Cristiano Ronaldo | Real confirm deal

[KC91]

As I said days ago, if a guy like Ronaldo (more like his agent) knew his mere pressence at Torino would mean a 80M revenue spike in just the first year, then he wouldn't settle for 30M (¿60M? gross), he'd be asking 80M so Juve get "an upgrade on Higuain at no loss" or even more, if I'm in such a position of power I wouldn't be ecstatic to sign for a company that's inferior performance-wise to my current one, but also knowing they're going to make a killing with me and I'm going to merely improve my wages.

Yes, Madrid with Ronaldo is a better team than Juventus. But Juventus with Ronaldo would be a better team than Madrid without Ronaldo in my opinion. So you can't really say they are inferior performance wise if they were to add a piece like Ronaldo, I'm sure he realizes this too.

I also think there's a lot more prestige for Ronaldo to head to Juventus than people think. Not only is Serie A the most competitive it's been in a long time & back on the rise, but Juve would surely be the favorites to lift the Scudetto, Coppa Italia, & CL if they added Ronaldo. Potentially winning multiple trophies in Italy and Europe would only build on to his legacy. As for Juve, this move is a no-brainer. They are a huge club, but Ronaldo would push them over the line to being a massive club globally.

 

[Ishdalar]

To give you an idea: Madrid, United and Barcelona make around 140-160mil a year off the two main sponsors. Juventus currently make 40mil. Signing Cristiano would likely at least double that amount right away: juventus would be in a strong position to renegotiate the terms with FCA[same owners, too!] and adidas.

Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are clubs he wouldn't join for a number of reasons, Bayern simply won't pay those wages to anyone and Roma could not afford it anyways

This is what I really don't get, "a number of reasons" is a thin argument, whatever, but in concrete Bayern and Roma, a week ago you would say the same, "Juve simply won't pay those wages to anyone", and 3/4 of the same in the Roma argument, a lot of people would say Juve couldn't afford Ronaldo's wages anyways. Yet everyone is using the "great marketing growth" and "they can afford his wages with the increased revenue" to justify Juventus paying those wages just because a number of sources have said this could happen, it could be exactly the same for Bayern.

He wouldn't because then juventus could not afford it anymore. For a club with a revenue of 400mil, to add 100 mil in expenses per year, they'd need to cut down expenses elsewhere while aiming to increase revenue to around 600mil in the space of 2-3 years. Because juventus are so far behind commercially to the english teams, bayern and the spanish teams, their growth potential is far greater, hence why Cristiano is worth so much more to them

If they don't sign him because they couldn't afford it afterall, they'll be playing the whole season in an empty stadium. No way.

The growth potential is also huge for Liverpool or Arsenal, and still you're not answering my main point in the argument I used. If a player alone has the potential to increase their revenue in 80M just this year, paying that same player 40M/y (80 gross) would still maintain them at "default" compared to this current year as long as they manage to sell Higuain and another player for 100M, but with a better potential return in the next seasons after Ronaldo isn't already in their payroll but they still benefit from the deals signed when he was, and the improved marketabilty after his stint.

And everyone seems to forget something important here, the fact that Real Madrid are asking Ronaldo to publicly express his desire to leave Real Madrid for Juve is not something to shrug at. When we're already talking about marketing, positioning yourself "against" the most marketable team in the world could be a huge hit, this is a two way street, Juve benefits from having Ronaldo in their deals as much as Ronaldo can benefit from playing for Real Madrid in his, Mendes probably has his calculators in overclock running numbers about what a hit it could mean for the Ronaldo brand to position themselves in a way that can displease Real Madrid fans. Why do you think this story froze once that condition hit the news?.

But whatever, maybe I'm just pissed at the double standard being used here, when my team renews their best player for an absurd amount of money it's suicide, not worth it and unsustainable, but when Juventus do the same with a revenue 250M below what Barcelona have, suddenly it's a brilliant move that will solidify their marketability and improve their future.

 

[Ishdalar]

Yes, Madrid with Ronaldo is a better team than Juventus. But Juventus with Ronaldo would be a better team than Madrid without Ronaldo in my opinion. So you can't really say they are inferior performance wise if they were to add a piece like Ronaldo, I'm sure he realizes this too.

I also think there's a lot more prestige for Ronaldo to head to Juventus than people think. Not only is Serie A the most competitive it's been in a long time & back on the rise, but Juve would surely be the favorites to lift the Scudetto, Coppa Italia, & CL if they added Ronaldo. Potentially winning multiple trophies in Italy and Europe would only build on to his legacy. As for Juve, this move is a no-brainer. They are a huge club, but Ronaldo would push them over the line to being a massive club globally.

You're implying that Juve get Ronaldo but Real stay idle and do nothing to replace him, in that situation Juve would be a better team, but as long as Real Madrid don't throw 150M at Andy Carroll, the guy they'll sign to replace Ronaldo would still keep them above Juve in quaility imo.

And about the competitivity of Serie A... Juve just sealed their 7th title in a row... with 95 points (2nd most ever, I think). You can argue about their title race vs Napoli, but if you take into account that Roma were second in 2017 with 87 points and lost their 2 best players just after that and fell 10 points do you honestly expect Napoli to close the gap to Juve if they lose Sarri, Jorginho and Witsel, while Juve swap Higuain for Cristiano Ronaldo?. Serie A is far from being more competitive now than 6 years ago imo, it's more about how many titles can Juve win before they screw up, can be 7, 10 or 14.

