Giggs trial

[Oranges038]

Alcoholism and drug addiction in general is a disease and most times not an actual choice of life. Best’s mother was an alcoholic too, making George vulnerable. Of course he did bad things too, but «killing» himself in his 50’s by drinking tells you this was a person who suffered a lot and never managed to take back control of his life. Of course it didn’t help that Best’s fame got out of control during a time this was something yet to be seen and nobody was prepared for the constant media circus and lack of privacy. Even though there are no excuses for some of Best’s actions, the situation with Giggs is still very different. You can do bad actions and make even worse choices and still be a good person (which most people would suggest Best was) and visa versa. Sleeping with your brother’s wife for 8 (!) years feels more calculated and a different league alone to anything George Best did in my book.

What if Giggs has an addiction to sex? Does that make it ok that he nailed his brother's wife? Because he had an addiction, he has a bad disease? He's not a mean calculated cnut, he's just sick.

Best was a scumbag, an alcholic and a wife beater, He did it for nearly 40 years, there were many times where he could have stopped. He was given plenty of chances. If your next door neighbour was getting drunk and beating on his wife but he went out and cut the grass, cleaned up rubbish, did odd jobs for people for free, raised money for charity etc. You'd think he's a good person, the poor lad just has a bad disease?

Giggs is a scumbag for banging his brothers wife, if this stuff is all true he's an even bigger scumbag.

 

[Spaghetti]

Oh, I wasn't aware of that. I retract my previous description of Joey Barton.

Haha, I gathered that you had missed it.

In case you are bothered about Joeys latest misdemeanour, from The Guardian:


Former footballer Joey Barton has been charged with assault by beating after a woman suffered a head injury at a residential address in London.
Barton, currently manager of League Two club Bristol Rovers, will appear at Wimbledon magistrates court on Monday. It follows an incident at a house in Kew, south-west London, on 2 June.
A spokesperson for the Metropolitan police confirmed the court appearance: “Joseph Barton, 38, of Widnes, is due to appear on bail on Monday 26 July at Wimbledon magistrates court charged with assault by beating.
“The charge relates to an incident which took place at a residential property in Kew on Wednesday 2 June in which a woman received a head injury.”

 

[BazzaBear]

Then whoever's judging in criminal court thinks it's less that 99 % chance he did it and whoever judges in civil court thinks less than 50 %.

And we still think we know better regardless?

 

[Hughie77]

Often it's a question of detail. Ched Evans was found guilty of rape and sent to jail, and years later the retrial found that although he did have sex with the woman, it didn't constitute rape.

This Giggs stuff is different. Either his ex has made it up or it's true. There's no question of whether or not it was illegal, just whether or not it happened.

Exactly wait we all find out .

 

[Hughie77]

I didn't say this was the only reason I dislike the man did i and also didn't claim he was guilty yet?

Wonderful footballer, shame about his character.

What about his character, hasn't everybody got a different one! Who's to judge other peoples character? It's the jury in this case .

 

[NotThatSoph]

And we still think we know better regardless?

I don't know what you'll think.

 

[Hughie77]

Well it's more than that. The police and judicial system believe there is enough evidence to bring it to court and that he has a case to answer. He was also arrested on the night in question. Obviously innocent until proven guilty but you're painting as though people are believing some tabloid rumour and starting a witch hunt.

No, only the ones who comment dont know! You dont Know I dont know, the only ones who know it's the parties involved! As for the tabloids it's TRUE that's where all the information is coming from. Because nobody on here unless directly there knows nothing but rumours .

 

[Withnail]

No, only the ones who comment dont know! You dont Know I dont know, the only ones who know it's the parties involved! As for the tabloids it's TRUE that's where all the information is coming from. Because nobody on here unless directly there knows nothing but rumours .

It's not rumours. I'm talking about the details of the case i.e. the charges he will face in court, information that is in the public domain and not tabloid rumours.

Are you for real?

Also lay off the exclamation marks and capital letters. No need to be getting worked up.

 

[KetilOwren88]

What if Giggs has an addiction to sex? Does that make it ok that he nailed his brother's wife? Because he had an addiction, he has a bad disease? He's not a mean calculated cnut, he's just sick.

Best was a scumbag, an alcholic and a wife beater, He did it for nearly 40 years, there were many times where he could have stopped. He was given plenty of chances. If your next door neighbour was getting drunk and beating on his wife but he went out and cut the grass, cleaned up rubbish, did odd jobs for people for free, raised money for charity etc. You'd think he's a good person, the poor lad just has a bad disease?

