Dean Henderson | Sold to Palace

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JB7 said:
Except they did, you like many others were probably blinded by his horrendous performance in the Liverpool game. It's not an opinion, it's objective, the data is there for all to see. I looked into the various statistics in a long post on here probably 18 months back because people were saying that De Gea was rightfully number one as Henderson "hadn't taken his chance", every metric was considerably better with Henderson vs De Gea in goal during 20/21, that's not an opinion, that is what the evidential data and the overall results on the pitch showed. As I said, it was a case of one not-United-quality goalkeeper vs another not-United-quality goalkeeper, but one allowed us to play higher up the pitch and also helped to prevent shots on goal, whereas the other encouraged shots on goal as a stylistic choice, during a period where he wasn't stopping those shots with the regularity that he had done several years previous. There's a reason Ole told Henderson he would be number one going into 21/22 and the data backed him on it.

Had Ole not been busy putting his faith into Henderson being his number one in the summer of 2021, you'd like to think we'd have looked around and realised Mike Maignan was being allowed to move clubs for like £12m while we could get £30m+ for Henderson at that stage, but we had our heads in the sand which has cost us in the long run, as it was always likely to.
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Nah I was one of those who were excited at the prospect of our academy finally producing an England no1, and hopefully for us as well. I remember he tried too hard when he was given the start, and would rush out recklessly in an attempt to 'show up' de gea. I didn't have much of a problem with youngsters trying hard to impress, though I was surprised at the attitude as I thought he was a nice guy and that the competition was friendly. IMO his season was alright, some bright spots here and there and some big mistakes which is understandable for a rookie. Then De gea recovered from his poor form and he couldn't handle it. Dave wasn't getting any younger, so had he shown more patience and went out on another loan, eventually he would've gotten his chance. Instead he went and did that interview.

I don't need to look at the data because DDG was pretty poor that year and was rightfully dropped. However, form is temporary, and Deano just wasn't ready to take over at such a big club at the time. You can't just go by raw numbers alone to make that decision.
 
mu4c_20le said:
Nah I was one of those who were excited at the prospect of our academy finally producing an England no1, and hopefully for us as well. I remember he tried too hard when he was given the start, and would rush out recklessly in an attempt to 'show up' de gea. I didn't have much of a problem with youngsters trying hard to impress, though I was surprised at the attitude as I thought he was a nice guy and that the competition was friendly. IMO his season was alright, some bright spots here and there and some big mistakes which is understandable for a rookie. Then De gea recovered from his poor form and he couldn't handle it. Dave wasn't getting any younger, so had he shown more patience and went out on another loan, eventually he would've gotten his chance. Instead he went and did that interview.

I don't need to look at the data because DDG was pretty poor that year and was rightfully dropped. However, form is temporary, and Deano just wasn't ready to take over at such a big club at the time. You can't just go by raw numbers alone to make that decision.
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The interview was largely misconstrued from what I remember. I'd heard about it being this arrogant-I-should-be-playing type thing and that just wasn't the case. He basically said that he wanted to go out and play football, and that Ten Hag would see him in training and want to keep him around as a back-up, which in fairness he probably wasn't wrong about given that it transpired that Ten Hag wanted proper competition for De Gea as evidenced by our bids for Sommer and Trapp later in the summer. It was the polar opposite of arrogance, a complete lack of self-belief. He saw a manager renowned for playing with a high-line coming into the club and didn't back himself to be better than a goalkeeper completely incapable of leaving his line with any regularity and way below the standard with most other things Ten Hag would want from a goalkeeper. It was very weak rather than how it ended up being perceived.

I don't think Solskjaer was looking at pure numbers in fairness, he was much closer to the situation than either of us and he was set to go with Henderson until he got ill. I'm just saying that the numbers backed up the eye test at that moment in time, that while neither of them were good enough, one was a considerably better fit than the other for our defenders at the time.
 
Forest Red said:
We do need a second keeper (hence the interest in Petrovic), but Hovarth can start the season for us if we don’t get him. We’ve got a difficult start to the season anyway so we aren’t expecting much from the first 8 or so games. The issue for us is how long before Hendo is fit and the likelihood of a further breakdown as there is more going on then the initial thigh injury. So yes you are correct about the reason for a loan.

Yes Hendo is our preferred option but the length of time this has taken plus the risks with his injury means we need to move on.
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Which makes good sense, and which is probably also why Utd are positive to a loan first deal in his cse, even in a situation where we need as much money up front as we can get due to FFP - who would fork out much on a long term injured keeper anyway. At least Forest apparatus knows his health, his qualities very well.

He’s never been injury prone before as I remember, is there something special about this injury that makes Forest wary?
 
IrishRedDevil said:
Brentford might be after a new keeper.
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Grande said:
Which makes good sense, and which is probably also why Utd are positive to a loan first deal in his cse, even in a situation where we need as much money up front as we can get due to FFP - who would fork out much on a long term injured keeper anyway. At least Forest apparatus knows his health, his qualities very well.

