Bruno Fernandes in 2020 had the best calendar year of any player in PL history

Bruno’s a brilliant player but I think, based on watching him for 90 minute matches, he hasn’t been close to the likes of Cantona, Ronaldo, Rooney or RVP in terms of performance. Impact and statistics perhaps but not performance.
 
JPRouve said:
I don't really know why I persist but Ronaldo won the player of season award, no one was better than him over the course of the season and it was recognized when the season ended. Ronaldo was the most consistent attacker at a high level alongside Torres but it doesn't mean that he was the best performer every months in the PL, he could be the second or third best performer. In fact during that season Ronaldo wasn't the best United performer every months it was sometimes Vidic, Scholes, Rooney, Ferdinand or Van Der Sar.
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Again I know your saying he was the best player overall, that’s my point, he wasnt just the best, he was on another level to anybody including Torres, were talking Ballon D’or level Ronaldo and he wins it only twice? Shocking.

If it’s an award that rewards forwards primarily, as you said, then this is a strange anomaly imo considering the player in question. Goes to show this reward doesn’t really indicate very much.
 
RUCK4444 said:
Again I know your saying he was the best player overall, that’s my point, he wasnt just the best, he was on another level to anybody including Torres, were talking Ballon D’or level Ronaldo and he wins it only twice? Shocking.

If it’s an award that rewards forwards primarily, as you said, then this is a strange anomaly imo considering the player in question. Goes to show this reward doesn’t really indicate very much.
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The problem is that you seem to not consider what put him at an other level, it was his consistency not the level of his peak. Also it's worth keeping in mind that there was only 9 player of month given, Ronaldo wasn't the best performer during the first three months and barely played during the first month. He then won 2 out of six awards when he got into rhythm and Torres won 1, the other winners were Agbonlahor in November when Ronaldo played less games, Santa Cruz and then Ashley Young who was more productive in April.
Now if you want to look into it, there is only one month that he could have won but didn't, it's December where he scored 7 goals and provided 2 assists while Santa Cruz scored 6 goals and provided 1 assist but maybe Santa Cruz was indvidually better during some of these games.
 
JPRouve said:
The problem is that you seem to not consider what put him at an other level, it was his consistency not the level of his peak. Also it's worth keeping in mind that there was only 9 player of month given, Ronaldo wasn't the best performer during the first three months and barely played during the first month. He then won 2 out of six awards when he got into rhythm and Torres won 1, the other winners were Agbonlahor in November when Ronaldo played less games, Santa Cruz and then Ashley Young who was more productive in April.
Now if you want to look into it, there is only one month that he could have won but didn't, it's December where he scored 7 goals and provided 2 assists while Santa Cruz scored 6 goals and provided 1 assist but maybe Santa Cruz was indvidually better during some of these games.
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how many years ago was this!

can’t believe Gabby won player of the month!
 
Jeppers7 said:
Bruno’s a brilliant player but I think, based on watching him for 90 minute matches, he hasn’t been close to the likes of Cantona, Ronaldo, Rooney or RVP in terms of performance. Impact and statistics perhaps but not performance.
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Comparable to RVP I’d say
 
RashyForPM said:
Games: 29
Goals: 18
Assists: 14
Goal contributions per game: 1.1
Player of the month awards: 4
Our league position before he came: 6th

Starting line-up in the last game before his debut, a 0-2 home loss to Burnley:

DDG
AWB Jones Maguire Williams
Fred Matic
Mata Pereira James
Martial

He single-handedly transformed a floundering team into a visibly good one who can do something really good if we just keep our feet on the ground and stay focused.

The likes of Henry, Ronaldo, RvN, RvP, Suarez and even King Eric have never had a better year for my money.
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I don't see the point in being so definitive about Bruno's year, I think it's arguable any one of those players you named (not to mention David Silva, Aguero or KDB) have had seasons or calendar years if you like in which they've played consistently better than Bruno.

We can certainly agree he's been awesome and transformative, but there were other factors at play in our revival last season. This good set of articles about Ole's 'tactical eras' credits Bruno's huge effect on our play from last January, but it also highlights the returns of Pogba and Matic and the role of Luke Shaw in the system (linking with Rashy on the left or tucking into midfield to release the front five) as key, not to mention the unprecedented Covid break that allowed both Rashford back from a 'season-ending' back injury and rest to all our players ahead of a period where Ole could barely afford to rotate the starting XI in any way. Counter to the narrative that Bruno immediately changed everything for us his debut against Wolves was a dour 0-0 in which Ole had to name a front six of Fred, Pereira, James, Bruno, Mata and Martial, and our poor play in the opening period led to Ole switching Bruno from the 10 position into the midfield two because Pereira was so bad there. So again though Bruno's performance levels were important we shouldn't discount the other favourable circumstances that led to our strong end to last year and to Bruno shining for us.
 