Giggs is a scumbag for banging his brothers wife, if this stuff is all true he's an even bigger scumbag.

I think you missed the point here. You made it sound like alcoholism is something it’s really not. If you read again, I said there are no excuses for some of Best’s antics, but it still feels a lot like more spontanious lack of control and desperation for money/drugs than the long term calculating actions by Giggs. Best never tried to be anyone else but himself, whilst Giggs is painting a picture of a great man, which gives Best a lot more sympathy. Where Best strikes me as a bit short and naive, Giggs is giving the impression of a much more cynical and «creepy» person. Nobody of us can tell what kind of persons these guys are in their privates, my point is most people suggest Best was a kind, intelligent and warm person who was destroyed by his inner demons and the massive media hysteria. Of course he might be a shitbag too, but again, I feel the situation is not really similar to Giggs. As you say, he could have stopped his drinking, but ended up killing himself. Since he just could have stopped, are you suggesting he took his own life by purpose? Probably he was so fecked up that a normal life was impossible to reach. In the end, he ended up as a victim of himself, which adds a bit of balance to the story compared to the cold lying coward that is Ryan Giggs.

 

[Oranges038]

I think you missed the point here. You made it sound like alcoholism is something it’s really not. If you read again, I said there are no excuses for some of Best’s antics, but it still feels a lot like more spontanious lack of control and desperation for money/drugs than the long term calculating actions by Giggs. Best never tried to be anyone else but himself, whilst Giggs is painting a picture of a great man, which gives Best a lot more sympathy. Where Best strikes me as a bit short and naive, Giggs is giving the impression of a much more cynical and «creepy» person. Nobody of us can tell what kind of persons these guys are in their privates, my point is most people suggest Best was a kind, intelligent and warm person who was destroyed by his inner demons and the massive media hysteria. Of course he might be a shitbag too, but again, I feel the situation is not really similar to Giggs. As you say, he could have stopped his drinking, but ended up killing himself. Since he just could have stopped, are you suggesting he took his own life by purpose? Probably he was so fecked up that a normal life was impossible to reach. In the end, he ended up as a victim of himself, which adds a bit of balance to the story compared to the cold lying coward that is Ryan Giggs.

Georgie the loveable rogue, if he was such a nice guy, he would have been able to realise the affect his drinking was having, he wouldn't have continued even after he got his transplant. He was a rotten alcoholic and a wife beater and he drank himself to death.

Clearly Giggs is a prick, I don't know whether or not he has concealed that deliberately all these years, he was never a very out there with his personal life from memory. Not sure how you can make out that him being a lying coward is somehow worse than being an alcoholic woman beater for 40 odd years.

 

[Bwuk]

Bests in the same boat as Giggs but it happened so long ago it’s forgotten about.

If Giggs is found guilty I hope the club never has anything to do with him.

 

[KetilOwren88]

Georgie the loveable rogue, if he was such a nice guy, he would have been able to realise the affect his drinking was having, he wouldn't have continued even after he got his transplant. He was a rotten alcoholic and a wife beater and he drank himself to death.

Clearly Giggs is a prick, I don't know whether or not he has concealed that deliberately all these years, he was never a very out there with his personal life from memory. Not sure how you can make out that him being a lying coward is somehow worse than being an alcoholic woman beater for 40 odd years.

Georgie the loveable rogue, if he was such a nice guy, he would have been able to realise the affect his drinking was having, he wouldn't have continued even after he got his transplant. He was a rotten alcoholic and a wife beater and he drank himself to death.

Clearly Giggs is a prick, I don't know whether or not he has concealed that deliberately all these years, he was never a very out there with his personal life from memory. Not sure how you can make out that him being a lying coward is somehow worse than being an alcoholic woman beater for 40 odd years.

You clearly have no intention trying to understand what I mean. I have never said George Best was such a nice bloke, I am refering to what many people have said about him. If he was such a terrible person you suggest, why did Northern Ireland/Belfast arrange his funeral the way they did? Why did so many people meet up to say good bye? Beeing a great fotballer alone is not enough and if he was a horrible person, that would never happen. Again, I have never suggested Best was a saint, my point is that the situation is not comparable to Giggs, simply because I think the latter is worse. You are still talking like beeing an alcoholic suggests you are an awful person, that’s what I disagree with. George Best drank himself to death. What does that tell you? You clearly ignored my question about the matter. Ryan Giggs is much more than a cold liar. My point is: George Best did horrible things, but atleast had the guts to admit it. Ryan Giggs is painting an image of a wonderful human beeing, while beeing a shitbag behind closed doors. It’s like what sociopaths and psychopaths do. Obivously, if that’s the case, Giggs is sick too, because these are things people with those diagnoses fail to see about themselves.

