Academy promise coming to a head?

[Ramshock]

I have to say I feel better about the youth set up now

 

[Conrad]

Sam Johnstone probably deserves a mention in this thread as well. It's a shame for him that he's come through when we've brought in such a fantastic young goalkeeper in David De Gea who'll probably kill his long term chances. Relegated today with Doncaster but it seems like he's been fantastic for them since he's been there.

 

[surf]

The standout under-21 talent is Januzaj. Not sure about any of the others - maybe a couple will make it into the squad, though I have no idea which ones. If they show Welbeck/Evans levels of talent in academy football they could get there.

 

[khoazany]

A bit early to make that judgement, isn't it? There have been a lot of players who've struggled to make an impact in their first year and gone on to good things. Lingard didn't score at all in his first year, Michael Keane was an absolute ghost, Tom Lawrence was always a bit in the shadow of the generation before (Morrison, Pogba, Keanes, etc.) and Paddy McNair is doing pretty well for himself now after not making much of a dent on the U18s. Mitchell's had a pretty good season compared to some of those lads.

On a separate note, you seem to know a lot about the youth teams, do you know anything about Rathbone and McTominay? They've been pretty much non-existent this year bar some time spent on the bench.

I don't consider McNair to be a special talent although I think he can make it at PL level if his defending is improved.Yeah bit early to make the judgement but usually you see the "sign" of them has ability to become good and so far I only see it in Mitchell,Thompson,CBJ,Henderson but they're no Wilson or Pereira for sure.With the level of talents in the U21s and second-year scholars it will tough for them to breakthrough being the younger ones.

Rathbone and McTominay mostly played down an age group for the U16s, they aren't non-existent but more of we're being patient with them due to their size.Especially with Rathbone he's even smaller than many of the U14s.Both of them has been injured a lot this season as well so I'm afraid they won't have enough chance to prove their impact for the U18s with a lot of younger talents challenge for their positions (Dearnley,Rashford,,Kehinde,Makela,... especially Dearnley seems to be ahead of Rathbone in the pecking order already despite being two years younger).I like Rathbone though he has a look of a typical United youth product.Good at linking up play and close control as well as possessing a tough character (track back and press opponents a lot despite being much smaller than them).Haven't seen him much to judge otherwise.

 

[Melvyn]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/may/03/manchester-united-fa-youth-cup-final?CMP=twt_gugu

Manchester United's youth Premier League finalists emulating class of '92

At Anfield on Friday night, Manchester United's latest band of hopefuls continued their quest to emulate the vaunted Class of 92. Warren Joyce's reserve team knocked Liverpool out of the Under-21 Premier League at the semi-final stage, winning 1-0, as they continued their attempt to retain the trophy they won last year.

To follow Ryan Giggs, Paul Scholes, Nicky Butt, David Beckham and Phil and Gary Neville to become the driving force of the 20-times champions may be the impossible task but that is the challenge. Most will fall short. The wave of talent nurtured by Eric Harrison and given the chance to blossom by Sir Alex Ferguson may go down as the brightest group of home-raised youngsters in domestic football history.

United's move to have a B team playing in the Football League is driven by the club's belief that since Giggs et al the influx of foreign players has left homegrown footballers' hopes near to moribund. Twenty years ago English players made up 69% of first-team starting XIs. That has dropped to a paltry 32%.

Still, the cream can rise to the top. The path from reserves to first team has been cleared again by Adnan Januzaj, and James Wilson is the latest to push for promotion. Only 18, the striker was named as a substitute by David Moyes for United's 4-0 win at Newcastle last month.

Having also been in the squad against Aston Villa and for the visit of Bayern Munich, Wilson, who has 19 goals this term, wants a senior debut soon. "Hopefully, it's not too far off. It would be great and it's what you work towards," he says. "Every time I just think: 'I could be in that first team.' It would be great to get a few minutes on the pitch. I need to see how I deal with the atmosphere, the pressure and other factors."

Against Liverpool there were flashes of the pace that with his lethal finishing makes Wilson, who hails from Biddulph in Staffordshire, a prospect.

One memorable strike came against Charlton at Old Trafford in an FA Youth Cup quarter-final in 2012 while still a schoolboy. "I can remember being in the changing rooms afterwards and I was in the shower," says Wilson, who at 5ft 11in is not the tallest of forwards. "It was boiling hot and everyone was touching the water and asking how I could bear to stand in it. It must have been because of adrenaline. It was just a great feeling, particularly with it being the winner as well."

Louis van Gaal, the favourite to replace David Moyes permanently, favours young players because of their willingness to buy into his philosophy so the Dutchman will demand regular dispatches from Joyce on Wilson and his cohorts.

