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Stayed out wide, had a great game. Was an outlet for alot of Verons passes. Involved in every attack.
Originally posted by Lynott:
<strong>Stayed out wide, </strong><hr></blockquote>
Not disputing whether or not he had a great game - but he didn't stay out wide! It was even pointed out during the game that Becks, and to a lesser extent Giggs, kept coming inside too much and crowding the midfield.
Originally posted by becks75:
<strong>someone is praising Becks </strong><hr></blockquote>
Beckham is class, I don't think anyone disagrees with that, but he excells on the wing. He should not come in field so much. Its very frustrating when he does.
Originally posted by Livvie20:
<strong>
Not disputing whether or not he had a great game - but he didn't stay out wide! It was even pointed out during the game that Becks, and to a lesser extent Giggs, kept coming inside too much and crowding the midfield.</strong><hr></blockquote>
????
He got alot of crosses in from the right. He set up Forlan from the right and he received alot of lond passes from Veron out on the right. Was the most I have seen him out wide in a long time.
Originally posted by Lynott:
<strong>Stayed out wide, had a great game. Was an outlet for alot of Verons passes. Involved in every attack. </strong><hr></blockquote>
He neither stayed out wide nor had a great game, we actualy missed Olles great corssing yesterday.
He defended well and worked hard, thats about the best i can say for him yesterday.
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>He was piss poor, yesterday.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Bit harsh, he's finding his feet again granted, but he did create our two clear openings <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[No No]" />
Some players take longer than others to re-hit form after injuries.
Patience
<img src="graemlins/smirk.gif" border="0" alt="[Smirk]" />
Originally posted by Lynott:
<strong>
????
He got alot of crosses in from the right. He set up Forlan from the right and he received alot of lond passes from Veron out on the right. Was the most I have seen him out wide in a long time.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I didn't say he didn't go wide. He did venture there on occasions.
But he didn't stay there as you suggested.
Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>
He neither stayed out wide nor had a great game, we actualy missed Olles great corssing yesterday.
He defended well and worked hard, thats about the best i can say for him yesterday.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I thought he played well.
Originally posted by Murt:
<strong>
He neither stayed out wide nor had a great game, we actualy missed Olles great corssing yesterday.
He defended well and worked hard, thats about the best i can say for him yesterday.</strong><hr></blockquote>
As the first full 90 minutes match after comes back from injury, I think he played quite well already. He has stayed out wide for most of the time, assisted one goal and very nearly assisted a second goal in the last minutes. Tell me how you think of Veron's performance in this match. I can't see Veron or Giggs were any better than him. But sadly, people seems only want to have a go at Beckham nowadays and will continue to knock him until he pinned himself on the right for 90 minutes and produced a dozen great crosses in every match.
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>we have been saying the same thing all season long.
Giggs - stay out wide.
Becks - stay out wide.
we need width in the game.
<img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" /> said "no team plays with wings anymore, only 2 teams in the 32 WC teams had wings".
Nope, I agree, a lot. Although, I think that licence to rove is also good, if well managed, in that it prevents a stereotype defence to be played against us. But, again, it is difficult to manage 'lack of discipline'. As indeed, too much of one good thing is bad, isn't it? So, I am not so sure where I stand here. I like the licence to rove, but I agree it is tough to practise.
but i don't think it's a good tactic for us.. Ole kept wide in his couple of games and he produced much more than Becks had this whole season before he got injured. Any disagreements anyone???</strong><hr></blockquote>
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>he needs to show us what he can still do for the team.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Although not at his best, he already showed some of the things he could do in Chelsea's match: some good crosses, won a couple of headers, ran tirelessly, one assist, and put Forlan thru again in the final minutes. Yes he was still not 100%, but he didn't perform any worse than Veron, phil or Giggs in this match, so singled him out alone for critize is totally, absolutely unfair, IMO.
Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>
, but he didn't perform any worse than Veron, </strong><hr></blockquote>
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />
He was crap, while veron had a good game. Are you a Beckham fan?