 

[Snuffkin]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

 

[Oranges038]

You clearly have no intention trying to understand what I mean. I have never said George Best was such a nice bloke, I am refering to what many people have said about him. If he was such a terrible person you suggest, why did Northern Ireland/Belfast arrange his funeral the way they did? Why did so many people meet up to say good bye? Beeing a great fotballer alone is not enough and if he was a horrible person, that would never happen. Again, I have never suggested Best was a saint, my point is that the situation is not comparable to Giggs, simply because I think the latter is worse. You are still talking like beeing an alcoholic suggests you are an awful person, that’s what I disagree with. George Best drank himself to death. What does that tell you? You clearly ignored my question about the matter. Ryan Giggs is much more than a cold liar. My point is: George Best did horrible things, but atleast had the guts to admit it. Ryan Giggs is painting an image of a wonderful human beeing, while beeing a shitbag behind closed doors. It’s like what sociopaths and psychopaths do. Obivously, if that’s the case, Giggs is sick too, because these are things people with those diagnoses fail to see about themselves.

Best being the best footballer to ever come out of Northern Ireland is why. They chose to ignore the other stuff he did, his status in football is what got him all that. He was a great player, but with all the other stuff he deserves zero respect on a personal level.

Same with Giggs, he did more for Man Utd than Best ever did. He's probably one of the best Man Utd and Welsh players ever. For all the shit he's done and if all the latest stuff is proven true then he too deserves zero respect.

I don't think it's a case of who was less of a cnut. Both have done cnutish things. Whether the image they portrayed in public was different to how they were privately or not. That was the basis my original point, many people choose to ignore what Best did and many people will choose to ignore what Giggs did and remember them only for their football. I personally think they were great players but deserve zero respect.

 

[Redlambs]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

Case clearly closed.

 

[thundercats]

Don't care, Giggs will still be one of the all time greats

 

[Brophs]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

Genuinely awful post.

She also has appalling taste in men, it seems.

 

[Withnail]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

I sincerely hope they take none of that pile of irrelevancies into account.

Nice little dig at the alleged victim as well. Good man.

 

[thundercats]

It is not unlikely a girl falls for men with a big wallet though. It is all historically correct. Women didn't work and had to marry rich men to have a luxurious life during marriage and after the husbands death, this was especially important due to wars killing off many husband throughout the centuries. This is obviously not the reason anymore to marry rich men but it is still part of female DNA. If a girl falls for a bum I'm pretty sure her parents will do everything they can to see it fail.

 

[Solius]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

 

[Raoul]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

 

[red4ever 79]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

Just wow

 

[SuperiorXI]

Shocker that one

 

[Hughie77]

It's not rumours. I'm talking about the details of the case i.e. the charges he will face in court, information that is in the public domain and not tabloid rumours.

Are you for real?

Also lay off the exclamation marks and capital letters. No need to be getting worked up.

Seems your the one getting worked up , it will only come out in the public domain after the trail unless someone who is there and watching and hearing every word of it will only know. So the only information everyone is getting is from the press. Ok .

 

[Withnail]

Seems your the one getting worked up , it will only come out in the public domain after the trail unless someone who is there and watching and hearing every word of it will only know. So the only information everyone is getting is from the press. Ok .

That's not what you said

 

[IWat]

Seems your the one getting worked up , it will only come out in the public domain after the trail unless someone who is there and watching and hearing every word of it will only know. So the only information everyone is getting is from the press. Ok .

The press are allowed to attend criminal trials to report on them. They'll have limits on what they can/can't publish sure if there is something paticularly sensitive, but come on.

 

[Cloud7]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

You see posts like this and then you wonder if some people have progressed at all in their thinking since the 1800s

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

She has a good career herself - Giggs met her because Hotel Football used her PR conpany.

Being a top footballer and hard working and having a humble background is irrelevant - if he's found guilty of domestivlc violence he should face the book like anyone else.

 

[IWat]

I don’t know how the mods view this thread and it’s various contributions, but clearly - at this stage - what we have are a set of allegations. You can think what you like about Ryan Giggs. But he deserves the chance to answer in court to these serious charges. There’s still an awful lot we don’t know.

For this to get to court the Crown Prosecution Service have looked at all the evidence including what Giggs has said in interviews etc and believe there is a "realistic prospect of conviction" which is their standard for charging someone. Now perhaps they've got it wrong, but at this point it is not just wild allegations.

