Barcelona: Charged with corruption .... again!

cyberman said:
Barca aren’t better than City, Liverpool or even this Arsenal. What has this Barca team shown?
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Arsenal and Barcelona have fairly similar point tallies now and had similar point tallies last season. Barcelona have better goal difference both this season and last season. Barcelona went further in european competition (easy as Arsenal didn't qualify) and are playing in more advanced competition now. I'm not sure what argument could be made that Arsenal are better other than "they play in the PL."
 
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Well can't win against Uefa's 12th man. 2 clear penalties not given against Bayern and Inter, as well as not given Pedri's goal, although with the new handball rule, it should have counted. According to Ferran Martinez it was the same VAR by the way, but I didn't check myself. We played also badly of course, especially in the first half. Let's see if we can turn around the situation at home. But with Christensen out for 3 weeks, we lost our 3 best defenders for the hardest october in football history with 12 games in 40 days. Looking real good so far.
 
Ragnar123 said:
Well can't win against Uefa's 12th man. 2 clear penalties not given against Bayern and Inter, as well as not given Pedri's goal, although with the new handball rule, it should have counted. According to Ferran Martinez it was the same VAR by the way, but I didn't check myself. We played also badly of course, especially in the first half. Let's see if we can turn around the situation at home. But with Christensen out for 3 weeks, we lost our 3 best defenders for the hardest october in football history with 12 games in 40 days. Looking real good so far.
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'Hardest october in football history' is facing Real Madrid, Bayern once and Inter Milan twice (who btw are 10th in Serie A)? And since when did the month of October have 40 days? :wenger:

And don't even get me started with Barca and UEFA referees in the past. :lol:
 
Iker Quesadillas said:
Laughable stuff.

The PL "we are the best, all our teams are superior" narrative is living off of 6 months of good Chelsea form in 2021. Look past that fluke and the overall performance of the league in maximum European competition is a complete embarassment.
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City have been the best team on the planet by far for years you could argue. Nobody in world football has been playing at their level. City got 100 points in the season not long ago too. Real don’t have a chance in hell of doing that back then and especially now in the Premier League.

You are arguing like the CL is everything.A lucky cup win is not reality and everyone knows Real have had more of that than basically anyone in recent years. They play City 8 time out of 10 they get smashed period. Anyone with eyes can see that.

Barcelona basically are a budget Man City these days one could argue also. They are no threat in the Premer League over a full season.
 
Looks like Barca and Atletico finally came to an agreement for Griezmann. They buy him for €20m+2. We bought him for €120m 3 years ago, now they blackmail us for their own legend and best player to reduce the agreed sum last summer. So we payed about €100m in fee and €50m in wages for his 2 mediocre years with us. Thanks again Bartomeu, since he personally made that transfer happen and I hope we never do business with them again. All in all an embarassing transfer and I'm glad this saga is over.
 
Son said:
City have been the best team on the planet by far for years you could argue. Nobody in world football has been playing at their level. City got 100 points in the season not long ago too. Real don’t have a chance in hell of doing that back then and especially now in the Premier League.

You are arguing like the CL is everything.A lucky cup win is not reality and everyone knows Real have had more of that than basically anyone in recent years. They play City 8 time out of 10 they get smashed period. Anyone with eyes can see that.

Barcelona basically are a budget Man City these days one could argue also. They are no threat in the Premer League over a full season.
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"Always luck is ability"

You claim that City is the best team in the world while the truth is that they consistently bottle the biggest games they have to play.
 
They were robbed yesterday and there's no reason to deny it. How screwed will Barca be if they indeed end up in the Europa?
 
Sounds like the Steven Gerrard/Frank Lampard hybrid is doing... as expected.
 
Red Star One said:
They were robbed yesterday and there's no reason to deny it. How screwed will Barca be if they indeed end up in the Europa?
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If they would be reasonable people they would take it as a quick opportunity to win a title. But as they are a bunch of delusional people they will embarass themselves like they did last season.
 
Son said:
City have been the best team on the planet by far for years you could argue. Nobody in world football has been playing at their level. City got 100 points in the season not long ago too. Real don’t have a chance in hell of doing that back then and especially now in the Premier League.
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You have nothing to base these arguments other than the belief that the PL is far superior to other leagues, a belief which is backed by very little.

