115 x 6 = 690 
Everton deducted 10 points for PSR breach (reduced to 6) | Deducted further 2 points for second breach
- Thread starter SilentWitness
- Start date
I'm convinced this recent push by the PL to look hard for the cameras is simply trying to avoid the independent regulator being imposed on them.
Because why are you imposing punishments on sides who have pled guilty, only for those punishments to be easily alleviated upon appeal? What does that say about the rigor of the PL's case and punishment?
And what faith does this give you about their ongoing case against City, who are actually fighting it?
We continue to observe.
Even at 100 points per league, that's relegation from the 7th tier... right?115 x 6 = 690
Can see a club considering legal action if means difference between staying up and relegation. Not sure on rules (do not they all sign up to them beforehand)?
Well the decision and appeal decisions were made by an independent commission, not the PL. I'm interested to see what the supposed "legal errors" are that were made in the first decision.
I think we are. Nottingham Forest's breaches were much worse than ours, so I think we can assume at least a 6 point deduction for them too in April. If there's any logic or consistency, it'd have to be more than 6.
So we still won’t know if the 2nd case will be heard and appealed before the end of the season?
Teams deserve clarity, but especially when you consider what is at stake. If I am Luton, I don’t know, and won’t know, what points tally will keep me safe until these cases are heard.
They should come out and say when so teams know what to expect.
It’s a mess and wholly unfair to the teams in and around the bottom.
Teams deserve clarity, but especially when you consider what is at stake. If I am Luton, I don’t know, and won’t know, what points tally will keep me safe until these cases are heard.
They should come out and say when so teams know what to expect.
It’s a mess and wholly unfair to the teams in and around the bottom.
Understood. If Everton are getting (deserved) penalty reductions upon appeal, what does that say about the PL's process for determining penalties? Or competency in these matters period?
What a great weekend for the city of Liverpool.
Not very competent at all. I don't really think any deductions or reimbursements should happen during a season unless it is a cut and dry case like administration.
I think, the PL have pooped their pants due to a possible independent regulator coming in and thus have tried to muster a hatchet job of a solution.
What does the FA have anything to do with it?
Absolutely.
City will have taken note ready for their appeal.
Good news for Everton, sucks to be Forest though. 4pt clear of relegation with a deduction hanging over them.
Unless of course the commission hand Everton a 4pt deduction for the ‘second breach’ charge and then it’s anybody’s guess at the bottom.
I agree entirely about all this going on mid season. It’s very shoddy by the PL and they are just showing themselves up again. Sooner this regulator comes in the better.
Unless of course the commission hand Everton a 4pt deduction for the ‘second breach’ charge and then it’s anybody’s guess at the bottom.
I agree entirely about all this going on mid season. It’s very shoddy by the PL and they are just showing themselves up again. Sooner this regulator comes in the better.
Worth pointing out that a very similar thing happened with Juventus last season.
Everton are incredibly lucky that they have been deducted six points this season rather than last.
Everton are incredibly lucky that they have been deducted six points this season rather than last.
We're back in the relegation zoneThat won’t help @Dirty Schwein ?
They are just a Football Association
Yous are definitely safe
Don't really know that.
That's why point deductions mid season are weird because they can galvanise or psychologically damage teams.
They know full well they're not going to do a fecking thing about City's cheating so they've decided to let Everton off the hook a bit so they don't look as corrupt. Won't be surprised if the points deduction is just scrapped altogether eventually.
The easier explanation is they don't know what the feck they're doing
Waiting until the end of the season has it's own problems though. For starters, waiting to do the actual court proceeding (or whatever it is) means the whole summer could be taken up, at which point you're either potentially leaving two teams in limbo not knowing which has been relegated, or relegating one while Everton's punishment gets tacked on to the next season (which many may deem as highly unfair). Even if you reach the verdict mid-season but wait until the end to announce it/the punishment, that's still looming over the club until the announcement, and that still leaves an appeal window.
Using this season as an example, say they announced that Everton have fallen foul of this rule mid-season, but the punishment is to be announced after the last game has been played. Everton finish 9 points of, for example, Luton, who get relegated in 18th. The Premier League then announce that Everton receive a 10 point deduction as a punishment and are relegated in Luton's place. However, in this instance Everton now don't have the same appeal window, because the time between verdict and appeal decision would have taken you into next season, and Everton are relegated, or it's back to the above where both teams are in limbo while they try and rush through the review of the appeal.
Didn't Everton admit to it? I don't understand why this happened.
I wish they reduced the 30 points they hit us with and sent us to non-league. What a joke.
I wish they reduced the 30 points they hit us with and sent us to non-league. What a joke.
Probably means Luton will go down with Sheffield United & Burnley now.
Very messed up how points deductions can be amended through the season. Not fair on the other clubs.
@SilentWitness will know the full details but it was something like Everton admitting the charge and the Premier League recommending a punishment of 10 points. The independent review then rejected whatever methodology they'd used to reach that 10 points figure, but then agreed on the 10 points figure anyway. Everton appealed the 10 points, and now someone has agreed it was too harsh, despite both the Premier League and the independent review seemingly landing at the figure separately, and now it's 6 points.
Yeah it’s pretty ridiculous how they’ve done it as @Alex99 has said.
I bet clubs have already alerted their legal teams..
Complete and utter farce
Typical farce from the 'Premier' league. I guess it pays off to cheat because it's so easy to get away with it if you have the right status. Seriously sick of football.
I'd be absolutely shocked if one of them stays up
I know our resident Toffee has been fairly confident of the punishment being reduced, but from the outside it just seems a bit daft.
The Premier League came up with some method to calculate the punishment and arrived at 10 points, then the review committee independently arrived at the same figure using a different method.
It does basically seems like Everton have kicked up a stink and got their own way, which has now set a precedent for any future punishment as handed out by these committees.
It should be done in the summer prior to the season beginning.
It also seems ridiculous that you’d actually deduct the points before establishing if that was the end of the matter.
If there’s an appeals process with any chance of adjusting the outcome surely you let that happen before acting.
Is the punishment for failing FFP/PSR the same regardless of how much you overspend?
This is just becoming a parody. Soon, nobody will take this league serious. It is just complete meltdown from VAR to this.
I was confident purely because of the way it's been set out by the original decision and reasons given. Not sure if you've read the article I posted a few weeks ago but it's definitely worth a read and basically sets out why 10 points was harsh and why we had grounds to appeal the original decision in a far more eloquent and sensible way than I can.
Hopefully our boys can use this "cheating and getting away with it" as motivation and take advantage of the decent run in we have upcoming. We still need to play Everton and Forrest so hoping they'll be well up for that.
What should? The whole thing? Just the announcement of the punishment?
As I said, there are issues doing it in a summer too. Chiefly, it presenting a clear argument for any points deduction being applied to the season that's just finished and potentially leaving two clubs in limbo about which league they’ll be playing in until a decision can be made.
Suppose the issue here was them appealing the severity of the punishment, and not the verdict itself.
Unless you're saying they should have privately been told of the punishment, then given the opportunity to either accept or appeal.
You've dropped some silly points against teams in and around you I think? Losing to Sheffield United & Burnley? Definitely hurt you a bit.
It's not really cheating and getting away with it, we have still been punished.
I think this is fair considering everything.
I'm interested to see what happens to Forest though as apparently their breach is more.
I think the fairest way to do it is to do it in the summer prior or post a season starting/ending so a team has those deductions already in place if that's going to be the case or they get them. It removes psychological stuff and makes it more so about football and what happens on the pitch. There is no easy or fair way to do it really so it's about trying to make it the fairest way.