A transitional team

Originally posted by MPTutd:
<strong>I think United serious lack pace. In midfield and up front we only have Giggsy who you would consider to be a quick player. But today's football is based around pace so much.

IMHO. we need a pacey striker and a right winger with pace.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Don't agree entirely. We do lack genuine pace upfront, but Keano is very quick (which people don't often realise) and Scholes has excellent change of pace.

But, we could do with more pace, and I know pace is something Sir Alex really appreciate in a player.
 
Originally posted by Davo:
<strong>

I'm not so sure..

I reckon a new manager and some fresh ideas could be what you need..then again there's obviously a big risk with any new appointment..</strong><hr></blockquote>

True, change could always be good. But then again it could be a disaster.
And there are not many managers in the world that could match Sir Alex, so why change for the sake of it, when it is such a gamble.
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>

True, change could always be good. But then again it could be a disaster.
And there are not many managers in the world that could match Sir Alex, so why change for the sake of it, when it is such a gamble.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Because he's going to go some time and the longer he stays the more you'll get the Matt Busby syndrome (sticking with players past their best and failing to bring new talent/ideas into the side).It's far esaier to replace SAF while the team is strong then when it's clear to everyone it's in decline!
 
Originally posted by Gillespie:
<strong>

Because he's going to go some time and the longer he stays the more you'll get the Matt Busby syndrome (sticking with players past their best and failing to bring new talent/ideas into the side).It's far esaier to replace SAF while the team is strong then when it's clear to everyone it's in decline!</strong><hr></blockquote>

In decline or in transition?

And which players are past their best?
 
Arest me if I'm wrong, but according to you:

- Blanc is not good enough :D
- Rio was a mistake, should have bought Ayala instead <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[No No]" /> Ayala is good but Rio is the long term product. I would bring Ayala to replace Blanc
because he has the experience needed
- Veron was a mistake :D
- We're playing players in the wrong positions :D
- We're playing the wrong formation :D
- We're chopping and changing too much :D

Too Good to be true you nearly read my mind.

Sacking SAF not now that he recognised his mistakes and is ready to solve them
 
This topic : Over, and over, and over, and over again! <img src="graemlins/yawn.gif" border="0" alt="[Yawn]" />
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>

True, change could always be good. But then again it could be a disaster.
And there are not many managers in the world that could match Sir Alex, so why change for the sake of it, when it is such a gamble.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I don't think you should sack him, it would be an undignified and unfair exit for someone who has done so much for you..

However, his reasons decisions often puzzle me...and from what is said on here many Manc fans...in fact all but the "he can never make any mistake" brigade, who are as daft as the ones who criticise everything he does. Questions seemed to be posed often as to the hunger and desire of the players...and that is his department to sort out...

Whoever eventually replaces him is going to have a hard act to follow, I reckon you might have been better off if he had retired when he first said he would...
 
Originally posted by Davo:
<strong>

I don't think you should sack him, it would be an undignified and unfair exit for someone who has done so much for you..

However, his reasons decisions often puzzle me...and from what is said on here many Manc fans...in fact all but the "he can never make any mistake" brigade, who are as daft as the ones who criticise everything he does. Questions seemed to be posed often as to the hunger and desire of the players...and that is his department to sort out...

Whoever eventually replaces him is going to have a hard act to follow, I reckon you might have been better off if he had retired when he first said he would...</strong><hr></blockquote>

Replaced by whom though?
 
IMO we're a striker and a left back from having a superb squad. Two positions we were looking at adding to in the summer, but we didn't get the right players for the right price. Not Sir Alex' fault IMO.
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>

Replaced by whom though?</strong><hr></blockquote>

whoever it is, there'll be a transitional period, big time. even if it were mclaren, who knows the players and the club.

i find it ridiculous that some manyoo fans honestly want the likes of capello and lippi as manager. . .neither of them speak english f'chrissakes! it'd be like ranieri at chelsea, they'd spend 2 seasons learning english before they could even speak to the players.

got to go for an english speaker, which would include i suppose eriksson, van gaal and hitzfeld. but i think you'll get moyes. . .
 
Originally posted by michael owen's mum:
<strong>

whoever it is, there'll be a transitional period, big time. even if it were mclaren, who knows the players and the club.

i find it ridiculous that some manyoo fans honestly want the likes of capello and lippi as manager. . .neither of them speak english f'chrissakes! it'd be like ranieri at chelsea, they'd spend 2 seasons learning english before they could even speak to the players.

got to go for an english speaker, which would include i suppose eriksson, van gaal and hitzfeld. but i think you'll get moyes. . .</strong><hr></blockquote>

I agree with that

At the moment I would go for McLaren or O'neill. Moyes could be an option in the future, but not yet.
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>IMO we're a striker and a left back from having a superb squad. Two positions we were looking at adding to in the summer, but we didn't get the right players for the right price. Not Sir Alex' fault IMO.</strong><hr></blockquote>


why, was he forced into blowing £28M on veron?

you're a right and left midfielder light as well. forlan's not a winger, and fortune isn't of the calibre you should be looking for as quality cover.

IMO of course.
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>

I agree with that

At the moment I would go for McLaren or O'neill. Moyes could be an option in the future, but not yet.</strong><hr></blockquote>


i think mclaren's going to be an excellent manager long-term.
 
