Delighted we didn't end up in the hands of Qatar, very interested to see how this pans out.
Club Sale | It’s done!
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Because once you tell people to stop comparing it to the no longer existent Qatar alternative & talk about the Ratcliffe deal on its merits people start story time.
On its own merits this potential deal is just one big gamble, one where we actually have living proof that the messiah in question hasn’t done particularly well with a smaller club but Paul Mitchell, Not Qatar, United fan & so on.
In my opinion that just confirms they were looking for minority investment all along, for max possible valuation. It makes their personal debt situation more tenable. They're gonna stick around forever.
Wow, some of you guys are so clever. Is this good news then?
But why? I still don’t understand why someone wants to hold onto a debt ridden asset? It makes no sense.
Someone offers me 5 billion cash I take it. But they’d rather just keep a credit card account loaded with debt? Again, why?
He’s made of concrete, concrete stuff
You keep the card. Still pay off your debt from the cards points and bring in £10m from the cards points, then in 5-10 years the card can get sold for x2-3 what it’s worth now.
In principle that's possible, but it's a pretty big leap of faith/hubris to think that , with other sides sharpening their recruitment and player development strategies, in 5 years time, let alone 10, the club is even going to retain much of its global supporter base, let alone regularly qualifying for whatever new iteration of the 'Super' money-spinning CL, making premium broadcasting/immersive viewing sales, attracting 'premium corporate/superfan' stadium experiences or all the other factors that would need to be in place for the club to continue (and accelerate) its growth in value.
Loyalty outside of a historical/regional supporter base, as well as 'brand' attractiveness, are all very contingent - even if mistakes (obvious to people working in the game or engaged supporters) aren't fully 'registered' in the 'price' short-term, - and the decay can be accelerated if the club becomes a further by-word for mismanagement and relative failure.
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That’s exactly how I see it, United will activate his one year extension effectively giving them 2 years left on his contract to 2026. They are looking for a sale for £40-50m he’s homegrown so he’s a saleable asset.
Will he come back and train with the squad in the Summer of 24, probably?
Will he ever play for united again, highly unlikely unless they play all the video and the context changes and she comes out and says something. This is highly unlikely but activating a 1 year extension. Or even signing a new 3-4 year contract where he’s constantly loaned out for he next two seasons before he’s sold for the optimum price is good business, selling. Greenwood for £40-50m offers a huge increase in our transfer budget under new FSP constraints where only 70% of revenue can be spent on transfers, agent and wages.
Big week next week as we transition from overwhelming majority glazer ownership with full control over the board, to overwhelming majority glazer ownership with virtually full control over the board. Excited to see how this shakes things up.
If Ratcliffe doesn't have a route to full ownership then nothing will change thus there is nothing for me to care about.
I feel like the only people that are super excited about the recent developments are the Glazers. They're getting a dream deal just when they thought they were completely screwed with spiralling debts, crumbling infrastructure, no dividends, no cash flow, negative growth rate, shocking share price, failing football team and a fanbase that holds them in pure contempt. They surely can't believe their luck, I'm sure, especially now that there's been so much positive INEOS PR for 3-weeks to sell this wonderful new sporting structure to "fix" the team deflecting the attention away from themselves whilst simultaneously selling a quarter of the club for £1.25b and leaving them completely in control. They literally just sold someone a chance to make the them more money in the future with no risk attached.
I'd like to pre-emptively counter the inevitable incoming argument that Ratcliffe wouldn't be investing without guarantees and say that one of the options for the Glazers during this process was no sale and they wouldn't be saying yes to something that doesn't benefit them and only them. There's a world where they have exploited Ratcliffe's pathological desire to win, his emotional attachment to Utd and his own legacy/narcissism. So just prepare yourselves for an outcome that isn't the fairy tails being drip fed on an hour-by-hour basis on the biggest sports deal in history whilst it's under NDA. There is a degree of propaganda - it's clear as day even if some of those details are accurate but prepare yourself for the small print. Glazers are in complete control of the deal and the outcome, if any.
