"Backing the Manager"

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

This topic has been done to death.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We do back our managers although we don't support them with the adequate executive level competency that we should. I don't think any of them would have been a success regardless though as they were poor appointments IMO. We have to back the new manager, but judge him at the same time, which is what every club does. At any organisation a CEO has both power and obligation.

 

[Mainoldo]

The scouting needs to be in-sync. That’s what really needs to happen. If he wants Antony and we can’t get him. The number two target best offer what Antony should have offered.

 

[croadyman]

The scouting needs to be in-sync. That’s what really needs to happen. If he wants Antony and we can’t get him. The number two target best offer what Antony should have offered.

Yeah exactly the strategy needed

 

[MUW4Eva]

We need a Director of Football for the women's team to be appointed pronto, to really help in terms of really "backing the manager", and helping to take some of the pressure off of him, and to allow him to fully concentrate on the on the pitch stuff.

 

[desertegil]

The most important job for the Man UTD board right now is to not hire a manager, but a head coach.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Good post.

Btw Moyes would've been sacked about 5 times during his tenure if he was at any other big european club.

Ironically, true of Ole too.

Shambolic how poorly we've operated.

 

[R'hllor]

RM threw him out of the door.

PSG and Man City were recently fined by FFP at the time. They already made a big signing in David Luis, so they couldn't meet RM asking fee in that window.

Yea that was it. anyway feck that ratface cnut

 

[padzilla]

There is more to backing the manager than giving him an open cheque book.
Players who were identified as previous managers as being not the type of character they want in the squad (Pogba, Martial) are not only still at the club - they have had lucrative contract extensions as well.
If a manager wants rid of players they should be moved on, the side Fergie when he won his first trophy bore no resemblance to the one that he took over just three and a half years before
Look at Liverpool's current side compared to what Klopp took over.
We are absolutely useless at selling underperforming players.

 

[padzilla]

I would also be quite worried that the new manager hiring process is taking so long that we won't be able to start negotiations for new signings until later in the summer, meaning anyone we sign will miss pre-season training.

 

[smi11ie]

I think it is more about the players backing the manager. I have read reports that some of the players don't think he is the right appointment. I hope ETH gets rid of the guys who don't beleive in him.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Depends what you mean by back to be honest. We’ve spent a lot of money but I don’t think we’ve really given any support to managers until the transfer committee was formed and the jury is still out on that anyway.

It’s hard to know what on earth happened with Moyes given all the stories, we know LVG had almost no help from a non existent DoF structure and Mou evolved that system slightly but he was picking preferred players and personally ranking them (which he even said in a presser and makes it so weird that fans argue certain signings weren’t his). Ole did have support at least but we seemed to go for high cost very obvious signings (Maguire and AWB) before lapsing back to desperate punts on old cnuts and random players who didn’t fit any philosophy but were available.

 

[JPRouve]

Depends what you mean by back to be honest. We’ve spent a lot of money but I don’t think we’ve really given any support to managers until the transfer committee was formed and the jury is still out on that anyway.

It’s hard to know what on earth happened with Moyes given all the stories, we know LVG had almost no help from a non existent DoF structure and Mou evolved that system slightly but he was picking preferred players and personally ranking them (which he even said in a presser and makes it so weird that fans argue certain signings weren’t his). Ole did have support at least but we seemed to go for high cost very obvious signings (Maguire and AWB) before lapsing back to desperate punts on old cnuts and random players who didn’t fit any philosophy but were available.

But that's why these three managers wanted the job, they wanted the SAF/Wenger role. It's fairly well documented that many managers around the world have been dreaming of having this kind of role, the only issue being that almost none of them can do it.

That's why I can't take the three managers that you mentioned seriously, they are absolutely spineless. They took a job and craved a power that they couldn't handle and then blamed someone else, none of them wanted a DOF, they wanted power, they got it, failed miserably and blamed others. That's also the difference between these guys and Klopp or Guardiola who made it clear that they are head coaches and don't want to stretch themselves into areas they don't master which is why Guardiola is happy with working with DOFs and Liverpool changed their structure to fit with Klopp.

