Can ETH get us scoring 80 league goals in his first season?

Skills

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I think the defence will improve automatically because it was historically bad last season. Our goals scored last season weren't out of family with our other seasons post Fergie:

21/22 : 57
20/21 : 73
19/20 : 66
18/19 : 65
17/18 : 68
16/17 : 54
15/16 : 49
14/15 : 62
13/14 : 64

So this is where Ten Haag really needs to show his magic, and can really separate himself from the other pretenders we've had on the job.

Klopp got 78 in his first season (2 short but still more than any season we've managed since Sir Alex) and Guardiola got bang on 80.
 
Skills said:
I think the defence will improve automatically because it was historically bad last season. Our goals scored last season weren't out of family with our other seasons post Fergie:

21/22 : 57
20/21 : 73
19/20 : 66
18/19 : 65
17/18 : 68
16/17 : 54
15/16 : 49
14/15 : 62
13/14 : 64

So this is where Ten Haag really needs to show his magic, and can really separate himself from the other pretenders we've had on the job.

Klopp got 78 in his first season (2 short but still more than any season we've managed since Sir Alex) and Guardiola got bang on 80.
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A big jump from 57. A tall order. We should be pleased with 70+ I guess.
 
Seeing that list and Klopp not getting 80 goals in his first season either... No I don't think so.

btw it's Ten Hag*
 
no. unless he’s registered as a player fa rules prevent him taking to the field. and even if we do register him as a player, 80 goals for a player in a single season is unheard of, especially one of his age.
 
80 goals would great. Would require a big contribution from Rashford though (as we’re currently lacking goals across the front three)

80 goals probably cements top 4, so ye - it should be primary target. We don’t want top 4 playing shit football as the cycle continues.
 
It's too much to ask, where are the goals coming from? In a more cohesive side I see this at absolute best:

Ronaldo - 20 Goals
Fernandes - 10-15 Goals
Sancho - 10 Goals
Rashford - 10 Goals
Elanga - 5 Goals
Defensive Midfield and Defence - 10 Goals collaboratively.

So at very best I would wager 65-70 goals. Even then, I feel I'm asking too much of Sancho who isn't too much of a goalscorer. We don't have a Son or Mane type player to be a 20+ goal support act.
 
Ronaldo 20+
Bruno 12-15

Good luck getting 45 from the rest unless we sign two goalscoring forwards.
 
No chance. We have one reliable goalscorer who is a declining 37 year old.

Can't help think the expectations of what Ten Hag can do with this squad are far too high.
 
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Possible, just not too probable at the moment. Even if Bruno & Ronaldo will provide 20 goals each, we have tons of other players that need to chip in and they won't because of quality & commitment issues. Also some elements of the squad could have problems with understanding ETH's upcoming system.

Our problems reach deeper than just lack of sharp finishing. We've spend almost whole last season inviting pressure that distracted entire team from creating.

We have two months to fix multiple dimensions of this team before going on scoring even up to 70 goals. Not that much of time, tbh, but still anticipating something positive will happen.
 
MyOnlySolskjaer said:
It's too much to ask, where are the goals coming from? In a more cohesive side I see this at absolute best:

Ronaldo - 20 Goals
Fernandes - 10-15 Goals
Sancho - 10 Goals
Rashford - 10 Goals
Elanga - 5 Goals
Defensive Midfield and Defence - 10 Goals collaboratively.

So at very best I would wager 65-70 goals. Even then, I feel I'm asking too much of Sancho who isn't too much of a goalscorer. We don't have a Son or Mane type player to be a 20+ goal support act.
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That's not really the right way to look at it tbh. You're basically saying you have no faith in Ten Hag to be able to be to get the team creating more chances. Raheem Sterling is in noway shape or form a 17+ league goal scorer - but he's peppered that total for Guardiola multiple times. Ten Haag should be be able to get one or more of those scoring more goals than what they're currently expected of
 
Skills said:
That's not really the right way to look at it tbh. You're basically saying you have no faith in Ten Hag to be able to be to get the team creating more chances. Raheem Sterling is in noway shape or form a 17+ league goal scorer - but he's peppered that total for Guardiola multiple times. Ten Haag should be be able to get one or more of those scoring more goals than what they're currently expected of
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If you envision Elanga being a 20+ goalscorer next season, I won't stop you from believing this. We're not going to have De Bruyne, Bernardo Silva and Rodri to support our attack next season so there's only so much these attackers can exceed their usual output, it'll take us a long time to build a squad that level. What I posted was quite a generous output as well, each of them with much more than they produced this season. It's not the manager I don't have faith in. It's the ceiling of the players, I've seen each of them at their very best and also seen them down tools.
 
