[Pogue Mahone]

I've watched that gif too many times now.

Still got no flipping idea what Anderson was thinking, mind you. Why did he run behind the nearest player?

 

[.Rossi]

For what it's worth, I think he's actually been alright defensively for us this season

 

[.Rossi]

I've watched that gif too many times now.

Still got no flipping idea what Anderson was thinking, mind you. Why did he run behind the nearest player?

 

[Steven Seagull]

I've noticed a lot of our players doing that pointing nonsense that Blackett was doing then. Instead of making a little 5 yard run to create an angle they just stand there pointing out wide or something. Looking petrified to have the ball into feet.

 

[Pexbo]

Don't really get what is laughable about that gif. Complete lack of options there. He's the last line of defence there, he's obviously not going to try and dribble past someone and nobody is making much of an effort to get into space for a pass. Especially Anderson, who does his usual "run behind the nearest opposition player" trick. I reckon Van Gaal is as pissed off with the poor movement off the ball as he is with the conservative pass.

I know people think I just defend Valencia for the sake of it but that gif is a really strange criticism. If you had one of him repeatedly smashing the ball into the full-backs shins, that would be a different story...

Lack of options?! That's bollocks Pogue. The bolded line is the only true bit of that post.

Here's his options:

First and most blindingly obvious move. Square it to Blackett who in turn has an easy pass down the channel to Januzaj. We're then in behind their defence with 5 men attacking the box.

If he didn't fancy going square he could have gone straight through the middle to Anderson who had Mata peeling off him. He could easily have made this pass and then made himself availible for the return in the acre of space ahead of him and he'd still have been positioned correctly defensively.

Alternatively, as the play developed if he didn't have the ball underneath his feet, something that is taught out of players at U9's level and actually had the ball in a position to pass it, he could have gone long to Januzaj who was moving into acres of space on the left hand side. A ball that would have been relatively risk free with Blackett also covering that channel and a host of United players moving back towards the half way line.

Also, earlier on in the move, rather than standing with the ball under his feet he could have pushed it forward into the space he had ahead of him. He'd have been clear of the man closing down on him and he'd have opened up numerous options. At any time if he felt the man was closing in too fast on him he could have played the easy out to Blackett.



Instead he stood over the ball, did nothing and played it back to the goalkeeper. It's the just the cowardly bollocks he's constantly blasted for doing on here.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I've actually gone through almost all of those options in my last few posts. Still images don't paint the real picture as you can't see Anderson actively hiding, Blackett making it clear he doesn't want the ball or the speed at which he is closed down. Nice work though. Lots of pretty arrows.

 

[Nighteyes]

Bloody hell......

He's beyond shite. Sign a new RB or get Rafa fit or play Young. No more Valencia..please.

 

[Pexbo]

I've actually gone through almost all of those options in my last few posts. Still images don't paint the real picture as you can't see Anderson actively hiding, Blackett making it clear he doesn't want the ball or the speed at which he is closed down. Nice work though. Lots of pretty arrows.

Blackett making it clear he doesn't want the ball? He's standing in an acre of space with an easy pass down the channel, who gives a feck what you think he wants, you pass it to him. You don't stand over the ball, not moving it to either side to create space for yourself or get ready for the pass.

I genuinely don't get why you are constantly making excuses and apologising for him. You're making a fecking fool out of yourself. 99.9% of United fans can see he's garbage and how much his importance is hindering our game.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Blackett making it clear he doesn't want the ball? He's standing in an acre of space with an easy pass down the channel, who gives a feck what you think he wants, you pass it to him. You don't stand over the ball, not moving it to either side to create space for yourself or get ready for the pass.

Yes. Look at his left arm. Blatantly doesn't want the ball.

I genuinely don't get why you are constantly making excuses and apologising for him. You're making a fecking fool out of yourself. 99.9% of United fans can see he's garbage and how much his importance is hindering our game.

Couldn't give a shit what 99.9% of United fans think. All I'm doing is give my own opinion. He's completely lost his attacking mojo but is coping with the new formation/approach better than most. Defending quite well and got our only assist from open play this season. Not really worthy of all this hatred. Not fussed at all if you (or anyone else) disagrees.