 

[tomaldinho1]

But that's why these three managers wanted the job, they wanted the SAF/Wenger role. It's fairly well documented that many managers around the world have been dreaming of having this kind of role, the only issue being that almost none of them can do it.

That's why I can't take the three managers that you mentioned seriously, they are absolutely spineless. They took a job and craved a power that they couldn't handle and then blamed someone else, none of them wanted a DOF, they wanted power, they got it, failed miserably and blamed others. That's also the difference between these guys and Klopp or Guardiola who made it clear that they are head coaches and don't want to stretch themselves into areas they don't master which is why Guardiola is happy with working with DOFs and Liverpool changed their structure to fit with Klopp.

Not sure I’d call them spineless, rather they probably all didn’t realise how bad our scouting/recruitment team was and so it’s both parties failing each other. Woodward was anti-DoF as well so we don’t know if they would have wanted one anyway.

 

[Zlatattack]

The reality is that the single biggest problem over the past decade has been really bad managerial appointments. Moyes proceeded to do feck all off 5 years until getting West Ham to be a decent upper mid table punching above their weight team. Van Gaal managed no other club team in the past decade. Mourinho proceeded to fail at Spurs and do ok at best at Roma now. Ole was doing feck all in Norway and is back to doing feck all. The second biggest problem? Giving the managers too much say in player turnover. The third, not sacking them when the first signs came in (both Ole and Mourinho probably shouldn't have been in charge at the start of their final seasons).

I agree. We have had these bad appointments because we have nobody in our clubs senior management responsible for the footballing direction of the club. That was all on SAF and when he retired, they just hoped the next manager would do the same. I think Moyes and Ole were bad choices (although i was as excited as Rio about Ole, but who cares what i think, i'm a fan). LVG and Mourinho could have been good managerial appointments, but were so different to each other in style and tactics.

 

[JPRouve]

Not sure I’d call them spineless, rather they probably all didn’t realise how bad our scouting/recruitment team was and so it’s both parties failing each other. Woodward was anti-DoF as well so we don’t know if they would have wanted one anyway.

They are spineless because instead of admitting that they were limited they have been blaming everyone else and are still doing it. It was their job to improve the scouting and recruitment team, as it was SAF's job to do it. And Woodward wasn't anti-DOF, he was pro giving the manager and fans what they asked until he had to sack the manager, it was of course a terrible way of leading a club but he wasn't anti anything.

We are not going to pretend that any of these managers wanted the influence of someone else above them or that a large part of the fanbase were and still are asking for the manager to be given all the power.

 

[Bondi77]

Of course he will be backed!
The problem is that every club wants nearly double the value of their player if we show an interest in them.
It will not only be Rice that will have an inflated price tag in the summer it will be every DM that gets talked about.

 

[Blood Mage]

If a manager shows evidence that he's trying to execute a plan then he should always be given time. That's why Pool didn't sack Klopp after his very disappointing debut season. Our post-Fergie managers so far didn't deserve the time we gave them as there was no sign of any plan or progress from any of them.

 

[tomaldinho1]

They are spineless because instead of admitting that they were limited they have been blaming everyone else and are still doing it. It was their job to improve the scouting and recruitment team, as it was SAF's job to do it. And Woodward wasn't anti-DOF, he was pro giving the manager and fans what they asked until he had to sack the manager, it was of course a terrible way of leading a club but he wasn't anti anything.

We are not going to pretend that any of these managers wanted the influence of someone else above them or that a large part of the fanbase were and still are asking for the manager to be given all the power.

Every single year we were told a variation of this quote.

‘Ed Woodward wants to find a DoF’

And yet at no point did we interview a single candidate who was qualified. Further to that I remember LVG supposedly asked for a DoF, Mou was our manager when the speculation kept coming up so hardly likely he was against it. That was even mooted as a way to appease him if we got Campos after the disaster window.

You can even find evidence reported by Sky that Woodward rejected SAF’s Walsh recommendation given he had no link to the club and, from what we can see, the only people he might have spoken to seriously are bloody Rio, Fletcher and Evra.

 

[JPRouve]

Every single year we were told a variation of this quote.

