He’s like the new Mkhi during Jose’s time here when everyone was questioning why the manager isn’t starting the player. Turns out Mkhi apparently has a meek mentality playing for a big club in his first season and that he wasn’t quite ready yet. Not saying Donny is too as i’m sure he’s better than that but perhaps Ole has a plan to start him more as the season progresses
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 36
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
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I can see him buying a CDM before we start VDB.
Fred &Mctomminay are our strongest deep midfield balance partnership however he didnt want to start with this. He was trying to accommodate Pogba, Bruno and maybe even VDB to that team but what it lacked was a CDM because we dont have one except Matic.
We ended up reverting back to the 4231 with Fred & Mctomminay now but they are two players that should be doing a single players work.
If we get a CDM players like Bruno can drop deeper with the ability to get forward and play as a CAM only when required (same for Pogba whether he is in our long term plans or not) which leaves a more obvious space for Van De Beek in our team.
I would simply play two fast forwards against that back three.
Blind is a good player. But for PL football, you must be either fast or strong, preferably both. If none, you're basically a liability waiting to be exposed.
Anyway agreed on the done part. And we're a bit off topic I think.
To be honest, I was disappointed with how he handled Istanbul 2nd goal. He didn’t even try to help defensively for that goal which he could have.
And there is nothing impressive in that stats honestly, the only positive was passing accuracy. 2 takes on, 2 tackles & 1 key passes against team like Istanbul in 66 minute is basically doing feck all.
He basically didn’t do lot of mistakes like Mata & Bruno did in that game but at the same time he didn’t do anything good in that game either. He was basically 5/10 and I gave 4/10 for the 2nd goal.
His first problem is we can't play 3 man midfield with single pivot (neither of Fred, McTominay and Matic can do it effectively, the former 2 being box to box midfielders, the latter not being good enough anymore for top level).
His second problem is there won't be many games in epl / CL when we can play him in double pivot (it's more of a two box to box midfielders really) because it'll be too risky. Just because he can do a job in midfield duo doesn't mean he's good enough to warrant a starting place there.
His third problem is Pogba. He will be ahead of Donny in most games, rightly or not, so until Paul leaves, frankly I don't see him being a starter.
His second problem is there won't be many games in epl / CL when we can play him in double pivot (it's more of a two box to box midfielders really) because it'll be too risky. Just because he can do a job in midfield duo doesn't mean he's good enough to warrant a starting place there.
His third problem is Pogba. He will be ahead of Donny in most games, rightly or not, so until Paul leaves, frankly I don't see him being a starter.
I'm not saying the stats are impressive, my point was that he had a solid game relative to the rest of the team, so saying he contributed to us losing because he was playing in a double pivot is a load of rubbish. How can you be disappointed in him for that second goal, when Bruno fecked up the pass to Mata, then Mata's bad touch and lack of pace got him terrorised by the opposition, then our centre backs were pulled out of position causing a free man at the back post, who Shaw should've been closer to, to score. There's at least 4 or 5 utd players to be disappointed with for that second goal before you start thinking about VDB.
The Twitter says ‘’continue to impress’’ with evidence of the stats which I don’t see what’s impressive or even positive in there apart from 91% passing accuracy but then again with only 1 key passes pretty much tells you enough how he got that 91%. It’s not even solid either. It’s pretty much 5 or 4/10 performance. Nothing good and nothing bad aka average. Solid should be 7.
Just because I was disappointed with him doesn’t mean I wasn’t even more disappointed on other players like Bruno, Mata & Matic for the 2nd goal. In reality he could actually do something defensively for that goal.
https://metro.co.uk/2020/11/12/van-...keeping-van-de-beek-out-of-the-team-13585938/
Players being preferred to VDB are being mocked by VDV!
Players being preferred to VDB are being mocked by VDV!
Well it seems today he was not first choice for the Netherlands either so that might change some perspective.
Because Van de Beek doesn't have enough playing rhythm.
Generally the national coach imposes an unwritten rule that you need to play regular minutes at your club to qualify for a starting spot on the team.
It's been a couple of months now and if this situation continues I don't think he'll get another chance to start as Wijnaldum and Klaassen will be ahead of him.
De Roon and Pröpper (if he's healthy) may pass him in the order as well.
Only a year ago Van de Beek was a nominee for the Golden Ball election, making the top 30 cut. He's probably a top 5 player at United right now, but because Solskjær plays a system where there's only one place for an attacking midfielder and United's best player happens to be Fernandes who plays at the '10' he won't get a chance to prove his worth.