 

[Hughie77]

The press are allowed to attend criminal trials to report on them. They'll have limits on what they can/can't publish sure if there is something paticularly sensitive, but come on.

Ok.the whole truth will only come out till after trial . Like I've said before then judge, until then it's just opinions on his character which everyone is entitled to do, and that is in the main on what they've read or heard, unless they personally know him.

 

[Adisa]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

My days!

 

[Hughie77]

That's not what you said

 

[IWat]

Ok.the whole truth will only come out till after trial . Like I've said before then judge, until then it's just opinions on his character which everyone is entitled to do, and that is in the main on what they've read or heard, unless they personally know him.

Being arrested is one thing. Being charged means detectives have looked at the evidence including his side of the story and believe the allegations to be legit and that they feel they have the evidence, that will then have been passed to the CPS who also have the opportunity to decline to prosecute it if they feel they don't have a reasonable chance of getting a guilty verdict. 72% of trials end with conviction for the record.

So at this point he's either very unlucky, or an abuser.

 

[Withnail]

No give over. You're full of it. You claim it's all rumours and nobody can know anything except from tabloids.

Then you switch it up and say we can only know what's in the press. Yes that's true because there are actual reporters for legitimate newspapers printing the facts that have been released by the authorities. Ffs

 

[IWat]

What if Giggs has an addiction to sex? Does that make it ok that he nailed his brother's wife? Because he had an addiction, he has a bad disease? He's not a mean calculated cnut, he's just sick.

I would not be surprised at all if he got off on the fact it was his brother's wife and actually enjoyed it more, the whole power play thing that he can just take what he wants. He's wealthy, famous and he's not bad looking for his age, if he goes looking I am sure he doesn't have to go home alone.

It's not like him and her tried to give it a go once it came out like Hancock, he didn't love her, she wasn't the one. He pumped her because she was his brothers wife and that thrill was probably more than picking someone up in a random club.

 

[FizzyWomack]

I would not be surprised at all if he got off on the fact it was his brother's wife and actually enjoyed it more, the whole power play thing that he can just take what he wants. He's wealthy, famous and he's not bad looking for his age, if he goes looking I am sure he doesn't have to go home alone.

It's not like him and her tried to give it a go once it came out like Hancock, he didn't love her, she wasn't the one. He pumped her because she was his brothers wife and that thrill was probably more than picking someone up in a random club.

You’re just assuming things here. The fact is he was “pumping her” before his brother met her.

So maybe he enjoyed pumping her so much he just couldn’t stop. There’s always 2 sides to a story, not only is he a bastard for shagging his brothers missus but what about her? She obviously is a top notch wrong’un as well.

 

[IWat]

You’re just assuming things here. The fact is he was “pumping her” before his brother met her.

So maybe he enjoyed pumping her so much he just couldn’t stop. There’s always 2 sides to a story, not only is he a bastard for shagging his brothers missus but what about her? She obviously is a top notch wrong’un as well.

I am assuming sure, but it sounds like classic textbook traits of narcissistic personality disorder when you take the previous sexual behaviour and now if these allegations are true.

And yep agree, takes 2 to tango.

 

[Cee90]

Some shocking posts in this thread.

 

[sebsheep]

What do we know about Giggs? He's reliable, professional, hard working, good with youth development, good with discipline, hard working for charity, a model athlete from a humble background.
What do we know about his girlfriend? She scored with a rich footballer.
I sincerely hope the courts take everything into account.

Don't care, Giggs will still be one of the all time greats

It is not unlikely a girl falls for men with a big wallet though. It is all historically correct. Women didn't work and had to marry rich men to have a luxurious life during marriage and after the husbands death, this was especially important due to wars killing off many husband throughout the centuries. This is obviously not the reason anymore to marry rich men but it is still part of female DNA. If a girl falls for a bum I'm pretty sure her parents will do everything they can to see it fail.

Some absolutely cracking posts in here.

 

[thundercats]

Some absolutely cracking posts in here.

You may find it insensitive but you will find I have said nothing that isn’t a fact. Women have married men (usually arranged) for 1000s of years. To this day women often state 2 superficial things that are attractive for them in men 1) looks and 2) money. How else would you explain younger women marrying old farts perhaps?

I’m not saying this is how it happened with Giggs’ wife , I’m just playing devil’s advocate here. But like I said in my first post here, I really don’t care what x or y did in his private life because in this case it has absolutely nothing to do with his performances on the pitch which were spectacular throughout his career.