‘Ed Woodward wants to find a DoF’

And yet at no point did we interview a single candidate who was qualified. Further to that I remember LVG supposedly asked for a DoF, Mou was our manager when the speculation kept coming up so hardly likely he was against it. That was even mooted as a way to appease him if we got Campos after the disaster window.

You can even find evidence reported by Sky that Woodward rejected SAF’s Walsh recommendation given he had no link to the club and, from what we can see, the only people he might have spoken to seriously are bloody Rio, Fletcher and Evra.

The rumours about Van Gaal admitting that he needed helps are from march 2016 when he was already doomed. Mourinho clearly didn't want a DOF in fact if I remember correctly he explicitely mentioned that he dreamed about having the SAF role or something to that effect, then later it was rumoured that the club had to convince him about it but then the issue was to find someone he would be happy with. And Campos would have been a poor fit for Mourinho, Campos network is built around very young players that need developing and nurturing while Mourinho wants battle ready players. They are also both fiery.

None of them took the job with the idea or will to have a DOF, they all wanted to be managers and emulate SAF. Now the club shouldn't have put them in a situation where they had any choice because it's none of their business but they got what they wanted, failed and blamed others.

 

[Adnan]

@JPRouve good posts, completely agree.

And also don't forget that the club (United) allowed the managers their own personal recruitment staff, which is understandable before the advent of the recruitment structure, pre 2018. But it made no sense to carry on with that approach after the formation of the recruitment structure.

 

[Denis79]

They are spineless because instead of admitting that they were limited they have been blaming everyone else and are still doing it. It was their job to improve the scouting and recruitment team, as it was SAF's job to do it. And Woodward wasn't anti-DOF, he was pro giving the manager and fans what they asked until he had to sack the manager, it was of course a terrible way of leading a club but he wasn't anti anything.

We are not going to pretend that any of these managers wanted the influence of someone else above them or that a large part of the fanbase were and still are asking for the manager to be given all the power.

Building an extensive scouting network, employing knowledgeable people in important positions, tools the manager needs to succeed is "backing the manager". But for all that to happen I think you need people with experience in most important positions and not just the manager.

We have thankfully left the nostalgia behind us now with Ole gone and hopefully start building a experienced team of people around our future manager.

 

[JPRouve]

@JPRouve good posts, completely agree.

And also don't forget that the club (United) allowed the managers their own personal recruitment staff, which is understandable before the advent of the recruitment structure, pre 2018. But it made no sense to carry on with that approach after the formation of the recruitment structure.

It made no sense in 2013. One of the good things about SAF is that he was fairly open and honest about his way of doing things. The scouting was organized by Lawlor, Langley and Martin Ferguson with the later being the most important piece, that piece left with SAF. SAF did two things from the early 2000s delegate a large part of coaching to the first team coach and delegate, delegate the admin part to the assistant manager and delegate the main part of the professional scouting to his brother and Lawlor, I knew that as a teenager so no professional has an excuse when it comes to how United worked in 2013, the information was everywhere.

 

[JPRouve]

Building an extensive scouting network, employing knowledgeable people in important positions, tools the manager needs to succeed is "backing the manager". But for all that to happen I think you need people with experience in most important positions and not just the manager.

We have thankfully left the nostalgia behind us now with Ole gone and hopefully start building a experienced team of people around our future manager.

Let's be clear about something. The traditional role of manager, the british definition of the term, means that the manager is the one supposed to bring those experienced people. We can't have it both ways, the manager can't demand the power and influence of a traditional manager while having the responsibilities of a traditional head coach. It makes no sense and it's frankly dishonest.

I have said for years that I want a top heavy structure because I do not trust a structure that relies heavily on a single person, imagine what would happen to United if SAF had a car accident in 2000 or 2001, the club would be doomed because for all intent and purpose it was an empty shell, SAF was the club. SAF was exceptional enough to give sense to that organization but for anyone else it would have been a ridiculous way of doing things and that's what we have witnessed.

Now if we bring that to 2022, we have a DOF in Murtough, we are supposed to have a head coach not a manager. So the club isn't supposed to back the head coach, the head coach is supposed to do what he has been employed to do which is coach the professional team in the most efficient way possible, if he can't unless he has shown that he is valuable to the club, he should be sacked.