Originally posted by becks75:
<strong>"Are you a Beckham fan?"
seems to be a crime in this muppet forum</strong><hr></blockquote>
The point is there are United fans who discuss the merits and failings of players and there are Beckham fans who are loyal to the ridiculous and are more fans of Becks than they are of United.This is annoying to the majority of us as we support MANCHESTER UNITED not BECKHAM UNITED.
and if I remember correctly uranushk1 slagged off Veron when he played no worse than Beckham but praises Beckham for doing the same.
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
i've changed my mind about SAF telling him to push inside, because clearly Ole kept out wide when he had his minutes on the wing.. so i think becks is surging inside on his own..
</strong>
<hr></blockquote>
Really?
Becks have been doing that since last season,
why do you think he still doing it this season.
If Becks come inside on his own all along do you think he still be on the team right now.
The reason why Becks and Ole played differently because they're different kind of players.
Ole has the speed and the ability to beat defenders, that's why he played mostly out wide.
Becks doesn't have those attributes but he have better passing and vision, therefore he come inside more often.
<strong>
he needs to show us what he can still do for the team.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think he's doing that now.
How about set up a winning goal?
Originally posted by becks75:
<strong>
So now I understand (english is not my native language). But I still wonder how a player, who set up the only goal of the game, was piss poor. Wasn`t he criticized for not having enough assists this season?</strong><hr></blockquote>
That was probably one of the few useful things he did.On the whole he was poor.
The problem with Becks is he has been hyped up into a superhero when as a matter of fact he is only great at what he does.He couldn`t do what Giggsy does or Keano or Ruud and they can`t do what he does but at the moment Ole seems to be giving Utd what they need in that position.
Its easy to knock Becks off a pedestal because his supporters keep raising it higher,sometimes unjustly.
Like many others on here I loved United before Becks was born and will do long after he has left football.The club gets the first loyalty the players second and most Beckham fans dont get this.
Would you still play him when hes past his usefulness?
Originally posted by reelworld:
<strong>
Really?
Becks have been doing that since last season,
why do you think he still doing it this season.
If Becks come inside on his own all along do you think he still be on the team right now.
The reason why Becks and Ole played differently because they're different kind of players.
Ole has the speed and the ability to beat defenders, that's why he played mostly out wide.
Becks doesn't have those attributes but he have better passing and vision, therefore he come inside more often</strong><hr></blockquote>
well.. if it works with Ole out wide, then why not stick becks out wide?
it gave us dimensions when Ole stayed out wide.. i won't argue about beck's visions, but as i asked in another thread.. "Will becks and Keane's return affect Veron"... are you prepared to have 3 playmakers in the team? it seemed to work wonderfully when Veron was the only 1.. why change that now..?
And yes, becks has always contributed.. eventhough tactically wrong he has always been one to push and push and push.. i don't discredit him for his efforts.. but when he hasn't done much better than Ole it won't justify putting Ole back on the bench.. wouldn't you agree?
Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>
Although not at his best, he already showed some of the things he could do in Chelsea's match: some good crosses, won a couple of headers, ran tirelessly, one assist, and put Forlan thru again in the final minutes. Yes he was still not 100%, but he didn't perform any worse than Veron, phil or Giggs in this match, so singled him out alone for critize is totally, absolutely unfair, IMO.</strong><hr></blockquote>
don't get defensive here.. i'm not singling beck out.. i'm merely suggesting that tactically it may even be better to keep with Ole on the wing.. u just cannot justify putting Ole back on the bench for all the wonderful performances he's given in the last 5 games..
If becks cannot do much better over the next few games then i'd be very surprised if Ole isn't given another run on the wing.
And Veron performed much better while becks wasn't here and Ole stayed out wide.. coincidence? i think not.
one lucky break is not enough to justify a person's stay in the first team.. it's a team's performance on an overall basis that should decide who plays and who doesn't.
Becks is a great player, great efforts, but he needs to gel with this tactic.
If he can do it, i'll be the happiest person in the world.. i'd hate to see a talented player go to waste.
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
well.. if it works with Ole out wide, then why not stick becks out wide?
</strong>
<hr></blockquote>
if Becks try to played like Ole, stay out wide, try to beat players, etc, he would be ineffective, as he have no pace.