He’s never been injury prone before as I remember, is there something special about this injury that makes Forest wary?
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As you say, he did his recovery at Forest so we know what his situation is. There’s never been anything released officially as to why he needed a further op other than something was found later on. I have no issues about Hendo’s long term injury prognosis but the Prem is an unforgiving league and we need a keeper now not in Jan or next summer.
 
JB7 said:
The interview was largely misconstrued from what I remember. I'd heard about it being this arrogant-I-should-be-playing type thing and that just wasn't the case. He basically said that he wanted to go out and play football, and that Ten Hag would see him in training and want to keep him around as a back-up, which in fairness he probably wasn't wrong about given that it transpired that Ten Hag wanted proper competition for De Gea as evidenced by our bids for Sommer and Trapp later in the summer. It was the polar opposite of arrogance, a complete lack of self-belief. He saw a manager renowned for playing with a high-line coming into the club and didn't back himself to be better than a goalkeeper completely incapable of leaving his line with any regularity and way below the standard with most other things Ten Hag would want from a goalkeeper. It was very weak rather than how it ended up being perceived.
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I wouldn't say he didn't back himself vs De Gea considering his attitude while playing on loan at Forest during that season, I think it's possible that he felt he would've been unfairly measured against De Gea's status as a club legend instead of De Gea at the start of the 2022-2023 season which is a pretty fair assessment considering the situation around Ronaldo.
 
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Mainoldo said:
I’m still confused to why it’s Forest or bust. What are these agents of our players doing. He was a £25m keeper at Sheffield United.

Don’t tell me no other team in the league can’t do with him.
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Because we've since brought him back and made him one of the highest paid keepers in the league. Probably even the highest paid backup in the world right now.
 
Ali Dia said:
Because we've since brought him back and made him one of the highest paid keepers in the league. Probably even the highest paid backup in the world right now.
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He was given that deal at a time when we expected that he would imminently be our first choice. He wanted big money because he was regarded as the best young keeper in the league and could have gotten similar-ish money as first choice elsewhere.
 
Really hope we can get him off our books ASAP as he is probably the most expendable squad member we can get a good fee for. £20 million is realistic. His agent needs to pull his finger out.
 
Cee90 said:
Really hope we can get him off our books ASAP as he is probably the most expendable squad member we can get a good fee for. £20 million is realistic. His agent needs to pull his finger out.
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There is only one place that rates Henderson and that is his own gold fish bowl. If he considers himself a top goalkeeper worthy of starting place then his agent isn't doing much of a job to back that up.
 
Forest Red said:
As you say, he did his recovery at Forest so we know what his situation is. There’s never been anything released officially as to why he needed a further op other than something was found later on. I have no issues about Hendo’s long term injury prognosis but the Prem is an unforgiving league and we need a keeper now not in Jan or next summer.
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Henderson has been training, doing the same things as the other keepers all pre-season so I think it's safe to say he isn't still injured.
 
Berbaclass said:
Hmmm… :nervous:

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Yep - we’re skint, not a pot to piss in, financially embarrassed, despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner. If my payment was 2 days late I’d be straight down the solicitors too - it’s an outrage! Thank god the Daily Mail has brought this complete travesty to light.
 
Forest Red said:
Yep - we’re skint, not a pot to piss in, financially embarrassed, despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner. If my payment was 2 days late I’d be straight down the solicitors too - it’s an outrage! Thank god the Daily Mail has brought this complete travesty to light.
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No offence by you remind me of the Barca fans that used to jump on here
Your owner is a literally criminal
 
Forest Red said:
Yep - we’re skint, not a pot to piss in, financially embarrassed, despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner. If my payment was 2 days late I’d be straight down the solicitors too - it’s an outrage! Thank god the Daily Mail has brought this complete travesty to light.
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Yet despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner if this story is true it's not exactly great is it?
 
Coxy said:
Yet despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner if this story is true it's not exactly great is it?
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They should bring back the birch and hanging.
 
Forest Red said:
Yep - we’re skint, not a pot to piss in, financially embarrassed, despite being in the Prem and having a billionaire owner. If my payment was 2 days late I’d be straight down the solicitors too - it’s an outrage! Thank god the Daily Mail has brought this complete travesty to light.
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Problem is that the billions need laundering, and because the PL is not Greece, eventually people are going to start asking questions.
 
Eplel said:
Problem is that the billions need laundering, and because the PL is not Greece, eventually people are going to start asking questions.
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Bitcoin is your best bet for money laundering - It’s untraceable.
 
I thought Brighton would be sniffing around this with Sanchez about to leave.

Unless they’ve brought in that young dutch keeper as #1
 
Lads, the owner has been giving too many people their gear on lay, he has to collect before he can pay bonuses, it's fair enough.
 