The year Manchester City got 100 points, 2nd best was United with 81 points, 3rd best was Spurs with 77, and 4th best was Liverpool with 75. None of these clubs had achieved anything substantial in recent years and were far from being the top teams in the world.

Meanwhile Real Madrid had won its domestic competition the previous season with 93 points, competing against Barcelona who'd won a treble the previous season, and Atletico Madrid who'd been to multiple CL finals and won the league a few years before.
 
Iker Quesadillas said:
Arsenal and Barcelona have fairly similar point tallies now and had similar point tallies last season. Barcelona have better goal difference both this season and last season. Barcelona went further in european competition (easy as Arsenal didn't qualify) and are playing in more advanced competition now. I'm not sure what argument could be made that Arsenal are better other than "they play in the PL."
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So why put Barca above Arsenal if they’re so close? Your post sounds like it’s ridiculous to even assume Barca would be a top 4 side yet you’re comparing second place to England’s 5th place.
Arsenal have been a lot more impressive than Barca this season by the way unless the metric is who can cross the ball more then Barca wins hands down
Barca just lost against the two similar sized teams in the CL so just being in a competition isn’t that much of a factor. If anything Arsenal being a similar side due to the competition in England and not being able to qualify goes against your original point.
Barca are too slow up top, they don’t have the intensity to press from the front and don’t have enough power around the team imo. You get away with that in Spain but step up and it’s looking like 2 CL group stage eliminations in two seasons
 
Son said:
They play City 8 time out of 10 they get smashed period. Anyone with eyes can see that.
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Guardiola's City have played Real Madrid 4 times in the last three seasons. City won 3 times, always by 1 goal. Real Madrid won the other time, by 2 goals. Instead of being condescending you should try using your eyes to look up some results.
 
Ragnar123 said:
Looks like Barca and Atletico finally came to an agreement for Griezmann. They buy him for €20m+2. We bought him for €120m 3 years ago, now they blackmail us for their own legend and best player to reduce the agreed sum last summer. So we payed about €100m in fee and €50m in wages for his 2 mediocre years with us. Thanks again Bartomeu, since he personally made that transfer happen and I hope we never do business with them again. All in all an embarassing transfer and I'm glad this saga is over.
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Can Barça fan quit the neverending victimization? The contract was drafted/reviewed by the club's lawyers, it contained provisions allowing Atletico not to buy Griezmann if he doesn't reach a certain amount of games/minutes played and Atletico has the choice to put him on the pitch or not. A contract isn't blackmail, and being stupid doesn't make you a victim, it just makes you stupid.
 
The argument that "Europe/CL doesn't matter" rings completely hollow, because it sure mattered when it looked like a second consecutive all-English CL final.
 
Iker Quesadillas said:
The argument that "Europe/CL doesn't matter" rings completely hollow, because people who argue for the PL superiority were bragging about another all-English CL final right up to when Rodrygo scored that first goal.
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It doesn’t matter because it’s harder to qualify for top 4 in England than in Spain. Might as well use it to say Celtic are better than Arsenal as well. It’s not a standardised level of quality to qualify for CL
 
Ragnar123 said:
Well can't win against Uefa's 12th man. 2 clear penalties not given against Bayern and Inter, as well as not given Pedri's goal, although with the new handball rule, it should have counted. According to Ferran Martinez it was the same VAR by the way, but I didn't check myself. We played also badly of course, especially in the first half. Let's see if we can turn around the situation at home. But with Christensen out for 3 weeks, we lost our 3 best defenders for the hardest october in football history with 12 games in 40 days. Looking real good so far.
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This is fecking hilarious!! Barcelona literally earned the nickname “Uefalona” due to the amount of favourable decisions they’ve had in the competition over the years. Talk about brass neck. :lol:
 
cyberman said:
It doesn’t matter because it’s harder to qualify for top 4 in England than in Spain. Might as well use it to say Celtic are better than Arsenal as well. It’s not a standardised level of quality to qualify for CL
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You must be quoting the wrong post. I have no idea how these thoughts connect with each other.

I'm sorry but this stuff is just very silly. You are talking about Arsenal. A club that have been very mediocre for the last 5 seasons. Their football has been somewhere between 'acceptable' and 'absolutely dire' for the majority of Arteta's tenure. They finally have a two-month period of great form and you're going to say they're better than Barcelona.