 

[Pexbo]

Yes. Look at his left arm. Blatantly doesn't want the ball.



Couldn't give a shit what 99.9% of United fans think. All I'm doing is give my own opinion. He's completely lost his attacking mojo but is coping with the new formation/approach better than most. Defending quite well and got our only assist from open play this season. Not really worthy of all this hatred. Feel free to ignore my opinion.

So tell me, what do you think he actually brings to the team that is positive?

 

[pseudo_canadian]

Yes. Look at his left arm. Blatantly doesn't want the ball.

Yeah his left arm is pointing up field into the space in front of him or towards Januzaj. How is holding his left arm up like that indicating he doesn't want it? Because clearly passing the ball back in this scenario was the right decision. Right, makes sense. He's a shit player and adds nothing to the team, and this few seconds of play sums up his effectiveness, or lack thereof.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

So tell me, what do you think he actually brings to the team that is positive?

This season? Same as he always brings. When we have the ball he's always available for a pass and almost never loses possession cheaply. When we don't have the ball he makes a lot of tackles and shores up the right side of our defence significantly (as compared to the left flank, where we're constanly getting exposed)

Obviously, he's been mainly crap in the final third for ages now. This genius fecking formation which means he has no fullback to make overlapping runs has made him even more ineffective. This lack of creativity is a real issue and might mean the end of him at United if he can't get his swagger back.

As part of a team who are all underperforming to various extents he certainly doesn't deserve the bile being spewed in this thread. Not based on his performances this season anyway.

 

[Hellboy]

Ando in that gif.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah his left arm is pointing up field into the space in front of him or towards Januzaj. How is holding his left arm up like that indicating he doesn't want it? Because clearly passing the ball back in this scenario was the right decision. Right, makes sense. He's a shit player and adds nothing to the team, and this few seconds of play sums up his effectiveness, or lack thereof.

ave you played football before? If you want the ball you don't tell someone to pass it to someone else.

 

[shaggy]

Ando in that gif.

Oh my god, he actually runs and hides behind the Burnley player

 

[FromTheBench]

That GIF is defending a counter from a attacking set piece where he is last man no ?

Not sure you'd want him trying to take on players there. Or anyone.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I first said he didn't have passing options but @Pexbo is correct. The Ando pass is a piss easy one and puts us in a great position. Not sure what Anderson is doing two seconds later though.

 

[acnumber9]

Don't really get what is laughable about that gif. Complete lack of options there. He's the last line of defence there, he's obviously not going to try and dribble past someone and nobody is making much of an effort to get into space for a pass. Especially Anderson, who does his usual "run behind the nearest opposition player" trick. I reckon Van Gaal is as pissed off with the poor movement off the ball as he is with the conservative pass.

I know people think I just defend Valencia for the sake of it but that gif is a really strange criticism. If you had one of him repeatedly smashing the ball into the full-backs shins, that would be a different story...

The strangest thing about it is that rather than talk about it when it actually happened we're now dragging up footage from a game played ten days ago just to have a fresh dig. People actually seem to take enjoyment from it.

 

[FromTheBench]

Blackett making it clear he doesn't want the ball? He's standing in an acre of space with an easy pass down the channel, who gives a feck what you think he wants, you pass it to him. You don't stand over the ball, not moving it to either side to create space for yourself or get ready for the pass.

They 2 are the last men there while the team is up front attacking a counter. You want a square pass played in that scenario when Blackett doesn't want it?

Blackett is seeing the Burnley player come near him and no quick pass options in front and clearly doesn't want it. Maybe one of them should be dropping deeper into space but he isn't in acres of space exactly. i.e if he takes One touch then the Burnley player will be on top of him and he will have to hurry the pass or risk losing the ball and setting the Burnley player through.

Valencia has been shit but that's a weird criticism.

I first said he didn't have passing options but @Pexbo is correct. The Ando pass is a piss easy one and puts us in a great position. Not sure what Anderson is doing two seconds later though.

He passes to Anderson surrounded by 3 Burnley players and if he loses the ball then the Counter is On immediately with 4/5 Burnley players ahead of the ball vs 2 United players behind.