<strong>
it gave us dimensions when Ole stayed out wide.. i won't argue about beck's visions, but as i asked in another thread.. "Will becks and Keane's return affect Veron"... are you prepared to have 3 playmakers in the team? it seemed to work wonderfully when Veron was the only 1.. why change that now..?
And yes, becks has always contributed.. eventhough tactically wrong he has always been one to push and push and push.. i don't discredit him for his efforts.. but when he hasn't done much better than Ole it won't justify putting Ole back on the bench.. wouldn't you agree?</strong><hr></blockquote>
It's still early to judge him that he hasn't done much. Just get back from injury and all. Just give him a few games to proved himself.
And to Becks and Veron, didn't this pair worked well in Europe? I don't see any reason why this won't work now, as Veron has adjusted his game to the EPL as well. Keane have told in an interview, that he would stop trying all by himself in the game. I think that could be a sign that he's ready to give the playmaker role to Veron.
All this still remain to be seen, but one thing for sure, if United want to succeed in Europe and England, they better have Beckham on the side.
Originally posted by reelworld:
<strong>
It's still early to judge him that he hasn't done much. Just get back from injury and all. Just give him a few games to proved himself.
And to Becks and Veron, didn't this pair worked well in Europe? I don't see any reason why this won't work now, as Veron has adjusted his game to the EPL as well. Keane have told in an interview, that he would stop trying all by himself in the game. I think that could be a sign that he's ready to give the playmaker role to Veron.
All this still remain to be seen, but one thing for sure, if United want to succeed in Europe and England, they better have Beckham on the side.</strong><hr></blockquote>
i agree. good post.
it's a blessing in disguise that we now realize Ole's ability on the right wing. Becks will surely know that he cannot under perform or else his position will be under scrutiny.
I agree that it has worked in Europe.. but it also didn't look very flowing (basing my judgement on the Deportivo game where Ole played on the wing compared to other games that we had becks).
I also agree that Veron has adapted more or less to the EPL games.. this would surely help becks gelling with veron more.
If Keane can truly stay back and work hard on the defensive side i'm sure it'll work whoever plays, ole or becks.
i think we have a great player in Ole, and if we should lose becks again due to injury i still won't cross us out on winning the big trophies this season.
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
don't get defensive here.. i'm not singling beck out.. i'm merely suggesting that tactically it may even be better to keep with Ole on the wing.. u just cannot justify putting Ole back on the bench for all the wonderful performances he's given in the last 5 games..
If becks cannot do much better over the next few games then i'd be very surprised if Ole isn't given another run on the wing.
And Veron performed much better while becks wasn't here and Ole stayed out wide.. coincidence? i think not.
one lucky break is not enough to justify a person's stay in the first team.. it's a team's performance on an overall basis that should decide who plays and who doesn't.
Becks is a great player, great efforts, but he needs to gel with this tactic.
If he can do it, i'll be the happiest person in the world.. i'd hate to see a talented player go to waste.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I totally agree at this moment Ole deserve to get a place in the starting lineup more than beckham. That's no doubt about that. Just don't want to hear people slagging off Beckham for no reason.
Originally posted by sin65:
<strong>
The point is there are United fans who discuss the merits and failings of players and there are Beckham fans who are loyal to the ridiculous and are more fans of Becks than they are of United.This is annoying to the majority of us as we support MANCHESTER UNITED not BECKHAM UNITED.
and if I remember correctly uranushk1 slagged off Veron when he played no worse than Beckham but praises Beckham for doing the same.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Beckham United? Imagine what reception will be got in Japan
Yes I slagged of Veron when he played consistently bad, and I have no regret about that. The point here is that Beckham is not performing a series of very bad match (actually, he has just been back from injury), so I cannot understand why people demand so much for him.
If there are someone who support a player more than United, that must be the parties of "Veron United". Take Chelsea's match as an example, what exactly has Veron done except a long pass which put Giggs thru? Yet Veron supporters are saying he played much better than Beckham, who put Forlan thru twice (and one of them result with a goal). I understand Veron supporters simple don't want Beckham to return to the starting lineup, because they afraid Beckham's return will affect Veron's performance. But for an objective United supporter, I'd rather give a more fair comment and more support to all of our players.