Amorim's Mourinho problem

fastwalker

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One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
 
fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
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Ermm what?
 
Psychology I find interesting is when there’s already a thread about a subject but a human feels the need to create their own thread as if their question is too good for existing thread or they need the attention on themselves.

Anyway, off to the Amorim thread.
 
fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
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Absolute load of bollocks.
 
Mourinho threw individuals under the bus for his own selfish reasons. It was never his own fault.

Amorin's comment about this being the "worst team in our history" by default also implicates himself as the manager of said team.
 
Correct me if I’m wrong but had Amorim singled out individual players and abused the shit out of them or has he made a couple of comments aimed at the teams ‘performance’ and not personal attacks?

I think some of you would have an absolute fit if Fergie was still here saying the shit he used to say on a weekly basis, or Keane for that matter. But then again you only seem to care when we’re losing games, as if there’s a right way and wrong way to deal with these things.
 
fastwalker said:
I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
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There's being clueless, mate. And then there's this. Just to humour this, I'd say someone with a fragile ego wouldn't have waited 2 months to throw this shitshow of a team under the bus. All they're doing is damaging Amorim's reputation at this point.
 
Isn't is generally agreed what he said has been taken out of context?

He wants to basically say we're rubbish (as in him and the team all together) but the media are pushing the angle of him saying the players are crap.
 
I don’t think anyone had much issue with Jose throwing players under the bus, much of it was justified or he has since been vindicated in his opinion.

Jose biggest problem is that his solutions are always shortsighted and designed to see success during his inevitably short tenure. It was against the United legacy.
 
fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
Click to expand...
Ridiculous
 
fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
Click to expand...
You couldn't be further from the truth my friend. Amorim has been very careful about calling out his players in the media. He protects them if anything! If you disagree feel free and give me an example of a player he's criticized publicly.
 
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fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
Click to expand...

What a load of shite. In what instance has Amorim "sold his players down the river"? Posts like this should be auto-deleted.
 
You read the headlines rather than listening to his full interviews. Definitely worth taking the time to do so because it changes a lot and I expect your opinion will shift too
 
There's no definitive answer. Sometimes a kick in the butt and a slap in the face yields results. Not every players are suited to arms around the shoulder type of thing

We assume a codly manager would win the hearts of his players but that's not the only way to motivate.

Desperate times called for desperate measures. Players like Keane, Ronaldo, Cantona would throw their tantrums and demand 110% from their fellow players. They would not be comfortable in an underperforming team and laughing dabbing doing fashion show in the dressing room

Real Madrid fans has been notorious for booing their players, it works. The players feared to get that treatment and gave their all. Our players jogs around and we clapped and cheer and sang their songs. Does it work? Do we see our nonstop support made them even have the decency to run 90 minutes?

I feel that stick and carrot have to be justly rewarded. If you give your all we will sing your song, we will support you. If you dont give a feck then maybe they should be thrown under the bus. If they dont like it then find another club
 
I think he did that on purpose by calling the team the worst in the history.
1. lower expectation
2. throw the whole team under the bus instead of individuals - different then Mourinho
3. want the response from the players
 
I suspect you didn't see the actual interview? The content was very much one of his own personal responsibility for both the bad results and helping the players succeed. I would say it was more self-deprecating than anything, which is the exact opposite of what Mourinho would have done. He is a gifted narcissist, I don't get that vibe from Amorim at all.

However, the point you make about the potential fragility of Amorims ego is something I'm more worried about. Again, I don't agree with your angle of Amorim having an inflated opinion of himself, but it reminds me of point Andy Mitten made on the last Talk of the Devils podcast. If Amorim and his team have seen nothing but success so far in their quite short coaching careers, how do they respond to his level of personal adversity played out in the most public way possible?

The club has two weeks to help him with transfers. They really need to come through here.
 
We need to read the full quote and not just the headline before we make judgement. He basically said we've only won 2 out 10 games and in this moment we are "the worst team maybe". He also said that he is losing more than the previous coach and fully acknowledges that. Nowhere has he thrown any individual under the bus (unlike Mourinho) and he has taken responsibility for the current form.

"In 10 games in the Premier League, we won two," said Amorim.

"Imagine what this is for a fan of Manchester United. Imagine what this is for me. So we are getting a new coach that is losing more than the last coach. I have full knowledge of that.

"Like I said, I'm not going to change, no matter what. I know we can succeed, but we need to survive this moment. Because I'm not naive and I know that we need to survive now.

"We are being the worst team maybe in the history of Manchester United. I know that you want headlines, but I'm saying that because we have to acknowledge that and to change that. Here you go, your headlines."
 
'I have to find a solution'

'The players arent to blame because it takes time to implement ideas'

'i havent been able to have enough training sessions so the players cant possibly understand'





Those are quotes that Amorim has said where he is taking accountability. Thread dismissed.
 