JB7 said:
The interview was largely misconstrued from what I remember. I'd heard about it being this arrogant-I-should-be-playing type thing and that just wasn't the case. He basically said that he wanted to go out and play football, and that Ten Hag would see him in training and want to keep him around as a back-up, which in fairness he probably wasn't wrong about given that it transpired that Ten Hag wanted proper competition for De Gea as evidenced by our bids for Sommer and Trapp later in the summer. It was the polar opposite of arrogance, a complete lack of self-belief. He saw a manager renowned for playing with a high-line coming into the club and didn't back himself to be better than a goalkeeper completely incapable of leaving his line with any regularity and way below the standard with most other things Ten Hag would want from a goalkeeper. It was very weak rather than how it ended up being perceived.

I don't think Solskjaer was looking at pure numbers in fairness, he was much closer to the situation than either of us and he was set to go with Henderson until he got ill. I'm just saying that the numbers backed up the eye test at that moment in time, that while neither of them were good enough, one was a considerably better fit than the other for our defenders at the time.
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The thing that annoyed me in the interview was him saying that "he was promised to be the #1, then he got COVID, and when he came back, he should've still been the #1, but no one followed through". It sounded to me that there was a level of entitlement to the starting spot. At that time, De Gea didn't whine about losing the #1 spot, moved his gf and their newborn to the UK for that season, and him cutting his vacation short so he can start training earlier after his dumpster-fire form at the end of the 20/21 season.

De Gea started the 21/22 season relatively strong, and Henderson coming back from COVID would have to challenge that. I'll never know what happened behind the scenes, or if he'd done enough to show Carrick or Rangnick that they should start him over De Gea later in the season. Him claiming in the interview that he should've still been #1 because someone promised him the spot, coupled with the rumors that he was one of the leaks in the dressing room (unproven, I know) would turn some of us off him.

Henderson wanting to go and play regular football is fine. After the dust settled from the initial interview, I don't even really take issue with him saying that it's criminal for him to waste 12 months, or that he would've loved to play against United as a Forest player. It's that entitlement that bothers me, because I think that while he isn't a bad keeper, he was challenging De Gea for the #1 spot when the latter was arguably at his most unfocused state of his career (playing in the UK with his newborn in Spain and COVID restricting his travels), and that's just my view of the gap between their abilities.

I hope, for his sake and ours, that he or we can find a club that'll take him on a permanent transfer, because he isn't going to want to sit on the bench behind Onana either.
 
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spe88 said:
I thought Brighton would be sniffing around this with Sanchez about to leave.

Unless they’ve brought in that young dutch keeper as #1
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They have, probably going to let him bed in and it does seem de Zerbi actually rates Steele so he will be happy to rotate but the new keeper was always eyed as a long term replacement for Sanchez.

This does help set the market a little more for Hendo though. Keepers are going cheap seems to be the theme this summer, Sanchez is younger, better and has accomplished more and is moving to moneybags Chelsea for 25M, Raya is massively better and Brentford are struggling to get any realistic bids at all. In that context if we get offered 15M for Hendo we should grab it, I would even take 10M plus some add ons at this stage.

We might need to recognize that we have no other bidders but Forest have countless alternative targets at bargain prices, the onus is on us to find a deal that they will take or we can let Heaton join Luton and settle for having the highest paid backup in world football.
 
spe88 said:
I thought Brighton would be sniffing around this with Sanchez about to leave.

Unless they’ve brought in that young dutch keeper as #1
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Verbruggen is very highly rated and is similar to Courtois. We also looked at him closely this summer.
 
mavradal said:
Makes no sense, why would the Premier League intentionally increase the chances of teams being less competitive?
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Conflict of interest. What's stopping a loaned out keeper letting one in to help his parents club out who he might be going back to the following season.
 
Berbaclass said:
What’s the point of this? They have quite obviously messed us and the player about with a shite offer. They clearly have money.
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They did that offer because he has been injured and they naturally didnt want to commit until they could see if he was 100% recovered
 
Oranges038 said:
That's might be a lesson to other clubs, don't sign 457 players in a year.
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Another team who clearly don’t understand the new FSP rules, so many teams especially from the PL are going to get sanctioned next year whether they stay up or go down. Dean Henderson has never been a player that warms United Fans hearts, well known leak of team news, ego maniac and we are currently paying him £100-130k per week if rumours are to be believed, he needs to knuckle down as our number 2 when he gets fit or maybe get a championship loan or a lower PL team.
 
Sanchez going for £25m scuppers us somewhat. Time to eat humble pie and bite their hand off for £10m.
 
Alemar said:
So Forest have Henderson money available, but don’t pay for him for some reason
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They don't agree with our valuation. It is not a like for like comparison of course as he is not a keeper but Ibanez is a much better player than Hendo and a bargain at 25M. Keepers are selling low in this window and Forest need 2, they can get Matt Turner and Jose Sa combined for what we want for Henderson and when you factor in that Hendo has been injured since January we are playing with a very weak hand. I think we need to accept that he is worth a lot less than we hoped and settle for a smaller fee with maybe some decent add ons and a sell on clause.
 
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