Is it possible? Yes.
But while i think ETH is the right guy for the job, i think it is important to keep an eye out for how big the job is. I've got zero expectations for next season. It is all about getting players in and out, and trying to get the ones here to get used to his ways.
 
MyOnlySolskjaer said:
That's not what I'm saying at all. If you envision Elanga being a 20+ goalscorer next season I won't stop you from believing this. We're not going to have De Bruyne, Bernardo Silva and Rodri to support our attack next season so there's only so much these attackers can exceed their targets, it'll take us a long time to build a squad that level. What I posted was quite a generous output as well. It's not the manager I don't have faith in. It's the ceiling of the players, I've seen each of them at their very best and also seen them down tools.
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You've seen this team have a historically bad season and have managed to come to the conclusion this is their ceiling? So do you think there was any point of us moving on from Ole or Rangnick, if you don't think our goal totals as a team or individually aren't going to be effected?
 
Didn’t realise how low we have scored. 49 goals one season :lol:
 
Skills said:
You've seen this team have a historically bad season and have managed to come to the conclusion this is their ceiling? So do you think there was any point of us moving on from Ole or Rangnick, if you don't think our goal totals as a team or individually aren't going to be effected?
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I'm of the view that the majority of these players aren't fit to wear the shirt. We've got a good man in charge but now we've slowly got to weed out a lot of the toxic individuals. It'll take time but will need to be done, the manner they gave up was probably the worst for me and combine that with apology tweets every single week, are these guys really the right mentality for you? What they did this season was pathetic.
 
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A lot depends on who we sign I think. No - from current squad members but if we sign a good attacker then maybe.

Also, it depends somewhat on what happens later this month with our currently suspended forward.
 
Before 80 goals, we need to see if ETH can make these players run.
 
MyOnlySolskjaer said:
I'm of the view that the majority of these players aren't fit to wear the shirt. We've got a good man in charge but now we've slowly got to weed out a lot of the toxic individuals. It'll take time but will need to be done, I don't think these players that post apology tweets every single week are the right mentality. What they did this season was pathetic.
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So what part of Erik Ten Hag's management do you actually have faith in then? Doesn't seem like you particularly rate him as a coach?

Is it his recruitment - something that he had little influence at a club like Ajax?
 
But in answer:

Ronaldo - 20
New striker - 15
Bruno - 15
Greenwood* - 10
Sancho - 10
VdB: 5

Can’t see 80 tbh
 
Doubt it.

As the OP highlights, 80 goals would be our best goal returns in a decade. Expecting ETH to get us returning at that level in his very first season is a bit much. Hell, we've only broken the 70 goal barrier once in that time.

Even more so when you consider the make-up of our current attack. Our principal goalscorer is Ronaldo, who is at an age where you can't bank on him to play week in and comes with obvious flaws that impact our overall attack as well. Then followed by other attackers you wouldn't exactly put the house on based on recent form.
 
Lay said:
Didn’t realise how low we have scored. 49 goals one season :lol:
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That was LVG's 2nd season. Apart from the appalling football, we didn't have any goalscorers except Martial and an ageing Rooney.

It's funny though that in 16/17 with all the talk of the football being much better, we only score 5 more goals than the previous season.
 
Skills said:
So what part of Erik Ten Hag's management do you actually have faith in then? Doesn't seem like you particularly rate him as a coach?

Is it his recruitment - something that he had little influence at a club like Ajax?
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Not sure where you got that from? I have faith in his style of play, but I feel I've been pretty consistent in this conversation by saying the issue lies with the players. We don't have the right players to execute his plans given their lack of energy (see how they "pressed" this season), motivation (salaries) mentality and the manner they give up when things aren't going their way. With the current players a lot of Ten Hag's work will be betrayed as we've seen with many managers before.
 
Cant see it first season unless there’s some big transfers incoming. Would need a huge improvement on what we’ve just seen.
 
Just play entertaining football. Winning (consistently) entertaining football is a bonus.
 
Looking at the goals conceded over the same period, I suspect we'd be more likely to see a 20 goal improvement there (57 > 37) than in attack (57 > 77).

21/22 : 57
20/21 : 44
19/20 : 36
18/19 : 54
17/18 : 28
16/17 : 29
15/16 : 35
14/15 : 37
13/14 : 43
 
sullydnl said:
Looking at the goals conceded over the same period, I suspect we'd be more likely to see a 20 goal improvement there (57 > 37) than in attack (57 > 77).

21/22 : 57
20/21 : 44
19/20 : 36
18/19 : 54
17/18 : 28
16/17 : 29
15/16 : 35
14/15 : 37
13/14 : 43
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That's not really a challenge though is it? Getting your team down to 1 GA per game should be manageable by any manager worth his salt.

That's not too far off from what Brighton and Wolves managed this season.
 
