Birmingham lack of success in English Football

[MackRobinson]

Ah that would be amazing.

I'm not joking. A lot people I met in Cali had medical marijuana cards (this was 3 years ago). You go see a "doctor" (one of the most hilarious doctor's visits I've ever been to) and you are given a legal prescription. You can walk into any medical marijuana shop and buy up to 4 ounces. The craziest thing was even though it was illegal federally and in most other states, if you were caught with weed at a California airport, they would call the cops, make sure you had a valid card, and allow you to board the plane with up to 4 ounces

 

[Okey]

Hey hey...what's going on here?! Y'all leave my city alone! It may be grey and uninspiring, and second to Manchester in my heart, but it's home, and we love it like that. 2nd largest city in the UK is a bit of a scam anyway. There's 2 parts of the UK - London and the rest, and Birmingham's football doesn't stack up too badly against London historically.

 

[Lay]

I’ve been going to Birmingham since I was a child due to my family being around there. I never overly minded it. Took my wife for the first time to Birmingham last year and she thought it was horrific The worst city she’s been to apparently.

 

[RUCK4444]

Went to Birmingham for my brothers 30th and spent two days there, absolutely awesome on the p*ss there in my opinion.

I like London and go regular for a weekend away but once you’ve done the sights and stay for a decent length of time you realise that you would hate to live there.

I don’t see the huge attraction to living in London full time for footballers. Traffic and the sheer volume of people makes you feel trapped.
Plus any supercar they would own you couldn’t do more than 10 miles an hour in

 

[SmashedHombre]

I’ve been going to Birmingham since I was a child due to my family being around there. I never overly minded it. Took my wife for the first time to Birmingham last year and she thought it was horrific The worst city she’s been to apparently.

And they say romance is dead!

 

[horsechoker]

Went to Birmingham for my brothers 30th and spent two days there, absolutely awesome on the p*ss there in my opinion.

I like London and go regular for a weekend away but once you’ve done the sights and stay for a decent length of time you realise that you would hate to live there.

I don’t see the huge attraction to living in London full time for footballers. Traffic and the sheer volume of people makes you feel trapped.
Plus any supercar they would own you couldn’t do more than 10 miles an hour in

Most of them live in Hertfordshire and other surrounding counties. Usually not in the city itself, except Mata

 

[Denis' cuff]

I thought Liverpool was the second largest city in England.

Really?

 

[KekiZeki]

My efforts to try and find ways to explain to you why without the use of the word sh**hole have been unsuccesful.

 

[padzilla]

With the exception of Madrid and Amsterdam, and now Paris thanks to the cash bonanza from Qatar, the best teams in most countries are not from the capital cities. Compare how many trophies AC and Inter Milan and Juventus have won compared to Roma and Lazio. Liverpool and United are both provincial cities in a way too.

 

[Raees]

Birmingham is a great city to ‘comfort live’ and raise a family but not a great place for a 20-30 year old looking to live life to the max and have a exotic lifestyle which is what most footballers would want or desire and especially their wags.

Now you could argue Liverpool and Manchester aren’t that more sexier but they’re cities which haven’t got such a divided fan base with two major clubs each, with one clearly dominant side and the natives are super passionate about their cities.. northerners are generally passionate about the fact they’re northern so it breeds a tribal bond and collectiveness which is a key asset on the football pitch. Both cities histories are based on local lads infused with Celtic talent... and celts find it easier to adapt to the north - easier to travel back home from there too. Similarly the weather up north isn’t great so it again breeds toughness and it has also attracted a lot of the best managers which have usually come from Scotland.

Midlands is in the middle, with not as much unique selling points in terms of culture - bit of a cross roads. So that lack of identity can result in lack of togetherness on the pitch from a historic perspective.

Success is also self perpetuating so Liverpool and Manchester became hugely successful at the right time and in the modern era and have been able to build legacies which attract future generations of players to them. If Villa won a CL in the modern era, they would be more attractive from a global perspective.

