Yes, that as well, generally it is a more demanding style of defending when you look at it, in my opinion at least. But I do rate Smalling as a defender and he can adapt his defensive side to a solid level. His obvious limitation on the ball is another thing altogether.
12
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 34
- Clean sheets
- 8
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Status
Bit of a weird statement when we all know the issue was Jose and had nothing to do with Smalling.
Smalling over Bailly any day of the week for me. He's the most organized and anticipating central defender we have. And he talks and arranges much when on the field, where there has been some misunderstandings with Lindelof and others leading to chances/goals.
We've also been taking in some big chances in the air under Ole.
Its easy to praise our defence, but its mostly De Gea and luck that has been on our side, under Ole.
We've also been taking in some big chances in the air under Ole.
Its easy to praise our defence, but its mostly De Gea and luck that has been on our side, under Ole.
Still think our defence will be strongest with Smalling and Lindey.
Smalling have many good sides, but I have always seen talking and arranging as some of his weaker sides. And of course there have been some, although rather few, misunderstandings. All the CB formations are rather new and don’t have many matches together as Smalling has started most matches for a long time.
I believe there are 7 goals conceded in 10 matches despite more offensive football. It’s weird that some people cannot acknowledge the players who did this, and instead talk about luck.
Anyway, it will be interesting to see how OGS will play Smalling. He has had his place given in the starting XI for a long time, but now with a new coach, different type of football and good results from the others, it may not be that given anymore.
7 in 10 is of course very good and credits where they are due, but if you look at the big chances it really is fair to say that De Gea and luck has been a really big factor. Im sure xG would support this.
Yep. Can't believe anyone seriously thinks we haven't missed Smalling!
We had to put matic on Maguire for goodness sake because we have so little trust in our actual centre backs!
Every single set piece against was a lotto that they wouldn't produce the right ball.
Imagine if we had played the old stoke lot! We'd have been screwed.
So it looks like Southgate and now Ole don’t rate him very highly
He's been injured basically the entire time Solskjaer's been here.
Keep him away from the first team. People dont understand the difference one player like Smalling makes in a team that plays the way we do. He got away with it under Jose but under OGS he would be a failure. He is scared of the ball. So he never offers himself as an option putting us at a disadvantage from the start. He spreads his nervousness on the ball across the defence and puts us on the backfoot. He can literally do nothing on the ball except for passing to the RB which will be Young making it a substandard duo on a already weak right side. He can defend sure but he is one of the worst in the league at everything else.
He was on the bench v burnley, if he was considered the no 1 Centre back he’d be back in straightaway.
Not necessarily, he’d barely trained and he’s been out long enough for his match fitness to be affected. It’s far too early to make a call like this.
Doubt it would be the same situation if his name was VVD
Depends on the severity of the injury and how he looked in training.
Time will tell I guess
De Gea has been fantastic, absolutely. He his part of the defence.
But xG doesnt tell anything about how the central defence has worked. If the midfield collapse, as it has in some of the matches, there will be a constant pressure. xG will tell you if there were many chances or not, but not how many chances relatively to how the match was played. Therefore xG does not say anything about how well the central defence worked.
I’m not gonna count him out just yet, he’s managed to establish himself under LvG and Mourinho so there’s a good chance he could do the same under Ole.
He cannot be fit.
According to official stats Maguire won one aerial duel. Normally he’s decent but in this match he was the worst CB on the pitch. He had zero awareness of who was running behind him and his slow reaction cost them a goal.
He's also our only CB who's a genuine goal threat, the only one with double figures and he's scored some key goals for us in comebacks down the years. He offers more than defensive stability (his main job that he does better than the rest)
But are you happy to trade a better aerial presence defensively for his weaker technical abilities? I think against Fulham he should play because Mitrovic is a very good striker in my eyes & I think he'll bully Jones and be able to goad Bailly into two footing him (or something equally rash & red card worthy).