Truth is no one really cares about what you do in calendar years, its all about individual seasons, so its a bit harder to remember how someone performed across the year. Individual seasons stick in the mind much more.

But just throwing names out there, was he better than Kane in 2017, Van Dijk in 2018 or Kante in 2016? I don't know but what I do know is he's playing extremely well and we'll need to start winning some silverware for all of this to truly win something.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
Is it me or has calender year only really become a thing in the last few years or so?

Just feels quite irrelevant to me... Football is literally played in seasons.
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It's a very good way of demonstrating form half way through a season. Lines up nicely with the opening of the January transfer window too. I'd much sooner people look at larger sample sizes of data than getting in a hissy fit because a player has 2/3 poor games.
 
RashyForPM said:
Games: 29
Goals: 18
Assists: 14
Goal contributions per game: 1.1
Player of the month awards: 4
Our league position before he came: 6th

Starting line-up in the last game before his debut, a 0-2 home loss to Burnley:

DDG
AWB Jones Maguire Williams
Fred Matic
Mata Pereira James
Martial

He single-handedly transformed a floundering team into a visibly good one who can do something really good if we just keep our feet on the ground and stay focused.

The likes of Henry, Ronaldo, RvN, RvP, Suarez and even King Eric have never had a better year for my money.
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That front 4...yuck

Remarkable what he has achieved in 12 months
 
POTM awards are irrelevant. As are Manager of the month awards, which Fergie was obscenely short-changed.

Re Bruno, there hasn't been consistency put forward by the Salahs and De Bruynes of the league, so I guess he wins partially by default.

I'm just happy he plays for us.
 
No more words to describe him really. He's transformed everything. We just need to build the team around him and win some major trophies, as he's a player who should be doing so. Phenomenal!
 
Verminator said:
POTM awards are irrelevant. As are Manager of the month awards, which Fergie was obscenely short-changed.

Re Bruno, there hasn't been consistency put forward by the Salahs and De Bruynes of the league, so I guess he wins partially by default.

I'm just happy he plays for us.
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Yeah but I wouldn’t say they are meaningless nonetheless. Fergie, Ole and even Mourinho were and in Ole’s case, are being screwed over in the manager one, but for players, it’s a good indicator of how magnificent they are if they keep winning it.

On a side note though, it’s a disgrace that Ole lost the June, July and December awards.
 
RashyForPM said:
Yeah but I wouldn’t say they are meaningless nonetheless. Fergie, Ole and even Mourinho were and in Ole’s case, are being screwed over in the manager one, but for players, it’s a good indicator of how magnificent they are if they keep winning it.

On a side note though, it’s a disgrace that Ole lost the June, July and December awards.
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This is exactly why they are meaningless.
They are not a true reflection of what happened. There is no formula to examine.
They are a process of emotions, bias, politics and even mischief.

Go and see how many MOTM award Fergie got. You'd be forgiven for thinking he was a good cup winning manager, instead of the most dominant manager, for quarter of a century.

Fergie won 27 in total. Just over 1 per year, on average.

From Wiki
The award has been won in consecutive months by 15 managers: Joe Kinnear, Kevin Keegan, Roy Evans, Alex Ferguson, Arsène Wenger, David O'Leary, Stuart Pearce, Paul Jewell, Rafael Benítez, Carlo Ancelotti, Manuel Pellegrini, Claudio Ranieri, Antonio Conte, Pep Guardiola and Jürgen Klopp. Guardiola is the only manager in Premier League history to have won the award in four successive months. Klopp is the first manager to win the award five times in a season.

Anyone would think they had done the treble.
 
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Ronaldo, Bergkamp, Scholes, Henry, Shearer, Vardy and Lampard all won player of the month in the premier league 4 times in their premier league careers.