 

[Denis79]

Let's be clear about something. The traditional role of manager, the british definition of the term, means that the manager is the one supposed to bring those experienced people. We can't have it both ways, the manager can't demand the power and influence of a traditional manager while having the responsibilities of a traditional head coach. It makes no sense and it's frankly dishonest.

I have said for years that I want a top heavy structure because I do not trust a structure that relies heavily on a single person, imagine what would happen to United if SAF had a car accident in 2000 or 2001, the club would be doomed because for all intent and purpose it was an empty shell, SAF was the club. SAF was exceptional enough to give sense to that organization but for anyone else it would have been a ridiculous way of doing things and that's what we have witnessed.

Now if we bring that to 2022, we have a DOF in Murtough, we are supposed to have a head coach not a manager. So the club isn't supposed to back the head coach, the head coach is supposed to do what he has been employed to do which is coach the professional team in the most efficient way possible, if he can't unless he has shown that he is valuable to the club, he should be sacked.

I agree with you but we don't have that top heavy structure at all at the moment and with Ragnick in a consultant role soon and a new manager coming in it's a good time we start constructing a functioning team in the club that isn't relient on solely the manager. We can't have complete squad rebuilds and complete tactic overhauls every time a manager is changed. That's why we're stuck in the mud.

 

[Adnan]

It made no sense in 2013. One of the good things about SAF is that he was fairly open and honest about his way of doing things. The scouting was organized by Lawlor, Langley and Martin Ferguson with the later being the most important piece, that piece left with SAF. SAF did two things from the early 2000s delegate a large part of coaching to the first team coach and delegate, delegate the admin part to the assistant manager and delegate the main part of the professional scouting to his brother and Lawlor, I knew that as a teenager so no professional has an excuse when it comes to how United worked in 2013, the information was everywhere.

The way Fergie was doing things before he retired wasn't conducive to how David Moyes worked. Because Moyes was someone that utilised data analytics and a actual scouting network in the modern game. So when Fergie retired we had Langley as head of recruitment and Jim Lawlor as the full time scout with a lot of the scouting information stored in Lawlor's head. And Langley was a pen and paper person and unlike at other clubs where information was stored on computer databases, Langley was compiling scout reports in the old school-way.

So Moyes from what has been reported, did try and build a recruitment structure that meshed with the modern game and brought in his own scouts like Robbie Cooke and James Smith. But his problem was that he wasn't a good enough coach on the training field to compete with the very best and lost his job.

And it's easy to say, it should've happened in 2013, but there's no way that was possible in 2013 because the mentality that existed at the time (even among the fans) was that the next manager would fix everything. And this mentality is what has held us back until possibly now. So I agree we should've changed things in 2013, but that would've required a vision and mindset change which didn't exist until John Murtough arrived half way through the 2013/14 season and he went about restructuring the club.

 

[JPRouve]

I agree with you but we don't have that top heavy structure at all at the moment and with Ragnick in a consultant role soon and a new manager coming in it's a good time we start constructing a functioning team in the club that isn't relient on solely the manager. We can't have complete squad rebuilds and complete tactic overhauls every time a manager is changed. That's why we're stuck in the mud.

But we are building it currently we have Murtough, Rangnick, Fletcher, Alan Dawson and should have an other member soon, that's ignoring the increased influence of senior scouts. We have moved toward the top heavy side of things and are miles away from the SAF era.

 

[JPRouve]

The way Fergie was doing things before he retired wasn't conducive to how David Moyes worked. Because Moyes was someone that utilised data analytics and a actual scouting network in the modern game. So when Fergie retired we had Langley as head of recruitment and Jim Lawlor as the full time scout with a lot of the scouting information stored in Lawlor's head. And Langley was a pen and paper person and unlike at other clubs where information was stored on computer databases, Langley was compiling scout reports in the old school-way.

So Moyes from what has been reported, did try and build a recruitment structure that meshed with the modern game and brought in his own scouts like Robbie Cooke and James Smith. But his problem wasn't that he wasn't a good enough coach on the training field to compete with the very best and lost his job.

