Changes to the FA Cup you would make

Bwuk said:
You could attach a Europa League spot too it (or conference?)
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I thought that was already the case to be honest?

The League Cup winner used to qualify for Europa League - I thought the winner now got entry to Conference League (if they haven't already qualified for Europe by other means).

The thing is at the moment, I suppose, it's usually won by a team who've qualified for a higher European competition based on the league so it doesn't mean much and teams finishing 6th or 7th tend to take that place instead.
 
Some sort of seeding system, and premier league teams play away first round
 
- Crystal maze music played during every draw for the next round
- BBC specifically banned from showing ANYTHING other than the game, while the game is going on. No shots of the crowd, close ups of the manager's face. Slow motion replays of the back of Declan Rice's head, etc.
- If a game is drawn both teams go through. They both have to play the next opponent in the next round, at the same time. If that's a draw, all three teams go through...unless its 0-0 inwhich case everyone is out, whoever they're drawn against in the next round gets a by.
- National Anthem and Abide by Me abolished, both at the FA cup final and in general.
- Only the final at Wembley. If a team like Tottenham decides to cheat and make Wembley their home stadium, all of their games are away.
- Every time anyone says "the magic of the FA cup" they have to write a detailed essay explaining what magic is and why they think it cant be explained by science or one team just scoring more goals than the other.
 
Increase the prize money or reward and teams will have to take it more seriously. The likes of Brentford putting out second string teams is a complete joke. Like an extra couple of games is going to make a difference to Brentford, who mostly play once a week anyway. I’d be furious if I supported them and watched them lose to a team bottom of the Championship.

Then again, they just got a point off city and so their manager will probably say he got the decision right. Maybe you have to look at increasing prize money for semi finalists and not just winners.
 
Rory Jennings actually had a good idea for once on The Overlap regarding replays which was basically if it's a draw after 90 minutes, both clubs vote whether they want to settle it on the night or have a replay. If both agree not to then you play on with extra time / pens til there's a winner, but if at least 1 of the 2 votes for the replay then they get their wish.

Basically the idea is that in a tie where it's say for example Bournemouth v West Brom which was a game in the 3rd round, if that had happened to finish as a draw both times might want to just avoid a replay considering Bournemouth or going well in the PL with an outside shot at qualifying for Europe, and West Brom are currently in the Championship play-offs and more focused on promotion than an FA Cup run. They can both vote 'no' and avoid the extra game.

But with Tamworth-Spurs for example, Tamworth would obviously vote 'yes' and they would have got their money-spinning replay at Spurs ground. Something like that is needed I think, we can't not have replays as teams like Tamworth are getting fecked over after an amazingly hard-earned result at home. What's worse is the fact it doesn't even go straight to pens and so they these lower league sides don't even have a reasonable chance of winning the tie outright given the PL side can just bring the big guns off the bench and roll over them in extra time which is exactly what Spurs did.

On the same episode Kieran Maguire also talked about the distribution of money and was essentially making the point that the prize money for winning is too much considering it's actually often less than PL teams (who will 9/10 win it of course) get for finishing 1 place higher in the league and so doesn't make much difference to them (I think it's £2m total) and it would be better instead to pay more for earlier games like getting to the 2nd / 3rd round etc so more of the pot of money goes into the hands of the lower league clubs as well.
 
Dan_F said:
Increase the prize money or reward and teams will have to take it more seriously. The likes of Brentford putting out second string teams is a complete joke. Like an extra couple of games is going to make a difference to Brentford, who mostly play once a week anyway. I’d be furious if I supported them and watched them lose to a team bottom of the Championship.

Then again, they just got a point off city and so their manager will probably say he got the decision right. Maybe you have to look at increasing prize money for semi finalists and not just winners.
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I dunno. Everyone's schedule is mad over Christmas, and they play both City and Liverpool in the week after that cup game.

About 8-9 of the team they put out get league games anyway, and they brought Wissa, Mbeumo etc off the bench.
 
DannyCAFC said:
Rory Jennings actually had a good idea for once on The Overlap regarding replays which was basically if it's a draw after 90 minutes, both clubs vote whether they want to settle it on the night or have a replay. If both agree not to then you play on with extra time / pens til there's a winner, but if at least 1 of the 2 votes for the replay then they get their wish.