The son of a father whose sporting preference is snooker, Wilson believes his progress should inspire others. "Yes, I think a few of the younger lads at my digs are asking things," he says. "As a boy I used to look up to lads when I was their age. The roles are reversed now and I know what it's like to be in their situation."

Being in the matchday squad at St James' Park was a highlight. "It was a great experience being with the team and learning how to act around the hotel by being professional," says Wilson. "Even the warm-up was different – out there with Nemanja Vidic and Tom Cleverley. When you're warming up for the reserves there are not usually thousands of people around. It was a great atmosphere – even when you're out there beforehand the ground is filling up and you can feel the volume rising."

Wilson and his team-mates defeated Liverpool courtesy of a blistering first-half 25-yard strike by Andreas Pereira to reach this month's final, where Chelsea await.

If having the chance to win consecutive titles is impressive for a side whose average age is 19-and a-half, there was still a troubling lack of quality on show to those watching, who included Scholes and Butt, plus the Liverpool manager, Brendan Rodgers, and Kenny Dalglish.

There was little of the fast-paced pass-and-move stuff United desire to ensure continuity in style from first team through the club's age groups. This, United say, is further evidence that Wilson and company should be parading their talents lower down the pyramid in high-pressure professional football.

At the moment, though, this prospect remains remote so the club's class of 2014 will have to try and make it the old-fashioned way.

Wilson hit a post early on but he was starved of clear opportunities in Joyce's 4-2-3-1 and limped off towards the end with yet another of the injuries that have plagued his campaign.

He says: "I've finished growing and 5ft 11inches is going to be my height. Hopefully, there will be no more injuries. I fractured my ankle a few years ago at Southampton and that was a bad one. It was weird because I'd never been out for that amount of time. It was hard because I was in the gym every day and not out on the pitch with the lads. So I just knuckled down and got back fit as soon as possible."

Beyond Pereira, an 18-year-old Belgian who joined from PSV Eindhoven two years ago, Ben Pearson also impressed. The 19-year-old from Oldham patrolled midfield and might have doubled the scoring when bursting through after 68 minutes.

The 24-year-old goalkeeper, Ben Amos, and Guillermo Varela, 21, a Uruguayan defender who moved effortlessly into midfield during the win, also shone in what was a makeshift side.

Joyce said: "We [had] a side out there with no centre-halves in. We've had no defenders – Paddy McNair came to the club as a No10, Charni Ekangamene is a midfield player. You've probably got two right-backs, one centre-forward and the rest are midfield players. So we have to work on certain things because of that. The lads did tremendously well to take on board everything we asked them to do – to keep a clean sheet. I think we've conceded less goals than everyone in the country despite having no defenders.

"We're mindful of the fact that obviously we're trying to produce footballers and clever footballers, but also trying to produce good human beings – the character of Manchester United players. So that when they go out on loan they are dependable and reliable."

For Wilson and company the dream is to force Van Gaal or whoever takes over from Giggs, who is the interim manager, into selection for the summer tour. "Hopefully all being well I'll have no injuries and will get on that plane to America. It would be absolutely brilliant. I've been to the States before, in the Dallas Cup last year."

 

[LR7]

I don't get the impression from that article that Jamie Jackson has watched much of the U21s this season.

 

[Conrad]

I don't consider McNair to be a special talent although I think he can make it at PL level if his defending is improved.Yeah bit early to make the judgement but usually you see the "sign" of them has ability to become good and so far I only see it in Mitchell,Thompson,CBJ,Henderson but they're no Wilson or Pereira for sure.With the level of talents in the U21s and second-year scholars it will tough for them to breakthrough being the younger ones.

Rathbone and McTominay mostly played down an age group for the U16s, they aren't non-existent but more of we're being patient with them due to their size.Especially with Rathbone he's even smaller than many of the U14s.Both of them has been injured a lot this season as well so I'm afraid they won't have enough chance to prove their impact for the U18s with a lot of younger talents challenge for their positions (Dearnley,Rashford,,Kehinde,Makela,... especially Dearnley seems to be ahead of Rathbone in the pecking order already despite being two years younger).I like Rathbone though he has a look of a typical United youth product.Good at linking up play and close control as well as possessing a tough character (track back and press opponents a lot despite being much smaller than them).Haven't seen him much to judge otherwise.

Ah, fair enough thanks for the info. I thought it might be due to their size, they did both seem tiny at the milk cup, hopefully they'll get a bit more U18 football next year.

 

[Brightonian]

How do you mean consistently? Januzaj's the only one made any kind of impact at first team level so far.

