Decades Draft Tournament : VP vs Isotope

[Moby]

The aim of this poll is to decide which team will win based on all the players being at their respective peaks. The player profiles have been linked in both tactics so please go through them to read a brief description about all the players involved in the game!

VP's tactics

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This is a team with a distinct United flavour: rock solid centre backs, explosive wingers, leaders in almost every position and managed by Sir Alex. Gento (with Evra overlapping) and Ronaldo are the best wingers in the draft while Deschamps-Socrates-Scholes the most intelligent midfield in the draft. Everyone's playing in positions they're comfortable in; the football's going to be beautiful. And to top it off, Sir Alex is leading a team with Zoff, Sammer, Deschamps, Socrates and Ronaldo, there are simply too many winners in there for this team to fail.​

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I have no idea how Isotope’s going to set up but he has absolutely no width. I can already see it: his attacking fullbacks venture forward, one of Sammer, McGrath, or Deschamps wins the ball, feeds it to Scholes who pings it to Ronaldo and Gento on the wings, Van Nistelrooy waits in the box… this is going to be carnage. Neuer is possibly the weakest goalkeeper in the draft, Moore was notorious for his lack of pace and Gentile just a bit of a thug waiting to be sent off (we’re playing in 2013 after all).​

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On paper, he's got a fantastic forward line but don't think they're compatible. Anyway, an injured McGrath playing next to Phil fecking Babb had Baggio at his peak in his back pocket in ’94. And for Maradona, if he passes his drug test (again we’re playing in 2013) and gets on the pitch then he has to breach a defence protected by Deschamps, then McGrath and Sammer and then Zoff. Might be a test too far even for the great man.​

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PLAYER PROFILES​

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TEAM VP​

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TEAM Isotope​

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Isotope's tactics

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One of the most entertaining team in the draft. On attack, arguably the best footballer in history: Diego Maradona will work in tandem with Roberto Baggio, one of the best attacker Italy has produced. Together they’ll freely roam behind Andriy Shevchenko, the greatest Ukrainian striker of all-time. With Shevchenko intelligent movement who is also comfortable going wide, these three will be difficult to man-marked. All three are capable of creating chances for others, while being clinical in front of the goal.

Bossing the midfield are another master of dribbler and creative passer of Andrés Iniesta, the charismatic Senor Mário Coluna, and the anchor Claude Makélélé. Maradona-Iniesta-Baggio axis as masters of superb ball control, and Coluna’s energy and passing, will ensure domination in ball possession. Anchoring the midfield is Makélélé, the master of self-sacrifice to bring out the best in more gifted footballers.

The rock-solid Isotope team is guarded by one of the finest centerback in history: Bobby Moore. The ball playing Moore is partnered by one of all time best combative centerback in Claudio Gentile. On their sides are the skilful Ruud Krol and José Leandro Ferreira, who are capable of 'owning' their flanks; thanks to their superb stamina and positioning, and good passing/crossing. In the goal is Manuel Neuer, who has been the main goalkeeper for football giants Germany and Bayern.

PLayers PROFILE​

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[Fergus' son]

Huge overkill in midfield from Isotope, can't even being to imagine how that will work.

In contrast, very well thought out team from VP, strong in all areas and clear to see how his team plans on scoring. Have never voted this early in a game but am really tempted to do so in this one, will give it a hour or so though....

 

[Theon]

Yup I've already voted, that team needs some width but it aint being provided by the fullbacks for two main reasons IMO

1) The quality of VP's wingers mean that Isotope's fullbacks have to conservative going forward

2) There is a real lack of cover - if you're gonna have fullbacks bombing up the pitch then I would like to see a rock solid central midfield to cover for it, but here its just really attacking

It's not a balanced side at all. Probably play some entertaining football though

 

[Isotope]

Let see:

France vs Brazil, World Cup Final 1998:

 

[antohan]

Huge overkill in midfield from Isotope, can't even being to imagine how that will work.

In contrast, very well thought out team from VP, strong in all areas and clear to see how his team plans on scoring. Have never voted this early in a game but am really tempted to do so in this one, will give it a hour or so though....

Iso was heading that way indeed but his positioning of Maradona is quite interesting. I would have expected him to be left of Baggio but it seems he is deliberately creating the room for Iniesta to roam into that left side, which is clever.

