Cristiano Ronaldo - Much Ado About Al Nassr

Portugal has excellent players and teams, Norway not so much. That’s not a good comparison.

The fact is Messi won and had a great WC. Ronaldo didn’t. That’s what stays in the history books.
 
SportingCP96 said:
Ronaldo and Messi arguably have both reached the highest individual peak ever in the sport.

You talk about the World Cup without any context. Portugal have only made it past the R16 3x in their whole history. Two of them….with Ronaldo…go figure.

It’s very different expecting a country that won nothing before Ronaldo to then become a World Cup favorite playing a majority of your career with the likes of Hugo Almeida and Postiga. Argentina won many trophies before messi and they will win many after, they are a county which huge history in these tournaments and always a favorite.

That would be like criticizing Haaland for not performing at the Euros or World Cup with Norway and sayinf Mbappe is better because he has a World Cup with France. It’s not even remotely a fair comparison.
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Interms of goals scored per season perhaps theirs is amongst the highest peak. But, Gerd Muller in the past, Haaland currently and maybe Mbappe if he moves to Real can match those tallies. R9 at Barcelona had similar numbers. When I say that his highest level was below the players I mentioned, it was about the overall influence on their teams. They possessed extraordinary ability so much so that even without being top scorers, it was always obvious that they were the best in their team and in the world.

As far as the world cup is concerned, I wasn't even referring to winning it. Rather, it's about the fact that his own individual performances have been forgettable (except for the game vs Spain) and the fact that he has had 0 influence on any match in the knock outs. That is a black mark.
 
antk said:
Comparing Portugal's football pedigree with Norway is quite the reach for a portuguese poster.
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Definition of fanboyism. Puts the player before his country. The guy disappeared after the world cup and reappears after Ronaldo scores for Al Nassr.
 
mshnsh said:
Definition of fanboyism. Puts the player before his country. The guy disappeared after the world cup and reappears after Ronaldo scores for Al Nassr.
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I’ve been active in other spaces in the forum. I got tired of this debate. Hence I’m not even engaging in anymore of if it. It’s exhausting.

Once again never put a player above a country but I guess lts easier to do straw man arguments as opposed to reading.

But anyways he scored a nice goal today, you should go take a look.

New league season starts next weekend of your interested.
 
Black Adder said:
That's what you get when fighting losing battle.
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Not necessarily. I don’t care if someone thinks Messi is better. It’s a fair argument to be had.

Just some of the comments and debates and thought processes was beyond ignorant so I just lost complete interest in constantly going back and forth. I’m sure some people feel the same about me so that’s fine too.

Like I stated above Ronaldo and Messi are now close to retirement, im just enjoying watching the two greatest players I ever saw.
 
SportingCP96 said:
Once again, “in your opinion” ;)
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It’s pretty much the universal opinion now though which I think is what really eats away at people now. Even Cal? realised it was over and conceded, and here I always thought he was the one who’d argue black is white and left is right until his final breath:D
 
Kinda funny how the only time period Juve didn’t do their pre season in USA is between 2018-2020
The same thing for man united
 
SportingCP96 said:
If he can score 30 this year it’s possible. Would be an insane milestone, how many does he have now? I genuinely lost count
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Think he is on 840 now. If he add a few more for Portugal, and score 25+ per season at Saudi over next 2 seasons, he could reach that 900 milestone. I think he is pretty much on course.
 
Rockets Redglare said:
An extra 60 goals or whatever in that league adds nothing to his legacy, he should’ve retired at the top level.
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Just another milestone no one ever reached. He is near on retirement anyway so maybe that could be his one last motivation there before his career comes to an end.
 
The year is 2070. The world in is disarray. Only road warriors fight to keep justice in a planet ravaged by climate change. Red Star Riyad dedicates its historic 10th UEFA Champion's League victory to the immortal work of Marx and Engels and international proletariat. On the super internet, debate rages as Lionel Messi had 1 assist in a game against his grandchildren & extended family while C.Ronaldo scored a double in a 15mn session at his pension home. The Portuguese stands at 20875 goals and 12606 assists including among others ranked FIFA games, Subbuteo conventions in Macau, promotional appearances and crumpled paper balls thrown into the bin. He's closing in on Messi that just was selected by NASA to score the first goal on Mars. Someone writes in the Caf' thread the following message "A small step for a small man but a pointless one for humanity". The server automatically adds, as always [This post is the user's opinion, in his opinion].
 
