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Euthanasia
- Thread starter calodo2003
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Help available here - https://www.mind.org.uk/
https://giveusashout.org/
https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/
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Maybe but also spot on point. Whereas the following comment wasn't an equivalent good faith response.The original post saying "just don't get one" was also overly simplistic too, to be fair.
Exactly why government needs to be secular in nature with a total separation from religion.But some people truly believe abortion to be equivalent to murder, so this argument doesn't hold up at all for them.
I watched my dad die a needlessly painful, undignified and protracted death and have been involved in the Dying with Dignity movement in Canada ever since.
For what it’s worth here are the three biggest things I’ve learned since we implemented AD here in 2016.
1. People really want agency regarding their end of life options. People tend not to fear death, they fear dying badly. AD provides a lot of comfort to a lot of people with that fear. A civil society should alleviate the suffering of its members, not add to it. Medical assistance in dying is humane and alleviates suffering. It’s hard to see why anyone would be against it in principle.
2. Abuse of the system is effectively zero. The edge case and slippery slope arguments are fallacious. The system (although there are provincial differences ) is simple, effective and hard to game. Safeguards work. Vulnerable people are protected. Many applications are rejected. The criteria are very clear. If there’s a criticism of the system it’s that it doesn’t allow (yet) for advance directives, where someone can specify their wish for AD in the event they become incapacitated.
3. It’s a personal choice. How other people choose to die is simply none of our business. If you don’t want to avail yourself of AD, then don’t, but to argue that others shouldn’t have that option is wrong: why should we have to live (and die) by someone else’s code?
Interestingly I don’t think I’ve ever met someone who’s had to watch a loved one die in agony who opposes AD. They all get it. There is no virtue or nobility in this type of suffering.
I hope the legislation passes, and that the many thousands of people in suffering might get some comfort.
For what it’s worth here are the three biggest things I’ve learned since we implemented AD here in 2016.
1. People really want agency regarding their end of life options. People tend not to fear death, they fear dying badly. AD provides a lot of comfort to a lot of people with that fear. A civil society should alleviate the suffering of its members, not add to it. Medical assistance in dying is humane and alleviates suffering. It’s hard to see why anyone would be against it in principle.
2. Abuse of the system is effectively zero. The edge case and slippery slope arguments are fallacious. The system (although there are provincial differences ) is simple, effective and hard to game. Safeguards work. Vulnerable people are protected. Many applications are rejected. The criteria are very clear. If there’s a criticism of the system it’s that it doesn’t allow (yet) for advance directives, where someone can specify their wish for AD in the event they become incapacitated.
3. It’s a personal choice. How other people choose to die is simply none of our business. If you don’t want to avail yourself of AD, then don’t, but to argue that others shouldn’t have that option is wrong: why should we have to live (and die) by someone else’s code?
Interestingly I don’t think I’ve ever met someone who’s had to watch a loved one die in agony who opposes AD. They all get it. There is no virtue or nobility in this type of suffering.
I hope the legislation passes, and that the many thousands of people in suffering might get some comfort.
Drainy
Full Member
It’s best to post this now -
Help available here - https://www.mind.org.uk/
https://giveusashout.org/
https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/
.
How about adding your own commentary to the endless shit you spam onto the forum?
Out of interest, why are you concerned by the private, personal choices made by other people that have no effect on you whatsoever?Assisted dying bill is ‘flawed and dangerous’ after changes, says group of Labour MPs
If you oppose assisted dying, then don’t avail yourself of it if/when the time comes. Suffer away, if that’s your wish. But why be concerned about others? That seems strange.
Sweet Square
ˈkämyənəst
On the surface it appears as a well meaning liberal reform of having more autonomy and to end suffering but the larger stats point to a growing dystopian picture.Out of interest, why are you concerned by the private, personal choices made by other people that have no effect on you whatsoever?
If you oppose assisted dying, then don’t avail yourself of it if/when the time comes. Suffer away, if that’s your wish. But why be concerned about others? That seems strange.
Assisted suicide programs tend to get expanded to other groups especially ones who are seen as “less valuable” in a capitalist society.
There’s a reason why so many disability rights activists have been against assisted suicide. The UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities has recommended Canada not expanded its maid program(evidence suggest it
women made up 59% of all maid track 2 deaths)
It’s also worth saying the history of assisted suicide is based in eugenics.
The choices we make along with the role of government and corporations don’t happen in a vacuum.
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What ‘larger stats’ are you referring to?On the surface it appears as a well meaning liberal reform of having more autonomy and to end suffering but the larger stats point to a growing dystopian picture.
Assisted suicide programs tend to get expanded to other groups especially ones who are seen as “less valuable” in a capitalist society.
There’s a reason why so many disability rights activists have been against assisted suicide. The UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities has recommended Canada not expanded its maid program(evidence suggest it
women made up 59% of all maid track 2 deaths)
It’s also worth saying the history of assisted suicide is based in eugenics.
The choices we make along with the role of government and corporations don’t happen in a vacuum. Mo
I can see you’re well meaning, but you’re misrepresenting reality. You seem to think that a group of people is sitting there with a list of groups they’d like to euthanize. That’s just not the case.
It’s true that MAiD is expanding, but most people see that as a positive because it’s at the specific request of those patient groups. For example, despite you implying that people with disabilities oppose MAiD, in fact 76% support it in Canada: https://www.dyingwithdignity.ca/med... disability support,would like to access MAID.
The bigger point though is that this ought to be a personal choice. You get to decide for you, and I for me. Why don’t you want people to have the choice to end their suffering? Why should anyone else’s view matter in that situation? What difference does it make to you? I genuinely don’t understand. Would you keep your dog alive when he was in pain and suffering greatly? I’d hope not.
Sweet Square
ˈkämyənəst
I’ve posted some of the stats in this thread.What ‘larger stats’ are you referring to?
Yeah I didn’t say any of that.You seem to think that a group of people is sitting there with a list of groups they’d like to euthanize.
A recent poll showed 54% of Canadians wanted to bring back the death penalty. Doesn’t make it a good thing.It’s true that MAiD is expanding, but most people see that as a positive because it’s at the specific request of those patient groups. For example, despite you implying that people with disabilities oppose MAiD, in fact 76% support it in Canada: https://www.dyingwithdignity.ca/media-center/2023-poll-support-for-medically-assisted-dying-canada/#:~:text=Seventy-eight per cent of people with a disability support,would like to access MAID.
Disabled people of course aren’t one single voice(There’s a poll showing British disabled voters currently favour a party which will happily cut any of their benefits)but polling isn’t good argument against activist groups and UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.
Can’t believe I have to do the meme but….we live in a society.The bigger point though is that this ought to be a personal choice. You get to decide for you, and I for me. Why don’t you want people to have the choice to end their suffering? Why should anyone else’s view matter in that situation? What difference does it make to you? I genuinely don’t understand.
No one is a free floating individual. This a national policy so it’s going to affect other citizens. From things like healthcare funding to how the governmental services interact with people.
Assisted suicide programs tend to get expanded to other groups especially ones who are seen as “less valuable” in a capitalist society.
Kind of proves the point.Would you keep your dog alive when he was in pain and suffering greatly? I’d hope not.
Would recommend this article -
Why I changed my mind on MAiD
https://www.readtheorchard.org/p/why-i-changed-my-mind-on-maid
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