Essentially number of factors why Birmingham isn’t really a hotbed for elite football... and it will take a long time before it can change that even though the city itself is getting more attractive with each passing year.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

The amount of money and work being put into Manchester, it seems it's over taking Birmingham in terms of being the "second city"... Though admittedly I only go to Brum once every year or two.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

He does have a point in that historically many of the biggest clubs were based in large industrial cities rather than more affluent capital cities. In England it was Liverpool and Manchester that had the biggest clubs, although Birmingham was the biggest industrial city and England's second City, in those days at least.

Well, if you go back far enough Villa/Birmingham fits that model perfectly. You could rightly call them the first example of a truly "dominant" club - over a longer period - in the English game.

 

[lysglimt]

I have been to Birmingham once in my life - my gf at the time drove up from London. And I have 2 memories of it (this was the mid 90s)

1) Rusty old Trains for the last hours before coming to Birmingham
2) A guy at McDonalds screaming at his paper-bag "Get a life you fu...muppet"

So to me it makes perfect sense

In fairness - they did have Duncan Edwards

 

[Classical Mechanic]

The amount of money and work being put into Manchester, it seems it's over taking Birmingham in terms of being the "second city"... Though admittedly I only go to Brum once every year or two.

Now HS2 has been confirmed I think you'll see Birmingham go the same way. A 49 minute train to London time puts it firmly in the commuter belt and there will be a lot of developers wanting to put up City centre apartment buildings.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

In fairness - they did have Duncan Edwards

Well...see the discussion above.

Closer to Wolverhampton than Birmingham.

As a matter of fact, Wolves should've been the obvious choice for Edwards back then (Villa were also interested, incidentally - as they would've been, he was an extreme talent) but he opted for United for various reasons (depending on which story you believe).

 

[Denis' cuff]

I have been to Birmingham once in my life - my gf at the time drove up from London. And I have 2 memories of it (this was the mid 90s)

1) Rusty old Trains for the last hours before coming to Birmingham
2) A guy at McDonalds screaming at his paper-bag "Get a life you fu...muppet"

So to me it makes perfect sense

In fairness - they did have Duncan Edwards

He was from Dudley/Wolverhampton and even he left at an early age to come to Manchester

 

[ivaldo]

That's fair.
Let me say the UK doesn't seem like an exciting place to live. For me, it's mainly the weather and drinking culture.

Every single time I've visited the UK it's rained. 4 separate times downpour every time. Last time I was in Manchester I couldn't believe how gray the sky was. It was damn near depressing. I'm from a place with shit weather but this was just too much.

The drinking culture is just too much IMO. Going out was fun until a certain point went you realize you are the least drunk person every spot you go to. Granted it probably more so the places I was taken to but what I saw sorta fit the stereotype.

Also, the weed in the UK is shite. Understandable and not a huge deal breaker, but not ideal.
Also, UK customs gives me shite every time at Heathrow. Someone of the questions I've been asked have been downright disrespectful. Again not a deal-breaker, but I'm a bit salty.

Yeah, so sounds as though you haven't really experienced the UK.

To pick up on a few of your points. 20% of the population is tee total. The climate is temperate. Meaning we get a bit of everything, without having to suffer the extremes of climates that are tropical, arid etc. It's one of the most diverse places on the planet. There's something for everyone.

 

[MackRobinson]

Yeah, so sounds as though you haven't really experienced the UK.

To pick up on a few of your points. 20% of the population is tee total. The climate is temperate. Meaning we get a bit of everything, without having to suffer the extremes of climates that are tropical, arid etc. It's one of the most diverse places on the planet. There's something for everyone.

Temperate climate doesn't mean much in terms of the weather you experience. Southern California and Chicago are considered to be in temperate climate zones but the weather is very different in each city. Most Western countries are diverse and I was raised in the most diverse city in the US, so almost anything else is underwhelming IMO.

A lot of my good friends who travel, regardless of background, adore London, but for myself and others, England is a bit underwhelming. I agree that I haven't experienced it enough since I haven't actually lived there, but I've been 4 times and I'm more or less over it. Maybe the 5th time is a charm

 

[ivaldo]

Temperate climate doesn't mean much in terms of the weather you experience. Southern California and Chicago are considered to be in temperate climate zones but the weather is very different in each city. Most Western countries are diverse and I was raised in the most diverse city in the US, so almost anything else is underwhelming IMO.

