom of speech side since the speech we're generally talking about legislating against is racist, homophobic, islamophobic crap but it's hardly surprising given the increasing sway of parties like UKIP and Front-Nationale.

Not sure why the OP thinks Europe being more in favour of restricting hate speech is a bad thing though, I know America loves to bang on about how freedom of speech is some divine right, "sticks & stones..." etc. But what Europe is generally legislating against is the most outlandish hate speech and incitement that has no place in a modern multicultural society and needs to be stamped on.
In Italy, a "golly" sign is still displayed outside some cafes near where we have a house - I think the logo used to be used to advertise Rombouts coffee. No-one seems to think anything of it, strangely enough. They seem very casual about that sort of thing.
 
In Italy, a "golly" sign is still displayed outside some cafes near where we have a house - I think the logo used to be used to advertise Rombouts coffee. No-one seems to think anything of it, strangely enough. They seem very casual about that sort of thing.
It's the curiously inverted way of these things; in Germany, Poland and Italy more historic references like fascistic imagery are rightly legislated against in a far heavier manner than in the UK or France yet the underlying tendancy towards both casual and overt racism seems to be more prevalent and even accepted.

We're far less likely to bang up some idiot walking around wearing a swastika in the UK, probably because he's a member of the royal family, but will take to twitter en masse the minute Robinsons Jam or Enid Blyton appear. Personally I think our greater sensitivity to it, whilst it can seem to be PC gone mad, does produce a society where there is less overt racism and where you're far less likely nowadays to see footballers being abused with monkey chants and bananas than you are in Italy, Spain or Poland.
 
This thread is like complaining about dust on the carpet after centuries of atomic bombing.