 

[Deleted member 101472]

You're implying that Juve get Ronaldo but Real stay idle and do nothing to replace him, in that situation Juve would be a better team, but as long as Real Madrid don't throw 150M at Andy Carroll, the guy they'll sign to replace Ronaldo would still keep them above Juve in quaility imo.

And about the competitivity of Serie A... Juve just sealed their 7th title in a row... with 95 points (2nd most ever, I think). You can argue about their title race vs Napoli, but if you take into account that Roma were second in 2017 with 87 points and lost their 2 best players just after that and fell 10 points do you honestly expect Napoli to close the gap to Juve if they lose Sarri, Jorginho and Witsel, while Juve swap Higuain for Cristiano Ronaldo?. Serie A is far from being more competitive now than 6 years ago imo, it's more about how many titles can Juve win before they screw up, can be 7, 10 or 14.

I think they’ll cope without him personally

 

[Ishdalar]

I think they’ll cope without him personally

Sorry, I meant Mertens

 

[poleglass red]

240mil in wages for 4 years, plus 100-150 in transfer fee plus 20 for mendes


his wages will be 30 million per season, over 4 yrs that's 120 million in wages. Transfer fee, no more than 100 million. That's 220 million. Unless Mendes is getting 180 million the deal is nowhere near 400 million.

 

[giorno]

This is what I really don't get, "a number of reasons" is a thin argument, whatever, but in concrete Bayern and Roma, a week ago you would say the same, "Juve simply won't pay those wages to anyone", and 3/4 of the same in the Roma argument, a lot of people would say Juve couldn't afford Ronaldo's wages anyways. Yet everyone is using the "great marketing growth" and "they can afford his wages with the increased revenue" to justify Juventus paying those wages just because a number of sources have said this could happen, it could be exactly the same for Bayern.

Because again, Roma aren't rich enough or big enough to afford it. Bayern, i dunno. Fact of the matter is juventus are FAR too exposed at this point for this to be all a ploy by Mendes with them playing along. Maybe it is all a ploy by Mendes to get Flo to pay up(unlikely to be and even more unlikely to happen at this point) but Juventus are in this for real. Evidently their financial experts told them the investment was sustainable. If that weren't the case, the story would have never been allowed to reach this point.

Why is it juventus and not Bayern, Chelsea or Arsenal? Ask Bayern, Chelsea or Arsenal. Maybe Cristiano never considered them. Maybe they felt the deal was too big a risk. Maybe there was mutual disinterest.

The growth potential is also huge for Liverpool or Arsenal, and still you're not answering my main point in the argument I used. If a player alone has the potential to increase their revenue in 80M just this year, paying that same player 40M/y (80 gross) would still maintain them at "default"

But the whole reason this deal makes sense for them is if it brings financial advantages. Most importantly: how is Cristiano supposed to know how much juventus can or can't afford? He named his price -up to juventus to see whether they can afford it or not. Ckearly they believe they can

Btw, selling higuain is nothing to them. They'll make a very small profit off him, if at all. Their homerun is Rugani for 40mil. A profit of more than 30mil on one player...

But whatever, maybe I'm just pissed at the double standard being used here, when my team renews their best player for an absurd amount of money it's suicide, not worth it and unsustainable, but when Juventus do the same with a revenue 250M below what Barcelona have, suddenly it's a brilliant move that will solidify their marketability and improve their future.

Different conditions and circumstances. Mostly, it's Messi holding the club he loves over a barrell for an ungodly amount of money is what raised my eyebrows. A club that even paid for his tax fraud(of which they might have even been unknowingly complicit!), came out in defence against pretty much the entire spanish population...

 

[giorno]

@poleglass red The figures are after tax

 

[Ishdalar]

Most importantly: how is Cristiano supposed to know how much juventus can or can't afford? He named his price -up to juventus to see whether they can afford it or not. Ckearly they believe they can.

Well, because if you can come here and tell us that estimates are he could improve Juve's revenue in 80M in the first year with him, he might think he has a claim to a big part of those 80M, otherwise you're being wasted in this forum when you could be counseling Ronaldo about financial matters, or you were already approached by him but he can't leave Mendes because he has Ronaldo's nudes .

Point is, if everyone knows Juve are going to make X money from you, it has no sense to accept half of X as salary, we're working with estimations here, but if you take the numbers being thrown as estimations in revenue for Juve out of this deal, and the amount of money spend on the deal, it feels like Real Madrid and Ronaldo are getting shafted, I don't think they're that dumb so I believe that those estimations are false and using them is pointless.

Different conditions and circumstances. Mostly, it's Messi holding the club he loves over a barrell for an ungodly amount of money is what raised my eyebrows. A club that even paid for his tax fraud(of which they might have even
been unknowingly complicit!), came out in defence against pretty much the entire spanish population...

It's the same, is a player with a perfomance and market value attached to him so you have to pay him what's fair, which is why I say the increase of revenue for Juve with Ronaldo doesn't seem right, as they don't correlate to the wage that's being reported.

Barcelona didn't pay anyone his tax fraud, Barcelona structure their wages in a way that the contract bonus are paid from transfer fee provisions in the fiscal year, making the yearly wage bill smaller enough to accomodate it to FFP provisions. That's why big earners get fat signing bonus and eventual loyalty bonus, like Busquets, Mascherano, Pique or even Neymar.

And Juve will have to do something similar if they finally manage to sign Ronaldo, with their revenue and current wage bill I doubt they have enough cap for Ronaldo to be there without breaking the FFP, and the revenue money can take more than 12 or 16 months to kick in, leaving them exposed to sell players the same way Roma or PSG had to. I doubt Mendes doesn't know that and hasn't mentioned it to Ronaldo, so they had to put a plan in motion to convince Ronaldo that they can pay him that much, without risking FFP sanctions or having to sell players he'll need for that UCL push he'd probably want with Juventus.