A lot of my good friends who travel, regardless of background, adore London, but for myself and others, England is a bit underwhelming. I agree that I haven't experienced it enough since I haven't actually lived there, but I've been 4 times and I'm more or less over it. Maybe the 5th time is a charm

Well it does when you complain that it rained on each visit. It's not too hot, it's not too, it's not too wet, it's not too dry. The rainfall is no different, or less in the case of the south east, than eastern America and large parts of Europe. To make a conclusion on the matter after a few visits is a little misconceived, no?

Right, so put of interest, what makes other places 'exciting?' What is it that the UK lacks? Where have you visited? Because, I'll be honest, it doesn't sound like you've seen much of the UK at all.

 

[André Dominguez]

This is kind of touching on one of my pet peeves, which is that England is so London centric. I read that London had the GDP of Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds and Glasgow combined. So we get a country of two economies, London and the rest.

We need a new airport and they put in a new runway at Heathrow, why not put it in Birmingham or one of the other cities. The purpose of HS2 seems to be to enable people to get to London more quickly. Why the focus on London ? I think England needs to de-Londize and boost the other cities - I was glad when the BBC moved from London to Manchester and this will be the basis of my political campaign.

Make The Other Cities Great Again.

Say no to London centralism! Let's start #Manchexit !

 

[MackRobinson]

Well it does when you complain that it rained on each visit. It's not too hot, it's not too, it's not too wet, it's not too dry. The rainfall is no different, or less in the case of the south east, than eastern America and large parts of Europe. To make a conclusion on the matter after a few visits is a little misconceived, no?

Depends where you are from and where you have lived. I

Right, so put of interest, what makes other places 'exciting?' What is it that the UK lacks? Where have you visited? Because, I'll be honest, it doesn't sound like you've seen much of the UK at all.

The views and polish of Switzerland.
The style and aesthetic of Paris.
The rawness plus relative cheapness of Berlin.
The beaches of southern California.
The juxtaposition between traditional culture and modernism in Japan.

London is similar to NY, but I prefer NY b/c it's slightly cheaper and it more so fits my lifestyle.

I never said I've seen the entire UK, but the 4 times I've been across 3 cities (London 3x and Manchester/Liverpool) ranging from 5-10 days each. I've had a good time but been underwhelmed. It just is what it is and doesn't mean England is a shit place.

We make judgements based on our experiences. My experiences in the UK have been ok but underwhelming. Short of having better experiences, I'm unsure what you can tell me that can change my mind. Maybe it would have been a more enjoyable experience if I didn't experience so much rain, but I did. Regardless, I just know the UK isn't the place for me. I'm sure many would disagree and there is nothing wrong with that.

If it makes you feel better, the list of places I wouldn't live in over the UK is probably much longer than places I would rather live.

 

[ivaldo]

Depends where you are from and where you have lived. I


The views and polish of Switzerland.
The style and aesthetic of Paris.
The rawness plus relative cheapness of Berlin.
The beaches of southern California.
The juxtaposition between traditional culture and modernism in Japan.

London is similar to NY, but I prefer NY b/c it's slightly cheaper and it more so fits my lifestyle.

I never said I've seen the entire UK, but the 4 times I've been across 3 cities (London 3x and Manchester/Liverpool) ranging from 5-10 days each. I've had a good time but been underwhelmed. It just is what it is and doesn't mean England is a shit place.

We make judgements based on our experiences. My experiences in the UK have been ok but underwhelming. Short of having better experiences, I'm unsure what you can tell me that can change my mind. Maybe it would have been a more enjoyable experience if I didn't experience so much rain, but I did. Regardless, I just know the UK isn't the place for me. I'm sure many would disagree and there is nothing wrong with that.

If it makes you feel better, the list of places I wouldn't live in over the UK is probably much longer than places I would rather live.

I mean, thats an amalgamation of the strengths of all those places. If that's what it takes for a place to exciting, then no place in the world is exciting!

But you say things like the UK doesn't have the views of Switzerland and yet you've been to London and a trip to London and on a trip to Manchester... That's like going to Disneyland and saying America lacks natural beauty. Try the Highlands of Scotland, the Lake District, Norfolk Broads, basically Cornwall in its entirety to name a few.

I had a suspicion you thought London was the UK. Looks like I'm right.