Being a Makelele picker yourself, you can see he is not just mopping up but a useful third defender if the fullbacks get caught out (which they will).

A lot rests on how Coluna wraps his head around the tactics and what they require of him though. I'll sit this out a wee bit TBH.

 

[Isotope]

Spain vs Italy, Euro 2012 Final

 

[Theon]

Spain vs Italy, Euro 2012 Final

Spain play a unique brand of football that I've never seen any team copy before, it's even more one dimensional than Barcelona

But if you can't see the difference between your team and that Italian side then there is something up. Look at the balance it has.

 

[Isotope]

Those four team didn't have actual wingers, but didn't hinder them to be the best.

 

[Fergus' son]

Those four team didn't have actual wingers, but didn't hinder them to be the best.

It's not just the lack of wingers, it's what looks like 3 number tens (plus Shev and Coluna) which to me suggests a serious overlapping of qualities and little balance.

 

[Theon]

Those four team didn't have actual wingers, but didn't hinder them to be the best.

You don't need to tell me that, I love centrally orientated sides which is why I tried it in the last two drafts.

You need the right set up though and you need balance. It's obvious you dont have it, pointless arguing against that to be honest because it's staring everyone right in the face.

You should embrace it and try and argue that even though its so attacking with so many technical number 10's that it'll mean you outscore VP. Something like that.

Copying formations from other teams doesn't help you because none of those teams played a similar style to what you have going on now IMO

 

[Fergus' son]

Yup I've already voted, that team needs some width but it aint being provided by the fullbacks for two main reasons IMO

1) The quality of VP's wingers mean that Isotope's fullbacks have to conservative going forward

2) There is a real lack of cover - if you're gonna have fullbacks bombing up the pitch then I would like to see a rock solid central midfield to cover for it, but here its just really attacking

It's not a balanced side at all. Probably play some entertaining football though

Hard to disagree with this to be honest.

 

[antohan]

Iso has turned into Theon 2-3 drafts ago

 

[Gio]

On the face of it, it's a real clusterfeck from Isotope. In practice though I can see it quickly morphing into a 3-5-2/3-4-2-1 with Makelele dropping as a third centre-half. I feel you can often get away with quite a bit less dig in the centre of the park with 3 central defenders behind you (see Real's 3-5-2 against Utd in 2000), and I can envisage Socrates and Scholes dictating play rather than bursting through the middle. If Iso's description of Coluna is fair (?) " A real force of nature who would run all day & perform the textbook box-to-box midfield role" then it could work.

 

[Moby]

Iso has turned into Theon 2-3 drafts ago

He usually prefers going like this, ever since I've played with him in the newbies. He loves a nice army of number 10s who are versatile and can be distributed across the pitch.

 

[antohan]

If Iso's description of Coluna is fair (?) " A real force of nature who would run all day & perform the textbook box-to-box midfield role" then it could work.

He was TBH. I've spent the entire draft yapping about how I don't think older midfielders could pull off a diamond or XMAS tree, but he probably could. Certainly had all the attributes required.

BTW, VP, you have your CBs the wrong way around. McGrath was a competent RB and you mention yourself that he had the upper hand against Baggio. On the other hand, I would fancy Sammer to be more competent in keeping up with Maradona's threat.

 

[antohan]

He usually prefers going like this, ever since I've played with him in the newbies. He loves a nice army of number 10s who are versatile and can be distributed across the pitch.

I meant the posting of successful wingless teams, I noticed the #10 fetish before.

It's really strange, in the last draft Theon himself showed us (then royally cocked up) how effective a wingerless side could be. Now teams are getting pummelled for it. If drafts could have an episode name this would be "Decades Draft: The Revenge of the Width".

 

[Moby]

 

[Theon]

It's really strange, in the last draft Theon himself showed us (then royally cocked up) how effective a wingerless side could be. Now teams are getting pummelled for it.

This is nothing like my side though, it lacks any of that balance with two hardworking DM's flanking a sitting playmaker

 

[Jayvin]

I meant the posting of successful wingless teams, I noticed the #10 fetish before.