I can't read this as anything other than an attempt to square the belief that the PL is massively superior to the rest with the reality that United, Chelsea, Liverpool, and Spurs don't look particularly good.
 
Iker Quesadillas said:
You have nothing to base these arguments other than the belief that the PL is far superior to other leagues, a belief which is backed by very little.
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How about Florentino Perez desperately wanting six English Premier League clubs to form part of a 12 club super league?
 
@Son

One of the difficulties of CL is that you have to be clutch/deadly in the right moment. If, as you say, you play 10 times against the same team, apart from the fact those 10 games take place in your head only, that handicap is not there anymore. It is not the Champions League anymore. In CL you know there is no room for mistake and if you make a mistake it will be heavily punished and hence you will have to do something extraordinary to overcome it, which is a quality not many possess.

If you want to analyze results in order to determine how well City did in past years maybe it would be more convenient to have a look at games against Monaco, Lyon, Spurs or a weak Madrid as compared to the ones between 2014-2018. These performances do not compare well to other great sides from the past.

I think City will eventually lift the trophy, but they will have to earn it on the pitch. Until that happens we will hand them the @Son and @GatoLoco's Cup, which consists of us determining who deserves the CL with teams not having any need to play real games.
 
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MegadrivePerson said:
How about Florentino Perez desperately wanting six English Premier League clubs to form part of a 12 club super league?
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The Super League is about money and no one doubts that there is the most money involved. It's especially not about the quality on the pitch.

And so far the economical dominance hasn't translated into dominating the European cups, so while the EPL is objectively ahead of other leagues, it's still close enough that their top teams have to prove themselves against the top teams from other leagues. And often they fail.
 
stefan92 said:
And so far the economical dominance hasn't translated into dominating the European cups, so while the EPL is objectively ahead of other leagues, it's still close enough that their top teams have to prove themselves against the top teams from other leagues. And often they fail.
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For me it's not just that it hasn't translated into dominating the European cups.

I don't know if I said it in this thread or another one, but the "PL superiority" narrative is being carried hard by Chelsea being great for 9 months under Tuchel and winning the CL.

Take that out of the equation, and take name recognition out of the equation, and look at what's there. Have Chelsea, Manchester United, Arsenal, and Spurs played great football in the last five seasons? Have they had the world's best players and squads? Have they obtained great results internationally or domestically?
 
stefan92 said:
The Super League is about money and no one doubts that there is the most money involved. It's especially not about the quality on the pitch.

And so far the economical dominance hasn't translated into dominating the European cups, so while the EPL is objectively ahead of other leagues, it's still close enough that their top teams have to prove themselves against the top teams from other leagues. And often they fail.
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Compare the top six teams in England with the top six from Spain Germany and Italy.

The last five Champions league finals have been made up of six English teams, two Spanish, one french and one german. I'd say that's pretty dominant!
 
MegadrivePerson said:
Compare the top six teams in England with the top six from Spain Germany and Italy.

The last five Champions league finals have been made up of six English teams, two Spanish, one french and one german. I'd say that's pretty dominant!
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That's true, but still only two have won it, which is my point. PL teams have to prove themselves against the best in Europe to be able to claim to be the absolute best. And all evidence points to the European top clubs all being on a similar level. England just has more of them.
 
MegadrivePerson said:
Compare the top six teams in England with the top six from Spain Germany and Italy.
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That's kind of the issue. I don't think anyone is denying that the PL has more top teams. But having more of them doesn't mean they are better.
MegadrivePerson said:
The last five Champions league finals have been made up of six English teams, two Spanish, one french and one german. I'd say that's pretty dominant!
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Liverpool amount to half of those appearances, three and one win. The rest are individual appearances by City, Chelsea, and Spurs. Chelsea are saved by their win, their record outside of it is quite mediocre. City have also objectively underperformed in this competition.
 
How many Levers have to be pulled if they go to the Ropey? In the Summer it sounded like they needed a minimum of a QF stop to make their Summer Levers add up for this year.
 
Oly Francis said:
Can Barça fan quit the neverending victimization? The contract was drafted/reviewed by the club's lawyers, it contained provisions allowing Atletico not to buy Griezmann if he doesn't reach a certain amount of games/minutes played and Atletico has the choice to put him on the pitch or not. A contract isn't blackmail, and being stupid doesn't make you a victim, it just makes you stupid.
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Wanted to say the same. Good post. And what an embarrassing statement you highlighted there.
 