Basically the idea is that in a tie where it's say for example Bournemouth v West Brom which was a game in the 3rd round, if that had happened to finish as a draw both times might want to just avoid a replay considering Bournemouth or going well in the PL with an outside shot at qualifying for Europe, and West Brom are currently in the Championship play-offs and more focused on promotion than an FA Cup run. They can both vote 'no' and avoid the extra game.

But with Tamworth-Spurs for example, Tamworth would obviously vote 'yes' and they would have got their money-spinning replay at Spurs ground. Something like that is needed I think, we can't not have replays as teams like Tamworth are getting fecked over after an amazingly hard-earned result at home. What's worse is the fact it doesn't even go straight to pens and so they these lower league sides don't even have a reasonable chance of winning the tie outright given the PL side can just bring the big guns off the bench and roll over them in extra time which is exactly what Spurs did.

On the same episode Kieran Maguire also talked about the distribution of money and was essentially making the point that the prize money for winning is too much considering it's actually often less than PL teams (who will 9/10 win it of course) get for finishing 1 place higher in the league and so doesn't make much difference to them (I think it's £2m total) and it would be better instead to pay more for earlier games like getting to the 2nd / 3rd round etc so more of the pot of money goes into the hands of the lower league clubs as well.
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I don't agree with much of that really.

I'll ignore the final point about money distribution as that's just the usual 'why should the wealthy have more, give it to the more needy' argument that is more a continuation of a class / societal debate than a specific football competition one.

I don't agree that a lower league club like Tamworth had less of a chance of winning that tie by playing 30 mins ET and maybe pens at their ground, rather than starting a new match from minute one away at the PL ground. From the money / business side, it's an extra money spinner, yes - but from the sporting side, there's more of a chance of an upset finishing the match on the day at the lower teams 'leveller' of a home ground than them winning a new match away from home.

And I don't agree that teams should be able to switch things between themselves - like the draw (switching to the big teams ground for financial reasons), or decide between themselves whether it's a replay or not. The rules should be in place and it shouldn't be up to the teams to manufacture them.

Personally, I don't see why VAR can't be used in matches where they have the facilities. But I keep hearing this idea that the same rules should apply to everyone in the round for fairness. So, if we're going down that route, I don't think we should be introducing things whereby certain ties can decide between themselves which teams play home and away, while other ties can't. I know that isn't a quote from your post, but it's been another similar idea suggested a lot on here that goes along with the kind of things you were saying Rory Jennings suggested.

So many of these suggestions are turning the ties into a manufactured negotiation and I don't agree with any of it - just keep it how it is. The open draw is made, and it's the luck of the draw whether you play a tougher or easier oppenonent, and whether you're home or away. It really shouldn't be up to clubs to be able to 'sell' home advantage (either from the start or after 90 minutes) for a money boost or anything like that.
 
Abizzz said:
I like these. Additionally the winner of the league cup getting a euro league spot keeps it attractive to all teams that don't usually qualify for Europe.
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That’s a great shout.
 
V.O. said:
I dunno. Everyone's schedule is mad over Christmas, and they play both City and Liverpool in the week after that cup game.

About 8-9 of the team they put out get league games anyway, and they brought Wissa, Mbeumo etc off the bench.
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Fair. I don’t watch Brentford often, I glanced over the team and it looked like a lot of back ups.
 
Start enforceing the rule that requires teams to play a strong line-up in all ties.

Use to same rules as the FA Trophy where before the game 2 clubs decide what will happen in the event of a draw (ET then Pens, just Pens, or replay.

If a smaller team draws a big team at home they can choose to switch the tie to a bigger venue in their local area or to the other teams ground if they wish to.

The FA Cup Winners qualify for the Champions League.

Semi Finals played at neutral venues but under no circumstances should those venues be in another country.

Final should always be played at Wembley.
 
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I wouldn't have an automatic CL place, but in these years now where we might get a 5th spot, if we did then it should go to the cup winners
 
diarm said:
  • Bring back replays.
  • Winner qualifies for CL.
  • Make the League Cup only for teams who haven’t qualified for Europe.
These 3 changes would reignite passion for the FA Cup and sort the fixture congestion they’re trying to fix by scrapping replays.
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These three plus semi finals played at neutral grounds, only the final at Wembley, last game of domestic season, kick off at 3pm
 
Bertie Wooster said:
I don't agree with much of that really.

I'll ignore the final point about money distribution as that's just the usual 'why should the wealthy have more, give it to the more needy' argument that is more a continuation of a class / societal debate than a specific football competition one.

