Im just not convinced yet. Hope i am completely wrong about him but he passes sideways and backwards more often than Cleverley does.
Ben Pearson
- Thread starter samabachan
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Jesus you're a funny one. Sometimes you're so right, and sometimes so, so wrong...
Tell you what, check one of his games that show all his touches, do a count, then pick absolutely any Clev game and do the same. then get back to me.
Burden of proof, mate. The ridiculous claim is yours, so you can do the fecking counting.
Until then, everyone else on this thread will carry on rating him very highly based on watching him week-in-week-out. Ok?
Have you been watching him when he's been partnered with Rothwell in central midfield? Alongside a more attacking player, Pearson's played a more defensive role, and I think that's down to Joyce's instructions. Still, he's performed well and shown great defensive qualities. Plus, he's great at keeping the ball and circulating it, and at times, he's shown that he can make some good, incisive passes forward to Wilson, Pereira, etc. Plus, he's good at keeping the ball in midfield and rarely loses it.
When he hasn't been partnered alongside a more attack-minded central midfielder, however, he's shown his potential as the main distributor of the ball and dictator of play. However, he can still improve himself as a playmaker. However, there's no doubt that he has the potential to be a great passer of the ball and even be able to dictate play from deep if developed appropriately.
Plus there's just nothing so annoying as the lazy 'passes sideways' criticism. Pearson is actually a notably positive distributor of the ball. Watch literally any of the videos recently posted in this thread to see him repeatedly pick up the ball from deep and send it forward with a lovely diagonal to the winger or an incisive forward pass to Wilson/Pereira/whoever.
But even if he wasn't, the idea that counting someone's forwards, sideways and backwards passes will somehow tell you how good they are is so typical of this weird generation of online football fans who will find literally any evidence to prove a point except just watching the football and using common sense. The 'he passes sideways too often' crowd are generally the same ones who moan about us being 'too static' and wanting us to play 'proper pass and move football'. What the feck do you think pass and move football is?! Clue: it involves a lot of sideways and backwards passing!
But even if he wasn't, the idea that counting someone's forwards, sideways and backwards passes will somehow tell you how good they are is so typical of this weird generation of online football fans who will find literally any evidence to prove a point except just watching the football and using common sense. The 'he passes sideways too often' crowd are generally the same ones who moan about us being 'too static' and wanting us to play 'proper pass and move football'. What the feck do you think pass and move football is?! Clue: it involves a lot of sideways and backwards passing!
OK, BP in game against Sunderland. Sideways passes 9, back passes 9, forward passes 10. lost possession 3, drove forward with ball 3, balls won 9, shots 0.
TC in game against Hanover Sideways passes 22, back passes 10, forward passes 24, lost possession 2, drove forward with ball 6, fouls 1, balls won 4, shots 2.
I simply googled ben Pearson all touches and the first game that came up was the southampton game
I googled Tom Cleverley all touches and Hanover game was first one that showed up.
Cleverley more involved but senior football is much faster. If you simply half all cleverelys numbers to make the ratio clearer you can see what i mean.
TC in game against Hanover Sideways passes 22, back passes 10, forward passes 24, lost possession 2, drove forward with ball 6, fouls 1, balls won 4, shots 2.
I simply googled ben Pearson all touches and the first game that came up was the southampton game
I googled Tom Cleverley all touches and Hanover game was first one that showed up.
Cleverley more involved but senior football is much faster. If you simply half all cleverelys numbers to make the ratio clearer you can see what i mean.
yeah but again you miss the point. If everyone thinks Cleverely is so terrible why is someone who plays in a very similar manner being given so much praise?.
Reminds me of Flamini, who really would have had a much better career had he not left Wenger for Milan.
Reminds me of Roy Keane in Luka Modric's body
Isn't that basically Flamini?
I was a little upset he wasn't included the other day when Giggsy gave Wilson and co. a taste, we've seen so many of his type of midfielder fail to make the step up from our youth in the past, I'm almost loathe to get my hopes up on him due to it, but I really would absolutely love it if he'd make it.
This was already discussed earlier in this thread or some other thread, but Cleverley came up as an attacking midfielder who would score goals and be strong in the final third. Most people saw him as the solution our midfield creativity issue. He was seen as our "Iniesta" i.e. someone who'd bring us towards the pass-and-move football game with inventive flicks and link-ups. Plus, he was also seen as a goalscoring midfielder due to his loan stints at Watford and Leicester City. However, time has passed and he's now more defensive than he ever has been since his times as a left back in the Reserves and/or Academy levels. However, he's never been renowned for his defensive qualities in his younger years, and he hasn't been that great, defensively, either, in the senior level.
Pearson, however, has played in a more disciplined central midfield role for quite a bit of time, and most of the time in the U-21 and U-18 levels, he's more known for distributing the ball from deep with a good range of passing combined with tenacity, energy, and good game-reading ability in midfield. Plus, Pearson still has tons of room for development, more than Cleverley at this instant.
He doesn't play anything like Cleverley, either on a good day or a bad day. That's my point. They're almost as different as it's possible for two central midfielders to be. Cleverley is lightweight, a mover and short passer, whose best work (when he plays well) is done up around the #10, keeping the tempo high and the football fluid. Pearson is an anchorman, both defensively and offensively; he stops opposition attacks, is always on hand to sweep up or claim a loose ball, covers for players that leave gaps when they go forward, and occasionally strides forward when he sees gaps to take advantage of. His passing range is longer, and he's more likely to start moves with a great ball forward than join in higher up the pitch the way Cleverley does. His attitude is also massively different, and this would be the biggest advantage he has over Cleverley in terms of natural ability, for me: he's ridiculously dogged, has more grit than a sandy beach, and will take a game by the throat and shake it until he owns it.