I'd like to pre-emptively counter the inevitable incoming argument that Ratcliffe wouldn't be investing without guarantees and say that one of the options for the Glazers during this process was no sale and they wouldn't be saying yes to something that doesn't benefit them and only them. There's a world where they have exploited Ratcliffe's pathological desire to win, his emotional attachment to Utd and his own legacy/narcissism. So just prepare yourselves for an outcome that isn't the fairy tails being drip fed on an hour-by-hour basis on the biggest sports deal in history whilst it's under NDA. There is a degree of propaganda - it's clear as day even if some of those details are accurate but prepare yourself for the small print. Glazers are in complete control of the deal and the outcome, if any.
Athletic are suggesting todays game was the last under full Glazer ownership
But wouldn’t a 25% stake still be subject to approval and all that boring paperwork shit?
But wouldn’t a 25% stake still be subject to approval and all that boring paperwork shit?
they are only humouring him with control of the football side anyway until they decide to take away. So he can probably crack on while the paperwork goes through
How much of the club will the Glazers actually own once this goes through
Most of the "boring paperwork shit" is probably already out of the way
Dont think any of that has been confirmed, what part Glazer/shareholder purchase
It's like when you are in driving school and the instructor has his own wheel
How being worth almost 30 billion pounds is being poor? Also you have to take into account he has another investing vehicle via his company, aside from his personal networth.
I prefered Qatar, but sir Jim is an upgrade on the Glazers and is wealthier than Abramovich or Sheikh Mansour.
Also as many had said, United is a commercial behemoth, we can compete with the likes of City just by getting our house in order and hiring the right people. Hopefully Jim can accomplish it, but that remains to be seen.
Like all things Glazer - it’s a hoax. A sham.
A mirage of what it implies in name only, much like Manchester United itself.
A ‘sale’, where the exact same owners continue as owners.
A ‘takeover’ that is simply ‘minority investment’ to anyone else.
A front, a simulacrum of the implied phenomenon.
Bingo. Good analogy.
‘Sir Jim’s in control!’. Yes, but the Glazers hold the master wheel, have a master break and most importantly - the Glazers own the fecking car!
I'm not especially sympathetic to SJR, but aside from their currently having control (which itself isn't absolute, considering they have to answer at least in part to major shareholders and keep making the case that they're managing the club for their fiduciary interest more than any option that might become available), from my layman's perspective I think he has three advantages. Firstly. or (a), that of being richer in pure brute monetary terms by a generous ratio, with more assets to cash in for the sake of liquidity if necessary; (b) based on the available evidence, smarter than the 'active' Glazers,; (c) more likely to temporarily 'sink' money for the sake of controlling a club he grew up supporting, rather than simply being fuelled by avarice and hubris (and also because this 'sinking' would still represent a relatively small part of his overall fortune; I'm not saying his sentiment doesn't have limits).
It's not as though they can mysteriously afford a better team of lawyers than he could muster if it came to any wrangling or redrafting of an agreement. If he's clear-eyed , he could turn and win a vote by the board against the Glazers retaining control, acquire a controlling interest, and send them away with an undeserved golden pay-off - or a conversion of what remains into ordinary shares - within a couple of years.
Assuming Ratcliffe buys 25% of the class A and 25% of the class B Shares.
113 million Class B shares equals 28.25m
53 million Class A shares equals 13.25m
Assuming the Glazers own 6.9% of the class A shares which is widely reported and they are selling 25% of their 3.657m which is 914,000. They would own 84.75m class B shares and 2.75m Class A shares.
This equates to 52.7% still a majority with A and B shares.
Sir Jim 25% and the minority share holders would now reduce to 23.3%. This will be the breakdown unless new shares are created for the additional investment that INEOS have agreed.
You have to assume that INEOS and the Glazers have agreed that the 28.25m class B shares also retain their 10 times voting rights and they must have offered $40 which is $1.130 Bn and the class B at $530m total of $1.680 billion which is £1.35 billion subject to Exchange rate.
I have a feeling that any future club investment may result in short term share dilution of all share holders as they simply may issue an increase in the amount of shares in the short term, meaning the value is initially lower per share only for the value to raise when Investment in infrastructure, stadium and the team on the pitch are proven to be successful.