That's why I talk about double standards, Madrid are safer in this regard because they have the biggest revenue with a slightly lower wage bill due to the way they've been building their squad, but almost everyone else at that level has to do the same tricks to survive.

 

[Peyroteo]

Well, because if you can come here and tell us that estimates are he could improve Juve's revenue in 80M in the first year with him, he might think he has a claim to a big part of those 80M, otherwise you're being wasted in this forum when you could be counseling Ronaldo about financial matters, or you were already approached by him but he can't leave Mendes because he has Ronaldo's nudes .

Point is, if everyone knows Juve are going to make X money from you, it has no sense to accept half of X as salary, we're working with estimations here, but if you take the numbers being thrown as estimations in revenue for Juve out of this deal, and the amount of money spend on the deal, it feels like Real Madrid and Ronaldo are getting shafted, I don't think they're that dumb so I believe that those estimations are false and using them is pointless.

Ronaldo's marketability will have a much bigger impact for Juve than it does for Real Madrid, hence they aren't getting shafted. Mendes offered Ronaldo to Juve for 60 million per year pre-tax. Reports said he offered him to PSG and United too but there wasn't interest, Juve would be next on the list after that. He obviously wouldn't have any interest in joining Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal or Roma.

Juve are going to be renegotiating the Adidas contract soon and their owners indirectly sponsor them too so you'll see an increase there. Even if Ronaldo coming in increased Juve's revenue in 80 million in the first year he wouldn't be in a position to ask for more given there wouldn't be any of the top clubs interested. He also wouldn't have the commercial effect he'll have for Juve for any of those other clubs.

The deal may fall through for some reason as deals always can but that Juve have agreed terms with Ronaldo and are willing to pay 100-150 million fee to Madrid is a fact. There's no way they'd do that without massive commercial benefits, they're one of the most cautious clubs in the world in the transfer market. Do you think there's any chance of this deal happening without those big commercial advantages for Juve?

They didn't just take an enormous risk for a 33 year old player and tried a hail mary to win the Champions League. If they're doing this is because the numbers add up for them.

 

[giorno]

Well, because if you can come here and tell us that estimates are he could improve Juve's revenue in 80M in the first year with him, he might think he has a claim to a big part of those 80M, otherwise you're being wasted in this forum when you could be counseling Ronaldo about financial matters, or you were already approached by him but he can't leave Mendes because he has Ronaldo's nudes .

I'm just reporting what an actual sports finance guy said here in Italy about it. Tbf it's less 80mil spike and more up to 80mil spike. But again, i seriously doubt Mendes had experts making calculations about it before he offered him to juventus. And once the deal between Mendes and Juve is agreed, he isn't going to come back and say "actually, we've calculated that you'll be making X thanks to him so we now want more". Especially given juventus were the only club willing to give him that much in the first place

Barcelona didn't pay anyone his tax fraud, Barcelona structure their wages in a way that the contract bonus are paid from transfer fee provisions in the fiscal year, making the yearly wage bill smaller enough to accomodate it to FFP provisions. That's why big earners get fat signing bonus and eventual loyalty bonus, like Busquets, Mascherano, Pique or even Neymar.

And Juve will have to do something similar if they finally manage to sign Ronaldo, with their revenue and current wage bill I doubt they have enough cap for Ronaldo to be there without breaking the FFP, and the revenue money can take more than 12 or 16 months to kick in, leaving them exposed to sell players the same way Roma or PSG had to. I doubt Mendes doesn't know that and hasn't mentioned it to Ronaldo, so they had to put a plan in motion to convince Ronaldo that they can pay him that much, without risking FFP sanctions or having to sell players he'll need for that UCL push he'd probably want with Juventus.

That's why I talk about double standards, Madrid are safer in this regard because they have the biggest revenue with a slightly lower wage bill due to the way they've been building their squad, but almost everyone else at that level has to do the same tricks to survive.

For sure. Juventus will have to get creative about fitting him into their wage bill. Clearly they do have a plan

 

[Ishdalar]

Ronaldo's marketability will have a much bigger impact for Juve than it does for Real Madrid, hence they aren't getting shafted. Mendes offered Ronaldo to Juve for 60 million per year pre-tax. Reports said he offered him to PSG and United too but there wasn't interest, Juve would be next on the list after that. He obviously wouldn't have any interest in joining Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal or Roma.

Juve are going to be renegotiating the Adidas contract soon and their owners indirectly sponsor them too so you'll see an increase there. Even if Ronaldo coming in increased Juve's revenue in 80 million in the first year he wouldn't be in a position to ask for more given there wouldn't be any of the top clubs interested. He also wouldn't have the commercial effect he'll have for Juve for any of those other clubs.

The deal may fall through for some reason as deals always can but that Juve have agreed terms with Ronaldo and are willing to pay 100-150 million fee to Madrid is a fact. There's no way they'd do that without massive commercial benefits, they're one of the most cautious clubs in the world in the transfer market. Do you think there's any chance of this deal happening without those big commercial advantages for Juve?

They didn't just take an enormous risk for a 33 year old player and tried a hail mary to win the Champions League. If they're doing this is because the numbers add up for them.