And it's easy to say, it should've happened in 2013, but there's no way that was possible in 2013 because the mentality that existed at the time (even among the fans) was that the next manager would fix everything. And this mentality is what has held us back until possibly now. So I agree we should've changed things in 2013, but that would've required a vision and mindset change which didn't exist until John Murtough arrived half way through the 2013/14 season and he went about restructuring the club.

We should have changed things before 2013 because you are right it wasn't going to be an easy switch, it should have been done in anticipation of SAF potential retirement, that's where I have focused my issue with the club and why I have zero respect for Gill. I don't rate Woodward as the CEO of United but Gill gave him a terrible job.

 

[bosnian_red]

They are spineless because instead of admitting that they were limited they have been blaming everyone else and are still doing it. It was their job to improve the scouting and recruitment team, as it was SAF's job to do it. And Woodward wasn't anti-DOF, he was pro giving the manager and fans what they asked until he had to sack the manager, it was of course a terrible way of leading a club but he wasn't anti anything.

We are not going to pretend that any of these managers wanted the influence of someone else above them or that a large part of the fanbase were and still are asking for the manager to be given all the power.

Yep. This is the point of this thread. I keep seeing on here or Reddit that "what manager would want the United job" or "the manager needs to be backed and get time" as if those were problems?? Have people not actually paid attention? The problems have been giving the wrong managers too much time. Giving the wrong managers too much backing. Giving them complete control, every time, when they don't get that anywhere. Its a dream situation for most managers, they all think they want control, big funds and time. United give that, except we've given that to our detriment over the past 10 years, because of consistently wrong appointments.

Literally not 1 of the managers we've appointed has gone on to do anything at club level. Moyes is the most impressive in making West Ham a "best after top 6" team, without playing in a way that suits a big team to actually take him. Van Gaal has had only international management in the past decade aside from the United job. He failed for other reasons, more to do with the style he tried to coach, and his inability to adapt, adjust to different players mentally. Mourinho failed before United, and failed after United and no big club will touch him. Solskjaer wasn't going to get any premier league job yet got United. Rangnick managed 2 club seasons in the past decade, but regardless was appointed as interim at a point where our season was almost gone anyway, and then the Greenwood thing happened so he never had a chance to get things going in the first place.

All these managers blame others when they should blame themselves. Or we as fans can blame the "others" for appointing them in the first place, or not replacing them in time. But I can't say much about the support or lack of support during their time here. Its been entirely normal and not the reason for our struggles. I don't think there's any 1 structure that is for sure right. Some structures help the the transition between managers be smoother and then give the right guy when they have him more control. Some just give the full control and give them a true shot, but it leads to a rocky period until you get the right manager. When the right manager is in charge though, I don't think it makes a big difference. As long as the manager does get financial backing and isn't sacked after 2 seconds, then it's on the manager.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Moyes was known as 'Dithering Dave' for a reason, plus it was Woodward' s first transfer window IIRC which he wasted chasing Fabregas and Bale.

You can criticise the board for lots of things but if anything they have been too loyal to badly chosen managers, digging themselves an ever deeper hole of incompetence and throwing bad money after good.

Thiago was close to a done deal all we needed was Moyes to sign off on it but he turned him down and went after Fabregas which was never going to happen. It was a shit window because Woodward was out of his depth and Moyes dithered too much. Money was there to be spent.

 

[Adnan]

We should have changed things before 2013 because you are right it wasn't going to be an easy switch, it should have been done in anticipation of SAF potential retirement, that's where I have focused my issue with the club and why I have zero respect for Gill. I don't rate Woodward as the CEO of United but Gill gave him a terrible job.

I completely agree with you. Gill is the one that allowed the foundations to deteriorate from the recruitment structures to the youth development. But Fergie kept winning and people thought Gill was doing a good job.

And everytime I've analysed the issues post Fergie, I've come to the same conclusion, that it was under Gill where we lost ground to rival clubs.

