Music Commercial Hip Hop Thread

I'm busy as hell nowadays and barely get to post on this specific thread but I just had to come in here to say that I'm one of the last people on gods green earth who would class themselves as a drake fan. I absolutely loved 'Take Care' for real but overall certain things made me dislike him. I was urging someone to body him which has happened now by Push (he was the only one capable imo) despite all this I can't stop listening to 'Duppy' it's probably my favourite Drake track and one of the best diss tracks in the past decade i don't care. I'm perfectly aware he has been bodied but the beat on this track is 9.5/10. @vi1lain you are a refcafe legend for spreading truth on certain subjects btw keep doing your thing :).
 
I would have preferred not to hear kanyes voice on this EP
Only track I had to press skip was everything
It was the best release out of ye ksg and Daytona
But tbh I would have preferred a premo large professor album

Full Disclosure I to am a Nas stan
 
I honestly don't think Nas' flow is as good as it should be in parts. I love all Kanyes production so far. Enjoyed all 4. I've liked KSG and Daytona the most
 
The Nas album is okay. I don't get why he doesn't rap much on it, though. Most of the album seems to be other people singing, which is a little disappointing. "Adam & Eve" and "everything" are the best songs for me.
 
Nas album was disappointing. Didn't feel 'Nas' enough. He's got the ability to make classics still which is why it's a bit frustrating.

Daytona is the best to come out of the Kanye 7 track album spell. That one was undeniably a Pusha album and him doing what he does best. The Nas album felt more Kanye than Nas really.
 
Oga on top. said:
I'm busy as hell nowadays and barely get to post on this specific thread but I just had to come in here to say that I'm one of the last people on gods green earth who would class themselves as a drake fan. I absolutely loved 'Take Care' for real but overall certain things made me dislike him. I was urging someone to body him which has happened now by Push (he was the only one capable imo) despite all this I can't stop listening to 'Duppy' it's probably my favourite Drake track and one of the best diss tracks in the past decade i don't care. I'm perfectly aware he has been bodied but the beat on this track is 9.5/10. @vi1lain you are a refcafe legend for spreading truth on certain subjects btw keep doing your thing :).
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Aw this was lovely, thank you so much!
I try to say my piece on subjects even when they aren't popular ;)
 
Given up on Nas few albums ago but this Nasir is actually quite good.

Wrong thread but WestsideGunn will drop "Chris Benoit" album on Friday. Got really high hopes for it.
 
vi1lain said:
What’s 15%? The amount of people who agree that drake isn’t a popstar?
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yes, One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Chris brown raps occasionally should we call him a rapper too?
 
Muffled funk said:
yes, One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Chris brown raps occasionally should we call him a rapper too?
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Sigh.

Drake's singles are usually popstar-ish (not all, but a large amount)

Drake's albums are majority rapping, he just happens to sing the hook - that doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's a hugely popular/commercial rapper, doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's corny & doesn't fit into the stereotypical 'mould' of what a rapper is/should be doesn't make him a pop star.

Just because a large amount of people in this thread seemingly don't like Drake or his music, and therefore share the view that he's a pop star, doesn't make him a pop star either.
There's no 2 ways about that.

He raps much more regularly than he sings, by a considerable amount going by my estimation
Would you like to do a breakdown of all his albums by track listing and we can see where he sings versus where he raps?
 
vi1lain said:
Sigh.

Drake's singles are usually popstar-ish (not all, but a large amount)

Drake's albums are majority rapping, he just happens to sing the hook - that doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's a hugely popular/commercial rapper, doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's corny & doesn't fit into the stereotypical 'mould' of what a rapper is/should be doesn't make him a pop star.

Just because a large amount of people in this thread seemingly don't like Drake or his music, and therefore share the view that he's a pop star, doesn't make him a pop star either.
There's no 2 ways about that.

He raps much more regularly than he sings, by a considerable amount going by my estimation
Would you like to do a breakdown of all his albums by track listing and we can see where he sings versus where he raps?
Click to expand...


Half the time he doesn't actually rap? He is not trying to be lyrical, articulate, complex etc.And that's fine, just don't compare it to hip hop because it's not.We like to put people in boxes when it comes to music, and this guy clearly wants to seperate himself and operate outside the box.
 
Muffled funk said:
Half the time he doesn't actually rap? He is not trying to be lyrical, articulate, complex etc.And that's fine, just don't compare it to hip hop because it's not.We like to put people in boxes when it comes to music, and this guy clearly wants to seperate himself and operate outside the box.
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"Half the time" is completely inaccurate, he does rap, much more than half the time.
You're probably more used to hearing his most popular songs where he doesn't always rap, which is fair - if you're not a fan I don't expect you to.
That doesn't mean that "half the time" he doesn't rap, he does.

