Centre Back... Who do we go for?

john moran said:
I certainly would prefer him in my team than any of the over hyped English center backs like Maguire and Stones
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Duffy or Dunk? I’m not sure I fully agree if you mean Dunk, but I think he deserves a shot at a higher level.
 
Ruben Dias for £60m would be a good signing (from what I’ve seen of him) looks a very good player reads the game well and gets tackles in early very accomplished player.
 
More dominant/commanding keeper plus decent DM and we can work with Lindelof and Smalling or Lindelof/Smalling/Shaw as a 3.
 
dutchred said:
I think Nathan Ake would be a good buy. Has PL experience. Only reason he is not in the Dutch team is because of de Ligt and Van Dijk. He is left footed good in the air and can cover for Shaw at left back. Also wouldn't cost a fortune
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I thought he was English?
 
Adnan said:
Jonathan Tah from Leverkusen looks the most interesting player if we can't get the obvious choices we're linked to.

He's physically imposing at 6'4 and is also fast. Good on the ball from what I've read and is still young at 23.

Admittedly I've only seen him in action via YouTube which isn't the best way to judge a player. So if anyone who has watched him play for Leverkusen for a period of time, care to share their thoughts on Tah's potential?

Koulibaly at 23-24 took off under the tutelage of Maurizio Sarri. Mainly because he had the tools that Sarri could work with, like ability on the ball, physicality and pace. Tah seems to have very similar strengths, but is better in dealing with aerial balls due to being 6'4.

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He's quality, would love him here if we can't land the usual suspects in De Ligt and Koulibaly.
 
Adnan said:
Jonathan Tah from Leverkusen looks the most interesting player if we can't get the obvious choices we're linked to.

He's physically imposing at 6'4 and is also fast. Good on the ball from what I've read and is still young at 23.

Admittedly I've only seen him in action via YouTube which isn't the best way to judge a player. So if anyone who has watched him play for Leverkusen for a period of time, care to share their thoughts on Tah's potential?

Koulibaly at 23-24 took off under the tutelage of Maurizio Sarri. Mainly because he had the tools that Sarri could work with, like ability on the ball, physicality and pace. Tah seems to have very similar strengths, but is better in dealing with aerial balls due to being 6'4.

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I do think he would be a very interesting player however you know when people say Smalling always has a mistake in him. This is what they’d say about Tah. Because he can be excellent and then other times he has some right gafs.

So I can only imagine what the CAF would make of him but he is certainly worth considering and if he gets his consistency and concentration sorted he could be one hell of a defender. Don’t know how much he’d be going for either but in this market I would think somewhere between 40-60 although I think I recall seeing something saying they want 80.

Still holding out hope we get DeLigt but If we can’t have him then I’d probably rather have Tah than Slabhead.
 
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I've never seen him play - is John Brooks of Wolfsburg rubbish? Just asking because seeing if there is any left footed CB that is good not at Barcelona.
 
We need a leader at the back, and looking at what we have at the moment, that is definitely missing. I quite liked the look of Baillie when he first joined, but he is a player who certainly needs guidance, Lindelof has played well, but like Shaw, I'm not totally convinced with him. Rojo and Smalling, with VAR coming in, will almost certainly be giving penalties away, and Rojo will see several red cards. Jones has had some decent games, but is liable to brain farts too often to be reliable. Tuanzebe could be a top Prem CB in my opinion, but I think he needs a full season, possibly with Villa, in the Prem to gain that experience. I could be wrong, and during the pre season may give Ole an indication that he is ready, but is not a leader, yet. I don't think we will get rid of any CB's, (unless we get a ridiculous bid for any of them) until we sign one or two new ones, so most of these I've mentioned will be here all season, I think next summer will see most of them go.
De Ligt is the only one I would move heaven and earth to get.
 
dutchred said:
I think Nathan Ake would be a good buy. Has PL experience. Only reason he is not in the Dutch team is because of de Ligt and Van Dijk. He is left footed good in the air and can cover for Shaw at left back. Also wouldn't cost a fortune
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Gandalf said:
Definitely agree on Ake. Would be my preferred choice unless by some miracle de Ligt does end up here. Ake and Lindelof would be a pretty good first choice combination and both still have upside and so could form a real partnership in the new look squad.
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Yes. Mobile and fast, can hold his own against pacy dribblers, does not recklessly dive into tackles, good on the ball, experience in the league(for those that think this is a must), would count as homegrown and despite not being a tank he seldom gets pushed around by the Deeneys and Mitrovics.
 
dutchred said:
I think Nathan Ake would be a good buy. Has PL experience. Only reason he is not in the Dutch team is because of de Ligt and Van Dijk. He is left footed good in the air and can cover for Shaw at left back. Also wouldn't cost a fortune
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Imo he is better than anything we have including Lindelöf.
 