He has scored important goals, no doubt. Now when he has been out they have sent up Lindelof instead and he has also created many chances incl two goals (one from him and one from the rebound of his header).
I think the stability is what he most of all offers. He is rarely having a poor game and seldom makes a big mistake.
I am very eager to have him back and see if he fits to OGS type of football.
I think he must walk right into the starting XI, he is our most reliable defender in the air by far.
Fortunately for us we didn’t concede againsr Leicester but Maguire and Evans won a lot of chances that couldn’t turn into goals but against tougher opposition we will surely pay.
Fortunately for us we didn’t concede againsr Leicester but Maguire and Evans won a lot of chances that couldn’t turn into goals but against tougher opposition we will surely pay.
Prefer not to mess with the defence now, keep Bailly/Lindelof partnership if at all possible. Can't keep swapping the defence willy nilly.
Im ok with that partnership as it has potential. Just keep Jones away
His 'weaker' technical are abilities are overstated for me, and the other qualities he brings are far more important IMO and they are not limited to aerial prowess. We don't need both CBs in a partnership to be Beckenbauer impersonators. Look how well Blind and Smalling worked together. That was by far our best CB pairing post Fergie.
Im eager as well, but im sure he'll be more than fine.
He offers a goal threat? Yes for both our side and the oppositions. Defensive stability is not all about putting in a tackle. Its about organisation and keeping the defenders around you calm. Smalling lacks composure and has zero ball playing ability. In this style of play he is useless.
Jones and Rojo were our best centre back pairing suprisingly
Should be second choice CB until proven otherwise.
Thats how I see it whenever I go to games. The times ive seen him play live, hes a great defender, but not sure about being a great CB. Often when hes there he does his own thing and looks good, but the partnership doesnt look good. I think hes ok when its a set piece but during play, I dont see that leadership quality to command a defence. Id still like to see him given a chance under Ole (may have to wait for that Chelsea cup match).
I think hes a great squad player to have and in terms of what we saw vs Leicester/Spurs would have been great to bring on as that third defender to deal with teams putting it into the box late on.
I will be a little disappointed if hes one of our starting CB next season (by choice)
If he stays fit he'll become first coice in about month, just like it happened with every manager so far. It's unlucky for him that he's been injured during Ole's start here, but he'll prove his worth I am sure. He is easily the best defender in this club, we can find better in other teams but there isn't one in our team.
I think they're exaggerated in that some posters genuinely believe he can't pass a football but they are poor. It seems like nothing but nearly every pass is slightly behind the man or away from his feet and, particularly when switching play, it gives the opposition that extra few seconds to shuffle and regain their structure. In the same way we let Sanchez have the ball in the EL final vs Ajax, teams are happy to let Smalling dwell on on the ball which kind of says it all.
Don't get me wrong, I thin he's a solid CB and a nice option from the bench, for a back three or if you're coming up against someone like Mitrovic (as we will this weekend) but if you look at the current top 3, you'd surely take any one of their starting CBs over Smalling in a heartbeat?
Liverpool - Lovren definitely not. Yes I'd take VVD in a heartbeat
City - Stones, Laporte, Otamendi - wouldn't take one of them in a heartbeat over Smalling
Spurs - Sanchez - definitely not. Vertonghen - not in a heartbeat. Alderweireld - possibly.
I think Ole will get him in line up soon and once he is in there, he is going to cement his spot just like he has previously because he is a very good defender and with Lindelof's form and ability on the ball, Ole will be just looking for that strong base.
I think we might be pretty different in how we assess CBs...
LPool: Gomez & VVD - Yes. Lovren is their backup but I'd lean toward Smalling.
City: Kompany (fit), Laporte, Stones - Yes. Otamendi I don't rate so Smalling wins that one for me
Spurs: Alderweireld & Vertonghen - Yes. Sanchez I'd probably take over Smalling as well given age/potential.
As a question: do you not rate Vertonghen? I'd say he's top 3 CBs in the league, particularly if you like a player like Smalling who is aerially strong and more of an out and out defender.