Still think that they will qualify rather than been in UEL like us.

They will beat Inter and Viktoria and I see them drawing against Bayern at Camp Nou so dont worry for these guys
 
Chaky_Best said:
Still think that they will qualify rather than been in UEL like us.

They will beat Inter and Viktoria and I see them drawing against Bayern at Camp Nou so dont worry for these guys
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They are under huge pressure now. If Inter gets a draw next week, it's curtains for them.
 
Xavi's mismanagement of this team is really something. Great players don't always make great managers.

Firstly, Raphinha had a good International break with 2 goals and 2 assists. Xavi decides to play him at LW vs Inter where he has proven ineffective. Dembele turns into a clown at RW but instead of swapping them (we know Dembele can also play at LW), I guess 2 shit ineffective wings with Lewa getting no service is better than 1 shit ineffective wing, right Xavi? Raphinha was moved to RW in the 2nd half and then shortly after gets the hook whilst Dembele continues playing like a donkey.

Balde should be starting ahead of Alonso. (why on earth did we even sign Alonso?)

Gavi isn't ready to be a starter yet, tbf Frenkie is out injured but maybe it's time to give Kessie more of a chance.

Our CB situation is fecked, Araujo, Kounde and now Christensen all out injured. Kessie is out now also as is Frenkie and Memphis. Referee yesterday was also pathetic but no excuses, we should totally be beating Inter in their current form.

Xavi was one of my favourite players of all time, the GOAT midfielder but if we end up in Europa league after the money spent this summer, he has to go.
 
Some things that had been happening are being confirmed.
Xavi needs to give the team more tactical options. He is still stubborn in the same idea of generating spaces for the winger to do 1vs1 the whole game.
The team must play more with the interiors and in the bands make triangulations of winger, CM and FB and generate clearer spaces.
In the constructions of the plays more options are also needed, some already have memorized the players of the Spanish team and are not done in Barcelona.
And finally put the players in their positions. Raphinha from RW and Gavi on the left.

I don't like to talk about referees and I'm not going to do it. The incredible thing is that the Var guy is still there with all the scandals he's had.
 
Pickle85 said:
Just yesterday you said


So which is it? Is Xavi terrible or brilliant?!
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Those are not contradictory claims at all. Xavi was/is an improvement compared to Koeman which means very little by itself as Koeman was largely clueless and a demoralizing figure by his constant public and diminishing statements in regards to the team. I am not a professional footballer but I doubt that such constant statements would give me much encouragement or motivation.

I am surprised by the results and overall play in the league (19 points in 7 games with 19 goals scored and just 1 goal conceded). The first game against Plzen in the CL was a comfortable victory and overall a good performance. The game against Bayern was also a very good performance and game which should never have been lost based on chances created and overall play. Hence my comment of me being positively surprised.

As for Xavi himself (as a manager and tactician) I already wrote in the La Liga thread on Sunday, that I regarded him as a novice and that RM are the favorites (in my eyes) to win the league this season. You can see my post in the La Liga thread.

Red Star One said:
They were robbed yesterday and there's no reason to deny it. How screwed will Barca be if they indeed end up in the Europa?
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Complete robbery. Goal disallowed contrary to the laws in place and a blatant handball (penalty) not given by the same VAR referee that denied a stonewall penalty for Dembélé against Bayern when the score was 0-0 just before the first half was about to end. Even Lucas Hernández who committed the foul admitted that it was probably a penalty in a post-match interview. It is beyond ridiculous that such clearly key referring decisions can alter our future prospects in the CL this season. Irrespective of the overall poor performance against Inter away from home. Regardless of the CL being a lottery in itself.

Then we have a bunch of users here, still depressed/obsessed about Barça's monumental success between 2004-2019, behaving like a bunch of losers, when they would be complaining about such crucial refereeing decisions if those occurred against the teams that they support. Childish behavior and projecting of some kind of non-existent "victimization".