He is lyrical, articulate and he does have the ability to be complex too and he is hip hop. No he's not Nas or Kendrick or even Joey Bada$$ when it comes to the lyrical complexity he chooses to use within his rhymes, but that doesn't mean he isn't witty, or lyrical or his words don't have depth.
In words of Jay-Z "'Cuz you don't understand him, it don't mean he that nice, it just means you don't understand all the bullshit that he write"

This preconceived notion that "hip hop" has to be put in a box is completely outdated, and for what it's worth completely undermines the essence of what hip-hop is.
Hip-hop has evolved through time, by innovators over the years who did operate outside the box, hip-hop was created because the likes of Grandmaster Flash dared to think outside the box (i'm in no way calling Drake an innovator or comparing him to any of the legends before someone has a heart attack) the point remains that hip-hop has continued to dominate the entire musical genre because the artists aren't scared to stay in their box.

So I really don't understand what it is you're trying to say.

Just say you don't like Drake and don't credit him as a "real" rapper in your eyes - that I would respect 100%, but making sweeping statements is disingenuous and it's completely false to imply that he's not worthy of being called a hip-hop star.

You're the one who was calling him bitch made this and bitch made that the other week weren't you?
 
Anyway - has anybody heard the dual Beyonce & Jay-Z (The Carter's) album yet?

It's only on Tidal for now, i'm sure it'll stream elsewhere.

I was at the London show when they announced it, and everybody lost it, I saw grown men jumping up and down in elation :lol:

Album is very good though, this summer is shaping up to be one of the greatest in modern hip hop.
 
vi1lain said:
"Half the time" is completely inaccurate, he does rap, much more than half the time.
You're probably more used to hearing his most popular songs where he doesn't always rap, which is fair - if you're not a fan I don't expect you to.
That doesn't mean that "half the time" he doesn't rap, he does.

He is lyrical, articulate and he does have the ability to be complex too and he is hip hop. No he's not Nas or Kendrick or even Joey Bada$$ when it comes to the lyrical complexity he chooses to use within his rhymes, but that doesn't mean he isn't witty, or lyrical or his words don't have depth.
In words of Jay-Z "'Cuz you don't understand him, it don't mean he that nice, it just means you don't understand all the bullshit that he write"

This preconceived notion that "hip hop" has to be put in a box is completely outdated, and for what it's worth completely undermines the essence of what hip-hop is.
Hip-hop has evolved through time, by innovators over the years who did operate outside the box, hip-hop was created because the likes of Grandmaster Flash dared to think outside the box (i'm in no way calling Drake an innovator or comparing him to any of the legends before someone has a heart attack) the point remains that hip-hop has continued to dominate the entire musical genre because the artists aren't scared to stay in their box.

So I really don't understand what it is you're trying to say.

Just say you don't like Drake and don't credit him as a "real" rapper in your eyes - that I would respect 100%, but making sweeping statements is disingenuous and it's completely false to imply that he's not worthy of being called a hip-hop star.

You're the one who was calling him bitch made this and bitch made that the other week weren't you?
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We have to be prescriptive about hip hop don't we? Otherwise how can we discern it from urban music in general? You're talking about your definition of hip hop that's fine, giving the voice to the voiceless sure - but punk did the same, so did blues, jazz, country, metal etc. One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Beyoncé and Erykah badu have 2 completely different styles that fall under r&b, one is more modern contemporary the other is more mellow, neo-soul but the subject matters are similar right? But if we tried to compare Beyoncé, Rihanna & Keyshia Cole to Lauryn Hill, Erykah & Sade, it wouldn't make much sense would it? I said in an earlier post I have no issue with them being labelled as rappers, but I think its under a different sub genre of rap.
 
Muffled funk said:
We have to be prescriptive about hip hop don't we? Otherwise how can we discern it from urban music in general? You're talking about your definition of hip hop that's fine, giving the voice to the voiceless sure - but punk did the same, so did blues, jazz, country, metal etc. One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Beyoncé and Erykah badu have 2 completely different styles that fall under r&b, one is more modern contemporary the other is more mellow, neo-soul but the subject matters are similar right? But if we tried to compare Beyoncé, Rihanna & Keyshia Cole to Lauryn Hill, Erykah & Sade, it wouldn't make much sense would it? I said in an earlier post I have no issue with them being labelled as rappers, but I think its under a different sub genre of rap.
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He does rap regularly. That's the point, so I don't understand what you're trying to suggest.

Yes there are different "sounds" in hip-hop, Jay-Z sounds completely different to Migos, who sound different to Scarface, who sounds different to ODB.
But they are all hip-hop right? So is Drake.

Just because he can sing, and he chooses to sing doesn't mean that most of his songs aren't of him rapping.