 

[MackRobinson]

I mean, thats an amalgamation of the strengths of all those places. If that's what it takes for a place to exciting, then no place in the world is exciting!

Not sure what answer you expected. You asked what makes other places exciting and I told you. The strengths of those places obviously make them exciting.

But you say things like the UK doesn't have the views of Switzerland and yet you've been to London and a trip to London and on a trip to Manchester... That's like going to Disneyland and saying America lacks natural beauty. Try the Highlands of Scotland, the Lake District, Norfolk Broads, basically Cornwall in its entirety to name a few.

Because it doesn't. I'm half-decent at world geography so I've heard of those places or at least seen them in pictures. I'm going to safely assume hiking up Pitlaus or Riggi and/or skiing in Matterhorn will more than likely provide better views that everything you listed. I have no idea what point you were trying to make with those examples.

And your analogy is pretty shite but I'm sure you realize that by now.

I had a suspicion you thought London was the UK. Looks like I'm right.

I had a suspicion you responded just to have one of your episodes. Looks like I don't care. Cheers.

 

[The United Irishman]

I swear people form opinions on places despite never having visited them. Birmingham city centre is getting better and better all the time. Of course it has rough areas like every other city on earth but footballers aren't going to live in Lozells or Handsworth are they?

I moved here from Ireland 3 years ago. i love it. Shit loads to do here, loads of cool bars/places to eat...The city centre is improving all the time they have spent a lot of money and time regenerating the place.

 

[ivaldo]

Not sure what answer you expected. You asked what makes other places exciting and I told you. The strengths of those places obviously make them exciting.

Because it doesn't. I'm half-decent at world geography so I've heard of those places or at least seen them in pictures. I'm going to safely assume hiking up Pitlaus or Riggi and/or skiing in Matterhorn will more than likely provide better views that everything you listed. I have no idea what point you were trying to make with those examples.

And your analogy is pretty shite but I'm sure you realize that by now.


I had a suspicion you responded just to have one of your episodes. Looks like I don't care. Cheers.

Oh you've seen pictures? Well, my apologies. You're decent at world geography, and yet you say you've been to the UK, but haven't been to Wales, N. Ireland or Scotland. Soooo, England? That doesn't bode well...

I'm going to safely assume you're talking out of your arse, particularly when you pretend you knew what the Norfolk Broads were.

What point am I trying to make? It's not difficult is it? You say you were 'underwhelmed' by the UK, but you haven't even been to 75% of countries within it. In fact, you've been to three heavily populated urban cities to form your view, then hilariously talk about how it's natural beauty doesn't compare to that of a ski resort. But you know this, don't you? Which is why you are getting pissy.

You're right. I should have said I've been to Panama and expressed a view on North America. It's closer to your experience.

Anyway, Birmingham.

 

[MackRobinson]

Oh you've seen pictures? Well, my apologies. You're decent at world geography, and yet you say you've been to the UK, but haven't been to Wales, N. Ireland or Scotland. Soooo, England? That doesn't bode well...

I didn't know the UK encompasses most of the world. You're right. Doesn't bode well for your knowledge of geography.

I'm going to safely assume you're talking out of your arse, particularly when you pretend you knew what the Norfolk Broads were.

Didn't say knew what it was but yes, I've heard of it as I was given an extensive list of places to visit in the UK my second time in London. If it was comparable to the Alps I would have know what it was. But it's not so your original point, like most you try to make, is useless.

What point am I trying to make? It's not difficult is it? You say you were 'underwhelmed' by the UK, but you haven't even been to 75% of countries within it. In fact, you've been to three heavily populated urban cities to form your view, then hilariously talk about how it's natural beauty doesn't compare to that of a ski resort. But you know this, don't you?

You aren't trying to make a point. Everyone else responded in jest but you chose to have an Ivaldo Episode. Never said I been to 75% and in fact, expressed I would like to visit other areas in the UK outside of England (Scotland), but you chose to ignore that and proceed with your patented shtick.

You're right. I should have said I've been to Panama and expressed a view on North America. It's closer to your experience.

Panama isn't in North America, but I'm sure you knew that. You should work on your analogies. It would help get your point across better.

Which is why you are getting pissy.