I agree, but i remember a few years ago we were all raving about tom cleverley and now he is known as Captain Pass-it-Sideways. Does he have what verratti or fabregas have which is above all else vision and ball retention.
I agree he has potential i just dont want to get my hopes too high. I have suffered enough with players who are hyped up and fail to materialize.
I would hope that scholes is giving him advice. But the skills that xavi/pirlo have cannot be learned in my opinion. The spatial awareness of these guys is incredible
Did people (not you) actually liken him to iniesta? Thats like comparing justin bieber to mozart
One thing i must add is that the U20s is less demanding than the full premiership. So to think that person would take his youth form and transfer it to the rigours of the premier league will not happen overnight
No-one has ever said otherwise. Obviously conversations about youth players who haven't had chances in the first team yet are always taking place in this context.
Fair enough, but that's your problem not necessarily everyone else's. Hype is when you rate a player or their prospects more highly than you yourself have seen evidence to support. Most of us in this thread aren't doing that. We watch him every week and based on what we've seen we think he has a great chance of getting into the first team one day. Just like we always said Januzaj would have no problems making the step up to the first team, which also got called 'hype' at the time. It's not hype, it's a measured opinion.
Thank feck someone else gets it.
(1) Same here. I'm not going to say he's going to be our saviour in midfield. However, if he's doing well at the lower levels, he needs to be exposed to first-team football so that he can continue his development. There's no point keeping him at a level where he is doing well if he's already doing well in it. A pre-season with the first team, next summer, will be a good indication of where he is in terms of first-team football.
(2) Pearson already demonstrates that good spatial awareness in his game. This is demonstrated in his defensive game. He's very good at reading the game ahead of him, defensively, and is very good at making decisions accordingly. He knows when to go and press hard and when to drop back. He knows what areas to cover and which areas are dangerous. He's excellent at intercepting passes. He knows when to be a tenacious ball-winner and when to cover up the gaps and dangerous areas to slow down the opposition's build-up.
Seeing this, I'm sure he can develop that spatial awareness that world class playmakers have (though reaching the world class level is another question). That's why I hope that Joyce gives him more freedom in his game and makes him more of a deep-lying playmaker. Instead of playing him like, say, Hargreaves, I want him to play like Xabi Alonso: dictate the game when on the ball and be defensively strong off the ball. He certainly has shown that he can pass the ball well, keep it well when under pressure, and play incisive passes forward.
Thanks for the comp jb
No problem
Are these compilations actually made by you jb? If so, kudos and please keep making them. Nothing like a good youth player highlights video.
If not, thanks for posting it anyway.
If not, thanks for posting it anyway.
One of the bright spots this season past, has been seeing the young lads, especially Pearson, progress.
I was concerned about Janko's attitude to start with, but he has tempered the self-centred side of things, and if he continues to learn the mental side as much as the physical, he could be a hell of a player too.
I was concerned about Janko's attitude to start with, but he has tempered the self-centred side of things, and if he continues to learn the mental side as much as the physical, he could be a hell of a player too.
No I just post them
I was worried about Pearson's lack of games at the start of the season, but he's had a brilliant middle and end to the season. I'd love for him to get a good Championship loan next season. I think he's ready for it.
Ah well cheers anyway. I'd miss most of them if they weren't posted here.
Pearson may have the best 'are you fecking serious ref?' face of all time. It's sort of a combination of a bloke in a bar who'll decide to try and bottle you in a second or two but is currently still trying to work out whether you actually just said what he thinks you said about his sister, and a baby getting itself worked up to have a good old scream.
He might have to rein it in when he starts playing first team football, though. Howard Webb in particular doesn't like players making faces at him. For the one at 1:16 in that video you'd probably get a straight red.
Not sure that video has his every touch in it. Am I going mad or was there a Chelsea break where he ended up sort of one-on-one as the last defender and managed to first slow down the attack to let everyone else get back before putting in a brilliant block when the player tried to shoot?
Yeah, I vaguely remember a similar situation. These videos - while excellent - do not always show every involvement, or every key involvement for that matter.
I think it shows every touch. 8 minutes is long enough for a player's touch in a match.
I remember the bits of play Brightonian and Elliott mention, it has probably been missed in the edit.
8 mins usually long enough to show every single touch in a match. How long do you expect for a player's touch in one match? If it's not every touch then why would he put some of bad touch, bad pass and bad tackle on his videos.
I remember that situation as well. I'm pretty sure it was Pearson...
Sorry, Im just pointing out the possibility of the person editing the video of missing when the player may have touched the ball. 8 min is plenty of time to show every touch a player has in a game, I just wonder if the particular moment I remember seeing and others remember seeing has been accidently missed in the video edit.
Even if he missed it's probabaly only 1 or 2 touch only. Not that much.
A notable passage of play is missing, not just a routine good/bad touch.
A valid question.
A valid question.
It doesn't really matter, @JSMHE, why are you getting worked up about it? There's obviously at least one key passage of play missing, there might be more. That's fine - the video doesn't claim to include every touch. It still basically sums up his performance nicely, and is generally very well made.
I don't understand your point of your post. You are just repeating my own word.
Actually that's what I've been saying all the time. It doesn't really matter if he missed 1 or 2 touches. 1 or 2 touches missed are not much and a big deal.
Do I really like getting worked up?
Oh come on!! I'm just saying that he showed the video every of his touches in the game. Even if he missed one or two touch it's not that much. I'm just saying what in my mind about the videos.