[Irrational.]

He’s just a different class. The commentators mentioned it and I noticed as well that without Kroos or Modric next to him he’s more adventurous in his play and takes more responsibility.

I expect him to start vs Arse.

 

[arthurka]

Love the guy, can´t do no wrong.

 

[fellwin]

We've not seen one touch forward passes like this since Carrick. Tears in my eyes.

I was certain I remembered several poor passes from him directly to Leicester, but nothing in the video? Seems unfair to compare him to our other midfielders if only include the good stuff he did

 

[Relevated]

We've not seen one touch forward passes like this since Carrick. Tears in my eyes.

This forum seems to be full of perfectionists. We haven't seen passes like these for many moons.

 

[tariqo]

Class

 

[Lecland07]

Quality player - the sooner he can become a regular starter the better.

 

[Adam-Utd]

This forum seems to be full of perfectionists. We haven't seen passes like these for many moons.

It's the fifa/football manager generation. Miss 1 pass and you're rubbish, it's getting a bit tiresome tbh.

That was a very good performance.

 

[Olecurls99]

He’s just a different class. The commentators mentioned it and I noticed as well that without Kroos or Modric next to him he’s more adventurous in his play and takes more responsibility.

I expect him to start vs Arse.

He always played like that.

I don't know where this notion of him being a pure grunt Vinny Jones came from.

He's a world class midfielder

 

[Fortitude]

One of the reasons to bring him here is that forcing of the bar upward; he knows nothing but success and being in and around winners. His quality shouldn’t be in question, but that experience and intrinsic know-how of his really will be invaluable to us.

 

[Jcrossley94]

One of the reasons to bring him here is that forcing of the bar upward; he knows nothing but success and being in and around winners. His quality shouldn’t be in question, but that experience and intrinsic know-how of his really will be invaluable to us.

Agree with this. however we have had a few players over the past few years with good winning pedigrees who have failed to make that impact on the players around them. (Schweinsteiger/DiMaria/Ibrahimovic/Sanchez etc - sure you could make arguments for and against some of those btw)

Hoping EtH can change the mentality of the squad to get them in a position where he can be in a position to force the bar upwards. theres definitely a spine in there of Ronaldo/Casemiro/Varane if we can harness it.

 

[Bondi77]

Love the guy, can´t do no wrong.

So he does nothing right

 

[In Rainbows]

We've not seen one touch forward passes like this since Carrick. Tears in my eyes.

Can Mctominay fans finally understand our frustration? The difference is the standard we've been holding him to.

 

[Red Rash]

Nice cameo by him and it's so refreshing to have a world class midfielder in his prime. The way he receives the ball and tries to start attacks quickly is going to be vital for us to improve our attacking phase of the game compared to what we see with McTominay and Fred.

I don't think we will see it often but I'd love us to try a midfield 3 of Casemiro, Eriksen and VDB as I think this is a midfield that could control games.

 

[JPRouve]

Oh, God. He's so bad and we're stuck with him.

He's very lucky that Maddison wasted that free kick. Lost the ball so cheaply too many times.

Not to pile on but this post is symptomatic of a larger trend among Football followers who somehow expect perfection. Footballers rarely have flawless games, top central midfielders in particular the ones that have the ball relatively deep in their own half lose the ball cheaply and in a dangerous area probably once a game if not more either through a poor pass, a tackle or a poor touch. Also an other issue that I noticed people need to keep in mind that attackers miss the target a fair amount of times and they also often don't take the optimal option, that includes top players.

 

[Borys]

Nice cameo by him and it's so refreshing to have a world class midfielder in his prime. The way he receives the ball and tries to start attacks quickly is going to be vital for us to improve our attacking phase of the game compared to what we see with McTominay and Fred.

I don't think we will see it often but I'd love us to try a midfield 3 of Casemiro, Eriksen and VDB as I think this is a midfield that could control games.

Absolutely. Our transition has already been better but Casemiro will be a game changer.

 

[Xaviboy]

We've not seen one touch forward passes like this since Carrick. Tears in my eyes.

His 1st pass in that video, around the corner to Eriksen

 

[Posh Red]

Can Mctominay fans finally understand our frustration? The difference is the standard we've been holding him to.

Agreed. McTominay has a great attitude and has done well so far this season, but the difference in class is there for all to see. To be honest McTominay looks far more comfortable further up the pitch anyway.

