Casey Stoney has resigned

[Champ]

She was fed a promise that they'd be in their home base of a freshly renovated Cliff in season one. Then an excuse that the team might soon need better than the (not renovated) Cliff and that United were looking at bigger and better things for them. This isn't about a post covid financial hit, it's about three years of failure to give her the infrastructure that she was promised.

Part of the big picture story for the women's team was that we weren't going to spend big on the player (transfer/wages) budget. Instead we were going to focus on developing young players, and suppliment them with experience/talent to give us a stable path to success. The superior infrastructure and technical support from United was supposed to be our secret weapon.

In many ways, it feels like Casey got us in a position to challenge too fast. The Glazers were content not to take the PR hit of, "the other Premier League teams all have a women's team - so why don't United," and they've done that.

Now we need to give them the next PR hit - how about proper facilities that don't make even your budget conscious manager walk out on you.

My understanding was that The Cliff renovations would go longside the Carrington improvements that were mooted, this was announced late 2019 by Woodward, so a fair bit after Stoney got the job as manager, and a mere few months before the WSL was postponed that season.

This cutailment of the season and subsequent games without fans has ultimately hit United Womans team and the Club as an entity fairly hard, so it does seem fair that improvements mooted in November 2019 may not take place straight away.

The Cliff has had minor improvements last year, the pitches were completely relaid to improve conditions for the players.

I am in no way sticking up for the Glazers or Woodward here, but I am questioning Casey Stoneys decision, the fact that she is already in line for a job in America strikes me as an opportunity to use the current malaise and disiilusionment with the Womans team direction as an easy way out.

Hopefully the team can pull together and the Owners/Club put in the money needed to progress and make the right decision with the new manager.

 

[RUCK4444]

It doesn't look like it's a bump in the road, more like she's been promised improved infrastructure since the team was announced and absolutely nothing has been done for the team.

They've given them the bare minimum and she's managed to recruit well on a lower budget than the teams above her. Leicester are coming up this year and will have one of the best facilities in the womens game, they probably had a similar budget to her, Everton as well.

She's walked because she can't see it changing and she can get a better job in the NWSL without having to deal with this rubbish.

What are the facilities like then? Do we have pics?
I can’t imagine it’s shockingly bad surely?

Then again you never know with these owners.

 

[Wixqaz]

What are the facilities like then? Do we have pics?
I can’t imagine it’s shockingly bad surely?

Then again you never know with these owners.

I'm pretty sure thats the 'gym tent' and the pitch the women are training on is at the edge of Carrington - hense the walk to the toilets etc as they must be back in the main building and maybe even specific ones because of covid, not the closest ones. Just no thought gone into it.

Their pitches at LSV did look 'okay' to the naked eye, no undersoil heating on them but their gym there was in the concorse of the stadium so they had no set gym, previously they'd been using the public gym there but only half the squad could use it at a time as it was small. You can see bottles behind them in some of the videos are the start of the season. No idea on rehab.

 

[jojojo]

My understanding was that The Cliff renovations would go longside the Carrington improvements that were mooted, this was announced late 2019 by Woodward, so a fair bit after Stoney got the job as manager, and a mere few months before the WSL was postponed that season.

You've got some inside knowledge if that's your understanding. In March 2018, the club announced that The Cliff would be the women's training base and that they'd move in as soon as the renovation work was complete, which would be later that year.

Then we heard that the renovations were postponed pending a broader review of the club training facilities with the possibility of moving onto an expanded Carrington campus.

They fobbed off the fans with talk about a strategic vision that might include a stadium closer to OT, or at least on the Metro and that the Cliff might not be relevant at all, and the possibility that they might be able to integrate the team into Carrington. Then it was that they couldn't move to Carrington as part of the next round of renovation, but that was still the goal. Again with a vague statement that the Cliff would be ready to use soon.

If they fobbed Casey off with that as well, then it looks like her patience for "some day, sometime in the future" plans ran out.

 

[arthurka]

She moves to San Diego.

Weird because she renovates her house since 14 months.

That's not strange, I would do that in a flash. Manchester v San Diego is non comparable when it comes to where is nicer to live. She will love it there.