 

[tenpoless]

Thiago was close to a done deal all we needed was Moyes to sign off on it but he turned him down and went after Fabregas which was never going to happen. It was a shit window because Woodward was out of his depth and Moyes dithered too much. Money was there to be spent.

Moyes chasing Fabregas and ended up signing Fellaini was the funniest thing in that year.

 

[RuudTom83]

It might be a message for the players more than the board or fans?

How about play for the manager and try to do what he asks…instead of “leaking” your latest PR post to the press.

 

[tomaldinho1]

The rumours about Van Gaal admitting that he needed helps are from march 2016 when he was already doomed. Mourinho clearly didn't want a DOF in fact if I remember correctly he explicitely mentioned that he dreamed about having the SAF role or something to that effect, then later it was rumoured that the club had to convince him about it but then the issue was to find someone he would be happy with. And Campos would have been a poor fit for Mourinho, Campos network is built around very young players that need developing and nurturing while Mourinho wants battle ready players. They are also both fiery.

None of them took the job with the idea or will to have a DOF, they all wanted to be managers and emulate SAF. Now the club shouldn't have put them in a situation where they had any choice because it's none of their business but they got what they wanted, failed and blamed others.

Due respect but nothing you’ve said here has any basis in facts. If you can provide a quote for the dream of SAF role that’d be useful as I’ve never seen that.

Your point on Campos is completely wrong, they worked together at Real and are good friends - what do you even mean they are ‘both fiery’ that’s a ludicrous thing to claim as a reason it would be a bad idea, as if Internet forum posters can gauge the temperament of people we don’t know. I wish we’d leave pointless conjecture out of these conversations, what we do know is they are mates and rate each other.

The one hard fact we have, that Woodward did block a DoF recommended by SAF, you’ve conveniently ignored.

Please explain how Woodward wasnt anti DoF when we know he a) blocked a direct recommendation and b) didn’t seriously interview any actual DoF’s for the DoF role.

 

[croadyman]

Of course he will be backed!
The problem is that every club wants nearly double the value of their player if we show an interest in them.
It will not only be Rice that will have an inflated price tag in the summer it will be every DM that gets talked about.

Yeah because everyone knows we are desperate to sign one so will hike up price

 

[JPRouve]

Due respect but nothing you’ve said here has any basis in facts. If you can provide a quote for the dream of SAF role that’d be useful as I’ve never seen that.

Your point on Campos is completely wrong, they worked together at Real and are good friends - what do you even mean they are ‘both fiery’ that’s a ludicrous thing to claim as a reason it would be a bad idea, as if Internet forum posters can gauge the temperament of people we don’t know. I wish we’d leave pointless conjecture out of these conversations, what we do know is they are mates and rate each other.

The one hard fact we have, that Woodward did block a DoF recommended by SAF, you’ve conveniently ignored.

Please explain how Woodward wasnt anti DoF when we know he a) blocked a direct recommendation and b) didn’t seriously interview any actual DoF’s for the DoF role.

Campos wasn't a DOF at Madrid, he was a scout for one season, his first job as a DOF was at Monaco and then Lille. Campos temperament is well documented at both Monaco and Lille, he is an excellent DOF but it is his way or the highway, in fact he explicitely said it in an interview with Monaco-Matin.

From memory it was in an interview for Telefoot, TF1 got rid of the full replays of Telefoot for some reason.

Has for the bolded part, I didn't ignore it, I didn't know about it. Woodward blocked a DOF recommended by SAF?


Edit: I forgot to mention that at Madrid his DOF was Valdano and they feud to the point where Valdano was sidelined.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Campos wasn't a DOF at Madrid, he was a scout for one season, his first job as a DOF was at Monaco and then Lille. Campos temperament is well documented at both Monaco and Lille, he is an excellent DOF but it is his way or the highway, in fact he explicitely said it in an interview with Monaco-Matin.

From memory it was in an interview for Telefoot, TF1 got rid of the full replays of Telefoot for some reason.

Has for the bolded part, I didn't ignore it, I didn't know about it. Woodward blocked a DOF recommended by SAF?


Edit: I forgot to mention that at Madrid his DOF was Valdano and they feud to the point where Valdano was sidelined.