 

[Luka Mora]

Casemiro 90 percent of time, always knows what to do with the ball before receiving it. He also brings a physical presence fighting spirit and calmness in the middle of the park. Last night he protected the defence and gave them some reprieve after leiscter brought on two strikers to pull the game back. He will do what Martinez helped do with our defence to our midfield, and that’s bring organisation, composure and control

He can potentially also be a great mentor for mctominay who can learn how to be able to pick a pass forward to keep momentum with the team, instead of opting for the safe backwards or side ways pass to the nearest teammate, which more often than not invites pressure

 

[Escobar]

So much better than anything we have seen in midfield in the past 10 years

 

[JPRouve]

Casemiro 90 percent of time, always knows what to do with the ball before receiving it. He also brings a physical presence fighting spirit and calmness in the middle of the park. Last night he protected the defence and gave them some reprieve after leiscter brought on two strikers to pull the game back. He will do what Martinez helped do with our defence to our midfield, and that’s bring organisation, composure and control

He can potentially also be a great mentor for mctominay who can learn how to be able to pick a pass forward to keep momentum with the team, instead of opting for the safe backwards or side ways pass to the nearest teammate, which more often than not invites pressure

McTominay is 25, there is no mentorship or drastic technical/mentality changes that we should expect.

 

[Fortitude]

Agree with this. however we have had a few players over the past few years with good winning pedigrees who have failed to make that impact on the players around them. (Schweinsteiger/DiMaria/Ibrahimovic/Sanchez etc - sure you could make arguments for and against some of those btw)

Hoping EtH can change the mentality of the squad to get them in a position where he can be in a position to force the bar upwards. theres definitely a spine in there of Ronaldo/Casemiro/Varane if we can harness it.

I hope the level can be elevated rather than him being dragged down to a lower mean - at the very least, he can marshal the midfield and be the general in a manner we haven’t seen in a literal age. There’s a lot for every single midfielder here to learn from him - he tells them to go here or there, and they do it, should be the theme. It’s different to the players you’ve listed outside of Schweinsteiger because of position. This is one of, if not the most, catalytic positions on the pitch - a central hub that so much goes through and is governed by - without him, Kroos and Modric don’t even get the ball; without him the CB’s are exposed, and so on and so forth, so it’s exactly the same for us and he should be seen as a vital conduit because, as the player he’s coming here as, he is.

A spine should have at least one point of governance straight through its key points GK, CB’s, CM’s and CF - if you’re an elite team, AM, too - we’ve seemingly got two at the back now and Casemiro should be precisely that in midfield. We’re obviously short at CF (you mention Ronaldo, but I am not sure at his age and with the frequency of games), but it is still one hell of an uptake for a summer.

Not sure what others expect from him, but for me, he has it in him to be utterly transformative for this team - the dictating central midfielder is one of the strongest threads throughout the history of the sport and I expect him to be one of a long line of them that turns a team from one thing into something wholly different.

 

[Jcrossley94]

I hope the level can be elevated rather than him being dragged down to a lower mean - at the very least, he can marshal the midfield and be the general in a manner we haven’t seen in a literal age. There’s a lot for every single midfielder here to learn from him - he tells them to go here or there, and they do it, should be the theme. It’s different to the players you’ve listed outside of Schweinsteiger because of position. This is one of, if not the most, catalytic positions on the pitch - a central hub that so much goes through and is governed by - without him, Kroos and Modric don’t even get the ball; without him the CB’s are exposed, and so on and so forth, so it’s exactly the same for us and he should be seen as a vital conduit because, as the player he’s coming here as, he is.

A spine should have at least one point of governance straight through its key points GK, CB’s, CM’s and CF - if you’re an elite team, AM, too - we’ve seemingly got two at the back now and Casemiro should be precisely that in midfield. We’re obviously short at CF (you mention Ronaldo, but I am not sure at his age and with the frequency of games), but it is still one hell of an uptake for a summer.

Not sure what others expect from him, but for me, he has it in him to be utterly transformative for this team - the dictating central midfielder is one of the strongest threads throughout the history of the sport and I expect him to be one of a long line of them that turns a team from one thing into something wholly different.

Sincerely hope you're right. Think you hit the nail on the head when you suggest hoping he can elevate rather than be dragged down to a lower level, which is whats happened in recent years to players at the club.

have to say the signs are looking good, 3 B2B wins has a huge impact on confidence, can see it in the way the back 4 are celebrating blocks and tackles.