There's nothing to debate.
 
vi1lain said:
He does rap regularly. That's the point, so I don't understand what you're trying to suggest.

Yes there are different "sounds" in hip-hop, Jay-Z sounds completely different to Migos, who sound different to Scarface, who sounds different to ODB.
But they are all hip-hop right? So is Drake.

Just because he can sing, and he chooses to sing doesn't mean that most of his songs aren't of him rapping.

There's nothing to debate.
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Migos are probably among the best out of the new wave of 'rappers'. I personally only have an issue with them being labelled rappers, it's urban music but would I call it hip-hop? Nope. A sub-genre of rap, sure.
 
Muffled funk said:
Migos are probably among the best out of the new wave of 'rappers'. I personally only have an issue with them being labelled rappers, it's urban music but would I call it hip-hop? Nope. A sub-genre of rap, sure.
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Which is fair, you're entitled to your opinion and I wouldn't suggest otherwise.

I would agree in the sense that they aren't stereotypical hip hop, 100% but they are rappers, however unconventional they are.

And I think that's where we can agree to disagree :)
 
vi1lain said:
And I think that's where we can agree to disagree :)
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well you certainly can

Muffled funk said:
yes, One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Chris brown raps occasionally should we call him a rapper too?
Click to expand...
vi1lain said:
One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper?
Chris brown raps occasionally should we call him a rapper too?
Click to expand...


vi1lain said:
Sigh.

Drake's singles are usually popstar-ish (not all, but a large amount)

Drake's albums are majority rapping, he just happens to sing the hook - that doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's a hugely popular/commercial rapper, doesn't make him a pop star.
Just because he's corny & doesn't fit into the stereotypical 'mould' of what a rapper is/should be doesn't make him a pop star.

Just because a large amount of people in this thread seemingly don't like Drake or his music, and therefore share the view that he's a pop star, doesn't make him a pop star either.
There's no 2 ways about that.

He raps much more regularly than he sings, by a considerable amount going by my estimation
Would you like to do a breakdown of all his albums by track listing and we can see where he sings versus where he raps?
Click to expand...


Muffled funk said:
Half the time he doesn't actually rap? He is not trying to be lyrical, articulate, complex etc.And that's fine, just don't compare it to hip hop because it's not.We like to put people in boxes when it comes to music, and this guy clearly wants to seperate himself and operate outside the box.
Click to expand...
vi1lain said:
Because half the time they don't actually rap? They're not trying to be lyrical, articulate, complex etc.
And that's fine, just don't compare it to hip hop because it's not.
We like to put people in boxes when it comes to music, and these guys clearly want to seperate themselves and operate outside the box.
Click to expand...


vi1lain said:
"Half the time" is completely inaccurate, he does rap, much more than half the time.
You're probably more used to hearing his most popular songs where he doesn't always rap, which is fair - if you're not a fan I don't expect you to.
That doesn't mean that "half the time" he doesn't rap, he does.

He is lyrical, articulate and he does have the ability to be complex too and he is hip hop. No he's not Nas or Kendrick or even Joey Bada$$ when it comes to the lyrical complexity he chooses to use within his rhymes, but that doesn't mean he isn't witty, or lyrical or his words don't have depth.
In words of Jay-Z "'Cuz you don't understand him, it don't mean he that nice, it just means you don't understand all the bullshit that he write"

This preconceived notion that "hip hop" has to be put in a box is completely outdated, and for what it's worth completely undermines the essence of what hip-hop is.
Hip-hop has evolved through time, by innovators over the years who did operate outside the box, hip-hop was created because the likes of Grandmaster Flash dared to think outside the box (i'm in no way calling Drake an innovator or comparing him to any of the legends before someone has a heart attack) the point remains that hip-hop has continued to dominate the entire musical genre because the artists aren't scared to stay in their box.

So I really don't understand what it is you're trying to say.

Just say you don't like Drake and don't credit him as a "real" rapper in your eyes - that I would respect 100%, but making sweeping statements is disingenuous and it's completely false to imply that he's not worthy of being called a hip-hop star.

You're the one who was calling him bitch made this and bitch made that the other week weren't you?
Click to expand...