Jones is the one who has scored 4 times against his own keeper, he's a potential goal threat against United whenever he plays. Smalling doesn't even make as many tackles as the rest of our CBs because he has better anticipation. Its no surprise he managed the most interceptions per 90 mins last season among our CBs. He's also a great marker.
For a whole 16 games compared to Blind and Smalling who both played over 50 matches together that season? Its not even just a question of reliability, that CB pairing just looked better than any other. In those games Jones and Rojo played together (and they did look very good at times) they both got away with rash challenges, especially Rojo who should've seen red at least twice.
The only CBs i'd take over Smalling in the top three are Van Dijk and Kompany but Kompany is done now. Would you take David Luiz over and Rudiger over Smalling? Lovren? Matip? Stones? Otamendi? Only Kompany has has more experience in the PL. Smalling has proven himself against better forwards more times than any of those can count. Ask Harry Kane
I originally said top three so using the Gomez, VVD, Lovren AND Stones, Laporte, Kompany AND Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Sanchez. Of those 9 players, I'd take all but Lovren and Sanchez over Smalling and even with Lovren and Sanchez you could make a point for them IMO.
Basing your views on Kane's quote that Smalling was the toughest defender he'd played against doesn't necessarily mean it's true. Pele said Nicky Butt was the best player at the 2002 WC for goodness sake.
Smalling is a good defender, he's an all round athlete, good in the air and I'm not saying he's terrible but he's nowhere near the league's elite CBs and I think that is a widely accepted point of view.
Smalling better than Laporte, Vertonghen, Otamendi and Sanchez. I’ve seen it all now.
I’d even take Stones and Gomez over him.
The reason we’ve looked so good is because Smalling isn’t playing. It’s not a coincidence.
I forgot Spurs
. I'd take Alderweireld but he's another injury prone player. I wouldn't take any of the City players, maybe Laporte because of his age, there's an upside there. Did Kane ever admit that Smalling is the toughest defender he played against? I know top 6 CB killer Vardy said that. In any case if a player praises another player who he actually came up against why wouldn't you take his word for it? Pele never played with or against Butt, but Butt was considered one of the best players at WC 2002 by many pundits and fans alike. I thought at the time his performances were a bit overrated but Pele wasn't the only one.Im not saying Smalling is the best CB ever or anything like that, but I think he's the best United have. I have hopes for Bailly, Tuanzebe and Lindelof. Why would you take Stones over him though? None of the City CBs have risen in stock since their move. In fact they are not even that important since their midfield control the ball so much, hence the constant rotation. None of them are vital and for me they are all too soft bar Kompany.
Personally don’t think he will get a look in, unless we have an injury crisis in defence.
You've seen it all? This is when in the same post you are saying that we've looked good because Smalling is not playing. Ok, you don't rate him, fair enough but, the quality of our play improving so much is down to him not being around? It's not that Pogba, Rashford, Martial, Herrera, Matic and even our fullbacks are thriving on getting more freedom to get forward, that instead of being passive and letting teams attack us, we actually work to retain possession and win it back quicker.
If anything, what Smalling's absence has shown is that we are in need of a solid partner to Lindelof that is will make us less nervous when we are under the pressure and can handle other teams danger men on set pieces and is far less likely to make a silly mistake compared to Jones or Baily.
@tomaldinho1 - to your question about Vertonghen, I think he is very good but, in taking someone over another in a heartbeat suggests that I think he is far better and I don't think there is that much between them in their defensive capabilities. Anyway, let's see - I might be proven wrong but, I very much think OGS will give Smalling a game and think he'll end up being paired with Lindelof after that till the end of the season. Just going by how OGS has gone about trying to mold the team in the way he thinks of us historically - and for that he'll want a strong CB like Smalling next to the likes of Lindelof.
Fair enough on the reasoning - of course both are professional footballer so it's not a gulf in talent. We'll see how things pan out and if Smalling can work well with Lindelof that's fine in my book.
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