Who do you feel did better overall?
Watch the programme in full here:
Watch the programme in full here:
Cameron & Miliband: The Battle For Number 10 (Overall Poll)
- Thread starter Damien
- Start date
Do we actually have any floating voters on here? Everyone beliefs seem pretty ingrained.
What exactly does that mean? Someone who's willing to vote for any party? Or someone who's just not set in stone to vote for a particular party?
More the latter- those undecided who may be swayed by the debates for example.
I'd put myself in that category then. I've got an idea who I'll vote for but I've not fully decided just yet.
The second highest result in the General Election poll thread is "Won't be voting" and not far behind is "Undecided but will vote", so there probably is a fair few there.
I'm undecided. Would vote Green as they are closest to me in terms of ideology but they have some pretty crazy ideas in my opinion, and Bennett is pretty uninspiring. So waiting to see how Ed comes across in the debates.
Was funny watching Ed trying to make out he's not the sopping wet lettuce he obviously is.
I dont particularly want to vote for Cameron, but when the alternative is Miliband and Balls...
How the polls thought Cameron won that is baffling. Must love food banks.
I saw someone say that Miliband won when it came to the undecided voters.
Guardian said:
That suggests he was impressive to those open to being swayed. However, the majority of the respondents preferred Cameron to Miliband, which suggests that he didn't really win over anyone who would not have voted for him anyway, which is to be expected.
Although they are asked to vote for who they thought was more impressive, regardless of their allegiances, people always vote for the person they think is representing their views.
I only caught the last 30 minutes or so, so missed Cameron's segment. But Ed came across very poorly. I can only hope Cameron came across worse, because Ed was awkward and unconvincing.
You might not like the Tories, but you have to have a serious look at yourself if you are considering voting Ed and his team.
It is all bollocks. Just because he has a funny voice and looks like a Wallace and Grommit character doesn't actually mean that he would be bad for the country. Or do you have sound ideological or evidential reasoning for doubting his ability to run the country?
Yes, I have formed my opinion based on:
Everything he says and does.
Labours shocking record from 1997 to 2010 of everything they touched turning to shit.
His wildly inaccurate economic predictions during his time in opposition.
The fact that if he really was a man of priniciple, he would of backed his brother for the leadership of the party rather than cosying up to the unions and stabbing him in the back.
He is nothing but a trade union puppet, and that's what a lot of people forget, if he ever got in (God forbid) it wouldn't be him calling the shots.
And Cameron's not every bit as much a puppet? K.
Lets put it this way, given the choice of which group of puppets I would like running the county.
Definitely Sesame Street over the muppets.
It is good to see however that that is the only part of the post you call me out on, me saying labour were dog shit and that Ed is back stabbing, economically clueless, trade union crony didn't have you batting an eye lid
Can you explain why being "a trade union puppet", i.e. a puppet for a democratic organisations that represent the interests of working people is worse than being a puppet for private interests?
Thought Miliband came out of it relatively well. Performed better than Cameron with the audience questions despite Burley's best efforts. Did take a bit of mauling from Paxman in the middle of their interview but didn't crumble as badly as I would've expected and came back strongly at the end scoring some points off Paxman with the whole "let the voters decide" and brushing off the personality jibes pretty well.
Cameron played it very safe but came across to me as evasive, tried to pivot every question to the economy. Understandable to want to play to your strengths but just looked like he wanted to avoid the question too often. Paxman did well to get the admission about not being able to live on a zero hours contract out of him which makes an easy headline.
Not a game changer either way though so I'd say both are relieved to get out relatively unscathed.
Cameron played it very safe but came across to me as evasive, tried to pivot every question to the economy. Understandable to want to play to your strengths but just looked like he wanted to avoid the question too often. Paxman did well to get the admission about not being able to live on a zero hours contract out of him which makes an easy headline.
Not a game changer either way though so I'd say both are relieved to get out relatively unscathed.
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Milliband did better than I expected to be honest.
I'm still not convinced i'll vote though.
I'm still not convinced i'll vote though.
Ah, fair point. The left are the most vocal though with a few right dissenters. The right has been vocal on here since the days of TBGB.
@Hectic, yes - a month before: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/redcafe-opinion-poll.292188/
at the election: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/2010-election-poll.295226/
at the election: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/2010-election-poll.295226/
Perfect, thanks Damien.
They are saying on the news now that 3m watched it. Thought it would be higher tbh.
I did won't be voting since I am not eligible to vote in the UK
Honestly? I don't like the unions in this country.
For all the good they have done they have wrecked havoc across the country and wasted billions of pounds and done irreparable damage to major companies and institutions through their short sighted militant actions.
I agree with the working man having fair and reasonable treatment at work and the right to a fair days pay for a fair days work.
Just not the way these idiots have gone about it over the years.
Without Unions how does the fair days pay happen? I don't see any mechanism to counter poverty wages in most jobs to increase Co profits without them. It has been my experience that without the unions being present in any negotiation with HR they outright lie to your face.
That entire video just made me cringe. politics is such a joke. its just little children trying to catch each other off gaurd.