Bruno has won 4 player of the month awards since Jan 29th 2020

1 more and he ties Rooney and Van Persie. Another 4 and he'd set the record of player of the month awards in a premier league career
 
It's always difficult to compare era's but there's no doubt that Bruno has been the best player we've had in a long time and his impact has been massive. He's turned us from a mediocre team who rival fans pissed themselves at, to insecure and worried. Some managers too. It's a good sign. But probably unfair to judge with other era's and players.
 
PieCrust said:
Bruno has been such an amazing signing and it felt like after the club durdled around in the summer that we'd miss out on him.

He still frustrates at times with errant passes that lose possession, but small price to pay for his overwhelming contribution since coming onboard.
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My feelings exactly.
 
Jeppers7 said:
Bruno’s a brilliant player but I think, based on watching him for 90 minute matches, he hasn’t been close to the likes of Cantona, Ronaldo, Rooney or RVP in terms of performance. Impact and statistics perhaps but not performance.
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Agreed.
 
JPRouve said:
I think that there has been other players that have been better even if you limit it to attacking players. But for me the problem with the metrics used is that they are extremely biased in favor of attacking players(goalscorers). IIRC the PL player of the month has been won 4 times by a none attacking player in the last 10 years, even the season when Kanté won the player of the year award he didn't won the player of the month once.
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As the saying goes, "attackers win you games but defenders win you titles"
 
I dont think I've ever seen someone with his stats be so awful in possession in lots of games. And its nonsense to say its because he's trying the risky pass. These are bread and butter passes for Tom Cleverley I'm talking about not through balls with the outside of his boot! KDB isnt anything like as sloppy for me and thats why he's on a different level. Stats don't show the amount of time he is turning over possession.
 
He's currently the best player in the whole league not just United imo. Hopefully he stays fit and in form for the remainder of the season. His impact on us can't be praised enough. You can pretty much classify United post Fergie into pre Bruno and post Bruno.
 
Annihilate Now! said:
Is it me or has calender year only really become a thing in the last few years or so?

Just feels quite irrelevant to me... Football is literally played in seasons.
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been around a little while but I always feel like it’s used to fluff up stats.
I’m with you, football has seasons
 
RedorDead21 said:
I dont think I've ever seen someone with his stats be so awful in possession in lots of games. And its nonsense to say its because he's trying the risky pass. These are bread and butter passes for Tom Cleverly I'm talking about not through balls with the outside of his boot! KDB isnt anything like as sloppy for me and thats why he's on a different level. Stats don't show the amount of time he is turning over possession.
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I wonder if Watford would consider a swap deal for Cleverly.
 
el3mel said:
He's currently the best player in the whole league not just United imo. Hopefully he stays fit and in form for the remainder of the season. His impact on us can't be praised enough. You can pretty much classify United post Fergie into pre Bruno and post Bruno.
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I think he might be our most important but I’d still swap him KDB in a heart beat
 
Jeppers7 said:
Bruno’s a brilliant player but I think, based on watching him for 90 minute matches, he hasn’t been close to the likes of Cantona, Ronaldo, Rooney or RVP in terms of performance. Impact and statistics perhaps but not performance.
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Yeah, I don't disagree with that. If you just look at the stats the guy is on his way to becoming one of the best players this league has had. But actually watching him for 90 minutes you realize he's very much a moments player. Very rarely does he control a game, or dominate it, for 90 minutes. I know saying something like "controlling a game" can seem a bit of a vague term, but I think most people will know what I mean.

He can often be very poor. He loses the ball quite a bit and can be extremely wild and careless with his passing. But then he does something that no other player in our team could do (aside from Pogba on a good day), and we end up winning the game because of it. He's obviously been outstanding for us and I wouldn't swap him for many midfielders in the world at the moment. But yeah, he can leave you scratching your head sometimes.
 
bsCallout said:
Don't think these comparisons are fair at all. IMO Bruno has had a bigger impact than all, Cantona comes closest.
Before RVP MU were a top team, we just needed a finisher.

Bruno came it at a time when United were looking awful after 6 years of mediocrity, looking like it was time to change manager again. Within one calender year we are top of the league for the first time since SAF. We looked like a proper midtable team, not going to get top 4, even top 6 looked questionable before Bruno.

Bruno deserves all the respect he's getting for that turnaround. Even if his play is frustrating to people at times. This weekend is huge for him personally though, if he drives us towards a win he cements himself top of that pile to me.
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Don't get me wrong, I recognise that RVP walked into a team that was almost there but Cantona joined a team that couldn't get over the line. If the team wins a top trophy over the next 2-3 years then Bruno will be, in my mind anyway, at the same level as Cantona who I rate as Utd's greatest signing. If Bruno delivers the league this year then he will be the greatest signing in the club's history.
 