 

[jojojo]

I'm pretty sure thats the 'gym tent' and the pitch the women are training on is at the edge of Carrington - hense the walk to the toilets etc as they must be back in the main building and maybe even specific ones because of covid, not the closest ones. Just no thought gone into it.

Their pitches at LSV did look 'okay' to the naked eye, no undersoil heating on them but their gym there was in the concorse of the stadium so they had no set gym, previously they'd been using the public gym there but only half the squad could use it at a time as it was small. You can see bottles behind them in some of the videos are the start of the season. No idea on rehab.

I think the LSV pitches in general are ok. Not the same kind of smooth surface or the blend you get in the stadium, but ok artificial pitches. I think the complaints were the usual ones - when it was frozen or waterlogged the team had nowhere to relocate to for 5-a-side or whatever. Not sure what those Carrington pitches are like though, the focus there has always been on the men's first team pitches really.

I did wonder if the final straw at LSV came when the Leigh Rugby League team returned to training. They're the ones with the long-term contracts there. With covid controls, they may have become more dependant on the site. They've also gone full-time pro this season (promoted to the Super League) so that might have changed their needs as well.

We may never know the details, but we'll get a clue from who they recruit to take over and what our squad looks like next season. I've not given up hope on us - but Casey leaving definitely sounds like a warning.

 

[Ayush_reddevil]

This is really really bad . United women's team had no identity and I think it was perfect for us to have a young manger slowly bringing the team up with her . Having a young British female coach who kind of had a love for the team because she had built it all up was such a positive thing for United . My feeling is that United will now be more like Liverpool & Everton level rather than taking the next step to be one of the best in Europe

 

[Wixqaz]

This is really really bad . United women's team had no identity and I think it was perfect for us to have a young manger slowly bringing the team up with her . Having a young British female coach who kind of had a love for the team because she had built it all up was such a positive thing for United . My feeling is that United will now be more like Liverpool & Everton level rather than taking the next step to be one of the best in Europe

Yeah I'd worry it'll be a Liverpool situation. They hemorrhaged players in 2018 and made poor managerial choices, plus they just had a disregard for their womens team similar to what we've heard here (although worse so far). They were relegated last season and didn't get promoted this year, they sacked their manager in January and still haven't replaced her. Everton were on a downward and were well bottom of the table when Willie Kirk took over in Dec 2018 but they stayed up and he's improved the team massively since. They were sort of on their own tier in 5th this year and thats probably the best case level for United from now on, no closing in on Arsenal etc.

Neither would be great of course but Everton would be much better than dropping to Liverpool. That would just be an embarresment.

 

[RUCK4444]

I'm pretty sure thats the 'gym tent' and the pitch the women are training on is at the edge of Carrington - hense the walk to the toilets etc as they must be back in the main building and maybe even specific ones because of covid, not the closest ones. Just no thought gone into it.

Their pitches at LSV did look 'okay' to the naked eye, no undersoil heating on them but their gym there was in the concorse of the stadium so they had no set gym, previously they'd been using the public gym there but only half the squad could use it at a time as it was small. You can see bottles behind them in some of the videos are the start of the season. No idea on rehab.

Hmmm not the best is it.

This is a real shame if it’s the real reason she’s moving on. Should have been rectified before getting to this point of losing the manager.

 

[Van Piorsing]

They couldn't even piss in the shower, since there also was no such thing.

Degrading to say the least, this club is a facade. The level of neglect is real.

 

[freeurmind]

Anyone and anything that defends the owners of this club needs to be thrown in the garbage.

 

[The Paddock]

Firstly, thanks to Casey Stoney for doing a great job. Absolutely gutted that she has decided to step down. This is terrible news for the women's team. I fear an exodus now, certainly from the top players in the squad, unless a top coach is brought in and honestly, is that going to happen ? Maybe her vision and facility requirements were never going to be implemented and if that's that case then it's a shocker. I would hate this team to go the way of Liverpool women. Look at Chelsea, City and Arsenal as to what's needed in terms of resources in the WSL and if Utd women is nowhere near no wonder she's called it a day.

 

[Champ]

You've got some inside knowledge if that's your understanding. In March 2018, the club announced that The Cliff would be the women's training base and that they'd move in as soon as the renovation work was complete, which would be later that year.