 

[Fortitude]

Sincerely hope you're right. Think you hit the nail on the head when you suggest hoping he can elevate rather than be dragged down to a lower level, which is whats happened in recent years to players at the club.

have to say the signs are looking good, 3 B2B wins has a huge impact on confidence, can see it in the way the back 4 are celebrating blocks and tackles.

Fingers crossed. Erase the old attitudes and replace them with as many fighters and winners as you can.

 

[Luka Mora]

McTominay is 25, there is no mentorship or drastic technical/mentality changes that we should expect.

There is no cut off period where as soon as a player hits their mid-twenties they can't improve their game, mentality and technical ability to become better all around player.

Some of the best players in the world were average in their mid twenties and managed to have improved their game. Obviously Mctominay's ceiling is no where near high enough where he becomes a great midfielder who is named along the best, so I wont name all those players who improved their game after 25. A better comparison, would be Henderson was considered a hopeless dud at Liverpool, with many people wondering what purposed he served. He was passenger most games and did not display of the leadership qualities until klopp found a place for him in his system and surrounded him with better players.

You can even argue limited player likes Milner suddenly made drastic improvement and became integral part to Liverpool.

Besides all that I'm a lot of midfielders usually hit their prime around 27-30 years of old.

 

[Jcrossley94]

There is no cut off period where as soon as a player hits their mid-twenties they can't improve their game, mentality and technical ability to become better all around player.

Some of the best players in the world were average in their mid twenties and managed to have improved their game. Obviously Mctominay's ceiling is no where near high enough where he becomes a great midfielder who is named along the best, so I wont name all those players who improved their game after 25. A better comparison, would be Henderson was considered a hopeless dud at Liverpool, with many people wondering what purposed he served. He was passenger most games and did not display of the leadership qualities until klopp found a place for him in his system and surrounded him with better players.

You can even argue limited player likes Milner suddenly made drastic improvement and became integral part to Liverpool.

Besides all that I'm a lot of midfielders usually hit their prime around 27-30 years of old.

Modric didnt move to Madrid until he was 26... Clearly a very different player but you'd be silly to suggest he hasnt improved incrementally year on year

 

[Real Name]

Can Mctominay fans finally understand our frustration?

Who?

 

[JPRouve]

There is no cut off period where as soon as a player hits their mid-twenties they can't improve their game, mentality and technical ability to become better all around player.

Some of the best players in the world were average in their mid twenties and managed to have improved their game. Obviously Mctominay's ceiling is no where near high enough where he becomes a great midfielder who is named along the best, so I wont name all those players who improved their game after 25. A better comparison, would be Henderson was considered a hopeless dud at Liverpool, with many people wondering what purposed he served. He was passenger most games and did not display of the leadership qualities until klopp found a place for him in his system and surrounded him with better players.

You can even argue limited player likes Milner suddenly made drastic improvement and became integral part to Liverpool.

Besides all that I'm a lot of midfielders usually hit their prime around 27-30 years of old.

Neither Milner nor Henderson made drastic improvements when they joined Liverpool, that's totally removed from reality. I like to criticize Henderson but outside of his first season at Liverpool he was a good player that improved every year from 2012 to 2020. Milner was also a starter and pretty good player for City, he didn't make a drastic improvement when he joined Liverpool, he was excellent for Villa and then generally good to very good for City.

 

[Sylar]

Happy to have him. And to think we were close to having Rabiot instead

 

[JPRouve]

Modric didnt move to Madrid until he was 26... Clearly a very different player but you'd be silly to suggest he hasnt improved incrementally year on year

And Modric was one of the PL best player, he had all the tools and refined his game as a deep lying playmaker. He didn't drastically develop.

 

[Massive Spanner]

I think he'll start against Arsenal, replacing Elanga. Scotty will move to a further up role and Bruno will move out left. It worked pretty well yesterday when he came on.

 

[Jcrossley94]

And Modric was one of the PL best player, he had all the tools and refined his game as a deep lying playmaker. He didn't drastically develop.

just so i understand, you dont think Modric improved as a player from leaving Spurs until the point he won the Balon D'Or ?

 

[JPRouve]

just so i understand, you dont think Modric improved as a player from leaving Spurs until the point he won the Balon D'Or ?