I think the word you are looking for is dismissive. And yes I'm very dismissive of you when you get into one of your episodes (which simply amusing and not bothersome except for a slight decrease in productivity). Other than that I have no issue with you. Cheers.

 

[FootballHQ]

I could write a dissertation on this.

Brum has always struggled for self esteem as a place for various reasons (snipes by the media for one) and it's also suffered very poor foresight from the council and other leaders over last 30 years. Recently we've been patting ourselves on the back for extending a tram line one mile across the centre (which took about two years to do) while Manchester 20 mile tram system has been up and running for decades.

I think that extends to the main football teams. Terrible ownership and also a lack of ambition.

Aston Villa- One of the great English clubs for decades up to 2000 and then decline set in. I make it we finished in the top 6 of the premier league 5 times in the 90s so we were more there or thereabouts than likes of Everton, Chelsea, Spurs and Man. City. West Ham also have only finished in the top 6 twice since the early 80s in the top league.

Even in the 90s there were cries of lack of ambition at Doug Ellis but I was pretty happy watching an 11 consisting of Bosnich, Southgate, Lord McGrath, Ehiogu, Ian Taylor, Townsend, Yorke, Savo. Our last great premier league team imo.

Losing the 2000 FA cup final to Chelsea was a major turning point and we slipped from that point as a major club with likes of ugo and Southgate leaving to fecking Boro and others citing lack of ambition when moving. We then became also rans in premier league like Newcastle did.

Ironically the 2010 final defeat to your lot also killed off our attempt at restablishing ourselves as a major force. O'Neill quit five months later and then Young, Milner and Downing all left within 12 months. Money dried up from Lerner and we became a constant relegation struggler, again similar to how Newcastle have fallen.

Poor ownership but now there's a chance of at least slowly rising up the league again seeing as we now have some decent players and owners who are interested (for now). I still feel there's a bit of hestitation in going after game changing players. For example we were linked with Piatek in the January window and most of our forum was going why on earth would he move to us....he's now moved to a Bundesliga club fighting relegation.

Hopefully the standards will be raised in next two years. One frustration of the MON years is we never really went after players who changed the perception of the club. Think Arsenal signing Bergkamp, Chelsea with Gullit, Man. City with Robinho or even Spurs when they got in Van Der Vaart (was going to say Modric but he was still largely unproven when he signed like Bale).

Birmingham City- Where do we start with this lot... If I think my club is poorly run......The ironic thing is I actually don't think their fans mind the chaos and the drama as they all love chirping how boring we are so there's no real big demand from their fanbase for even competent owners.....Of course they were last central Midlands club to win a trophy but we'll whisper that quietly....

West Brom- Traditional club but bar that good team Big Ron put together in late 70s they haven't really threatened in the top flight for a long time. If they were North West they'd be Bolton (was going to say Blackburn but then you'd all say they won the league in the mid 90s). Club that tends to attract cautious owners.

Wolves- Now up to very recently they were to me one of the biggest under achieving clubs in English football. A mini Man City in the 90s with pretty good support (were getting around 20k in league one) yet just floated around the championship for years on end.

One of my best mates at Uni was a Wolves fan and he always used to bang on to us watching the games on the Sunday that he couldn't wait to get relegated as he hated almost everything about the premier league (this was 2010 under Big Mick so pretty different to the Wolves of today).

Haven't actually spoken to him for a few years but I'd imagine he's changed his tune. Winning in europe, watching top class players in many positions and more than matching the best clubs. I think they'll play CL in next 5 seasons.

Does Leicester count......

Anyway that's my take. Yes Midlands isn't great at all comparing it to Manchester, Liverpool and London but there are other far more success starved regions. All three North east teams have badly declined from where they were 15 years ago and Yorkshire up to this season had only one top flight team in last decade, compare that to the 90s.

Like many things in football it goes in cycles. I haven't read the responses on here yet so looking forward to doing it, sure there's plenty I'll agree and disagree on, hopefully no lazy perceptions though....

 

[ivaldo]

I didn't know the UK encompasses most of the world. You're right. Doesn't bode well for your knowledge of geography.


Didn't say knew what it was but yes, I've heard of it as I was given an extensive list of places to visit in the UK my second time in London. If it was comparable to the Alps I would have know what it was. But it's not so your original point, like most you try to make, is useless.


