[SalfordRed18]

Have to say it's hard to believe we are covering 100pc of his wages.

Are you a Sevilla fan?

 

[bosnian_red]

Have to say it's hard to believe we are covering 100pc of his wages.

We are covering 0% of his wages...

 

[Crashoutcassius]

We are covering 0% of his wages...

Ah, the title 'all wages covered' isn't clear. Sounds more like united are from that

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Because we aren't maybe?

Where do you think I got the idea. Jesus the reading comprehension

 

[kouroux]

Still don't understand the point of his signing

 

[Alemar]

It’s good he’s off the wage bill now. Best of luck on loan, hopefully he does extremely well, and we then manage to sell him for 8-10m next summer.

 

[dannyrhinos89]

He's upgraded.

Gets to live in a warmer climate
Sevilla are competitive in their league
Usually do well in Europe

Good luck to him.

 

[Kag]

Still don't understand the point of his signing

We needed cover for Shaw and thought that he would be a bit better than he was. It made sense, though.

 

[Revaulx]

We really are the worst club at recruiting Brazilians. All of ours tend to be shite.

This was a poor purchase by Ole if we're being honest. Looking at his style of play he was never going to be a good fit in the PL.

I doubt he was a “purchase by Ole”.

I reckon his agent (or maybe Porto) gave Ed a call, pointed out that Shaw was great but unreliable, and they had just the right player to be his backup.

 

[Revaulx]

We needed cover for Shaw and thought that he would be a bit better than he was. It made sense, though.

Yeah. Initially people were happy to overlook his defensive frailties on account of his looking decent going forward and ability to take a free kick. Sadly those qualities seemed to disappear before long.

 

[Kag]

I’m actually pleased we’ve called this a day within two seasons. Usually these folk hang around for years. At least Telles clearly wants to play a bit of football.

 

[Tiber]

With both Phelan and Telles gone who the hell is going to put the cones out?

 

[Bwuk]

With both Phelan and Telles gone who the hell is going to put the cones out?

Jones

 

[AndySmith1990]

Jones

Wouldn't trust him to do that without spraining his ankle

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Why can't we just sell a player for once. fecking loans. Joke.

 

[sglowrider]

I doubt he was a “purchase by Ole”.

I reckon his agent (or maybe Porto) gave Ed a call, pointed out that Shaw was great but unreliable, and they had just the right player to be his backup.

As we learnt from ETH, I don't think previous managers had the final say in as far as transfers go

 

[Revaulx]

As we learnt from ETH, I don't think previous managers had the final say in as far as transfers go

Indeed. I think that if a manager really wanted a player the club would (within reason; e.g. not in Jose’s final summer) try their best to get him.

I strongly believe that fans massively underestimate the role of agents and selling clubs in creating a market for players though, and a club with a weak scouting/footballing infrastructure is going to get taken advantage of.

I reckon we haven’t done anything like enough in the window so far. That said, the big positive I’m taking away from it is that we’ve signed players that someone at United (regardless of who) actually wants, rather than ones that someone else (agent or selling club) wants to re-home.

 

[sglowrider]

Indeed. I think that if a manager really wanted a player the club would (within reason; e.g. not in Jose’s final summer) try their best to get him.

I strongly believe that fans massively underestimate the role of agents and selling clubs in creating a market for players though, and a club with a weak scouting/footballing infrastructure is going to get taken advantage of.

I reckon we haven’t done anything like enough in the window so far. That said, the big positive I’m taking away from it is that we’ve signed players that someone at United (regardless of who) actually wants, rather than ones that someone else (agent or selling club) wants to re-home.

Also makes you wonder how much of the United tax really are brown envelopes.

 

[Marcus]

In the end, not quick enough and not good enough at defending.

 

[Josh 76]

In the end, not quick enough and not good enough at defending.

Another strange signing which summed up the Ole and Woodward era!

 

[Revaulx]

Also makes you wonder how much of the United tax really are brown envelopes.

Well I don’t doubt that much of that goes on. I think Arsenal have admitted that someone involved in their transfers had been, er, not acting in the best interests of the club. The ludicrous Pepe fee brought that to light, I think.