Anyway, looking at the result yesterday with a cool "head", Inter barely created anything other than 2 shots on goal. We should never have lost that game and there is no reason to believe, that we cannot win against them at the Camp Nou next Wednesday. Our biggest enemies in this regard are the plague of injuries and Xavi's dysfunctional tactics. I still believe that we will qualify but it won't be easy and Xavi has made it far too complicated for himself and the team.

Speaking about injuries, the amount of them in the past 2 weeks is beyond ridiculous. Something is clearly wrong with our fitness team or physical preparation. Or just bad luck. Whatever it is, it should be fixed.
 
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Raiden Shogun said:
Xavi's mismanagement of this team is really something. Great players don't always make great managers.

Firstly, Raphinha had a good International break with 2 goals and 2 assists. Xavi decides to play him at LW vs Inter where he has proven ineffective. Dembele turns into a clown at RW but instead of swapping them (we know Dembele can also play at LW), I guess 2 shit ineffective wings with Lewa getting no service is better than 1 shit ineffective wing, right Xavi? Raphinha was moved to RW in the 2nd half and then shortly after gets the hook whilst Dembele continues playing like a donkey.

Balde should be starting ahead of Alonso. (why on earth did we even sign Alonso?)

Gavi isn't ready to be a starter yet, tbf Frenkie is out injured but maybe it's time to give Kessie more of a chance.

Our CB situation is fecked, Araujo, Kounde and now Christensen all out injured. Kessie is out now also as is Frenkie and Memphis. Referee yesterday was also pathetic but no excuses, we should totally be beating Inter in their current form.

Xavi was one of my favourite players of all time, the GOAT midfielder but if we end up in Europa league after the money spent this summer, he has to go.
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Agree. However his obsession and insistence on playing a 34 year old Busquets that can barely run anymore constantly is driving me nuts as well. It is like playing with 1 player less in high-intensity games. Inter's sole tactic was to sit back and play on the few counters that they got using quick transitions where Busquets's usefulness is equal to that of a scarecrow.

The insistence on playing a barely fit Roberto is also laughable. He had TONS of space but not even ONCE did he overlap with Dembélé or create something on his own. Truly laughable. A 39 year old Alves was preferred over Roberto last season. Why not use Balde as a right back again? It worked rather well against Mallorca and it would be impossible for him to do worse even when played out of position.

The less said about his tactics or lack thereof the better. It seems that he has learned nothing from the last few months of last season where the team imploded. Not only that, the entire transfer window was spent on signing almost every single player that he wanted the club to sign, with the exception of Azpilicueta (thank God for that). He has no excuses, I get that our CL group is the CL group of "death" this season, but it would be a sackable offense to not advance further and end behind this Inter team.

I get it, the club has been in a crisis for the past 2-3 season (biggest in the past 20 years) but we are Barça and the obligation is to win and compete for trophies every season. There is no time for transitions. Xavi had that last season when he took over and it was obvious that the team would not win anything of note. Right now he has the players to compete for the league title and at the least advance from the CL group.

Anyway hopefully the team can bounce back against Celta at home on Sunday night and afterwards give it all against Inter at home.
Hopefully with tactics from Xavi that make sense.
 
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Raiden Shogun said:
Xavi's mismanagement of this team is really something. Great players don't always make great managers.

Firstly, Raphinha had a good International break with 2 goals and 2 assists. Xavi decides to play him at LW vs Inter where he has proven ineffective. Dembele turns into a clown at RW but instead of swapping them (we know Dembele can also play at LW), I guess 2 shit ineffective wings with Lewa getting no service is better than 1 shit ineffective wing, right Xavi? Raphinha was moved to RW in the 2nd half and then shortly after gets the hook whilst Dembele continues playing like a donkey.

Balde should be starting ahead of Alonso. (why on earth did we even sign Alonso?)

Gavi isn't ready to be a starter yet, tbf Frenkie is out injured but maybe it's time to give Kessie more of a chance.

Our CB situation is fecked, Araujo, Kounde and now Christensen all out injured. Kessie is out now also as is Frenkie and Memphis. Referee yesterday was also pathetic but no excuses, we should totally be beating Inter in their current form.

Xavi was one of my favourite players of all time, the GOAT midfielder but if we end up in Europa league after the money spent this summer, he has to go.
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It is not just about the wings - but when there is not much movement in and around the box, the passing is too slow and Lewy does not really have a help + no service, he will not function. He is good but no superman.
 
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