It's really strange, in the last draft Theon himself showed us (then royally cocked up) how effective a wingerless side could be. Now teams are getting pummelled for it. If drafts could have an episode name this would be "Decades Draft: The Revenge of the Width".

Width didn't help me much

 

[Isotope]

It's not just the lack of wingers, it's what looks like 3 number tens (plus Shev and Coluna) which to me suggests a serious overlapping of qualities and little balance.

Coluna at his later age, move back to be more defensive: box to box, or even defensive midfield.

Benfica vs Manchester United, 1968 European Cup Final.

Baggio used to start the attack from the left, and Maradona from the right; if they need to. Also Iniesta, although start in midfield, can move to the left as he's done it regularly with Barca.

You may also consider that VP only has Deschamp to do his 'dirty work' on midfield battle, where he usually had another defensive player in di Livio or Davids at Juventus. Also my defense is a notch above VP team.

 

[Isotope]

You don't need to tell me that, I love centrally orientated sides which is why I tried it in the last two drafts.

You need the right set up though and you need balance. It's obvious you dont have it, pointless arguing against that to be honest because it's staring everyone right in the face.

You should embrace it and try and argue that even though its so attacking with so many technical number 10's that it'll mean you outscore VP. Something like that.

Copying formations from other teams doesn't help you because none of those teams played a similar style to what you have going on now IMO

Formations are there to point out about 'lack of width' argument; not necessarily copying it position for position. Anyway, as you suggested, I can see my team dominating the midfield and attack; where I have Maradona-Baggio-Iniesta who have superb ball control. Then VP only has Deschamps (more of water carrier) to battle the midfield.

Dominating the play, and as you said, I have players to really punish it and make it counts.

 

[antohan]

Baggio is used to start the attack from the left, and Maradona from the right; if they need to. Also Iniesta, although start in midfield, can move to the left as he's done it regularly with Barca.

In possession I expect that to morph into a three with Iniesta-Baggio-Maradona and two CMs/DMs behind them, which is fine really.

You may also consider that VP only has Deschamp to do his 'dirty work' on midfield battle, where he usually had another defensive player in di Livio or Davids at Juventus.

He certainly is up against it as far as getting the ball back is concerned.

Also my defense is a notch above VP team.

Disagree, you look more of a porous mishmash to me, which is why despite seeing you dominating the game I can see VP scoring a few.

 

[antohan]

I just realised Gio has three 30s players and two keepers

 

[VP]

Antohan, you're right, my CBs are the wrong way round - should change it.

Isotope, don't understand why you're posting these narrow formations of successful teams who are clearly more balanced than yours.

Disagree completely re. my midfield and defence. Scholes at his peak was a fantastic box to box midfielder more than capable of putting in a shift defensively.

Zoff, McGrath and Sammer comfortably trumps Moore, Gentile and Neuer.

 

[antohan]

How do you define box-to-box midfielder VP?

 

[Isotope]

In possession I expect that to morph into a three with Iniesta-Baggio-Maradona and two CMs/DMs behind them, which is fine really.



He certainly is up against it as far as getting the ball back is concerned.



Disagree, you look more of a porous mishmash to me, which is why despite seeing you dominating the game I can see VP scoring a few.

I don't think Deschamp alone can support Socrates and Scholes in midfield battle with Maradona Bagio Iniesta, plus Coluna. THat Juve team always have another hustle and bustle player alongside him. But it's impossible to prove it anyway.

Which part of my defence is a mishmash to you?

 

[antohan]

I don't think Deschamp alone can support Socrates and Scholes in midfield battle with Maradona Bagio Iniesta, plus Coluna. THat Juve team always have another hustle and bustle player alongside him. But it's impossible to prove it anyway.

Which part of my defence is a mishmash to you?

I agreed on the Deschamps point, which is why I expect you to have the lion's share of posession. You are wide open on the counter though. Leandro was great as an attacking fullback but I always found him quite brainless defensively. It helps Gentile is out there to cover but, frankly, I rate him as a standalone man-marker not the other half of a CB pair. Moore was superb but pace is an issue and he is covering Krol vs. Cristiano. I can see RvN having a field day here.

 

[Isotope]

He usually prefers going like this, ever since I've played with him in the newbies. He loves a nice army of number 10s who are versatile and can be distributed across the pitch.