I was happy that Van de Beek stayed another year at Ajax after the great CL campaign despite interest of Real Madrid as I thought that wouldn't be the right team for him, but it looks like he didn't make the right choice after all. Fernandes isn't going anywhere and probably neither is Solskjær.
His biggest problem is that he isn't a 25 year old from Birmingham.
He was never constantly the first choice in Netherlands either when he was supposed to tick this unwritten rule of playing regular time at Ajax. I often see him being dropped by Wijnaldum, De Jong, Marten de Roon.
I think Ole was expecting Pogba and Matic to have big seasons this year, and brought in VDB to freshen things up when needed.
Ole is discovering Pogba is not up to it consistently, Matic hasn't really performed and then Bruno does not offer enough defensively to have 2 defensively suspect players behind him.
It's the same problem with VDB in that there's a lack of defensive balance in the midfield if he plays next to Bruno with someone behind them.
So we have a situation where Fred and McT are the only combination Bruno can play with where we have enough defensive balance, but in certain games Fred and McT will not offer enough creativity if Bruno is having an off day.
Could be that VDB ups his defensive discipline side to his game and can eventually become part of a midfield 3 that strikes a healthy balance between attack and defence. We'll have to wait and see.
Ole is discovering Pogba is not up to it consistently, Matic hasn't really performed and then Bruno does not offer enough defensively to have 2 defensively suspect players behind him.
It's the same problem with VDB in that there's a lack of defensive balance in the midfield if he plays next to Bruno with someone behind them.
So we have a situation where Fred and McT are the only combination Bruno can play with where we have enough defensive balance, but in certain games Fred and McT will not offer enough creativity if Bruno is having an off day.
Could be that VDB ups his defensive discipline side to his game and can eventually become part of a midfield 3 that strikes a healthy balance between attack and defence. We'll have to wait and see.
This is true. Frenkie de Jong and Wijnaldum have been undisputed first choices, while De Roon played when Ronald Koeman went with a defensive option.
However it was clear that it was only a matter of time before Van de Beek would get more opportunities to start. Media were pressing last year for Van de Beek.
And De Roon performed really weak. Koeman is a very conservative coach who doesn't change his line-up quickly.
But Marten de Roon and Ryan Babel as regular starters we all knew that wasn't going to last. There was a position to be filled where Van de Beek and Pröpper were the main options, but surprisingly it seems like Klaassen has taken it. That wouldn't have been the case if Klaassen hadn't returned to Ajax and Van de Beek had stayed in Amsterdam.
Even though I'm fond of the way Klaassen is playing now (Johan Cruijff once said that Klaassen had the attributes to play like Toni Kroos) I find Van de Beek more talented.
Don't think Klaassen would be a starter right now if he was a Manchester United player, despite probably being better than McTominay. Therefore I argue that Van de Beek is a victim of making a wrong choice, where the system and reputations stand in his way. Obviously Van de Beek is good enough to start.
Sorry but I find your comment is biased and controversy here. Marten de Roon has something that none of VDB, Wijnaldum & De Jong have and that’s the defensive attribute. That means Marten de Roon plays in a role that VDB doesn’t play and was always gonna stay as regular starter under Koeman and if not someone else that is more defensive midfielder would have play the role under Koeman.
In fact, here some fact. In 2018, VDB was on the bench 6x and starter 3x only. In 2019, VDB was on the bench 6x and starter 2x only. He was never regular starter, come on, it last for two years already and that’s long enough.
Klassen is getting his chance to play because it’s only fair for the head coach to make rotation. Everyone needs to play, he’s not going to keep playing the same XI. Unlike Wijnaldum & De Jong, VDB was never regular starter or the key in midfield and that’s why he was benched for the sake of giving others playing time.
This has last long for 3 years already including before he joined us, so don’t start using us as an excuse.
Man Utd 1:0 West Brom
One question needs to be asked here.
Was Woodward content with paying +45m for a bench option who is going to play 10-15 minutes a game ?
Because if he knew that from Ole and spent the money anyway, that's some crazy level of backing your manager that makes me wonder how can anyone claim otherwise.
Was Woodward content with paying +45m for a bench option who is going to play 10-15 minutes a game ?
Because if he knew that from Ole and spent the money anyway, that's some crazy level of backing your manager that makes me wonder how can anyone claim otherwise.
He was completely ignored tbh. Bruno make things happen but he just don't see this guy or his runs. Very weird.
I like what I see with him for these 10 mins he plays. He plays very fluid and across the pitch.
He put a fantastic shift in today. There are few players who can keep going for a full 11 minutes.
Woodward looks even content of signing totally unproven youngsters for 20m each. Our spending looks all over the place while the obvious targets we should be signing are passing us by. At some point United were desperate of any kind of player who could put Lingard & Pereira on the bench and I guess we succeeded at that.