I'm not saying this deal doesn't come with commercial advantages, I'm saying that those advantages, more concrete, the numbers being thrown, are being exaggerated, or otherwise the transfer fee and wage would probably be bigger. They blew 90M in Higuain just two seasons ago, so I'm sure they can afford the fees reported, for example, they are more than 100M above Atletico de Madrid in the 2018 Deloitte money league, yet they don't overspend Atleti by much, also iirc Griezmann will earn 24M with his new contract.

For the wages thing I think it's about planning, they obviously take into account marketing gains by having Ronaldo but in the grand scheme of things, I think that amounts to nothing when we talk about what he's going to bring vs how much he gets paid, not because it's Ronaldo, call him Pelé, Beckham or Maradona, it stays the same. Their plan must revolve around signing Ronaldo, taking a smaller net loss on the fee by selling surplus players, giving it a go for two years with their current core, extract Ronaldo's wages from the transfer funds in the next 2 or 3 seasons (so, unless they sell big they won't buy big either). And rebuilding the squad in 3 or 4 years, with Ronaldo gone, part of the sales paying for Ronaldo's last year, and the transfer funds unlocked again.

They get a couple years window of being competitive, at apparently no loss, they get to enjoy one of the GOATs in their team and profit from being linked to him not just those seasons, but in the future. But marketing is a "plus" in this kind of things, not a deal breaker, the press just throw around this narrative around Adidas want this or that because in a world moved by sponsors just mentioning them and saying they're key to anything happening just improves their exposure, but there's bigger things at stake for them.

After all, even if the Adidas contract ends soon, those contracts are being signed in at least 10 years windows lately, how many Adidas shirts wil Ronaldo sell for Juve from 2021 to 2028? You think that doesn't have any weight in their negotiations?.

 

[Peyroteo]

I'm not saying this deal doesn't come with commercial advantages, I'm saying that those advantages, more concrete, the numbers being thrown, are being exaggerated, or otherwise the transfer fee and wage would probably be bigger.

They wouldn't though. The transfer fee was an agreement between Perez and Mendes and it was obvious that if Ronaldo wanted to leave Madrid would facilitate it. The wages are better than he'd get anywhere else.

The wages will be 60 million per year pre-tax, there's no way that Ronaldo coming in won't increase their revenue enough to pay a significant part of that. They've already increased their ticket prices by 30% for starters, the Adidas deal will be renegotiated soon and Ronaldo being there will obviously have an impact on that deal as it will have on the sponsorships they'll indirectly get from their own owners.

For the wages thing I think it's about planning, they obviously take into account marketing gains by having Ronaldo but in the grand scheme of things, I think that amounts to nothing when we talk about what he's going to bring vs how much he gets paid

If like you say the revenue increase would be insignificant in comparison to what he'll earn then there is absolutely now ay Juve would have agreed to the terms they've agreed to.

 

[KC91]

You're implying that Juve get Ronaldo but Real stay idle and do nothing to replace him, in that situation Juve would be a better team, but as long as Real Madrid don't throw 150M at Andy Carroll, the guy they'll sign to replace Ronaldo would still keep them above Juve in quaility imo.

And about the competitivity of Serie A... Juve just sealed their 7th title in a row... with 95 points (2nd most ever, I think). You can argue about their title race vs Napoli, but if you take into account that Roma were second in 2017 with 87 points and lost their 2 best players just after that and fell 10 points do you honestly expect Napoli to close the gap to Juve if they lose Sarri, Jorginho and Witsel, while Juve swap Higuain for Cristiano Ronaldo?. Serie A is far from being more competitive now than 6 years ago imo, it's more about how many titles can Juve win before they screw up, can be 7, 10 or 14.

Unless Madrid is getting Neymar, or MBappe (both seem unattainable) I'd put Juve ahead of them.

As for Juve winning 7 titles in a row, it doesnt speak to the competitivness a whole lot. They’ve just grinded out crucial wins when they needed to in order to get over the final hurdle. The top of the league as a whole is very competitive. Napoli, Roma, Inter, and Lazio have only futher strengthened this summer.

 

[Ishdalar]

They wouldn't though. The transfer fee was an agreement between Perez and Mendes and it was obvious that if Ronaldo wanted to leave Madrid would facilitate it. The wages are better than he'd get anywhere else.

The wages will be 60 million per year pre-tax, there's no way that Ronaldo coming in won't increase their revenue enough to pay a significant part of that. They've already increased their ticket prices by 30% for starters, the Adidas deal will be renegotiated and Ronaldo being there will obviously have an impact on that deal as it will have on the sponsorships they'll indirectly get from their own owners.

That's just media blabber, I won't buy that notion until someone slaps my face with official numbers, otherwise is, like I said, selling the notion that players are throwing money away, if everyone knows you're worth X, a team will earn X more with you there, then you're entitled to eat a big part of X, or you're basically losing money.

They've already increased their ticket prices by 30% for starters

Now that's going to be another feat of announcing Ronaldo?. Take, from Juve's official fiscal year PDF

They increased the ticket sale revenue in 50% just in the last 3 seasons with the same average attandance, which amounts for a 25% ticket price increase in the last two summers, on par with the 30% for starters you said, Ronaldo had nothing to do with it, they have their stadium at an average 96% attendance, they'll keep rising the price as long as they can.

Time will tell, thankfully due to Juve having to disclose their movements in the stock market, we'll be able to judge how much a star player amounts for a team in due context.

 

[Peyroteo]

That's just media blabber, I won't buy that notion until someone slaps my face with official numbers, otherwise is, like I said, selling the notion that players are throwing money away, if everyone knows you're worth X, a team will earn X more with you there, then you're entitled to eat a big part of X, or you're basically losing money.