Muffled funk said:
We have to be prescriptive about hip hop don't we? Otherwise how can we discern it from urban music in general? You're talking about your definition of hip hop that's fine, giving the voice to the voiceless sure - but punk did the same, so did blues, jazz, country, metal etc. One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper? Beyoncé and Erykah badu have 2 completely different styles that fall under r&b, one is more modern contemporary the other is more mellow, neo-soul but the subject matters are similar right? But if we tried to compare Beyoncé, Rihanna & Keyshia Cole to Lauryn Hill, Erykah & Sade, it wouldn't make much sense would it? I said in an earlier post I have no issue with them being labelled as rappers, but I think its under a different sub genre of rap.
Click to expand...



vi1lain said:
We have to be prescriptive about hip hop don't we? Otherwise how can we discern it from urban music in general?
You're talking about your definition of hip hop that's fine, giving the voice to the voiceless sure - but punk did the same, so did blues, jazz, country, metal etc.
One of the fundamental elements of hip hop is the rapping part, there's no 2 ways about it. If you don't rap regularly why should you be labelled a rapper?
Chris brown raps occasionally should we call him a rapper too?
Beyoncé and Erykah badu have 2 completely different styles that fall under r&b, one is more modern contemporary the other is more mellow, neo-soul but the subject matters are similar right? But if we tried to compare Beyoncé, Rihanna & Keyshia Cole to Lauryn Hill, Erykah & Sade, it wouldn't make much sense would it?
I said in an earlier post I have no issue with them being labelled as rappers, but I think its under a different sub genre of rap.
Click to expand...

vi1lain said:
He does rap regularly. That's the point, so I don't understand what you're trying to suggest.

Yes there are different "sounds" in hip-hop, Jay-Z sounds completely different to Migos, who sound different to Scarface, who sounds different to ODB.
But they are all hip-hop right? So is Drake.

Just because he can sing, and he chooses to sing doesn't mean that most of his songs aren't of him rapping.

There's nothing to debate.
Click to expand...

Muffled funk said:
Migos are probably among the best out of the new wave of 'rappers'. I personally only have an issue with them being labelled rappers, it's urban music but would I call it hip-hop? Nope. A sub-genre of rap, sure.
Click to expand...
vi1lain said:
Migos are probably among the best out of the new wave of 'rappers'.

I personally only have an issue with them being labelled rappers, it's urban music but would I call it hip-hop? Nope. A sub-genre of rap, sure.
Click to expand...
vi1lain said:
I would agree in the sense that they aren't stereotypical hip hop, 100% but they are rappers, however unconventional they are.

And I think that's where we can agree to disagree :)
Click to expand...
 
Muffled funk said:
well you certainly can
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Yeah almost 2 years ago I used to think "mumble rap" was a drain on hip-hop and not worthy of any discussion.

Since then my opinions have changed and i've learned to embrace the wider varieties in hip-hop.

I didn't realise it was a bad thing to evolve your stance over time :confused:
 
I could understand if I said that last month, but December 2016 ffs :lol:

My position has changed, my perspective has broadened & i've embraced the evolution & diversity in hip-hop, what's wrong with that?
 
vi1lain said:
Anyway - has anybody heard the dual Beyonce & Jay-Z (The Carter's) album yet?

It's only on Tidal for now, i'm sure it'll stream elsewhere.

I was at the London show when they announced it, and everybody lost it, I saw grown men jumping up and down in elation :lol:

Album is very good though, this summer is shaping up to be one of the greatest in modern hip hop.
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Did Lemonade ever stream elsewhere?
 
Bubz27 said:
Did Lemonade ever stream elsewhere?
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Hmmm that's a good point I don't think it did, one of Beyonce's lines on the new album is something along the lines of
"if I gave two fecks about streaming numbers, woulda put Lemonade on Spotify"

So maybe it won't stream everywhere else?
It's a good album though, so I might just buy it to have in iTunes anyway.
 
vi1lain said:
Hmmm that's a good point I don't think it did, one of Beyonce's lines on the new album is something along the lines of
"if I gave two fecks about streaming numbers, woulda put Lemonade on Spotify"

So maybe it won't stream everywhere else?
It's a good album though, so I might just buy it to have in iTunes anyway.
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Yeah I might have to download it illegally.

The nerve, the audacity to only put it on Tidal.
 
Bubz27 said:
Yeah I might have to download it illegally.

The nerve, the audacity to only put it on Tidal.
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:lol:

Tidal is pretty good! I decided to keep it, it's really great for discovering new music.
Create a new gmail and get a trial membership.

I daren't say more than that in case someone quotes in 2 years time. :nervous:
 
vi1lain said:
:lol:

Tidal is pretty good! I decided to keep it, it's really great for discovering new music.
Create a new gmail and get a trial membership.

I daren't say more than that in case someone quotes in 2 years time. :nervous:
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Its good indeed. I kept it for two months after it launched but I eventually had to pick between it and Spotify premium which i've used since 2012.
 
Loublaze said:
Its good indeed. I kept it for two months after it launched but I eventually had to pick between it and Spotify premium which i've used since 2012.
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True, I'm paying £20 for both right now but I think i'll get my family on family plans for both so i end up paying ~£15 a month or so which would be ideal.
 
Xxxtentacion has been shot, reports saying he’s been killed, others say severely wounded
 
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