SportingCP96 said:
Ronaldo and Messi arguably have both reached the highest individual peak ever in the sport.

You talk about the World Cup without any context. Portugal have only made it past the R16 3x in their whole history. Two of them….with Ronaldo…go figure.

It’s very different expecting a country that won nothing before Ronaldo to then become a World Cup favorite playing a majority of your career with the likes of Hugo Almeida and Postiga. Argentina won many trophies before messi and they will win many after, they are a county which huge history in these tournaments and always a favorite.

That would be like criticizing Haaland for not performing at the Euros or World Cup with Norway and sayinf Mbappe is better because he has a World Cup with France. It’s not even remotely a fair comparison.
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Mbappe is better player than Haaland.

The day he moves out of Ligue 1, and does 60% of what he does in France, it will just become official for everybody. Mbappe can create his own chances, Haaland needs to be assisted, if his team is playing bad, he becomes invisible.
 
FrankFoot said:
Mbappe is better player than Haaland.

The day he moves out of Ligue 1, and does 60% of what he does in France, it will just become official for everybody. Mbappe can create his own chances, Haaland needs to be assisted, if his team is playing bad, he becomes invisible.
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I actually agree with you. I do think Mbappe is better as well.

My point is that using national team successes to judge them is absolutely obscene given the clear advantage Mbappe has due to his fortune of being born French and not norweigen.
 
SportingCP96 said:
I am not. Your mis reading.

I said…saying Ronaldo failed at winning a World Cup for Portugal while Messi played for Argentina is like or comparable to using Mbappe World Cup win as a metric to separate him from Haaland who plays for Norway and won’t ever have a chance to compete for a major international trophy.

Argentina have 10+ major international trophies.
Portugal have …1.

That’s the difference in gulf and class between these two counties. The 1 Portugal win was with Ronaldo. 2/3 WC appearances past the R16 was with Ronaldo.

Argentina won the World Cup…just like they did 2x before and just like they will after….

So no I am not comparing Norway to Portugal I am Comparing the metrics of which people are using World Cup or international trophy as a metric of who was or is a better player.

If Ronaldo was Brazilian and failed to win a World Cup. NOW you DO have a justifiable comparison or judgment.
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I think you belittle your own team a little bit here. Portugal might not have been great historically and their teams since 2004 may or may not have been better than Argentina's but they still had many excellent players over the years of Cristiano's career.

And in the end it isn't even about the title alone but Cristiano's performances. He simply wasn't very good at most international tournaments he played.
 
Surely he's regretting it a bit at this stage? ....(not the obscene amounts of money hes getting of course)..

By regret, i mean the choice to move to Saudi, not the way he left Utd.. (i think his ego is way too big to regret that)

You can see in some games the frustration is boiling over, maybe a mixture of him not being able to do what he once could, and the pretty sh*t standard around him on the pitch.

He could have lowered his wages and finished off the last couple years at Sporting or a similar level european team. Would have been great ending to his career.

Saudi might have brought in a wealth of decent players this window, (which will surely raise the level a bit), but overall its a still pretty pretty low standard.
 
EireRed_GS said:
Surely he's regretting it a bit at this stage? ....(not the obscene amounts of money hes getting of course)..

By regret, i mean the choice to move to Saudi, not the way he left Utd.. (i think his ego is way too big to regret that)

You can see in some games the frustration is boiling over, maybe a mixture of him not being able to do what he once could, and the pretty sh*t standard around him on the pitch.

He could have lowered his wages and finished off the last couple years at Sporting or a similar level european team. Would have been great ending to his career.

Saudi might have brought in a wealth of decent players this window, (which will surely raise the level a bit), but overall its a still pretty pretty low standard.
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He's no longer good enough for even Sporting honestly.