'Consistently' as in the ratio of genuinely promising talent to obvious space-fillers in the youth teams is improving with each new generation. These sides are 'consistently' talented.

 

[Brightonian]

Willock has been consistently decent in the midfield but he's not Rothwell,Pearson or even Goss calibre of talent.We produce that kind of CM talent every single year.

Rothwell wasn't 'Rothwell calibre' when he was at that stage of his development. And Wilson wasn't 'a Wilson' yet either. Only a year or two up and you're already remembering them with rose-tinted specs. One or two talents show themselves from the ages of 15 or 16 - Januzaj, Pearson and Pereira, for example - but most don't really emerge from 'really good' to 'special' until they hit 18 or 19. Rothwell was one of those, as was Lawrence.

You can see the ones who are going to be special at a younger age, but aside from those who genuinely don't look that good, you can't really say which ones aren't going to be special, because they've still got a significant period of development ahead of them. Mitchell, Rashford and Borthwick-Jackson already look potentially special to me, but I've seen nothing from Willock to suggest that he can't be a top player either.

 

[oskarutd]

Not the darling of the week. But remember Cleverley the academy left back? Didn´t really show his promise until later when playing midfield. Not talked about really, but worked at it and was behind in his physicality. But did enough for me to have a soft spot for him in left back position.

McNair might follow in his footsteps, yet to get change in his position.

 

[khoazany]

Rothwell wasn't 'Rothwell calibre' when he was at that stage of his development. And Wilson wasn't 'a Wilson' yet either. Only a year or two up and you're already remembering them with rose-tinted specs. One or two talents show themselves from the ages of 15 or 16 - Januzaj, Pearson and Pereira, for example - but most don't really emerge from 'really good' to 'special' until they hit 18 or 19. Rothwell was one of those, as was Lawrence.

You can see the ones who are going to be special at a younger age, but aside from those who genuinely don't look that good, you can't really say which ones aren't going to be special, because they've still got a significant period of development ahead of them. Mitchell, Rashford and Borthwick-Jackson already look potentially special to me, but I've seen nothing from Willock to suggest that he can't be a top player either.

Don't know which players you were watching but Rothwell and Lawrence did show early promise in their Academy years.Injuries hampered them a bit but you can see they have an extra "it" when you watch them.The likes of Rothwell or Pearson weren't playing ahead of age group only because of their injuries and the players ahead of them in the U21s.

Of course you're right about them having a significant period of development ahead.I didn't write anyone off but I think saying they're not outstanding talents is a fair statement.Cleverley never is for me and he still made it to the first team when Morrison and tons of others didn't.I have seen many young CMs around Willock's age that has more than him in the locker so Willock isn't seem an outstanding prospect for me,as simple as that.Saying we produce CM talents like him every year isn't an overstatement either.For examples (in a descendant order of crops):James,Petrucci,Pogba and Tunnicliffe,Ekangamene,Rothwell and Pearson,Goss and Willock himself,Redmond and Thompson.I didn't see him a better talent than any of those names listed apart from maybe Tunnicliffe and Ekangamene.

Long way to go to transform talent to performance though.We would release a player straightaway if we think he has no chance to make it (which those incidences recently indicated that we really would) so if they're still at United, nobody can really write them off.Everything I'm talking here is about talent, not first team prospect.More talented means greater chance of breaking into the first team though, and in terms of that the first-year scholars crop didn't look better than any of our recent crops except for the Charni crop.Rashford belongs to the lower age group along with Kehinde,Tuanzebe,etc so I didn't count him in.In a separate note that age group looks good in quality from a little I've seen them but shortage in number.

 

[Brightonian]

So I'm feeling even better about the prospects of this after the Hull game. Every single time a youngster comes in and shines, it increases the chances of more such chances being handed out. A decent run-out for Lawrence, a brace for Wilson on his debut, and Januzaj at his effervescent best, another MOTM performance.

 

[LR7]

So I'm feeling even better about the prospects of this after the Hull game. Every single time a youngster comes in and shines, it increases the chances of more such chances being handed out. A decent run-out for Lawrence, a brace for Wilson on his debut, and Januzaj at his effervescent best, another MOTM performance.

Yeah me too. Most of my optimism comes from the fact that so much promise was shown by Wilson and Lawrence last night but I think there's a few more at a similar stage, ready to step up. Lingard, Varela and Michael Keane are ready now imo and should hopefully be given a chance next season. The following season we will have to see how Pearson, Rothwell and Janko progress. It's exciting and whilst I don't want to get too ahead of myself because it's easier said than done to blood so many youngsters in over a small timeframe, it's hard not to. van Gaal's reputation as somebody who brings young players through is exciting too.