I don't agree that a lower league club like Tamworth had less of a chance of winning that tie by playing 30 mins ET and maybe pens at their ground, rather than starting a new match from minute one away at the PL ground. From the money / business side, it's an extra money spinner, yes - but from the sporting side, there's more of a chance of an upset finishing the match on the day at the lower teams 'leveller' of a home ground than them winning a new match away from home.

And I don't agree that teams should be able to switch things between themselves - like the draw (switching to the big teams ground for financial reasons), or decide between themselves whether it's a replay or not. The rules should be in place and it shouldn't be up to the teams to manufacture them.

Personally, I don't see why VAR can't be used in matches where they have the facilities. But I keep hearing this idea that the same rules should apply to everyone in the round for fairness. So, if we're going down that route, I don't think we should be introducing things whereby certain ties can decide between themselves which teams play home and away, while other ties can't. I know that isn't a quote from your post, but it's been another similar idea suggested a lot on here that goes along with the kind of things you were saying Rory Jennings suggested.

So many of these suggestions are turning the ties into a manufactured negotiation and I don't agree with any of it - just keep it how it is. The open draw is made, and it's the luck of the draw whether you play a tougher or easier oppenonent, and whether you're home or away. It really shouldn't be up to clubs to be able to 'sell' home advantage (either from the start or after 90 minutes) for a money boost or anything like that.
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You've misread what I said. I wasn't saying Tamworth would have more chance beating Spurs in a replay, I'm saying on top of missing out on the replay which they had earned with a hard-fought 0-0 which in turn denied them A) a massive payday for the club and B) their fans a great experience going to a big PL away ground - they are getting double-screwed because they realistically don't have a hope in hell of beating Spurs in extra time (and so if you are fecking them out of a replay I think if they earn a draw you at least go straight to pens where they have some hope of winning).

I also didn't say anything about switching a draw to a big ground for financial reasons so I'm not sure where that's come from. But if a team like Tamworth manages to hold a giant like Spurs to a 0-0 at home after 90 minutes they should be rewarded with the replay for their efforts. As it is, currently these teams are having to go to extra time and they're always going to get slaughtered over the next 30 minutes and lose because they can't keep up physically and the PL team can just bring 2 or 3 fresh first-team players off the bench. It's a lose-lose situation for them and they get nothing for drawing the game in normal time.
 
Open it to Saudi Arabian and Qatari teams until they (Saudi) host the world cup. If the system is already ruined, what's pouring a little more paraffin onto the flames gonna hurt.

On an unrelated note if any amir's are reading this, open to DM's for bank deets
 
DannyCAFC said:
You've misread what I said. I wasn't saying Tamworth would have more chance beating Spurs in a replay, I'm saying on top of missing out on the replay which they had earned with a hard-fought 0-0 which in turn denied them A) a massive payday for the club and B) their fans a great experience going to a big PL away ground - they are getting double-screwed because they realistically don't have a hope in hell of beating Spurs in extra time (and so if you are fecking them out of a replay I think if they earn a draw you at least go straight to pens where they have some hope of winning).

I also didn't say anything about switching a draw to a big ground for financial reasons so I'm not sure where that's come from. But if a team like Tamworth manages to hold a giant like Spurs to a 0-0 at home after 90 minutes they should be rewarded with the replay for their efforts. As it is, currently these teams are having to go to extra time and they're always going to get slaughtered over the next 30 minutes and lose because they can't keep up physically and the PL team can just bring 2 or 3 fresh first-team players off the bench. It's a lose-lose situation for them and they get nothing for drawing the game in normal time.
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It's come from being suggested a few times in the couple of pages so far. I know you hadn't mentioned it in your post - that's why I actually stated "I know that isn't a quote from your post, but it's been another similar idea suggested a lot on here that goes along with the kind of things you were saying Rory Jennings suggested".

I didn't so much misread what you said about Tamworth, I just wasn't agreeing that lower league clubs have no chance in hell of winning a drawn game that they've taken to ET on their own ground. It didn't happen this time - the gulf in clubs told this time. But my point was that the gulf in clubs will tell more often in a replay at the big clubs ground, starting afresh from the first minute, than it would in games played to a finish in the 'leveller' of the little clubs ground that's already gone to ET.

As a fan of United, I'd feel much more confident thinking we were returning to Old Trafford for a replay than the game going on to ET (and potentially pens) at the other teams ground. I'd think there's a lot more chance of an upset in the latter scenario.