He literally calls himself out too in the interview 'the new coach is losing more than the last coach'

Are people seeing this and concluding he's praising himself here?
 
This is silly. He said, "We're the worst team in Man United history, maybe." That last part is crucial but omitted from most people's replies about the situation.

He said sardonically after "there's a headline" for the reporters which encouraged reason to suspect he wasn't trying to make a grand point of it. Many have taken what they've seen in text (maybe as tweets or headlines atop their mobile telephones) and run with it and now, for example, like yourself come up with some unwarranted comparison to Jose Mourinho whose methods were different insofar as being more inflammatory and defensive. You're right to say he had/has a fragile ego.

Also personal point but I think Amorim sounded like he meant in PL history rather than historically ever, which is technically true.

There are swathes of differences between them, particularly in terms of temperament.
 
Maybe we need players who can accept their manager speaking the truth, there in might just lie the problem, players we have are weak.
 
I did not detect any similarities between Amorim and Mourinho, it was normal to say something that "rings bells" because of our terrible run of results and the way we play.
From what I've seen Amorim is always smiling, is never confrontational, never pointed out any players or individual mistakes.

He identified the player's unfamiliarity with his tactics and approach as the main reason for our disastrous position, suggesting he will fix things if given time.
 
Big Ben Foster said:
Why? I don't agree with the OP but this is a discussion board.
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Obviously they won’t be deleted, I was just expressing my contempt for what I consider to be a ludicrous comparison between two completely different managers; the only similarity being their nationality.
 
Sky1981 said:
Real Madrid fans has been notorious for booing their players, it works. The players feared to get that treatment and gave their all. Our players jogs around and we clapped and cheer and sang their songs. Does it work? Do we see our nonstop support made them even have the decency to run 90 minutes?

I feel that stick and carrot have to be justly rewarded. If you give your all we will sing your song, we will support you. If you dont give a feck then maybe they should be thrown under the bus. If they dont like it then find another club
Click to expand...

Real Madrid run away with the La Liga and the Champions League season is the massively unequal income structure of Spanish football. Not because they boo their players.
 
Sky1981 said:
Desperate times called for desperate measures. Players like Keane, Ronaldo, Cantona would throw their tantrums and demand 110% from their fellow players. They would not be comfortable in an underperforming team and laughing dabbing doing fashion show in the dressing room
Click to expand...

I look forward to the day we don't have to hear quite as much bollocks about Keane dragging his teams to exceptional success through high standards and aggression.

Keane's career success was because he was an exceptional player who played his peak years alongside other exceptional players. When his teams were full of inferior players, guess what? They were shit.

Did he drag Republic of Ireland to many tournament successes? Remind me what happened to his famous refusal to accept poor performances from his teammates in '92-'93.

As for Ronaldo, he basically played in this team and I must have missed the period when he elevated Solskjaer and Ten Hag's sides through his attitude.
 
fastwalker said:
One of the unique characteristics of Jose Mourinho was his willingness to throw players and his whole team under the bus, when things were not going his way. Jose was not one for accepting responsibility, especially if affected his well cultivated public reputation. When push came to shove, it always seemed to be someone else's fault.

Amorim's recent comment about the current United team being the "worst team in Man United in history" and the earlier one, prior to the Liverpool game, suggesting that "we are starving for leaders" are right out of the Jose Mourinho playbook.

I am more concerned by the psychology behind the comments and what I think they reveal about Amorim himself. Whilst he does not have the super self-confidence of the 'special one' Amorim seems to think nothing of selling his players down the river if it absolves him accountability. I don't think anyone seriously holds a manager c2months in a role, responsible for a decade of decline, so why does he feel compelled to go over board to distance himself from the problem he has inherited?

I think what we are seeing is a manager with quite a fragile ego. Like every other United fan, I want Amorim to succeed, but the parallels with Jose are starting to unsettle me.
Click to expand...

I don't agree with that at all. I get no sense from Amorim that he's throwing the players under the bus to absolve himself. On the contrary, he always seems to be at pains to include himself on the blame list. More opposites than similars in my view.
 
Vidyoyo said:
This is silly. He said, "We're the worst team in Man United history, maybe." That last part is crucial but omitted from most people's replies about the situation.

He said sardonically after "there's a headline" for the reporters which encouraged reason to suspect he wasn't trying to make a grand point of it. Many have taken what they've seen in text (maybe as tweets or headlines atop their mobile telephones) and run with it and now, for example, like yourself come up with some unwarranted comparison to Jose Mourinho whose methods were different insofar as being more inflammatory and defensive. You're right to say he had/has a fragile ego.

Also personal point but I think Amorim sounded like he meant in PL history rather than historically ever, which is technically true.

There are swathes of differences between them, particularly in terms of temperament.
Click to expand...

Also, and not least, he said "WE". As opposed to "They".
 
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