No, he's worth that much money to Juve. He's not worth that much money to all the other top clubs he'd want to play in, including Real Madrid. He's not losing money, he's getting more money than he'd get anywhere else.

It's insane to think the most cautious club in the transfer market is about to spend 400 million for a 33 year old in a 4 year period without believing they won't get a big part of that back through their revenue. If you believe the revenue numbers are media blabber, then you must think Juve are beyond stupid to make this move. Don't you think that would be tremendously out of character?

As for the ticket prices, with Ronaldo there will obviously have a tendency to increase even if it's already been the case in the past few years. How much the increase will be due to him is impossible to know, they'll get a new deal with Adidas in the next couple of years but we won't know for sure how much of the money Adidas will be willing to pay has to do with Ronaldo. I'm absolutely certain Juve condidered everything and made several studies, after all of that they still went ahead with it so it seems natural to think it's because they were happy with the projected results.

 

[Ishdalar]

No, he's worth that much money to Juve. He's not worth that much money to all the other top clubs he'd want to play in, including Real Madrid. He's not losing money, he's getting more money than he'd get anywhere else.

It's insane to think the most cautious club in the transfer market is about to spend 400 million for a 33 year old in a 4 year period without believing they won't get a big part of that back through their revenue. If you believe the revenue numbers are media blabber, then you must think Juve are beyond stupid to make this move. Don't you think that would be tremendously out of character?

As for the ticket prices, with Ronaldo there will obviously have a tendency to increase even if it's already been the case in the past few years. How much the increase will be due to him is impossible to know, they'll get a new deal with Adidas in the next couple of years but we won't know for sure how much of the money Adidas will be willing to pay has to do with Ronaldo. I'm absolutely certain Juve condidered everything and made several studies, after all of that they still went ahead with it so it seems natural to think it's because they were happy with the projected results.

Tickets are increasing all around the world, it's just funny to say this will be the "Ronaldo factor" for Juve, when they've been increasing them at the same rate and will obviously continue to do so as long as they keep 96% attendance all through the season.


Bolded part, I think they're trying to make this move because they have the money available and it's Cristiano Ronaldo, if Jorge Mendes calls you offering Cristiano Ronaldo on a silver plate, either you have the money and wage space to get him, or you don't and have to pass. Overcomplicating this with marketing and revenues is absurd.

 

[Peyroteo]

Bolded part, I think they're trying to make this move because they have the money available and it's Cristiano Ronaldo, if Jorge Mendes calls you offering Cristiano Ronaldo on a silver plate, either you have the money and wage space to get him, or you don't and have to pass. Overcomplicating this with marketing and revenues is absurd.

It's not absurd if it's the truth... Them having 400 million to spend doesn't mean they should spend it on a huge risk that goes completely against what the club is known for in the transfer market.

Either you think the revenue and marketing are very singificant parts of this deal which seems natural and it's what every source is reporting or to put it like you said we're watching a club known for their cautiousness in the transfer market throw a 400 million hail mary to a 33 year old. Only one of those is absurd.

Juve aren't a club that would do anything like this on a whim, there's absolutely no chance they'd get close to spending what they're spending if they didn't think they would make it back through added revenue. If they don't make any significant amount through revenue then there would be hundreds of different ways they could spend 400 million and get a better footballing return.

Tickets are increasing all around the world, it's just funny to say this will be the "Ronaldo factor" for Juve, when they've been increasing them at the same rate and will obviously continue to do so as long as they keep 96% attendance all through the season.

How much is the question. The Adidas deal will increase too and then you'll say the exact same thing about that. 'Well, all deals are increasing so obviously Ronaldo didn't have anything to do with that'. You will never have the exact numbers of how much revenue a player can generate and you won't have it with Ronaldo either, hence you can keep saying it's irrelevant no matter what numbers come out in the following years.

What I do know is that Juve are a cautious club, they have done enough studies on what signing Ronaldo would mean for their finances and after all of that they still went ahead with it.

 

[RedCurry]

Point to note is that, within four year’s time, Ronaldo may have no resale value at all. Looking at it from that perspective, this deal would be eye wateringly massive. It’s not like PSG with Neymar or Mbappe whose values will probably remain the same in a few year’s time in case PSG needs to sell. Unless of course Juve want to use Ronaldo for a season and then sell him next season to the highest bidder which would make a whole lot of sense.

 

[KC91]

Point to note is that, within four year’s time, Ronaldo may have no resale value at all. Looking at it from that perspective, this deal would be eye wateringly massive. It’s not like PSG with Neymar or Mbappe whose values will probably remain the same in a few year’s time in case PSG needs to sell. Unless of course Juve want to use Ronaldo for a season and then sell him next season to the highest bidder which would make a whole lot of sense.

I would be shocked if a Chinese team wouldn’t pay 25-30m for Ronaldo in 4 yrs. Unless he retires of course.

 

[Vilev]

Juventus will have to get creative about fitting him into their wage bil

Nothing really creative about it. First of all, 53 millions euros is a big sum, but not really critical for Juve. With their overall operating expenses at ~400 mil, wages at 230-250, healthy EBITDA (over 100m) and operating income, there is clearly room there for just putting 53m just right there. No FFP worries, esp since Juve showed decent profit last years. Also it obvious some top earners will go to compensate a bit.
But of course there are quite an easy way to shift the cost. They can just give Ronaldo more percentage of image rights. Real as a top earner in football, well head to head with MU, takes around 50% if not more. These are huge contracts, Juve could easily give Ronaldo as high as 75-80%.