Then we heard that the renovations were postponed pending a broader review of the club training facilities with the possibility of moving onto an expanded Carrington campus.

They fobbed off the fans with talk about a strategic vision that might include a stadium closer to OT, or at least on the Metro and that the Cliff might not be relevant at all, and the possibility that they might be able to integrate the team into Carrington. Then it was that they couldn't move to Carrington as part of the next round of renovation, but that was still the goal. Again with a vague statement that the Cliff would be ready to use soon.

If they fobbed Casey off with that as well, then it looks like her patience for "some day, sometime in the future" plans ran out.

No inside knowledge needed, Woodward himself publicly stated that things would be improved moving forward around the end of November 2019.

Personally I think She was probably sold a dream which was with good intentions, but the pandemic led to issues in fulfilling that dream.
I could be massively wrong, but that how it looks and feels to me.

No club, not even City, gets everything they want after three seasons, especially with the situation being what it is.

 

[jojojo]

No inside knowledge needed, Woodward himself publicly stated that things would be improved moving forward around the end of November 2019.

Personally I think She was probably sold a dream which was with good intentions, but the pandemic led to issues in fulfilling that dream.
I could be massively wrong, but that how it looks and feels to me.

No club, not even City, gets everything they want after three seasons, especially with the situation being what it is.

She'd already been waiting for 18 months by then, after the initial set of promises.

 

[Champ]

She'd already been waiting for 18 months by then, after the initial set of promises.

I can't comment on that as I have no idea on what was promised to Her during contract negotiations,

I am only going by the publicly forwarded timeline by Woodward, which was announced as I say in November 2019.

I think a little realism is needed here, the Woman's team was built from scratch, literally no team, facilities or accomodation or anything, so to be where they are in just 3/4 years is incredible.

I believe, with no evidence of course, that Casey Stoney probably had one eye on another job, whilst not getting the demands she issued met by the Club, leading to a perfect storm in which to leave.

Murtough has stated that the Woman's team is still paramount to the club and that they will continue to progress which is a good sign.

As someone who is more knowledgeable than me about the woman's team, do you have any idea who the club may target next?

 

[elmo]

I am not an apologist for the cnuts but we did lose a £100M last year. At some point, anyone who runs a P&L will understand that there have to be sacrifices made -- if revenues are down by 25% (due to matchday) and now sponsors are pulling out.

Our money don't grow from the ground unlike the other side.

We need to spend big on summer transfers, then big on refurbishing OT, big on salaries and now women's infrastructure.... at some point you just cant afford to do all of the above.

Choices need to be made.

That's just excuses.

The training facilities and stadium problems have been there since they took over and they did feck all about it. It's not like these problems are new and the covid situation prevented them from doing anything about it.

The only consistent choice they've done is to take out their share of the dividends and pay out the loan.

 

[Wixqaz]

I can't comment on that as I have no idea on what was promised to Her during contract negotiations,

I am only going by the publicly forwarded timeline by Woodward, which was announced as I say in November 2019.

I think a little realism is needed here, the Woman's team was built from scratch, literally no team, facilities or accomodation or anything, so to be where they are in just 3/4 years is incredible.

I believe, with no evidence of course, that Casey Stoney probably had one eye on another job, whilst not getting the demands she issued met by the Club, leading to a perfect storm in which to leave.

Murtough has stated that the Woman's team is still paramount to the club and that they will continue to progress which is a good sign.

As someone who is more knowledgeable than me about the woman's team, do you have any idea who the club may target next?

The information about the Cliff is literally said in the announcement from March 2018. Repeated multiple times in the subsequent months.

 

[jojojo]

I think a little realism is needed here, the Woman's team was built from scratch, literally no team, facilities or accomodation or anything, so to be where they are in just 3/4 years is incredible.

It was United who said that they waited until 2018 before launching the team, "so they could do it right." The went on to explain they planned for the Cliff to become a home for the team and that renovation work was underway. They still don't have facilities or accommodation - they do have a team though. The test now is what do they have next season.

 

[Champ]

The information about the Cliff is literally said in the announcement from March 2018. Repeated multiple times in the subsequent months.

It was United who said that they waited until 2018 before launching the team, "so they could do it right." The went on to explain they planned for the Cliff to become a home for the team and that renovation work was underway. They still don't have facilities or accommodation - they do have a team though. The test now is what do they have next season.