How did you come to that conclusion? I said that he didn't drastically improve, because he didn't, Modric was one of the best midfielders around when he was at Spurs and while he refined his game, he didn't drastically develop. The way you are putting it, you would think that he was at McTominay's level and became a world class player which isn't the case. Also it wasn't through mentorship but part of the same growth that he has shown every seasons of his career.

The point being that Henderson, Milner and Modric all showed high level quality and consistency way before 25 years old, none of them drastically developed through mentorship during the second part of their 20s.

 

[Jcrossley94]

How did you come to that conclusion? I said that he didn't drastically improve, because he didn't, Modric was one of the best midfielders around when he was at Spurs and while he refined his game, he didn't drastically develop. The way you are putting it, you would think that he was at McTominay's level and became a world class player which isn't the case. Also it wasn't through mentorship but part of the same growth that he has shown every seasons of his career.

The point being that Henderson, Milner and Modric all showed high level quality and consistency way before 25 years old, none of them drastically developed through mentorship during the second part of their 20s.

I didnt come to that conclusion, Hence why i asked you to qualify. You said he didnt "drastically develop" i very clearly stated in my post, that hes obviously a very different player to Mctominay, not sure if its a strawman argument to claim i think they're comparable in ability. i was just using him as an example of a player who improved post 25.

he might have been one of the best midfielders in the PL when he was at Spurs, but i think its incredibly disingenuous to suggest he didnt drastically develop between when he arrived to when he won the Balon D'or.

I dont understand how you draw a difference between growing as a player, and developing, theyre both synonyms for each other.

 

[facund]

Solid cameo that helped wrestle back control of the game and secure a result.
He's going to be a transformative player for this team once he settles in.

 

[JPRouve]

I didnt come to that conclusion, Hence why i asked you to qualify. You said he didnt "drastically develop" i very clearly stated in my post, that hes obviously a very different player to Mctominay, not sure if its a strawman argument to claim i think they're comparable in ability. i was just using him as an example of a player who improved post 25.

he might have been one of the best midfielders in the PL when he was at Spurs, but i think its incredibly disingenuous to suggest he didnt drastically develop between when he arrived to when he won the Balon D'or.

I dont understand how you draw a difference between growing as a player, and developing, theyre both synonyms for each other.

I didn't draw any difference, I don't really get your point but I can see that you are somehow ignoring the point that I made which is centered around the word drastic. I didn't tell you that a player won't improve and I didn't use the term drastically just for the sake of it.
And no Modric didn't drastically develop between the 2012 and 2018, he was one of the best midfielders in the world in 2012 and was still one of the best midfielders in the world in 2018. Also the Ballon d'Or means very little when it comes to player's development, it only tells that you that he had a very good season which was highlighted by an excellent 2018 WC, interestingly Modric was also recognized for his 2008 Euro.

 

[The_Midfielder]

Let's play him and McT against Arsenal and sucker punch them

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

Has to start against Arsenal.

 

[DWelbz19]

Not to pile on but this post is symptomatic of a larger trend among Football followers who somehow expect perfection. Footballers rarely have flawless games, top central midfielders in particular the ones that have the ball relatively deep in their own half lose the ball cheaply and in a dangerous area probably once a game if not more either through a poor pass, a tackle or a poor touch. Also an other issue that I noticed people need to keep in mind that attackers miss the target a fair amount of times and they also often don't take the optimal option, that includes top players.

That’s an interesting point. Do you think it’s easier for a defensive/central midfield player to be perceived as having a bad game than an attacking player is?

 

[flameinthesun]

I was certain I remembered several poor passes from him directly to Leicester, but nothing in the video? Seems unfair to compare him to our other midfielders if only include the good stuff he did

You are right, on about 3 occasions he turned over the ball in midfield which led to Leicester putting pressure on us. He played good when he came on, nothing special. People will see what they want to see, he's played maybe a half of football in total so far, so not enough minutes to say he's great or he's bad. Both sides need to give him time to have a run of games before labelling him great or bad.

 

[JPRouve]

That’s an interesting point. Do you think it’s easier for a defensive/central midfield player to be perceived as having a bad game than an attacking player is?

I think so, it seems that people are more likely to label a regular 'poor' action as a mistake when they are looking at defenders while the term unlucky is more often used for attackers. Now I would say that in both cases people expect too much consistency of outcomes which is a bit baffling because if defenders were perfect no goals would be scored and if attackers were perfect dozens of goals would be scored per games. The narratives that people follow make no sense.