I don't think there is actual need for a creative accounting here. numbers add up on their own.

 

[vincent11]

ok well first of all this is a done deal, no doubt about that. for people wondering where juve will find the money, maybe you should consider that fact that EXOR which is the holding that owns about 60% shares of Juve has a revenue of 143 billion euros, so that means that if they want they can buy real madrid and make perez their gardener. it's true that juve have been for the most part a self financed club, but they might make an exception this time, considering that CR7 is probably the most famous person on earth and a sponsorship will benefit them also

 

[RedCurry]

I would be shocked if a Chinese team wouldn’t pay 25-30m for Ronaldo in 4 yrs. Unless he retires of course.

That’s fair but it barely even covers his one year salary. I just somehow don’t see Juve as a club that would make an investment like this without a plan for making a bulk of the money back.

 

[Ishdalar]

Nothing really creative about it. First of all, 53 millions euros is a big sum, but not really critical for Juve. With their overall operating expenses at ~400 mil, wages at 230-250, healthy EBITDA (over 100m) and operating income, there is clearly room there for just putting 53m just right there. No FFP worries, esp since Juve showed decent profit last years. Also it obvious some top earners will go to compensate a bit.
But of course there are quite an easy way to shift the cost. They can just give Ronaldo more percentage of image rights. Real as a top earner in football, well head to head with MU, takes around 50% if not more. These are huge contracts, Juve could easily give Ronaldo as high as 75-80%.

I don't think there is actual need for a creative accounting here. numbers add up on their own.

50% of his rights, he got that in the 2013 renewal.

Still his image rights "aren't his" anymore, he sold that to Peter Lim, I use quotations there because it's a debatable thing (he sold those rights to a friend of his manager, just in the last year of the Beckham exception, so it probably was more of a tax thing than actually giving control of that). But what's more important here, and avoided in the press, is that when news talk about the deals of image rights between player and club it's never about personal image rights, some journalists have slipped when talking about that and said what they actually negotiate in that regard is their image rights in content related to both player and club, if Real Madrid does an ad with Ronaldo wearing a Real Madrid shirt for Fly Emirates, Ronaldo has negotiated to get 50% of that ad value, but when it comes to him partnering with Castrol, he gets 100% of that money and Real Madrid get nil, and it's the same way for almost every player.

This is another take on the argument I'm defending on this thread, the media are misinforming about these things to appease their overlords, 12 years ago people thought if Becks earned 5M from RM and earned 50M in market deals, Real were basically earning 25M from Becks rights, he would be losing money compared to his United contract but people still believe that.

There's a lot of money in market partnerships between player and team, couple millions here and there, but the big buckets are in personal dealerships, that's sacred for any star be it NBA, Golf or Tennis, and Football is not an exception.

 

[Vilev]

But what's more important here, and avoided in the press, is that when news talk about the deals of image rights between player and club it's never about personal image rights, some journalists have slipped when talking about that and said what they actually negotiate in that regard is their image rights in content related to both player and club, if Real Madrid does an ad with Ronaldo wearing a Real Madrid shirt for Fly Emirates, Ronaldo has negotiated to get 50% of that ad value, but when it comes to him partnering with Castrol, he gets 100% of that money and Real Madrid get nil, and it's the same way for almost every player.

It's not that straightforward. Sure they are different image rights. But the thing is, the most lucrative sponsor deal must include some sort of club/sport interaction. I think if we take all Ronaldo's income, 2/3 will come from club, and 1/3 at the most would be those strictly personal sponsorship deal's that are completely pass Real by.

There's a lot of money in market partnerships between player and team, couple millions here and there, but the big buckets are in personal dealerships, that's sacred for any star be it NBA, Golf or Tennis, and Football is not an exception.

From what i know the model in US and Europe regarding sponsorship and stuff is completely different. In USA leagues players have way more power and ability to strike deals.

This is another take on the argument I'm defending on this thread, the media are misinforming about these things to appease their overlords

Yeah, i'm not sure i get that. What argument is that?
The way i see it, Juve can afford Ronaldo as is. Without any further actions. Their profitability will take a hit, sure, but they will stay in the black. But if Juve do sign Ronaldo two things will almost definitely happen. Some players will go, generating transfer revenue and cutting costs. Juventus core revenue will increase dramatically. Juventus commercial income is actually very low. I take last Deloitte report (16/17 season) and they have only 28%, almost 115m from commercial activities. Many clubs are well above them, including Dortmund(150), Inter (130). Clearly Juve is very weak in that area. If we look at their international sales, they lag behind Chelsea, Arsenal and everybody else from Deloitte's top 10. Given their weakness in this area Ronaldo can actually help them to double their income from sponsors in 3-4 years. I agree with a user who said that Ronaldo effect for Juve will be much bigger, if we measure it in percentages than it could have bee for MU or PSG. Or for Real. Juve can really jump-start their commercial activities. Juve's title plus kit deal comes at around 40m euros pa. That's almost nothing compared to other top clubs. Arsenal gets just that from shirt. They will double it with their kit deal.
And the reason Juve can't generate more commercial money is because they have not got any marketable players like almost at all. They are a strong team, but have nothing to sell. Even Higuain may be a star in terms of his contribution on the pitch but in terms of getting money out of him he is no different to Pjanic or Khedira.
So it way, from strictly business point of view Juventus desperately needs such a character as Ronaldo.

 

[Ishdalar]

How much is the question. The Adidas deal will increase too and then you'll say the exact same thing about that. 'Well, all deals are increasing so obviously Ronaldo didn't have anything to do with that'. You will never have the exact numbers of how much revenue a player can generate and you won't have it with Ronaldo either, hence you can keep saying it's irrelevant no matter what numbers come out in the following years.