His decline was simply monumental. The Saudi League is perfect for him.
 
SportingCP96 said:
I actually agree with you. I do think Mbappe is better as well.

My point is that using national team successes to judge them is absolutely obscene given the clear advantage Mbappe has due to his fortune of being born French and not norweigen.
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Mbappe is the more talented and exciting player but I have little doubt Haaland for France would score a ridiculous amount of goals. More than anyone else.

Could argue the same for Messi too tbh. Imagine him in that French team. Would be next level for assists especially.
 
Eddy_JukeZ said:
He's no longer good enough for even Sporting honestly.

His decline was simply monumental. The Saudi League is perfect for him.
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sadly I think you could be right.. I couldnt get over how behind the pace/out of sorts he looked at times in the PL towards the end
 
Eddy_JukeZ said:
He's no longer good enough for even Sporting honestly.

His decline was simply monumental. The Saudi League is perfect for him.
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I don't know about that. You would need to build a team around him and place him in a tactical setup in which he can be the target man without many defensive duties. His finishing and movement is still elite I'd say, he just knows how to score. Obviously no top club will be willing to do so, it's even questionable if it makes sense to sacrifice compactness for a star player like Mbappe these days, but in a smaller team and a weaker league I imagine this could work. And while that may not be the best way tongo for that particular team in terms of conpetitiveness, two or three years of CR7 could sky rocket their revenues.

And then there's always the possibility of being an impact sub if your fitness isn't enough to keep going for 90 minutes.

It's not his decline but his ego that prevented such scenarios.
 
Zehner said:
I don't know about that. You would need to build a team around him and place him in a tactical setup in which he can be the target man without many defensive duties. His finishing and movement is still elite I'd say, he just knows how to score. Obviously no top club will be willing to do so, it's even questionable if it makes sense to sacrifice compactness for a star player like Mbappe these days, but in a smaller team and a weaker league I imagine this could work. And while that may not be the best way tongo for that particular team in terms of conpetitiveness, two or three years of CR7 could sky rocket their revenues.

And then there's always the possibility of being an impact sub if your fitness isn't enough to keep going for 90 minutes.

It's not his decline but his ego that prevented such scenarios.
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It was his ego refusing to recognise or acknowledge his decline was the problem.

That same ego refuses to be an impact sub, as that would be belittling to him.

As for building a team around him, yes that would work for a much smaller lower level team. But any team above a certain level is never going to change their plans or style, and sacrifice the roles and impact of other players just to accomodate him up front (not at the level hes performing at these days.). Ole done it and it contributed to him losing his job. Rangnick tried to change it and got no response from the players, EtH was having none of that. "Your a squad player now." The fact Ronaldo seen that disrespect rather than assessing his own levels, shows he'll prob settle for nothing less than being the main man until he calls it a day.

If he does decide to leave Saudi, will be interesting who would take him (willing to make him the main man), and who he would want expect to go to
 
EireRed_GS said:
It was his ego refusing to recognise or acknowledge his decline was the problem.

That same ego refuses to be an impact sub, as that would be belittling to him.

As for building a team around him, yes that would work for a much smaller lower level team. But any team above a certain level is never going to change their plans or style, and sacrifice the roles and impact of other players just to accomodate him up front (not at the level hes performing at these days.). Ole done it and it contributed to him losing his job. Rangnick tried to change it and got no response from the players, EtH was having none of that. "Your a squad player now." The fact Ronaldo seen that disrespect rather than assessing his own levels, shows he'll prob settle for nothing less than being the main man until he calls it a day.

If he does decide to leave Saudi, will be interesting who would take him (willing to make him the main man), and who he would want expect to go to
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Agree with that. It's questionable if building your team even around one of the best players in the world like Mbappe pays off in comparison to a more balanced team in which everybody works hard off the ball so no elite team will do so for a declined CR7.

But it can work in a) underdog teams and b) teams that dominate their leagues clearly. I could imagine that Sporting for instance could qualify for the UCL by building a system eith Cristiano as the star player who barely works against the ball. They could also do without him, obviously, so the rarionale behind that would rather be of economic nature but it could worl in principal.