With our players not rushing back quickly the long ball aerially seems the best bet there but seems some would be offside then.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He passes to Anderson surrounded by 3 Burnley players and if he loses the ball then the Counter is On immediately.

With our players not rushing back quickly the long ball aerially seems the best bet there but seems some would be offside then.

It's this mentality of fear of closed spaces that has led to us being such a cartoon team. Teams play these passes in between the lines all the time. Anderson is surrounded by players a few seconds into that clip but initially he's comfortable.

 

[FromTheBench]

It's this mentality of fear of closed spaces that has led to us being such a cartoon team. Teams play these passes in between the lines all the time. Anderson is surrounded by players a few seconds into that clip but initially he's comfortable.

Burnley players seem way quicker in that situation and well positioned in the clip for their jobs than our players. Firstly it's Anderson and 2nd passing to him there doesn't leave Anderson with exactly many options either as he will get closed down in a instant from 3 sides with Burnley in good shape to Counter. 3 of our players are offside and then 3 are flat behind their markers.

Don't remember, what lead to that scenario beforehand but since he has been closed down by the time the team gets in some sort of shape i don't think passing back is the worst decision there at all. All teams do that when in such a situation as well. (Evra did it plenty of times as well in such a scenario.)

The team should be rushing back quicker there getting into space and onside and couple of players pulling wide to get into a crossing area.

 

[Fahad Jawaid]

Looking at that gif, when he receives the pass, there are five players who are in an onside position and only Welbeck whose offside, and Burnley defence is all over the place, if he just clips the ball in with any half decent accuracy we could have had a chance.

 

[Blue always red]

Some guys on here expect the opposition to stand still whilst whilst we pass the ball around, lol. If I'm playing a 20 yard ball into the heart of their half with all 11 of their team behind, do people not expect someone to try to intercept it??

 

[Kag]

The pass to Blackett was an obvious one. Either way, the entire GIF sums up Valencia's wank game, as well as our even wankier off the ball movement. Valencia shouldn't be anywhere near the first team at the moment.

 

[Señor]

Wait, people are saying there's nothing wrong with what Valencia did in that GIF?

You've got to love this place.

 

[pseudo_canadian]

ave you played football before? If you want the ball you don't tell someone to pass it to someone else.

Huh? My point is that Blackett was clearing telling Valencia to push it upfield. To get it upfield he had plenty of space to either pass it to Blackett or ping it across field to Januzaj. Or any of the other options @Pexbo said.

Though this whole argument is moot because Valencia can't pass if his life depended on it.

 

[Godfather]

Wait, people are saying there's nothing wrong with what Valencia did in that GIF?

You've got to love this place.

You have to ask yourself if there is any winger at top clubs out there that plays week in week out that would have played that ridicolous pass.
Ando's movement of course is a freaking joke, but he's done anyway.
Blackett pointing somewhere? Well good for him the pass to him was still obvious, he can point wherever the feck he wants.
BUt passing the ball back like 50 yards? feck my life. LvG's facial expression says it all really.

Val better gets his shit together soon, he's unbearable atm.
Have to agree with Pogue that this formation doenst help him much but at least it focuses more on his defensive duties, which are still there.
Offensively he is just not there anymore, no matter whether he got that assist this season or not.

 

[bugmat]

Wait, people are saying there's nothing wrong with what Valencia did in that GIF?

You've got to love this place.

Even funnier are responses like yours - there are about 5-8 burnley players between him and anyone but Blackett. His only options are

1. Launch a ball in the air that Januzaj may or may not reach, which could equally be too long and go out of play. Burnley ball. Trying that pass on the ground past 3 Burnley players would most likely be an interception.

2. Try and pass to Ando who is surrounded - if the pass is intercepted (y'know because players aren't statues) or Ando miscontrols and/or is tackled and he loses it, there is a Burnley counter on with only Valencia and Blackett in between DDG and about 4 Burnley players

3. Pass it back to DDG and allow our attack to reset/spread out, stretching the compact 10-man defence of Burnley again and try again - the option he took after no one moved to give him a pass.. And no Blackett was telling him to try and get it to Januzaj which was an unlikely ball at that point.