Juve's title plus kit deal comes at around 40m euros pa. That's almost nothing compared to other top clubs. Arsenal gets just that from shirt. They will double it with their kit deal.

Can we stop with the "new kit deal" charade, pls.

https://www.football-italia.net/40963/juventus-announce-adidas-deal
"Juventus have officially announced a new six-year deal with Adidas from the 2015-16 season worth €139.5m."

https://www.juvefc.com/juventus-sponsors-partners-pays/
"For instance, Juventus currently has a kit deal with Adidas that lasts until 2022 and which is worth £20 million to the Club. Interestingly, although this is the most lucrative such arrangement in Serie A (ahead of AC Milan’s deal, also with Adidas, which netted them £19 million)."

When Juve sit to negotiate a new kit deal, the first year that deal would go through is the 2022/2023 season, by that point how is Ronaldo going to be a factor? Either his contract runs out in 2022 so he's out of the picture, or he's 37 to 38 y/o, even if he's still Ballon d'Or material at that stage of his career, Juve will negotiate to a minimum of 6 years, he'd be a valuable asset for 1 or 2 seasons, the kit deal covers a span that could range between 6 and 10 seasons, one season of a 39 y/o Ronaldo doesn't rise anything in Adidas/Nike eyes at that point.

 

[Peyroteo]

Can we stop with the "new kit deal" charade, pls.

https://www.football-italia.net/40963/juventus-announce-adidas-deal
"Juventus have officially announced a new six-year deal with Adidas from the 2015-16 season worth €139.5m."

https://www.juvefc.com/juventus-sponsors-partners-pays/
"For instance, Juventus currently has a kit deal with Adidas that lasts until 2022 and which is worth £20 million to the Club. Interestingly, although this is the most lucrative such arrangement in Serie A (ahead of AC Milan’s deal, also with Adidas, which netted them £19 million)."

When Juve sit to negotiate a new kit deal, the first year that deal would go through is the 2022/2023 season, by that point how is Ronaldo going to be a factor? Either his contract runs out in 2022 so he's out of the picture, or he's 37 to 38 y/o, even if he's still Ballon d'Or material at that stage of his career, Juve will negotiate to a minimum of 6 years, he'd be a valuable asset for 1 or 2 seasons, the kit deal covers a span that could range between 6 and 10 seasons, one season of a 39 y/o Ronaldo doesn't rise anything in Adidas/Nike eyes at that point.

They negotiate the deal years before it happens. Last one started in 2015 but was announced in 2013 for example as you can see on the date of the first article.

 

[Ishdalar]

They negotiate the deal years before it happens. Last one started in 2015 but was announced in 2013 for example as you can see on the date of the first article.

Goddamnit I knew you would caveat to that nonsense.

2020 negotiations
Mr Juventus: Hey guys, I'd like to negotiate the terms of our future kit deal, we have Ronaldo now.
Mr Adidas: Ok, nice, but we're going to pay you for the amount of shirts you'll sell from 2022 onwards, his contract ends the same year as our current deal, why should I care?.
Mr Juventus: Because he's Cristiano Ronaldo?.
Mr Adidas: How many shirts will he sell for Juve if he goes to China, the MLS or, god forbid, Inter or Milan?.
Mr Juventus: Oh, don't worry about that, we're still 2 years away from 2022 but we're already planning on giving him an extension.
Mr Adidas: Nice, for how many years?.
Mr Juventus: Wel... he'll be 38 y/o once he ends the current contract, so, as usual, we'll offer him an extra year, and if he keeps delivering, maybe another one when he's already 39.
Mr Adidas: Oh, so you want to negotiatie a new kit deal, 2 years in advance, basing your whole marketing operation on a 38 y/o which may leave before the deal kicks in, or can get to stay a year or two in our future 6 year partnership?.
Mr Juventus: Yeah, what's wrong with that.

Jesus

Best case scenario: Adidas or Nike want to close a larger deal with Juve, so either

A) Adidas renegotiate the whole deal to extend it longer in time by improving the amount they're already paying Juventus. Problem with that? Why would they want to renegotiate a deal that's valid for another 4 years if Juve sign Ronaldo, it would be literally the moment Juve could ask for the bigger numbers (peak of the hype) and nothing assures them Ronaldo will sell 1/4 of the sirts he'll sell this year past 2022, a date at which they're still in control.

B) Nike get anxious and want the Juve kit, anticipating an absurd boom in marketing, putting them at the level of Real, United or Barcelona. So they offer an absurd amount of money because Juve now have Ronaldo, so Juve pay a penalty to cancel the Adidas contract (Chelsea paid 67M to terminate their 300M/10yr deal with Adidas 6 seasons sooner), so they paid 22% of the original deal back, 40% into the duration, if Juve get the same deal, they'll have to pay around 30M.

Problem with B)? well, they need Nike to up the ante as they can't buy out the contract blindly, they need Adidas to be reasonable, it's easier to be reasonable with Chelsea when they don't have... you know... Cristiano Ronaldo, and leaving Chelsea gave adidas cap and money to pursue a deal with Arsenal, which normally could be a lateral step and at worst, a minor downgrade. Losing Juve + Ronaldo in a single blow doesn't have a lateral step in Italy for Adidas, every other club is a downgrade, and no other player in the world would sell more shirts than Ronaldo this year. There's already millions of people in the world with a PSG shirt and Neymar or Messi and Barcelona, I doubt there's a more than a dozen of "Ronaldo 7, Juventus".