Usually, what signals the end of a top players career are ever more frequent injuries. Cristiano so far has managed to stay fit abd I guess as long as that is the case, he's generally good enough to play in Europe.
 
matherto said:
Given the rate Messi is scoring for Inter Miami at, I think Cristiano might be second to it.
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Who knows, maybe they could both reach it. Currently Ronaldo is on 840, Messi on 812. They have 2 years and 2.5 years left in their contract. It’s hard to say now but there are chances they could both retire after their contract ends.
 
EireRed_GS said:
Surely he's regretting it a bit at this stage? ....(not the obscene amounts of money hes getting of course)..

By regret, i mean the choice to move to Saudi, not the way he left Utd.. (i think his ego is way too big to regret that)

You can see in some games the frustration is boiling over, maybe a mixture of him not being able to do what he once could, and the pretty sh*t standard around him on the pitch.

He could have lowered his wages and finished off the last couple years at Sporting or a similar level european team. Would have been great ending to his career.

Saudi might have brought in a wealth of decent players this window, (which will surely raise the level a bit), but overall its a still pretty pretty low standard.
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Don’t think he will regret playing in Saudi instead of Portugal league. Make no mistake it’s a retirement league, but he will be doubling his wealth there, plus playing alongside some “top class” players for headlines in the next coming 2 seasons.

But I do think he will regret leaving us too soon. Should have stay until end of last season.
 
SportingCP96 said:
It’s very different expecting a country that won nothing before Ronaldo to then become a World Cup favorite
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its always funny to see cristiano fans trying to make it like if he was the main reason why Portugal won the euro while his controbution to it wasn't that big in fact they beat france the host in the final WITHOUT him ...

was he the top scorer ? no
was he ever the best player in any tournament portugal played in ? no

in world of stats ... goals stats yeah Cristiano is one of the best goalscorer

other than that you can never put his name in top 10 all time

Messi
Maradona
Pele
R9
Zidane
Cruyeff
Ronaldinho
Baggio
Rivaldo
Best /Henry


if we talking about overall performance / talent ..... cristiano is a top 5 between 06 to 2015 other than it's only a delusional .... btw facts isn't hate
 
tariqo said:
its always funny to see cristiano fans trying to make it like if he was the main reason why Portugal won the euro while his controbution to it wasn't that big in fact they beat france the host in the final WITHOUT him ...

was he the top scorer ? no
was he ever the best player in any tournament portugal played in ? no

in world of stats ... goals stats yeah Cristiano is one of the best goalscorer

other than that you can never put his name in top 10 all time

Messi
Maradona
Pele
R9
Zidane
Cruyeff
Ronaldinho
Baggio
Rivaldo
Best /Henry


if we talking about overall performance / talent ..... cristiano is a top 5 between 06 to 2015 other than it's only a delusional .... btw facts isn't hate
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You can't seriously think Baggio and Henry are better? Or Rivaldo. Zidane was a midfielder so hard to compare.
 
tariqo said:
its always funny to see cristiano fans trying to make it like if he was the main reason why Portugal won the euro while his controbution to it wasn't that big in fact they beat france the host in the final WITHOUT him ...

was he the top scorer ? no
was he ever the best player in any tournament portugal played in ? no

in world of stats ... goals stats yeah Cristiano is one of the best goalscorer

other than that you can never put his name in top 10 all time

Messi
Maradona
Pele
R9
Zidane
Cruyeff
Ronaldinho
Baggio
Rivaldo
Best /Henry


if we talking about overall performance / talent ..... cristiano is a top 5 between 06 to 2015 other than it's only a delusional .... btw facts isn't hate
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Comments like this make my point on why I started to stay away. Pure ignorance.

Only one guy has ever won more than 5 Balon D or and it’s messi. Everyone else on that list is so far behind it’s not even funny. Ronaldo with his head and weak foot alone has as many career goals as anyone on that list. He owns almost every single record there is to own (along with Messi). In terms of the CL he has dominated that completions better than anyone ever and none have come remotely close including messi in this case.