The answer lies somewhere in the middle. No-one wants the UK to end up like France, regularly being paralysed by strikes.
That's not to say the unions don't still do good work, it's more that with the likes of the minimum wage enshrined in law, Acas and employment tribunals in place, not to mention the rise of litigation, the unions are just less relevant today.
Who here is actually a member of a trade union?
No chance I'm voting Ed when he can't even answer a question on immigration.
These idiots never learn
These idiots never learn
This, it's genuinely a very trying task for me to listen to that utterly corrupt bunch of snivelling shithead weasels for more than a few minutes. If I wanted to be blatantly lied to I'd ask my mam if she's proud me.
Its a tough one, in absolute terms I think Cameron did better which is hardly surprising as he is just better at this kind of thing. But relative to expectations I think MilliE did better on the basis that he did better than a lot of people expected him to while Cameron didnt do that well by his own standards.
I thought Paxman had them both rattled but MilliE more so. I do like Paxman a lot but I really didnt like his "are you alright, Ed?" quip at the end, which I thought was massively patronising. In fact I thought both hosts displayed quite a clear bias, Paxman was tough on Cameron but much tougher on MilliE. He asked Cameron tough questions but gave him more space to answer them. When he asked the question about his judgement with his three friends he allowed Cameron to answer about Green and Clarkson, which were both relatively easy to explain away, but ignore the really embarrassing one - Coulson. I didnt like Paxo's entire line of questioning when it came to Ed to be honest - very personal and with little reference to policy.
I thought Paxman had them both rattled but MilliE more so. I do like Paxman a lot but I really didnt like his "are you alright, Ed?" quip at the end, which I thought was massively patronising. In fact I thought both hosts displayed quite a clear bias, Paxman was tough on Cameron but much tougher on MilliE. He asked Cameron tough questions but gave him more space to answer them. When he asked the question about his judgement with his three friends he allowed Cameron to answer about Green and Clarkson, which were both relatively easy to explain away, but ignore the really embarrassing one - Coulson. I didnt like Paxo's entire line of questioning when it came to Ed to be honest - very personal and with little reference to policy.
A competitive market takes care of that. Labour is an input into production like any other, and will be priced appropriately by supply and demand. Broadly speaking, that's how wage levels across the world are determined; unions can distort relative wage levels a little - the distribution of the national cake between unionized and non-unionized workers for instance - but, except in exceptional cases where they have acquired overweening power - the British print industry prior to Murdoch - their impact is limited.
Have you been in a cave for the last ten years?
How is it right that people working full time are paid so little that we have to pay them benefits to top up their income to a barely sustainable one?
I am a member of Community which used to be the ISTC. I haven't yet been on strike in the 31 years I have been in the union (might be soon over the recent pension news).People underestimate just how much work unions do inside big companies to just force their management into following the terms and conditions they have agreed to follow.
We aren't like France in our industrial relations, the right to withdraw your labour was hard won and without it we would see a slide in conditions as sure as night follows day.
I'm in a Trade Union but I've never used it and am thinking of leaving. I had it for a few of the roles I did as one was ruled by a bit of a mad individual who had the ability to destroy your career if she disliked you, and the other was managing a team in a part of the business where they love sticking any old grievance in against managers (though thankfully I managed to avoid one somehow).
I completely see the value in Unions but they do have to be practical in their conduct (which mine is). I'm lucky to have an employer who treats its staff pretty well so I don't feel there's a huge danger in leaving a service I've never used.
To the debates, I don't have a particular preference for either candidate but think Miliband came out on top. His answers were more open and he seemed more relaxed. Kay Burley was woefully inconsistent in her questioning of him compared to Cameron and I thought Paxman was a bit of a dick with the unnecessary 'are you alright?' at the end after more questions on his personality than his policies.
I completely see the value in Unions but they do have to be practical in their conduct (which mine is). I'm lucky to have an employer who treats its staff pretty well so I don't feel there's a huge danger in leaving a service I've never used.
To the debates, I don't have a particular preference for either candidate but think Miliband came out on top. His answers were more open and he seemed more relaxed. Kay Burley was woefully inconsistent in her questioning of him compared to Cameron and I thought Paxman was a bit of a dick with the unnecessary 'are you alright?' at the end after more questions on his personality than his policies.
It seemed so unpublicised to me, I barely saw any press about it until Thursday afternoon.
Do you actually believe in the free market? Do you really believe that without any government intervention to labour laws in the last century British workers would be in a better position than they are now?
I'm catching up on this now and all I can really deduce for certain is that Kay Burley is a monstrosity of an objective host.
She single-handedly spoiled the Miliband questioning segment, so in spite of his inherent inability to speak with any kind of eloquency and clear thought, it's difficult to judge him on that.
Paxman to go. I thought Cameron dealt with him quite well. But we already know he's good at that.
She single-handedly spoiled the Miliband questioning segment, so in spite of his inherent inability to speak with any kind of eloquency and clear thought, it's difficult to judge him on that.
Paxman to go. I thought Cameron dealt with him quite well. But we already know he's good at that.