This could Mean that in 2/3 years, after a £0.7 billion investment from INEOS which may result in a ‘Stock Split’ therefore increasing INEOS by another 8% in shares ownership, probably with an agreement that half are Class A and Half Class B potentially meaning that in 2025-26 the total shares may be as follows;
117.5m Class B shares and 55.5m Class A shares.
INEOS would now own 32.75m class B
Glazers still own 84.75m Class B
Total 117.5m
INEOS would now own 15.75m class A
The Glazers 2.75m Class A
Minority 37m Class A
Total 55.5m
Overall total 173m shares
Percentage owned;
Glazers 50.6%
INEOS 29.2%
Minority 20.2%
It’s important to note that on the NYSE after a ‘Stock Split’ the price per share adjust downwards so there is an equal valuation and both the Glazers and minority share holder shares will be diluted and lose value initially.
The additional £1 billion investment promised will be for more chunks of the club with added percentages until Sir Jim can activate a full buy out maybe in 2028-2029.
When you look at this in detail the Goblin’s retain absolute power or control for at least another 2-3 years with the caveat that Sir Jim controls the football side and a sum of £700-800m should be enough from INEOS to pay off some of the debt, fix infrastructure and modernise the training complex whilst at the same time making better off and on field decisions that free up more money for more sensible transfers.
The stadium, contrary to popular opinion is a self financing project which INEOS can partner with Mercedes, spend the
£1-1.25bn and repay the investment by using the increased Matchday revenue to pay the payments of the loan through INEOS over a 20 year period at £60-75m per, plus this has no effect on FSP/FFP going forward.
A new shiny stadium orca major renovation could actually be made possible just by paying off £200m of the £550m legacy debt used to buy the club by the Glazers in 2005.
Sir Jim really did give the Glazers everything and more that they wanted and in 2029 if the club is worth £10bn with a shiny new 90,000 all seater stadium they’ll probably get another $6.5bn to go with the $1.2 they will get this year.
All of this while someone else invests into the club to bring back the glory days, the Glazers are the skurge of our club but they have played SJ and 92 Foundation with the promise of 100% sale, something that was clearly never an option!
The Glazers played a blinder, while getting INEOS to give them everything they wanted and more, the club was clearly never up for sale from day one unless someone paid an obscene amount of money?
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Genuine question: has there been some sort of poll on this I've not seen?
Sheikh Jassim returns?
Crafty.
Crafty.
I was strongly pro Qatar but i love this early rumours about new and proven DoF. And maybe even new CEO.
I just hope he will hire them immediately, not wait end of season.
I just hope he will hire them immediately, not wait end of season.
What are you hearing, pal?
You have to give Ratcliffe some props -- finally get to see his boyhood dream come true at the ripe ol' age of 77y.o.
Hope to christ he stays healthy enough to see it come true.
There's been lots of polls. Depends what you put value in. The athletic polls were overwhelmingly in favor of him not returning, same with United we stand polls. Polls open to the masses of twitter fans were like 60/40 in favor of him returning, but those are just open up everybody
Look for of the fans, me including who gave him a hard time, if he truly loves the club and wants to restore it, now is the time for fans to get behind him but make sure that even though the parasites are staying, none of them should ever visit old Trafford or a Wembley final again, ever !!
There are rumours on Twitter but we all knows it’s complete BS last minute bid of £7bn to the Glazers plus another £3.5bn in buying minority shares, infrastructure, new stadium and player investment.
Complete BS so not worthy of the post on here!
The birdies in Cuckoo Land.
He's 71
Freedman would be such an anti-climax. Palace are utter shite.
Not the most glamorous name, but aren't they known for punching above their status in terms of youth development /U23s to 1st team (Olise, Guehi as Chelsea sub to 80m valued defender, Eze, some of the defenders) in particular. Also, they still tend to play better football (in this 2nd coming of RH) that we do. Beyond that, they also had their moments under Vieira -it was just a punt that didn't completely pay off, but the reasoning (Arsenal and City group trained young manager) was OK.
This bunch have hamfistedly dealt with a number of sensitive issues this season, but hopefully somebody has their head screwed on. Likely somebody from the incoming bunch.
The Glazers are not attending the funeral? Not even one of the major two tits? That's disgraceful. New low.
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