Cliche Guevara said:
If Barcelona sign De Ligt we should go for Umtiti on loan for the season, with an option to buy.
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My hope is that we manage to sneak in de ligt this season & next season take a punt on the injury prone Umtiti that turns out well for us since Barcelona have lenglet anyway.

A bit of a fantasy land no doubt but de ligt & an injury free Umtiti would be hell of a partnership.
 
Centre back is a worry for me, because in spite of the reservations about Smalling and Jones (as well as Bailly) supporters have, just about every recommendation I seem to come across is objectively worse.

Smalling and Jones are good defenders, you know. They make mistakes, and on the ball they are an issue, but some like to dramatise their weaknesses tenfold. However, they’ve been here long enough for us to realise that we need to go to the market to sort the position out. But the suggestions (Ake, Lascelles, Schar, even Maguire) just aren’t much of an improvement. Some of them are inferior, playing for teams in which their mistakes are unreported. Smalling, in particular, would look phenomenal at a side further down the table, in which defending for much of the game is more common and playing out from the back is less of a concern.

For me, the answer lies somewhere in the middle, and it’s why the club (in my opinion) has been reticent to blow money on sub par alternatives. De Ligt, Koulibaly, Umtiti? Ay, go for it. But these players might not be attainable. Unless the club can pull a gem from out of nowhere, I think this position is more difficult than perhaps any other to improve.
 
Lash said:
How would that work if they have a ban?
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That's an interesting situation indeed. Do Chelsea have the right to refuse Bournemouth to sell one of their assets just because Chelsea have a transfer ban? Or would they buy Ake back without being able to play him for a year thus wasting him?
 
ArjenIsM3 said:
That's an interesting situation indeed. Do Chelsea have the right to refuse Bournemouth to sell one of their assets just because Chelsea have a transfer ban? Or would they buy Ake back without being able to play him for a year thus wasting him?
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Yeah, I’m genuinely curious as to how that works. If it works the same as an option, it’s only the right, not the obligation to buy - this can expire.
 
Kag said:
Centre back is a worry for me, because in spite of the reservations about Smalling and Jones (as well as Bailly) supporters have, just about every recommendation I seem to come across is objectively worse.

Smalling and Jones are good defenders, you know. They make mistakes, and on the ball they are an issue, but some like to dramatise their weaknesses tenfold. However, they’ve been here long enough for us to realise that we need to go to the market to sort the position out. But the suggestions (Ake, Lascelles, Schar, even Maguire) just aren’t much of an improvement. Some of them are inferior, playing for teams in which their mistakes are unreported. Smalling, in particular, would look phenomenal at a side further down the table, in which defending for much of the game is more common and playing out from the back is less of a concern.

For me, the answer lies somewhere in the middle, and it’s why the club (in my opinion) has been reticent to blow money on sub par alternatives. De Ligt, Koulibaly, Umtiti? Ay, go for it. But these players might not be attainable. Unless the club can pull a gem from out of nowhere, I think this position is more difficult than perhaps any other to improve.
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Isn't Umtiti as bad injury wise as Jones recently and probably why they want De Ligt and want rid of him?
 
ArjenIsM3 said:
That's an interesting situation indeed. Do Chelsea have the right to refuse Bournemouth to sell one of their assets just because Chelsea have a transfer ban? Or would they buy Ake back without being able to play him for a year thus wasting him?
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It is a registration ban technically.

They could still buy him and, I think, leave him to play at Bournemouth this season.

Notwithstanding a registration ban might, somehow, invalidate a buy-back option.

Of course, the player has to agree to any deal so if he doesn’t want to go back to Chelsea it’s probably irrelevant.
 
Lash said:
Yeah, I’m genuinely curious as to how that works. If it works the same as an option, it’s only the right, not the obligation to buy - this can expire.
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And another question:
If they want to buy him with this buyback clause, can he refuse them, if let's say he wants to joint us?
 
Kag said:
Probably. Which makes the situation even harder for us.
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Yep. It needs really good scouting for this because all I am reading about is targets for other positions who would rather stay where they are or go elsewhere than come to us. So if they decide to go young and up and coming they really need to have done their homework. Just think we like going to easy route and then fall flat on our faces.
 