I hope this won't turn into Fred situation where the signed player barely played his whole first season... I don't even know who's our transfer priorities anymore.
Ole put him on just for the sake of it didn't he? I don't think even van de Beek knew which position he was supposed to play in. Such a strange signing
There was a moment when McTominay could make that "risky" pass to VDB, but saw him and chose to ignore him. Must be so heartbreaking for VDB.
A great signing being put to waste by a manager who doesn't want to use him
Really annoyed at how this has become a situation, due to Ole's inept ability to either handle substitutions better (so, so late on into games) and/or his unwillingness to choose a more attacking line-up.
This can't be good for the player mentally. Nobody is winning from this situation. VDB loses because he isn't getting game time, Ole looks clueless because he isn't playing him or he looks like he doesn't want him or he plays him for a stupidly short length of time, and the fans lose because we are subjected to performances like that against West Brom.
This can't be good for the player mentally. Nobody is winning from this situation. VDB loses because he isn't getting game time, Ole looks clueless because he isn't playing him or he looks like he doesn't want him or he plays him for a stupidly short length of time, and the fans lose because we are subjected to performances like that against West Brom.
The annoying thing is that when he came on he played in the centre and Bruno moved out wide. We're not going to move Bruno out of position on a regular basis so it basically guarantees that VDB stays on the bench or maybe plays in central midfield. The preferred option at the moment would definitely be that he gets a chance on the right to show what he can do and if he impresses then he becomes a proper option out there.
Of course VDB just may not be showing anything in training indicating he can play out wide. He's never played there for Ajax so maybe he just isn't suitable for that role.
Of course VDB just may not be showing anything in training indicating he can play out wide. He's never played there for Ajax so maybe he just isn't suitable for that role.
He is a better player than Matic, Mata or McTominay for sure.
based on what?
I’m not saying you are wrong in the long term, but we haven’t seen anything to suggest that he’s better than those players - especially McT.
he will get his chances. Hectic schedule to the end of the year.
He just doesn't fit us nor our haphazard anything-goes system.
Not yet at least...
This is becoming embarrassing, surely by November we should already know what his roles and best positions. Around the same time we already where Mkhi is playing and what his roles are in the starting 11. VDB and Ole on the other hand... the player seems lost, and the manager doesn't look like he knows what to do with this player. It's like we bought VDB just for the sake of buying someone, to appease the fans and "settle" down a bit the pressure of transfer window. Genius planning by the whole club management.
Not yet at least...
This is becoming embarrassing, surely by November we should already know what his roles and best positions. Around the same time we already where Mkhi is playing and what his roles are in the starting 11. VDB and Ole on the other hand... the player seems lost, and the manager doesn't look like he knows what to do with this player. It's like we bought VDB just for the sake of buying someone, to appease the fans and "settle" down a bit the pressure of transfer window. Genius planning by the whole club management.
He's way better than McTominay. That's not even a debate.
And Miki turned out well...
Poor comparison in my opinion. VDB had a lot of really good players in his position. He will get chances, still very early days, and far too early to be making any sort of judgement.
Ole’s misuse of VDB is insane. If this persists who can blame Donny for seeking, and hopefully finding, a club which knows what it’s doing.
That's Scotty for you. Now don't get me wrong and I'm a big fan but his passing needs improving. Its more Scotty did not trust his own passing rather than VDB. Evidenced in the bit where he did a dribble with a few feints but you could see the dribble was due not being confident in passing and when he did he lost it.
He seems to be struggling. Very encouraging style of play offensively but he doesn't seem to be able to really be effective yet. Better than Lingard but I'm not sure we needed such a like for like replacement.
VDB will find his feet with us soon. But, people are way overrating him at the moment.
Not the biggest compliment but I feel comfortable that our side can string more than 3 passes together when he's on the pitch. Has the ability to control dodgy passes and convert the play into silkiness.
I think Manchester United was the absolute wrong move for him and his career at this point imo.
This is what I feel too.
I feel that we feel more fluid as a team when he is on the pitch even for 10 minutes because there is an element of him handling the pressure and spaces well.
I'd like to see it more.
Shame that unfortunately the 4231 is stuck in Ole's mind.
From what I've seen, it's similar for the Netherlands. He roams around but hardly involved. His best impact is a brilliant touch or catching a deflected strike, but we shouldn't expect him to run games.
Care to explain why you think so? Because in my opinion, neither of them is direct competition for Donny.
It's yet to be seen if it was a right move for United. I don't know what Ole sees in him, or what is the plan to use him.
Not worried about his game time though, especially with Pogba out.
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