Three Peat winner, 5 total wins, top scorer ever, top assister ever (Di Maria will take that soon) in the KO rounds of the most difficult competition in the world he has double the goals of the second guy behind him. In the semi finals he has double the goals and overall he has more big moments then I can remember.

His peak level of performance was only matched and at some points bested by Lionel Messi. Like you just said…this is facts.

yet you want to ignorantly say that for example….Thierry Henry was better ? :lol:

Not only is it idiotic to say but it’s downright disrespectful to one of the greatest to ever play this game. If you make a poll discussing who the 4 greatest players ever are OR if you just type the question on any search bar you will find an overwhelming majority have 4 consistent names there: Ronaldo,Messi, Maradona, and Pele.

Respond if you would like but I am not going to continue to entertain this and it’s the only reply I’m giving you.

“Not even top 10” :lol: This is exactly why I’ve been enjoying other spaces in the forum more then these stupid debates.
 
EireRed_GS said:
Surely he's regretting it a bit at this stage? ....(not the obscene amounts of money hes getting of course)..

By regret, i mean the choice to move to Saudi, not the way he left Utd.. (i think his ego is way too big to regret that)

You can see in some games the frustration is boiling over, maybe a mixture of him not being able to do what he once could, and the pretty sh*t standard around him on the pitch.

He could have lowered his wages and finished off the last couple years at Sporting or a similar level european team. Would have been great ending to his career.

Saudi might have brought in a wealth of decent players this window, (which will surely raise the level a bit), but overall its a still pretty pretty low standard.
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I actually disagree, this is the happiest and most loose I’ve seen him on the pitch since before he lost his child. I think he genuinely enjoys it over there at the moment. He gets the limelight and can still make a difference in that league at a consistent level.
 
Eddy_JukeZ said:
He's no longer good enough for even Sporting honestly.

His decline was simply monumental. The Saudi League is perfect for him.
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He’s more than good enough for Sporting. Paulinho was out starting striker for 2 seasons and he’s worse then half the guys in the Saudi league.

Ronaldo clearly declined I think we can all agree on that but I think it’s more than evident he is not as bad as he played in those last few months in Manchester. I think it’s very evident he was not in the right headspace at all. You can see it in his body language and mind, I have zero doubt much if it had to do with the loss off his child and then almost loss of another and then a string of bad performances through him over.

Ronaldo clearly is still and was still able to play an impact for United even If it meant in a a different role. As another poster pointed out it was his ego more than his actual ability that let him down. At 38 his athletics ability is still there and his finishing and positioning In the box is fantastic. Even for Portugal he has 5 goals and is the second top scorer in qualifying.

Regardless we are passed that stage now, I wish he would have left United at the end of the season as opposed to the middle but you can just see mentally as well as physically on the pitch it was not the same Ronaldo those months. He was in a dark place.
 
Gehrman said:
You can't seriously think Baggio and Henry are better? Or Rivaldo. Zidane was a midfielder so hard to compare.
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When even you and I can agree on this you know it was a horrendous comment :lol:

You and me have debated an insatiable amount of times and even here we can agree.
 
tariqo said:
its always funny to see cristiano fans trying to make it like if he was the main reason why Portugal won the euro while his controbution to it wasn't that big in fact they beat france the host in the final WITHOUT him ...

was he the top scorer ? no
was he ever the best player in any tournament portugal played in ? no

in world of stats ... goals stats yeah Cristiano is one of the best goalscorer

other than that you can never put his name in top 10 all time

Messi
Maradona
Pele
R9
Zidane
Cruyeff
Ronaldinho
Baggio
Rivaldo
Best /Henry


if we talking about overall performance / talent ..... cristiano is a top 5 between 06 to 2015 other than it's only a delusional .... btw facts isn't hate
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Im not his biggest fan these days after his behaviour at the end of that 2nd Utd stint... but by christ thats an awful take there..

He's easily in the top 10, prob the top 5, or even 3.

For about 10 years, if it wasnt for the phenomenon that is Messi, CR7 would have won the Ballon D'or every year.
 