Is Godfrey worth a punt, probably be quite cheap whilst Norwich are still in the Championship league.
 
DarkRed said:
And another question:
If they want to buy him with this buyback clause, can he refuse them, if let's say he wants to joint us?
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This was mentioned about morata in another thread. It would depend on the agreement. Can’t be sure.
 
redzer said:
Shane Duffy, 6'4, scores headers, leader at the back reads the game well 27 years old. Not saying he's the be all and end all but he's better than our current lot and would cost feck all. Well worth a punt in my opinion.
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Our CB situation is not that dire.
 
Lash said:
I know they’re not great, but you’d honestly switch one of them for a CB who nearly got relegated?
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This is where we're at with the centre half debate. Replacing Jones with Shane Duffy. Brighton conceded 60 goals last season; how many of those could Shane Duffy had done more to prevent? I know that isn't the best way to view centre halves, especially in poorer teams, but these underreported players are all well and good until they're in your team. Then you quickly realise that, actually, they're no better than what's already at the club. Jones, believe it or not, could go to a team like Leicester and put in some tremendous performances. He isn't the halfwit he's made out to be. Unfit, yes. But not poor.
 
Lash said:
I know they’re not great, but you’d honestly switch one of them for a CB who nearly got relegated?
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As a potential 4th/5th option CB then yes. Also, the point of having backups are to use them when the starters needs a rest or are injured, not them being the ones being injured all the time. Also, Rojo and Jones dives into tackles all the time. Something that should only be the last resort for a defender, not the only resort.
 
I think we just need a CB who is really,really good now and not another potential.
 
Kag said:
This is where we're at with the centre half debate. Replacing Jones with Shane Duffy. Brighton conceded 60 goals last season; how many of those could Shane Duffy had done more to prevent? I know that isn't the best way to view centre halves, especially in poorer teams, but these underreported players are all well and good until they're in your team. Then you quickly realise that, actually, they're no better than what's already at the club. Jones, believe it or not, could go to a team like Leicester and put in some tremendous performances. He isn't the halfwit he's made out to be. Unfit, yes. But not poor.
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Not a discussion on buying Duffy as a starter obviously (hopefully), more as a non-injured 4th/5th option. Ability-wise, I think they are somewhat on the same level, but Rojo and Jones's injury record does not speak well for them in regards to being dependable backups.
 
Kag said:
This is where we're at with the centre half debate. Replacing Jones with Shane Duffy. Brighton conceded 60 goals last season; how many of those could Shane Duffy had done more to prevent? I know that isn't the best way to view centre halves, especially in poorer teams, but these underreported players are all well and good until they're in your team. Then you quickly realise that, actually, they're no better than what's already at the club. Jones, believe it or not, could go to a team like Leicester and put in some tremendous performances. He isn't the halfwit he's made out to be. Unfit, yes. But not poor.
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Yep, I feel sorry for Jones a bit. He’s obviously not anywhere near the level we need consistently, but he’s surely better than fecking Shane Duffy.
Fosu-Mens said:
As a potential 4th/5th option CB then yes. Also, the point of having backups are to use them when the starters needs a rest or are injured, not them being the ones being injured all the time. Also, Rojo and Jones dives into tackles all the time. Something that should only be the last resort for a defender, not the only resort.
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Just seems like a giant waste of time to sign someone who will hardly ever play and is no better than what we already have. Rojo is still an Argentina international when fit.
 
Andersons Dietician said:
I do think he would be a very interesting player however you know when people say Smalling always has a mistake in him. This is what they’d say about Tah. Because he can be excellent and then other times he has some right gafs.

So I can only imagine what the CAF would make of him but he is certainly worth considering and if he gets his consistency and concentration sorted he could be one hell of a defender. Don’t know how much he’d be going for either but in this market I would think somewhere between 40-60 although I think I recall seeing something saying they want 80.

Still holding out hope we get DeLigt but If we can’t have him then I’d probably rather have Tah than Slabhead.
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Who cares what the caf would make of a player?
 
Lash said:
Yep, I feel sorry for Jones a bit. He’s obviously not anywhere near the level we need consistently, but he’s surely better than fecking Shane Duffy.

Just seems like a giant waste of time to sign someone who will hardly ever play and is no better than what we already have. Rojo is still an Argentina international when fit.
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I am not suggestion we sign Duffy, but in theory we would be better off with him as a backup compared to Rojo and Jones.
 
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