4. Try and beat the man, lose it possibly and have Blackett defending a counter

He could have gone for a risky pass/move but given we had lost the last match (cup) and needed to make sure we didn't lose, and there was little movement, what he did was fine and not something for people to harp on, especially given how poor our defenders have been. With Rio or Vida there I would say yeah..but Blackett and AV defending a counter?!

If he had tried the more risque options and a goal was scored due to a bad pass or interception van Gaal would have been even more upset!

 

[Eric'sCollar]

@bugmat agreed.

Sure it looks bad but at the end of the day, he kept the ball and every other option would have placed his teammates in a dangerous position.

 

[kouroux]

In that gif, never mind Valencia but wtf is Ando doing ?

 

[Rykker_4united]

closed his twitter down due to abuse apparently.

 

[NK86]

Even funnier are responses like yours - there are about 5-8 burnley players between him and anyone but Blackett. His only options are

1. Launch a ball in the air that Januzaj may or may not reach, which could equally be too long and go out of play. Burnley ball. Trying that pass on the ground past 3 Burnley players would most likely be an interception.

2. Try and pass to Ando who is surrounded - if the pass is intercepted (y'know because players aren't statues) or Ando miscontrols and/or is tackled and he loses it, there is a Burnley counter on with only Valencia and Blackett in between DDG and about 4 Burnley players

3. Pass it back to DDG and allow our attack to reset/spread out, stretching the compact 10-man defence of Burnley again and try again - the option he took after no one moved to give him a pass.. And no Blackett was telling him to try and get it to Januzaj which was an unlikely ball at that point.

4. Try and beat the man, lose it possibly and have Blackett defending a counter

He could have gone for a risky pass/move but given we had lost the last match (cup) and needed to make sure we didn't lose, and there was little movement, what he did was fine and not something for people to harp on, especially given how poor our defenders have been. With Rio or Vida there I would say yeah..but Blackett and AV defending a counter?!

If he had tried the more risque options and a goal was scored due to a bad pass or interception van Gaal would have been even more upset!

Seriously? That ball to Januzaj was supposed to be risky? How? As it may cause a Burnley throw in?

If that is the case we might as well never try and make a difficult pass lest we lose possession. We had them in their half and their defenders were not in shape after the corner. We had so many players in their half that we could actually get in the box. But he decided to pass to to DDG which not only pushed us back but allowed Burnley to get their shape back and press us more.

I really hope you don't complain when Young passes the ball back everytime to put defenders from the half way line instead of taking his man on or trying a more difficult pass. Because by your theory that might lead us to losing the ball.

 

[ZDwyr]

closed his twitter down due to abuse apparently.

That's a bit of a shame if true. Must be horrible copping that sort of stuff every single day.

 

[girish]

So, a player shouldn't play risky passes? He had his options, but he just stands there with the ball until he is closed down and then plays a long back pass all the way back to his own box. But yes @Pogue Mahone, nice arrows indeed.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

closed his twitter down due to abuse apparently.

*slow handclap* Our global network of "fans" doing us proud, once again.

 

[Ixion]

I remember that moment when it happened, you can't defend that. He had so much space and allowed himself to be closed down then panicked, no composure.

 

[Godfather]

*slow handclap* Our global network of "fans" doing us proud, once again.

Apparently he got a lot of shit of Ecuadorian pll (fans?) for his performances for the National team.

 

[Pexbo]

*slow handclap* Our global network of "fans" doing us proud, once again.

For what it's worth I might be his harshest critic but in no way whatsoever would I condone that. Similarly if I'm at Old Trafford and he was playing he'd have my full support.

I think it's a totally seperate thing though, criticising him on a forum like this, as the nature of a forum is debate and discussion from both sides of opinion.

 

[girish]

He received threats after his game for Equador. If its been United fans, he'd have closes down his twitter at least am year ago.

 

[FromTheBench]

He received threats after his game for Equador. If its been United fans, he'd have closes down his twitter at least am year ago.

Apparently he got a lot of shit of Ecuadorian pll (fans?) for his performances for the National team.

Valencia opts for an international break

http://www.manutd.com/en/News-And-F...valencia-misses-ecuador-win-over-bolivia.aspx



If he's received abuse then it's for not playing recently or thinking of retiring i imagine ?

United fans won't have helped either. Might be a cumulation of United fans making it tough only too.