Never said he was a DoF, he was an analyst and scout but they are friends. His success in his DoF role at Lille was why he then got linked to the myth of our DoF role, the same reason he was then linked to Spurs when Mou was there.

Was Valdano DoF? It says he was Director General, I didn’t know Real had a DoF at that time.

Yes re Woodward, Sky reported after Woodward refused to hire a DoF (again making him anti DoF) SAF recommended Walsh to come in. If you search a lot of articles come up but one Sky article below and you’ll find lots more of you search Walsh and Woodward.
www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11667/11744370/sir-alex-ferguson-urges-man-united-to-appoint-steve-walsh-in-consultancy-role

My point is how can you say he wasn’t against a DoF when he clearly rejected this referral but, more damningly, didn’t interview a single relevant candidate in years?

 

[JPRouve]

Never said he was a DoF, he was an analyst and scout but they are friends. His success in his DoF role at Lille was why he then got linked to the myth of our DoF role, the same reason he was then linked to Spurs when Mou was there.

Was Valdano DoF? It says he was Director General, I didn’t know Real had a DoF at that time.

Yes re Woodward, Sky reported after Woodward refused to hire a DoF (again making him anti DoF) SAF recommended Walsh to come in. If you search a lot of articles come up but one Sky article below and you’ll find lots more of you search Walsh and Woodward.
www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11667/11744370/sir-alex-ferguson-urges-man-united-to-appoint-steve-walsh-in-consultancy-role

My point is how can you say he wasn’t against a DoF when he clearly rejected this referral but, more damningly, didn’t interview a single relevant candidate in years?

The question wasn't about whether they are friend or not but about whether they are a good fit when Campos is a DOF and Mourinho a head coach, on paper they are not they see things differently and as far as we know neither will change on that, Campos has been pretty clear on that front. And it's his job at Monaco that saw him linked with United, he had barely started his job at Lille when he was linked to United and it took a bit of time for things to go well.

Yes, Valdano was what some call a DOF, others will call it a sporting director or a director general.

The article that you linked talked about a consultancy role?

 

[tomaldinho1]

The question wasn't about whether they are friend or not but about whether they are a good fit when Campos is a DOF and Mourinho a head coach, on paper they are not they see things differently and as far as we know neither will change on that, Campos has been pretty clear on that front. And it's his job at Monaco that saw him linked with United, he had barely started his job at Lille when he was linked to United and it took a bit of time for things to go well.

Yes, Valdano was what some call a DOF, others will call it a sporting director or a director general.

The article that you linked talked about a consultancy role?

My error on Monaco v Lille. Not sure on Valdano, those other roles are different to a DoF but even ignoring that, Zidane credited Mou with his appointment after Valdano left:

‘Mourinho has been fundamental in this, and so has the President’

I’d add Valdano likely wasn’t a DoF because you can find a BBC article which suggests Zidane might take up some of his responsibilities after he left. Surely if Valdano was a DoF, Zidane would just replace him and wouldn’t have a different title? See below.

www.bbc.com/sport/football/14067827.amp

On your bolded point, that’s because Woodward had reportedly said no to a full time DoF which is the entire point of what I’m trying to tell you.

 

[JPRouve]

My error on Monaco v Lille. Not sure on Valdano, those other roles are different to a DoF but even ignoring that, Zidane credited Mou with his appointment after Valdano left:

‘Mourinho has been fundamental in this, and so has the President’

I’d add Valdano likely wasn’t a DoF because you can find a BBC article which suggests Zidane might take up some of his responsibilities after he left. Surely if Valdano was a DoF, Zidane would just replace him and wouldn’t have a different title? See below.

www.bbc.com/sport/football/14067827.amp

On your bolded point, that’s because Woodward had reportedly said no to a full time DoF which is the entire point of what I’m trying to tell you.

They are not different, the term DOF doesn't exist in Spanish or even french, if you are looking for that exact term you won't find it and none of them are defined differently anyway. Zidane wasn't appointed by Mourinho who never had the power to appoint someone at that level, Zidane was the president special advisor, he then became Valdano"s assistant and then he replaced Valdano in 2011, he was appointed by Perez and Sanchez.