The Bebe deal is well known, and the “three for one” when Raiola managed to get Ed to take Zlatan and Mkhitaryan off his hands alongside Pogba seemed to escape raised eyebrows amid an orgy of muppetry. I doubt if anyone inside United has actually benefited personally though; they’ve been gullible idiots rather than crooks.

 

[sglowrider]

Well I don’t doubt that much of that goes on. I think Arsenal have admitted that someone involved in their transfers had been, er, not acting in the best interests of the club. The ludicrous Pepe fee brought that to light, I think.

The Bebe deal is well known, and the “three for one” when Raiola managed to get Ed to take Zlatan and Mkhitaryan off his hands alongside Pogba seemed to escape raised eyebrows amid an orgy of muppetry. I doubt if anyone inside United has actually benefited personally though; they’ve been gullible idiots rather than crooks.

Bungs have been going on for decades now so who knows? Otherwise, it is difficult to explain some of the stupid transfer pricing, especially those huge agent fees.

 

[Revaulx]

Lets hope so. Otherwise, it is difficult to explain some of the stupid transfer pricing, especially those huge agent fees.

This is the sort of thing that can happen when you’ve got remote owners who aren’t really interested in the day to day detail.

Maybe it’s significant that the Glazers, having initially been really hands-off, started to demand all decisions being run past them and expenditure requiring sign-off. I’d always assumed this was just because they had got fed up with Ed spaffing “their” cash on a load of overpriced duds. Maybe it was more than that and they suspected something?

 

[sglowrider]

This is the sort of thing that can happen when you’ve got remote owners who aren’t really interested in the day to day detail.

Maybe it’s significant that the Glazers, having initially been really hands-off, started to demand all decisions being run past them and expenditure requiring sign-off. I’d always assumed this was just because they had got fed up with Ed spaffing “their” cash on a load of overpriced duds. Maybe it was more than that and they suspected something?

If you look at the org structure of United, Woodward had a lot of power & control within his hands and therefore the lack of accountability. He resisted organisational changes (like getting a DOF) and let organisational chaos fester.

Its the perfect environmet for brown envelopes. I have also worked in far too many countries where you require to slip incentives to get a deal or even to get paid. You develop a sense of who you can work with after a while.

We paid between 20-30million quid annually to agents. Woodward's trusted mate Matt Judge was appointed by Woodward to negotiate. I am sure there has been a case or two but how many bargains or value for money deals did we get over the last 10 years? And yet we consistently over the odds for players that we bigger 'brands' than they were better fit -- and the same time paid over 20+ million quid every year to agents.

Makes you wonder. Getting a DOF would have at least ensured that we have better fit of players and consistent playing style. Instead it was like a pendulum swing from one end to another. The chaos was just opportunities for the unaccountable madness that is/was United under Woodward.

 

[Revaulx]

If you look at the org structure of United, Woodward had a lot of power & control within his hands and therefore the lack of accountability. He resisted organisational changes (like getting a DOF) and let organisational chaos fester.

Its the perfect environmet for brown envelopes. I have also worked in far too many countries where you require to slip incentives to get a deal or even to get paid. You develop a sense of who you can work with after a while.

We paid between 20-30million quid annually to agents. Woodward's trusted mate Matt Judge was appointed by Woodward to negotiate. I am sure there has been a case or two but how many bargains or value for money deals did we get over the last 10 years? And yet we consistently over the odds for players that we bigger 'brands' than they were better fit -- and the same time paid over 20+ million quid every year to agents.

Makes you wonder. Getting a DOF would have at least ensured that we have better fit of players and consistent playing style. Instead it was like a pendulum swing from one end to another. The chaos was just opportunities for the unaccountable madness that is/was United under Woodward.

Excellent post! I used to be a director of a company that made equipment for the global oil and gas industry; “compliance” (a great euphemism for not being bent) was a total nightmare…

I reckon in Ed’s case it was all about ego rather than personal gain. But yes you’re absolutely right; there will always be those who will be ready to take advantage of such a rotten environment.

 

[bringbackbebe]

If you look at the org structure of United, Woodward had a lot of power & control within his hands and therefore the lack of accountability. He resisted organisational changes (like getting a DOF) and let organisational chaos fester.

Its the perfect environmet for brown envelopes. I have also worked in far too many countries where you require to slip incentives to get a deal or even to get paid. You develop a sense of who you can work with after a while.