RedRonaldo said:
Who knows, maybe they could both reach it. Currently Ronaldo is on 840, Messi on 812. They have 2 years and 2.5 years left in their contract. It’s hard to say now but there are chances they could both retire after their contract ends.
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I'm very very sure that the record or milestone plays on Ronaldo's (and his fans') mind whereas Messi may not even given it a thought at this time.
 
SportingCP96 said:
When even you and I can agree on this you know it was a horrendous comment :lol:

You and me have debated an insatiable amount of times and even here we can agree.
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I've always been complimented as the objective fanboy.
 
EireRed_GS said:
Im not his biggest fan these days after his behaviour at the end of that 2nd Utd stint... but by christ thats an awful take there..

He's easily in the top 10, prob the top 5, or even 3.

For about 10 years, if it wasnt for the phenomenon that is Messi, CR7 would have won the Ballon D'or every year.
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Thank you. It was an absurd comment.

I mean let’s just use logic here…. For the better part of 15+ years Ronaldo and Messi have literally shared the stage atop of world football and have won 12 Balon D or between them. Even if you think Messi is the best (which is fine) Ronaldo won 5 Balon D or in the the same time messi was in his prime.

So if this guy literally was head to head and shoulder to shoulder with Messi (at one point it was 5-5 in Balon d or) then how on earth is one top 4 and the other “outside of top 10”.

Defies logic and makes zero sense because it’s very easy to put this equation I guess you can say together.

If these guys were neck to neck competing with each other all of their careers but one is outside top 10 and the other is top 5 then we only have 2 options,

Either Messi is outside of top 10 as well or Ronaldo is all the way up top next to his little pal.

Which one makes more sense ?

I swear people defy the use of logic and reason due to petty hate. Beyond ignorant.
 
EireRed_GS said:
Surely he's regretting it a bit at this stage? ....(not the obscene amounts of money hes getting of course)..

By regret, i mean the choice to move to Saudi, not the way he left Utd.. (i think his ego is way too big to regret that)

You can see in some games the frustration is boiling over, maybe a mixture of him not being able to do what he once could, and the pretty sh*t standard around him on the pitch.

He could have lowered his wages and finished off the last couple years at Sporting or a similar level european team. Would have been great ending to his career.

Saudi might have brought in a wealth of decent players this window, (which will surely raise the level a bit), but overall its a still pretty pretty low standard.
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Ronaldo loves three things; himself, his stats, and attention. I agree he’s probably regretting this. His self love remains undiminished, but the stats he racks up there count for nothing because no one takes them seriously, and since he’s gone out there, no one cares about what he does except his most ardent fans, and those who feed off the schadenfreude of watching him be shit. In terms of “playing retirements”, Messi has gone to MLS and it’s made waves around the world in terms of the type of interest it has garnered, because he’s gone to a celebrity culture, with better marketing and more widespread coverage. And I’m sure that grates like nothing else. Plus, with all these other players going to Saudi, players who are currently better than Ronaldo, I’m sure his exploits there will be over shadowed anyway. Not that they’ve been particularly great anyway. Wasn’t he outscored last season by a player no one had ever heard of?
 
tariqo said:
its always funny to see cristiano fans trying to make it like if he was the main reason why Portugal won the euro while his controbution to it wasn't that big in fact they beat france the host in the final WITHOUT him ...

was he the top scorer ? no
was he ever the best player in any tournament portugal played in ? no

in world of stats ... goals stats yeah Cristiano is one of the best goalscorer

other than that you can never put his name in top 10 all time

Messi
Maradona
Pele
R9
Zidane
Cruyeff
Ronaldinho
Baggio
Rivaldo
Best /Henry


if we talking about overall performance / talent ..... cristiano is a top 5 between 06 to 2015 other than it's only a delusional .... btw facts isn't hate
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I am not a CR7 fans but he has to be among top 5, may be even top 3. Baggio and Rivaldo ahead of CR7? Come on! I won't even put Henry above CR7.
 
Not even in Portugal there’s a consensus Ronaldo is the goat.

He was out best player ever, no doubt, but it’s time for him to f*ck off the national team already, enough is enough.

He is a proper bellend but he certainly was better than Baggio or Henry, what the hell?!
 
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