You aren't trying to make a point. Everyone else responded in jest but you chose to have an Ivaldo Episode. Never said I been to 75% and in fact, expressed I would like to visit other areas in the UK outside of England (Scotland), but you chose to ignore that and proceed with your patented shtick.


Panama isn't in North America, but I'm sure you knew that. You should work on your analogies. It would help get your point across better.


I think the word you are looking for is dismissive. And yes I'm very dismissive of you when you get into one of your episodes (which simply amusing and not bothersome except for a slight decrease in productivity). Other than that I have no issue with you. Cheers.

Seriously, what? Most of the world? You're embarrassing yourself now. You really think England = UK don't you? You brought up world geography specific to this, and now you have a problem with world geography being used specific to this. Superb.

Ah, so the extensive list of places to visit while in London and you didn't leave London. Maybe, just maybe, if you would've gone to the places on that list your opinion of England wouldn't be specific to London? Mind. Blown.

I was making a point and you immediately got defensive. You know it, I know it. Your childish little comments about it being an Ivaldo episode only highlights that.

Maybe if you could differentiate between England and the UK I wouldn't need to use overly simplistic analogies. You should work on your geography. It might give your points some credibility..

I can't be arsed to continue this. Thread successfully derailed. Feel free to have the last word. I won't read it. Enjoy your day.

 

[rcoobc]

Should have probably got a few of those labels a bit closer

 

[FootballHQ]

Went to Birmingham for my brothers 30th and spent two days there, absolutely awesome on the p*ss there in my opinion.

I like London and go regular for a weekend away but once you’ve done the sights and stay for a decent length of time you realise that you would hate to live there.

I don’t see the huge attraction to living in London full time for footballers. Traffic and the sheer volume of people makes you feel trapped.
Plus any supercar they would own you couldn’t do more than 10 miles an hour in

Most of Arsenal live in Hampstead Heath, same for Spurs. Chelsea lot in Surrey. Palace lot in Peckham...o.k maybe not.

Four Oaks just north of Sutton Coldfield actually has one of the most expensive roads in the U.K to live on. Certainly comparable to Alderley Edge where many players of the two Manchester clubs live.

Ultimately London just has that international recognition and so footballers with young families would be tempted by that more than living in Brum.

Our transport network is really really bad, that's one point I'll certainly not argue against from whoever said that point.

 

[FootballHQ]

Birmingham is a great city to ‘comfort live’ and raise a family but not a great place for a 20-30 year old looking to live life to the max and have a exotic lifestyle which is what most footballers would want or desire and especially their wags.

Now you could argue Liverpool and Manchester aren’t that more sexier but they’re cities which haven’t got such a divided fan base with two major clubs each, with one clearly dominant side and the natives are super passionate about their cities.. northerners are generally passionate about the fact they’re northern so it breeds a tribal bond and collectiveness which is a key asset on the football pitch. Both cities histories are based on local lads infused with Celtic talent... and celts find it easier to adapt to the north - easier to travel back home from there too. Similarly the weather up north isn’t great so it again breeds toughness and it has also attracted a lot of the best managers which have usually come from Scotland.

Midlands is in the middle, with not as much unique selling points in terms of culture - bit of a cross roads. So that lack of identity can result in lack of togetherness on the pitch from a historic perspective.

Success is also self perpetuating so Liverpool and Manchester became hugely successful at the right time and in the modern era and have been able to build legacies which attract future generations of players to them. If Villa won a CL in the modern era, they would be more attractive from a global perspective.

Essentially number of factors why Birmingham isn’t really a hotbed for elite football... and it will take a long time before it can change that even though the city itself is getting more attractive with each passing year.

I think that's a great point actually. Guys like Paul Merson and Kevin Phillips came to us in their 30s. Both still live up here rather than in London. Actually saw Merse in my local a few years back.........

Whereas star player in mid 20s who wants to let his hair down isn't really going to settle for Broad Street. That's a big thing going for London, all the different areas where you can have a good night out with little hassle. Manchester also a bit like that with the Spinningfields area where the Corrie lot go.

 

[Njord]

Was looking through the Championship for a team to start with in FM20 a while back, and landed on Birmingham City, just because of the lack of a top team from the city.