Skills said:
20/21 : 73
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Given that Ole (in some people's eyes) was a worse manager than Ralf, then surely reaching 80 isn't going to be that big of a deal?

Ronaldo can get 30+ in all competitions providing the rest of the team do their job. It mainly comes down to the output of players who were part of that 73 goal season (accepting a couple of contributors will be gone but hardly irreplaceable).
 
19/20 Rashford scored 17 in the league. 20/21 he scored 11 after missing half the season. The idea that he’s only good for 5-10 goals a season under an attack minded coach, in some people’s minds, is a little absurd. Some people have left him off their lists entirely.

Yes, it’s possible he never rediscovers his form. But that could be true of most of the squad. But a huge reason we’ve brought in ETH is not to spend 500 billion quid buying a whole new squad, it’s to make a few astute signings and then coach the shit out of the rest of an expensively assembled and largely talented squad.

Players such as Rashford, Sancho, Fernandes, Varane, Shaw, Van de Beek, and Fred have massive amounts of improvement left in their game, to levels we have either seen previously (which is the minimum requirement), or in terms of potential that has yet to be realised.

If ETH can get those players to optimum fitness levels, understanding clearly what is expected of with with and without the ball, and playing to their best level, then I think people will be surprised how good this team can be.

Ronaldo is Ronaldo, a perpetual self Center of excellence. Maguire and Dalot will likely have significant roles to play, and hopefully ETH can coax reliable consistency from them (the best outcome IMO), and McTominay should be considered an important squad player. If he can focus on being that player that will always sacrifice for the team, and run his socks off when he gets a chance, he can be a valuable and versatile squad player. Like all the best teams have.

Any ambitious coach taking over this squad and seeing that he has players of the, previously shown, quality of Fernandes, Rashford, Sancho, and Ronaldo in the front four, would relish the chance to get those in peak condition and form; because if they are, they are comfortably good enough to score a shed load of goals between them.

This last season has created a false impression of the quality of many of our players. Massive question marks over how so many players can down tools at once, but when it happens on such a grand scale, their is something systemically rotten. The hope is that the change of coach, and coaching team in general, the exodus of unsettled players, and the massive changes in the club hierarchy; will change the club culture and allow these players to flourish again.
 
simonhch said:
19/20 Rashford scored 17 in the league. 20/21 he scored 11 after missing half the season. The idea that he’s only good for 5-10 goals a season under an attack minded coach, in some people’s minds, is a little absurd. Some people have left him off their lists entirely.

Yes, it’s possible he never rediscovers his form. But that could be true of most of the squad. But a huge reason we’ve brought in ETH is not to spend 500 billion quid buying a whole new squad, it’s to make a few astute signings and then coach the shit out of the rest of an expensively assembled and largely talented squad.

Players such as Rashford, Sancho, Fernandes, Varane, Shaw, Van de Beek, and Fred have massive amounts of improvement left in their game, to levels we have either seen previously (which is the minimum requirement), or in terms of potential that has yet to be realised.

If ETH can get those players to optimum fitness levels, understanding clearly what is expected of with with and without the ball, and playing to their best level, then I think people will be surprised how good this team can be.

Ronaldo is Ronaldo, a perpetual self Center of excellence. Maguire and Dalot will likely have significant roles to play, and hopefully ETH can coax reliable consistency from them (the best outcome IMO), and McTominay should be considered an important squad player. If he can focus on being that player that will always sacrifice for the team, and run his socks off when he gets a chance, he can be a valuable and versatile squad player. Like all the best teams have.

Any ambitious coach taking over this squad and seeing that he has players of the, previously shown, quality of Fernandes, Rashford, Sancho, and Ronaldo in the front four, would relish the chance to get those in peak condition and form; because if they are, they are comfortably good enough to score a shed load of goals between them.

This last season has created a false impression of the quality of many of our players. Massive question marks over how so many players can down tools at once, but when it happens on such a grand scale, their is something systemically rotten. The hope is that the change of coach, and coaching team in general, the exodus of unsettled players, and the massive changes in the club hierarchy; will change the club culture and allow these players to flourish again.
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Good post.
 
Yes. Or at least close enough. Chelsea had 76 last season so probably around that. But we'll conceed 50 if we dont make multiple CB and midfield signings
 
To get 80+ goals we’d need some goal scoring wingers, we’ve not got this since greenwood left. Ronaldo will get the majority, Fernandes will chip in with a few and maybe sancho. Ten Hag has a tough job on his hands to get rashford back to his best. We also need the midfield to be able to play the ball forward nice and quick and create enough chances for the forwards to put away. At the moment can’t see us getting even 70 goals a season.. we’re to reliant on Ronaldo… Liverpool have tons of goals from there front 3. City have goals from all over the pitch even midfielders. Spurs have Kane and son. Massive improvement needed.
 
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