I see no mention of Cliff renovations in any announcements?! Merely that they will be based there.

The only mention of any Cliff renovations was from November 2019 as previously mentioned.

I have obviously missed something here.

 

[Wixqaz]

I see no mention of Cliff renovations in any announcements?! Merely that they will be based there.

The only mention of any Cliff renovations was from November 2019 as previously mentioned.

I have obviously missed something here.

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2018-05-29/manchester-united-get-womens-championship-licence

The team will be called ‘Manchester United Women’ and will be based at The Cliff, the club’s training ground in Salford, once redevelopment work has been completed.

https://www.manutd.com/en/news/deta...ens-championship-after-successful-application

The team will be called ‘Manchester United Women’ and will be based at The Cliff, the club’s historic training ground in Salford, once redevelopment work has been completed.

Do I need to get more for you?

 

[Champ]

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2018-05-29/manchester-united-get-womens-championship-licence

The team will be called ‘Manchester United Women’ and will be based at The Cliff, the club’s training ground in Salford, once redevelopment work has been completed.

https://www.manutd.com/en/news/deta...ens-championship-after-successful-application

The team will be called ‘Manchester United Women’ and will be based at The Cliff, the club’s historic training ground in Salford, once redevelopment work has been completed.

Do I need to get more for you?

Those redevelopment plans were the relaying of pitches if I understand correctly.

No mention of any major redevelopment was mentioned until late 2019. Again, maybe I'm wrong.

 

[RORY65]

Those redevelopment plans were the relaying of pitches if I understand correctly.

No mention of any major redevelopment was mentioned until late 2019. Again, maybe I'm wrong.

The word redevelopment literally in the statement isn't a bit of a giveaway?

 

[Champ]

The word redevelopment literally in the statement isn't a bit of a giveaway?

It's quite ambiguous without any semantics, it could literally mean anything.
They consistently call relaying of the pitches at the Cliff 'renovation' work, and the pitches get relaid end of May.

 

[RORY65]

It's quite ambiguous without any semantics, it could literally mean anything.
They consistently call relaying of the pitches at the Cliff 'renovation' work, and the pitches get relaid end of May.

If it was literally that then they would have been training there, unless you think it takes 3 years to relay a pitch. I'm not sure why you're going into the semantics of "major redevelopment" or just " redevelopment" or why you're trying so hard to defend the club, they just lied and seemingly Casey got fed up of the bullshit.

 

[Champ]

If it was literally that then they would have been training there, unless you think it takes 3 years to relay a pitch. I'm not sure why you're going into the semantics of "major redevelopment" or just " redevelopment" or why you're trying so hard to defend the club, they just lied and seemingly Casey got fed up of the bullshit.

Feck Me, why do people start trying to call people out for 'defending the club' on here, ridiculous.

I'm defending no one, just feel that people have been too quick to judge the club on this occasion.

The club have literally said that they plan to incorporate academy, Woman's team and the men's team into Carrington, but the pandemic has led to delays with this plan. Not an unthinkable scenario.

 

[Wixqaz]

Those redevelopment plans were the relaying of pitches if I understand correctly.

No mention of any major redevelopment was mentioned until late 2019. Again, maybe I'm wrong.

You honestly think that in the announcement of a new team "redevelopment" means relaying a pitch? You think that takes 3 years to complete? The team never moved to the Cliff for outdoor training until this year for minimal days.

I just give up now. Believe what you like.

 

[RORY65]

Feck Me, why do people start trying to call people out for 'defending the club' on here, ridiculous.

I'm defending no one, just feel that people have been too quick to judge the club on this occasion.

The club have literally said that they plan to incorporate academy, Woman's team and the men's team into Carrington, but the pandemic has led to delays with this plan. Not an unthinkable scenario.

Your argument is that despite the official statement from March 2018 stating that the team would move to the Cliff once redevelopment was completed that this might have just been the pitches being relaid but this may have been delayed due to the pandemic. How can you seriously make that argument?

 

[Lightbringer]

From the ladies performance coach Elle Turner:


elle_turner04

"They say you don’t know what you’ve got until it’s gone... but we knew exactly what we had and appreciated it more than anything every single day

Here has been and is special because of @caseystoney
The best person, coach, manager, mentor, leader who always selflessly put her team first. Even now.