We paid between 20-30million quid annually to agents. Woodward's trusted mate Matt Judge was appointed by Woodward to negotiate. I am sure there has been a case or two but how many bargains or value for money deals did we get over the last 10 years? And yet we consistently over the odds for players that we bigger 'brands' than they were better fit -- and the same time paid over 20+ million quid every year to agents.

Makes you wonder. Getting a DOF would have at least ensured that we have better fit of players and consistent playing style. Instead it was like a pendulum swing from one end to another. The chaos was just opportunities for the unaccountable madness that is/was United under Woodward.

Glazers have to shoulder the blame as much as Woodward here. Woodward was merely the executioner of Glazer's mission. If Galzer mission was to "Continue to be the biggest football club by playing the best football", perhaps he'd have approached things differently. Instead, our mission was "Be the biggest marketable brand, grow revenue from all angles and maximize dividend payout". Woodward executed that mission well.

 

[Morpheus 7]

Another shite deal, for a very poor player. United have to start selling players, watching them get loaned out to just return again. Delaying the problem to next Summer. Been shown up this window, can't negotiate and move players on. We can chat about high wages but club have to start selling full internationals, we can't give some of ours away.

 

[sglowrider]

Excellent post! I used to be a director of a company that made equipment for the global oil and gas industry; “compliance” (a great euphemism for not being bent) was a total nightmare…

I reckon in Ed’s case it was all about ego rather than personal gain. But yes you’re absolutely right; there will always be those who will be ready to take advantage of such a rotten environment.

But his ego probably told him -- that a well-educated, talented guy, making hundreds of millions if not billions in shareholder value (such as himself) should not be paid less than plebs/kids who barely have any GCSEs never mind a university degree and CPA qualifications like himself.

 

[Revaulx]

Glazers have to shoulder the blame as much as Woodward here. Woodward was merely the executioner of Glazer's mission. If Galzer mission was to "Continue to be the biggest football club by playing the best football", perhaps he'd have approached things differently. Instead, our mission was "Be the biggest marketable brand, grow revenue from all angles and maximize dividend payout". Woodward executed that mission well.

Oh definitely. I’m not letting them off the hook at all.

I’m really hoping that Arnold can prove to them quickly that the more football focused direction he wants to take the club in is going to be a success. We seem to be stuck with them so their buy-in to change is essential.

 

[Revaulx]

But his ego probably told him -- that a well-educated, talented guy, making hundreds of millions if not billions in shareholder value (such as himself) should not be paid less than plebs/kids who barely have any GCSEs never mind a university degree and CPA qualifications like himself.

I dunno; I’m not sure he has “that” sort of ego. Not the arrogant kind.

The “urgent transfer business”, Disneyland and “can do things others can only dream of” comments point to someone who was rather star struck and having great fun playing a role. The sort who would be susceptible to flattery and easily bamboozled by the likes of Raiola, or even Edwin (see the strange case of Donny).

 

[Nick7]

Having an absolute shocker against Valladolid here after coming on with 11 minutes left. What were we thinking signing him?

 

[mattunited1978]

One of the worst players iv ever seen, utter fu*king shite, absolute liability, to stand out as being particularly rubbish, in our squad full of rubbish, is a feat in itself. So glad he's gone...Just another 5 or 6 to get rid of now

 

[sugar_kane]

He is shite but somehow we've ended up with his equivalent in terms of ability holding down our RB position.

 

[TMDaines]

Going to the World Cup. What’s his real level?

 

[Vidyoyo]

Interesting. Must be playing decent at Sevilla to get into the squad?

 

[bond19821982]

Look at their full back options. Doesn't really tell the while story .

Good luck to him!

 

[arthurka]

Interesting. Must be playing decent at Sevilla to get into the squad?

To be fair Dani Alves is going

 

[DWelbz19]

Alves, Danilo, Telles, and Alex Sandro. It’s a list of fullbacks that was exciting to look at in maybe 2017

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Forgot he existed, to be honest.

He's started in their last couple of friendlies, it seems. Is he their 1st choice LB? Or is whatshisface, the Juventus LB, injured?

 

[TMDaines]

We’ll have four World Cup winners: two starters, a sub, and one who we could afford to loan out, and we’ll still have people pretending United only have 11 senior players and the cupboard is bare.