Obviously, if you're focusing on the money aspect, then there's no debate. The more matches - especially televised - that the smaller teams get v bigger teams the more money they'll make. But making decisions based on prioritising money is meant to be the wrong / ugly side of football, isn't it? That's certainly what you hear in every scenario - except when it's big club v small club debate, then it apparently should be the main criteria it seems. I'm more consistent, and prefer to still prioritise the sport side of it still rather than the ('ugly' / 'all that's wrong with the modern game') money and business side.
 
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Love OP’s suggestion of the lower division clubs always getting home advantage (and revenue!). It makes it more interesting as a competition and that revenue is a big lifeline for lower league clubs. I’d make one modification, the FA cup winners get to be home for all their FA cup games in the following season. A simple way to add some financial incentive to winning the cup (extra matchday revenue) without having to increase prize money.

I don’t want replays. The calendar is horrendous as is.

Edit: this suggestion makes no sense
 
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tenpoless said:
:lol:
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Come on, think about it. Every team tries to score own goals so the opponents try to stop that. Essentially the outfield players change to the other team at kickoff, only goalies stay. No wait, they would just swap sides and it would be business as usual.
 
Squeaky_Bum_Time said:
Oh I didn’t know that, I thought it’s the other way around. Is matchday revenue shared?
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Indeed, I'm not sure of how the split is currently worked out but it used to be similar to a match day allocation for a Prem Game and then as a good will gesture the big clubs would buy back the tickets that the smaller club couldn't sell.

I'm sure there is some footage out there of lower league clubs going mad celebrating getting drawn at Old Trafford cause it can make a giant difference for their club.
 
Semi Finals no longer at Wembley. Final to be played the week after the last Premier League game of the season. No extra time, straight to penalties. VAR in use immediately, not halfway through the competition.
 
  • Can leave VAR out, bequeath the competition to the Luddites
  • Only finals at Wembley. Semi-finals at stadiums that make sense. Why should 2 Northern clubs be schlepping down to Wembley to play semis?
  • I'm not sure about having lower club pyramids host games, I'm sure if you ask them they prefer the gate receipts when they go to an Old Trafford or Anfield. Maybe let them choose?
  • Out of the way idea: open the FA Cup to Scottish and Welsh and NI clubs? Unless they care deeply about their local FA cups?
  • Scrap replays and extra time. Straight to PKs after the 90.
 
adexkola said:
  • Can leave VAR out, bequeath the competition to the Luddites
  • Only finals at Wembley. Semi-finals at stadiums that make sense. Why should 2 Northern clubs be schlepping down to Wembley to play semis?
  • I'm not sure about having lower club pyramids host games, I'm sure if you ask them they prefer the gate receipts when they go to an Old Trafford or Anfield. Maybe let them choose?
  • Out of the way idea: open the FA Cup to Scottish and Welsh and NI clubs? Unless they care deeply about their local FA cups?
  • Scrap replays and extra time. Straight to PKs after the 90.
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I'd love it if they did it at the The Millennium Stadium in Cardiff or Ibrox/Celtic Park. Given most teams only make semifinals a couple of times a decade (the good ones) I don't think it would be too bad on fans either, it would make it even more special.
 
Red00012 said:
Ya Tamworth lost out on big bucks over the weekend because of no replays
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This is a fallacy. Tamworth were in the third round precisely because of no replays. Plus, if there were replays, Tottenham would likely have approached the match differently to make sure they got the job done in the ninety minutes.
 
the first name out of the hat gets to choose whether to play the tie at home or away. small teams like tamworth may decide they want to try and beat tottenham at their shithole, or take the money on offer playing at spurs. we’d probably choose to play away so we don’t have to play with a leaky roof.
 
- The tournament seeded at all times to make sure big teams avoid each other
- Semi-finals venues rotate between US and Middle East
- Get rid of the FA part of the name and just call it the Emirates Cup
- Play the UAE National Anthem before the final in recognition of the sponsors
- Have a half-time show during the final which lasts at least an hour
 
Bertie Wooster said:
It's come from being suggested a few times in the couple of pages so far. I know you hadn't mentioned it in your post - that's why I actually stated "I know that isn't a quote from your post, but it's been another similar idea suggested a lot on here that goes along with the kind of things you were saying Rory Jennings suggested".

I didn't so much misread what you said about Tamworth, I just wasn't agreeing that lower league clubs have no chance in hell of winning a drawn game that they've taken to ET on their own ground. It didn't happen this time - the gulf in clubs told this time. But my point was that the gulf in clubs will tell more often in a replay at the big clubs ground, starting afresh from the first minute, than it would in games played to a finish in the 'leveller' of the little clubs ground that's already gone to ET.