 

[giorno]

@Ishdalar juventus own the licensing rights. Their current deal once they sign Cristiano, becomes a bad deal for adidas

 

[Striker10]

We should be in for Ronaldo. I know we would have to shuffle a few things and his age etc etc..but it would be a shame and knowing United we'll try at the last minute and fail. Not down just feel Ronaldo could swing up 10 - 15 points on top of what we have. Maybe we think about sell on etc - we shouldn't think like a selling club but also it's up to the club to spot talent early to try to get low prices to then generate huge fees. So let's get it done United. Sanchez Ronaldo Lukaku (Martial and Rashford rotated). If not then maybe we could put Martial central and push Lukaku wider since he seems better from wide. Or we bring in Ronaldo and play him at full back instead of Valencia

 

[Samid]

Boom!

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

What a BOOM!

 

[GBBQ]

I actually think Juve could still make a decent sale when he’s 37 to China or the MLS.

Yeah, he'd be a big draw for China or the MLS even at 37.

 

[Nedved]

Boom!

He’s just been reading various Juventus forums the past 24h. Hardly an exclusive.

 

[Ronaldo's Mum Eh?]

Boom!

Why do people keep quoting this fecknut. He knows nothing and bullshits a lot.

 

[Peyroteo]

Goddamnit I knew you would caveat to that nonsense.

2020 negotiations
Mr Juventus: Hey guys, I'd like to negotiate the terms of our future kit deal, we have Ronaldo now.
Mr Adidas: Ok, nice, but we're going to pay you for the amount of shirts you'll sell from 2022 onwards, his contract ends the same year as our current deal, why should I care?.
Mr Juventus: Because he's Cristiano Ronaldo?.
Mr Adidas: How many shirts will he sell for Juve if he goes to China, the MLS or, god forbid, Inter or Milan?.
Mr Juventus: Oh, don't worry about that, we're still 2 years away from 2022 but we're already planning on giving him an extension.
Mr Adidas: Nice, for how many years?.
Mr Juventus: Wel... he'll be 38 y/o once he ends the current contract, so, as usual, we'll offer him an extra year, and if he keeps delivering, maybe another one when he's already 39.
Mr Adidas: Oh, so you want to negotiatie a new kit deal, 2 years in advance, basing your whole marketing operation on a 38 y/o which may leave before the deal kicks in, or can get to stay a year or two in our future 6 year partnership?.
Mr Juventus: Yeah, what's wrong with that.

Jesus

Best case scenario: Adidas or Nike want to close a larger deal with Juve, so either

A) Adidas renegotiate the whole deal to extend it longer in time by improving the amount they're already paying Juventus. Problem with that? Why would they want to renegotiate a deal that's valid for another 4 years if Juve sign Ronaldo, it would be literally the moment Juve could ask for the bigger numbers (peak of the hype) and nothing assures them Ronaldo will sell 1/4 of the sirts he'll sell this year past 2022, a date at which they're still in control.

B) Nike get anxious and want the Juve kit, anticipating an absurd boom in marketing, putting them at the level of Real, United or Barcelona. So they offer an absurd amount of money because Juve now have Ronaldo, so Juve pay a penalty to cancel the Adidas contract (Chelsea paid 67M to terminate their 300M/10yr deal with Adidas 6 seasons sooner), so they paid 22% of the original deal back, 40% into the duration, if Juve get the same deal, they'll have to pay around 30M.

Problem with B)? well, they need Nike to up the ante as they can't buy out the contract blindly, they need Adidas to be reasonable, it's easier to be reasonable with Chelsea when they don't have... you know... Cristiano Ronaldo, and leaving Chelsea gave adidas cap and money to pursue a deal with Arsenal, which normally could be a lateral step and at worst, a minor downgrade. Losing Juve + Ronaldo in a single blow doesn't have a lateral step in Italy for Adidas, every other club is a downgrade, and no other player in the world would sell more shirts than Ronaldo this year. There's already millions of people in the world with a PSG shirt and Neymar or Messi and Barcelona, I doubt there's a more than a dozen of "Ronaldo 7, Juventus".

Yes, Ronaldo being there will obviously increase the numbers not only when he’s there... It’s not a move to increase their revenue for 4 years, it’s a move to get to the level of revenue United, Madrid and Barca get but that won’t happen in 4 years. They negotiate the deals according to who is currently at the club too, not at who they think it’s going to be 2 years later. It’s not just about how many shirts he’ll sell, it’s about the impact he’ll have on Juve’s brand.

You’re believing in the most stupid and out of character decision in football history if you believe what you’re saying.

Mr Mendes: Hey Juve, i know you’re the most cautious club in the world when it comes to transfers but you want to sign a 33 year old Ronaldo until he’s 37 for a grand total of 400 million euros when he has no re-sale value, won’t significantly improve your revenue and you can have a better use of that money by spending it in a thousand different ways?

Mr Juventus: Sure, yolo.

It’s impossible to believe in this scenario over the one being reported by every single source on the subject.

 

[André Dominguez]

Kudos to Ronaldo to keep playing at the highest level. If the chinese offer I heard is true, I'm sure 99% of the football players would have accepted.

 

[christinaa]

Unfortunately he 'used' us every year and now goes to Juventus.

Sad.

 

[Judas]

Absolutely done us good and proper.

 

[buchansleftleg]

Is this actually likely to happen or is it like a feuding couple where one person threatens to look for a new flat - they part ways for 3 days and then are back together?