It’s been the best most memorable 3 years of my life through the highs and lows of football... devastated it’s cut so short!

Thank you for everything!"

 

[Grande]

If Casey Stoney has too much ambition for Manchester United (Glazers), what does that tell us about Manchester United (Glazers) (that we didn’t already know)?

 

[R77]

If Casey Stoney has too much ambition for Manchester United (Glazers), what does that tell us about Manchester United (Glazers) (that we didn’t already know)?

It's even worse than that. Failure to provide basic facilities of an acceptable standard paints a grim picture. Combined with stuff we already knew, it really makes you wonder as to the extent of neglect throughout.

 

[Grande]

It's even worse than that. Failure to provide basic facilities of an acceptable standard paints a grim picture. Combined with stuff we already knew, it really makes you wonder as to the extent of neglect throughout.

I thunk John Murtaugh needs to answer this question as well as the Glazers.

 

[Member 105568]

Wouldn’t it be better just putting all resources into the men’s team? Fergie thought women’s football was a distraction, didn’t he?

 

[arthurka]

Wouldn’t it be better just putting all resources into the men’s team? Fergie thought women’s football was a distraction, didn’t he?

Times have changed and it was about time we got on with it.

 

[Wixqaz]

This is not a woman who's got a better job offer.



I hope there's not an NDA in her contract. I think we need to know whether the whole club is the issue, it's individuals (Woodward/Murtough etc) or is it just the owners. Cause that to me is someone who never wanted to leave but has been pushed to the limit.

 

[madi5h]

i think that looks exactly like a women who got a better offer.
sad but at peace, doesnt seem angry or frustrated,

just my opinion though, obviously if we have to lose her, i would prefer it was more fuel on the glazer fire

 

[RORY65]

This is not a woman who's got a better job offer.



I hope there's not an NDA in her contract. I think we need to know whether the whole club is the issue, it's individuals (Woodward/Murtough etc) or is it just the owners. Cause that to me is someone who never wanted to leave but has been pushed to the limit.

Even if it is a better offer what does that say that a club that calls itself the biggest in the world and apparently took so long to get back into women's football as they wanted to do it right can't match the offer of an expansion team? I'm glad that it looks like her options will be good but it's still a shame that she seemingly wanted to create something special with us and has lost faith in that possibility.

 

[Wixqaz]

Even if it is a better offer what does that say that a club that calls itself the biggest in the world and apparently took so long to get back into women's football as they wanted to do it right can't match the offer of an expansion team? I'm glad that it looks like her options will be good but it's still a shame that she seemingly wanted to create something special with us and has lost faith in that possibility.

If it's San Diego she goes to (as is the rumour), they've only just taken over from Sacremento for the expansion. They don't have a Stadium and will be playing at a 6k college one, they have no set facilities and their current staff is just Jill Ellis. They don't even know for sure if they'll start in 2022 and Angel City are starting at the same time. Angel City have all the fans, setup and big name owners, they've got all the publicity and media.

The fact that a team with nothing, and one very likely to be 2nd choice to everyone next year is a better prospect for her than Manchester United says everything about how things are there. It's a box ticking exercise and one they never intended to actually rival the top 3 teams. I'm very disappointed in the whole thing.

 

[Grande]

This is not a woman who's got a better job offer.



I hope there's not an NDA in her contract. I think we need to know whether the whole club is the issue, it's individuals (Woodward/Murtough etc) or is it just the owners. Cause that to me is someone who never wanted to leave but has been pushed to the limit.

I really hope some of the journos who followed up on the ‘when are United going to join the train on women’s football’ follows this up, like Suzanne Wrack/Guardian and others. Uncomfortable questions needs to be asked - and answers publicized - to avoid left hand plays from Glazers/Woodward/Murtaugh regarding this. Like I said - if any of them have lower ambitions than Stoney, it’s them who needs to go and she who needs to stay.

 

[Jippy]

Wouldn’t it be better just putting all resources into the men’s team? Fergie thought women’s football was a distraction, didn’t he?

Here's a thought- if you don't care about women's football, stay out of the women's football threads.

 

[Wixqaz]