Wanted to build around a core of Birmingham born youngsters, and managed to assemble a nice group with Jude Bellingham, Rakeem Harper, Nathan Ferguson, Louie Barry and Morgan Rogers.

Became a very fun save.

 

[Lynty]

The West Midlands in general has a very strong football culture (being a predominately working class area of the country) with even grass root football having good fan bases. So it is weird.

I agree that it's a comfortable place to live and raise a family, but not necessarily thrilling enough for a youngster in the peak of his career.

I also agree that it's coincidence that poor ownership has prevented some of the clubs from reaching potential.

Another thought is that the lack of culture in the area also prevents foreign coaches from wanting to settle here. WBA, Villa, Wolves and Birmingham was left behind until very recently in coaching methods, becoming the last bastions of 'proper English football' with less focus on technical ability or tactical nous. It really showed at youth level to.

 

[ManUArfa]

As a North West lad who has lived in the West Midlands for nearly 30 years now I can tell you that there is an incredible passion for football here, right back to the grass roots and youth games. Atmospheres around the stadia of Birmingham and the Black Country are fantastic...

 

[Stig]

Say no to London centralism! Let's start #Manchexit !

Count me in.

 

[MackRobinson]

Seriously, what? Most of the world? You're embarrassing yourself now. You really think England = UK don't you? You brought up world geography specific to this, and now you have a problem with world geography being used specific to this. Superb.

I'm genuinely curious if English is your first language. If not, it all makes sense now and this isn't fun anymore. If so, your sarcasm detector needs new batteries. Replace them and we can continue.

Ah, so the extensive list of places to visit while in London and you didn't leave London. Maybe, just maybe, if you would've gone to the places on that list your opinion of England wouldn't be specific to London? Mind. Blown.

You do know humans travel to other countries for specific purposes that keep them in that said city/area, right? Like work, visiting family/friends, etc. Not every long haul flight is a holiday excursion. Shocking.

I was making a point and you immediately got defensive. You know it, I know it. Your childish little comments about it being an Ivaldo episode only highlights that.

Defensive? Hmmm. Refresh my memory.
And why do you think you keep making valid points when you completely ignore what's been previously said? That's not how discussions work

It is an Ivaldo Episode. This is what you do and it's amusing.

Maybe if you could differentiate between England and the UK I wouldn't need to use overly simplistic analogies. You should work on your geography. It might give your points some credibility..

Who said England and the UK were the same? See? That's a symptom of an Ivaldo Episode. Arguing against strawmen to make non-existent points.
Simple analogies are fine and actually preferred. It's the fact that yours are confusing is the issue (Comparing North America to the UK is pretty nonsensical as Mexico is very different from the US and Canada. But you knew that, right?).

I can't be arsed to continue this. Thread successfully derailed. Feel free to have the last word. I won't read it. Enjoy your day.

Well you had the first pointless ramblings word so it would be polite to let me have the last word. At least I appreciate your etiquette. Cheers.

 

[::sonny::]

To be fair, besides London, the UK isn't an exciting place to live. Even London wasn't that exciting when I first went. British people are pretty funny though and know how to have a good time. Nothing is worse than Italy though, and I don't care how beautiful the country is (yes, I am complete biased and basing this on a bad experience)

Italy is bad at 360°, going to become in the next years a 3rd world country

 

[Grinner]

Italy is bad at 360°, going to become in the next years a 3rd world country

What do you mean by this?

 

[Glaswegian]

I'm German and lived in Edinburgh for half a year when I was a student. Best city I've ever been to, still miss it. Much better place to live than London.

You know I've always thought of folk from Edinburgh as being like how the Canadians are portrayed in South Park, wee flappy heads, beady eyes. "Ken whit am tawkin aboot' eh?"

Obviously, with being a Glasgow man, I'm a little biased here but I never felt Edinburgh was a very welcoming City, very cold, the natives attitude changing when they heard your Glaswegian accent and of course it is full of middle-class tory you know whits

 

[::sonny::]

What do you mean by this?

Bad place in general:
low wages, high cost of living, everything is expansive and full of taxes, one of the biggest national debt in the world, corruption and criminality everywhere, pollution and trash everywhere

So a bad and unsafe place