Don't forget, go for players by names

I don't see players as static object. Players should be able to play all across the midfield, especially for attacking players.

 

[Isotope]

I agreed on the Deschamps point, which is why I expect you to have the lion's share of posession. You are wide open on the counter though. Leandro was great as an attacking fullback but I always found him quite brainless defensively. It helps Gentile is out there to cover but, frankly, I rate him as a standalone man-marker not the other half of a CB pair. Moore was superb but pace is an issue and he is covering Krol vs. Cristiano. I can see RvN having a field day here.

Yeah. There's always one scenario where every team can be punished, whether through wing-play, midfield possession, counter-attack, etc. Hard to argue one team is unbreakable. VP has better wingers, enough goalscorers, and world class midfielders and defence. So does my team, although mine is focusing more on possession. I said my defence is better, but VP insists his/her is. You argued my defence won't be able to cope with Nistelrooy, but I'm sure they can.

Who can tell who's right?

 

[antohan]

I said my defence is better, but VP insists his/her is. You argued my defence won't be able to cope with Nistelrooy, but I'm sure they can.

Who can tell who's right?

At 7-1 up I reckon he is winning that argument TBH.

 

[Isotope]

It's ok. I'm pretty satisfied with my team so far.

 

[Isotope]

For anyone questioning Coluna, he's also capable of playing in midfield 2:

 

[NM]

its 7-4. Comeback is on! I just voted Iso for the nuts he had choosing this formation. I'd love to see it refined and improved. VP does have a killer team though

 

[antohan]

I like your style

You seem to have cut it down to 7-3 (your vote doesn't count). All I can say is keep at it bumping the thread as you need the traffic to get back into this.

 

[Isotope]

I'm in happy mood now, Anto. Just got a new job I've been dreaming of for a long time. So, any result of this is still a happy one, seeing players I like in my team.

 

[Isotope]

I like your style

You seem to have cut it down to 7-3 (your vote doesn't count). All I can say is keep at it bumping the thread as you need the traffic to get back into this.

So, if thing gets worse, I might go with this one, as I don't think VP defence can cope with this (maybe). Those attack is a sight to behold, you must admit .

 

[antohan]

For anyone questioning Coluna, he's also capable of playing in midfield 2:

Of course he is. Not the best game to bring up as Portugal were completely shot in that game. After a gruelling QF match, the venue for their game got changed to favour the hosts.

That Benfica side is massively underrated on here despite arguably being the best European side of the 60s. They were unlucky to still be in fantasy mode while Italy had started shifting to catenaccio, but it was also mainly down to there no being subs at the time that they lost the finals against Milan and Inter.

They literally got the shit kicked out of them and finished both games effectively down to 9/10 men. Inter only managed a 1-0 win, playing at home in the San Siro, and despite injuring their keeper and Benfica having to play Germano in nets!

It's unfortunate that, Coluna and Makelele are perfectly fine keeping Scholes and Socrates anonymous, let alone with Iniesta's support and Deschamps is too fecking busy to do anything but run around like a headless chicken. I really see you dominating the game and with Iniesta tracking back to support Coluna, Makelele can help shore up that defence when hit on the break.

 

[Isotope]

Coluna and Makelele might need to switch side, but they can do it on the game.

 

[Theon]

So, if thing gets worse, I might go with this one, as I don't think VP defence can cope with this (maybe). Those attack is a sight to behold, you must admit .

I prefer what you're thinking there but Iniesta is the one who should be on the left not Baggio!

He's the most accomplished of all three out wide by far, god knows why he is the central one!

Get Maradona where Iniesta is - he is your best player so make the most out of him in the middle of the pitch

 

[antohan]

I'm in happy mood now, Anto. Just got a new job I've been dreaming of for a long time. So, any result of this is still a happy one, seeing players I like in my team.

Congrats mate

Not sure what the suggested rejig does, I reckon you would still play the game the exact same way as before. Iniesta going wide/inside left for much of the game, Baggio as a 9 1/2 behind Shevchenko and Maradona doing whatever the feck he wants but with more space to operate down the right.

Maybe it makes it clearer that your midfield makes Scholes and Socrates rather redundant, but I was seeing that already.