As a fan of United, I'd feel much more confident thinking we were returning to Old Trafford for a replay than the game going on to ET (and potentially pens) at the other teams ground. I'd think there's a lot more chance of an upset in the latter scenario.

Obviously, if you're focusing on the money aspect, then there's no debate. The more matches - especially televised - that the smaller teams get v bigger teams the more money they'll make. But making decisions based on prioritising money is meant to be the wrong / ugly side of football, isn't it? That's certainly what you hear in every scenario - except when it's big club v small club debate, then it apparently should be the main criteria it seems. I'm more consistent, and prefer to still prioritise the sport side of it still rather than the ('ugly' / 'all that's wrong with the modern game') money and business side.
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I agree, but as you've said I've really focused on the money aspect and made that pretty clear I think in my OP.

These ties are potentially huge for lower league clubs - an article in FourFourTwo the other day suggested that Tamworth might have earned enough from a replay at Spurs that they could cover around 6 months of running the entire football club. That sort of money can do big things not just for the team's budget on the field but in developing facilities or even certain initiatives around the local community.

It just doesn't sit right with me that these types opportunities have been now been decreased for lower league teams given they can only rely on the luck of the draw to get an away game to begin with, and aren't able to earn one now with a plucky draw at in a home fixture.

Particularly when we know this is largely because the bigger clubs are moaning about fixture congestion and don't want the hassle of the extra games, yet they're playing more CL games and more pre-season games in countries US / Saudi etc so they can line their pockets further. It just pushes the gap between the rich and the poor in football even wider.
 
It should be turned into a squid game style event with the pitch getting smaller as time progresses. Losing team gets ‘exterminated’. Players aren’t allowed to wear boots and the ball is as heavy as a medicine ball.
 
DannyCAFC said:
I agree, but as you've said I've really focused on the money aspect and made that pretty clear I think in my OP.

These ties are potentially huge for lower league clubs - an article in FourFourTwo the other day suggested that Tamworth might have earned enough from a replay at Spurs that they could cover around 6 months of running the entire football club. That sort of money can do big things not just for the team's budget on the field but in developing facilities or even certain initiatives around the local community.

It just doesn't sit right with me that these types opportunities have been now been decreased for lower league teams given they can only rely on the luck of the draw to get an away game to begin with, and aren't able to earn one now with a plucky draw at in a home fixture.

Particularly when we know this is largely because the bigger clubs are moaning about fixture congestion and don't want the hassle of the extra games, yet they're playing more CL games and more pre-season games in countries US / Saudi etc so they can line their pockets further. It just pushes the gap between the rich and the poor in football even wider.
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That bit gets said a lot as if it reveals hypocrisy, but really it's just an extension of the same problem of the packed schedule and player safety demands on one hand, and those organising fixtures (either at clubs or governing bodies) just looking to pack the schedule with ever more games for financial reasons on the other.

The people calling for fewer games during the domestic season are not at all the same ones packing the summer break with ever extended international tournaments or club friendlies. Those people are the ones also complaining about that ever reducing summer break as well. It's all part of the problem of unfair levels of physical demands being put on the elite level players playing pretty much all year round season in, season out for either club or country.

There are legitimate concerns being voiced on the one hand, but all that's really happening is more and more games being added on the other - especially in lucrative foreign markets. The removal of the replays has been the only concession made (I'd have thought making League Cup SF's one legs would have been an easy change as well) - but, as you say, that comes at the expense of lower league clubs missing out on a money spinning replay. They probably should have kept it as replays only being removed from rounds 4 or 5 onwards.
 
Abizzz said:
I'd love it if they did it at the The Millennium Stadium in Cardiff or Ibrox/Celtic Park. Given most teams only make semifinals a couple of times a decade (the good ones) I don't think it would be too bad on fans either, it would make it even more special.
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Agreed

I heard (may be wrong) that Wembley is contracted out for a while to host FA Semi finals, but you'd think that should be ending soon. Makes no sense for football to follow the country and be London-centric
 
I'd give the winners the Champions League spot that usually goes to the 4th placed League team.

I feel this is the only thing that would give the Fa Cup back it's prestige.
 
Winners champions league spot, semi finals at Villa Park / Hillsborough / OT.
 
Im not a fan of semi finals being held at Wembley too. Use the other grounds and keep Wembley for that special occasion- cup final day
 
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