Mart1974 said:
Don't get me wrong, I recognise that RVP walked into a team that was almost there but Cantona joined a team that couldn't get over the line. If the team wins a top trophy over the next 2-3 years then Bruno will be, in my mind anyway, at the same level as Cantona who I rate as Utd's greatest signing. If Bruno delivers the league this year then he will be the greatest signing in the club's history.
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At the start of the season I wouldn't have agreed with that but now that it is ours to lose I think that is probably fair.
 
Can we put this in the trophy cabinet with Maguire’s ‘Most minutes played’ trophy.

Seems an odd boast and a very Scouse thing to do.

Yes, he’s been brilliant but until they start giving out awards for calendar year achievements, it’s a nothing.
 
Mart1974 said:
Don't get me wrong, I recognise that RVP walked into a team that was almost there but Cantona joined a team that couldn't get over the line. If the team wins a top trophy over the next 2-3 years then Bruno will be, in my mind anyway, at the same level as Cantona who I rate as Utd's greatest signing. If Bruno delivers the league this year then he will be the greatest signing in the club's history.
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I can see the argument but, no. Not for me.

Yet.
 
bsCallout said:
Don't think these comparisons are fair at all. IMO Bruno has had a bigger impact than all, Cantona comes closest.
Before RVP MU were a top team, we just needed a finisher.

Bruno came it at a time when United were looking awful after 6 years of mediocrity, looking like it was time to change manager again. Within one calender year we are top of the league for the first time since SAF. We looked like a proper midtable team, not going to get top 4, even top 6 looked questionable before Bruno.

Bruno deserves all the respect he's getting for that turnaround. Even if his play is frustrating to people at times. This weekend is huge for him personally though, if he drives us towards a win he cements himself top of that pile to me.
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We need to win the league and he needs to be the inspiration behind that before comparing to RVP. Cantona inspired a team that couldn’t get over the line and then a bunch of youth team players.

Bruno has made a big difference because it’s a world class player replacing Lingard or Perreira, but Maguire and Bissaka have also made a difference because had we not signed them and signed Bruno we wouldn’t be where we are.....at this point we could win it....we could finish 3/4th and in that case there would be no argument
 
I think his stats are highly inflated by pens however think he's there up with top players in his position and mainly because his hard work he leaves on the pitch as well, technically brilliant player of his quality would be great but without added grit wouldn't push us where we are now. Before Pogba got injured he carried the "shit" team too but now we have both, plus rashford back it's great to see it's not on a single player's shoulder and everyone is more determined with a leader like him around.

I really like him, he can have his day off but most often than not he's one of our best players. Just hope we try to sign similar players with all technical, mental and physical qualities.
 
RedorDead21 said:
I dont think I've ever seen someone with his stats be so awful in possession in lots of games. And its nonsense to say its because he's trying the risky pass. These are bread and butter passes for Tom Cleverley I'm talking about not through balls with the outside of his boot! KDB isnt anything like as sloppy for me and thats why he's on a different level. Stats don't show the amount of time he is turning over possession.
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Kdb needs at least, 12-15 tries to score a goal, makes some good passes but not that many. Easily disappears in important matches, can't dribble, not that fast, mostly injury prone. Remove City's defensive performances and the likes of Ruben Dias, Cancelo etc, and they would be easily 12th or lower in the table.
 
K Stand Knut said:
I can see the argument but, no. Not for me.

Yet.
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I should add the the word arguably.... It would be a strong argument considering we will have turned around a 33 point deficit (I know we are not finishing on 99 points and neither are Liverpool).
 
Mart1974 said:
I should add the the word arguably.... It would be a strong argument considering we will have turned around a 33 point deficit (I know we are not finishing on 99 points and neither are Liverpool).
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I hear you and it would definitely be hard to argue against it.

Playing Devil’s advocate, you’d be comparing 18 months of Bruno to Cantona and Ronaldo (in my humble opinion).

I do think it’s another sign of jumping the gun and making bold positive statements far too early.

Let’s just enjoy him for what he is and judge him when he’s gone, or certainly after more than 18 months

EDIT - 18 months will be the time he will have been here IF we win the league
 
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