Originally posted by michael owen's mum:
<strong>


why, was he forced into blowing £28M on veron?

you're a right and left midfielder light as well. forlan's not a winger, and fortune isn't of the calibre you should be looking for as quality cover.

IMO of course.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Veron made sense at the time. Sir Alex had idendified our problems creating chances and breaking teams down in Europe.

And if he continues his good form in Europe and can become more consistent in the league, then I'm for one is happy with him.

Fortune and Chadwick are not good enough IMO, but with six quality midfielders, and some promising youngesters coming through, we're covered in midfield.

Scoles can step in for both Beckham and Giggs, and Veron can also play on the right. Not as well as Beckham and Giggs, but we wouldn't get back-up as good as them either.

Money should be spent on a quality striker and a left back that could compete with Silvestre for the left back spot.
 
Originally posted by Gillespie:
<strong>


SAF has to take the blame.....his 'tweaks' included selling Stam/Sheringham/Cole/Yorke and bringing in Blanc,Veron, RVN and Forlan......with the exception of RVN ,poor decisions.

Compare the £4.5m spent for Gilberto with the £29m on Veron.....that's why your squad is now weaker.A criminal waste of money,I'd say.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Now that the sun's gone and rain has started, Gilberto is doing squat for Arsenal.
 
Scoles can step in for both Beckham and Giggs, and Veron can also play on the right. Not as well as Beckham and Giggs, but we wouldn't get back-up as good as them either.

I was with you till here. Our main problem in the midfield is not that we dont't have classy player but because SAF had been playing alon with them like in a Merry go round.

No matter how good a player is you CANNOT change his position regulary. This put players out of form while dimmorolising them. We have witnessed this facts in Scholes, Giggs, Becks and Veron.

Playing players out of position damages their form

Ending of story

Manutd need

1 A left back** (cover for Silvestre)
2 An experienced central back ( Ayala) instead of Blanc
3 a right winger (cover for Becks)
4 a world class (or 2*) forwards

I would advice also to

return to the 4-4-2
Give a first team run to Webber* Tierney**, Oshea
Djordic and Richardson

*/** only if these two players dont make an impact to the team
 
I heard Wenger say that the average life of a team is five years. So, in our case, if you take the period 1991 - 1996 and then 1997 to 2002, give or take a year either side, he 's probably right. In which case we're now in transition and maybe we should allow for this. Whether or not Fergie has the time, the inclination or indeed still the ability to build a third side remains to be seen. Personally I think this transitional phase, if indeed it is one, should be taken forward by someone else.
 
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
<strong>It's good to see Sir Alex confirming what I've repeatedly said; we're in a transitional period :D </strong><hr></blockquote>


I think you must have misread it AEBM. Apparently it said we were crap :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by michael owen's mum:
<strong>

whoever it is, there'll be a transitional period, big time. even if it were mclaren, who knows the players and the club.

i find it ridiculous that some manyoo fans honestly want the likes of capello and lippi as manager. . .neither of them speak english f'chrissakes! it'd be like ranieri at chelsea, they'd spend 2 seasons learning english before they could even speak to the players.

got to go for an english speaker, which would include i suppose eriksson, van gaal and hitzfeld. but i think you'll get moyes. . .</strong><hr></blockquote>

Sounds pretty good. A English speaker is a must. Although, SGE isn't a United manager of the future IMO and Moyles is too inexperienced. Which leaves us with O'Neill who pretty much has the credentials (even though I'm not convinced) and McClaren who would be my choice. But how realistic this is will depend on how he does in the mean time.

If we win nowt this year then it isn't impossible that Fergie will step aside next summer. It might even be the plan for him to step aside before the end of his contract to avoid the unsettling situation that occured last year.

I'd settle for Fergies last game in charge being a 3-0 romp (all scored by Forlan)against Real madrid at Old Trafford. <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />
 
Agree with a fair bit of what's posted here, even some of the scouse contributions :eek:

The statement "Ferguson is wary that United are being muscled out of this year's championship because they lack the physical presence of previous years" is a recognition of a problem that has actually existed for a couple of years.

That inevitably means a change of personnel but also could mean that some of the current squad could thrive in a team better able to compete in the physical battles. No good having 4 ball players in midfield if nobody's winning any ball.

Wenger and Houllier have set the blueprint for EPL in this decade, whether we like it or not. It's time to recognise it and address the challenge.

As for the endless Veron debates, SAF saw him as a Cantona type figure to inspire the team and delight the fans. If it was a mistake, then one should at least applaud his motives.
 
I said we were in transition weeks ago, and we must be realistic this season, because the job will not be completed until summer.
But I do reckon we may see some surprise moves out during the next 12 months!
<img src="graemlins/nervous.gif" border="0" alt="[Nervous]" />
 
Originally posted by MPTutd:
<strong>I think United serious lack pace. In midfield and up front we only have Giggsy who you would consider to be a quick player. But today's football is based around pace so much.

IMHO. we need a pacey striker and a right winger with pace.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Bingo there MP .. or I always call it "dynamic and mobility" .. Other than physical presence which we have gone down quite a fair bit - the "dynamic and mobility" is the part we have been seriously lacking now ... I don't know it comes naturally 'cos of the lack of "eagerness" towards games ... I hope it's not. We use to be the strongest team in terms of Wing-Play and speed ... but no more for a long while now. Giggs don really fly down the wing nowadays ... and matches after matches, I saw us pumping long balls or statically passing to each other without the true "run" ...

We really have to look at ourselves and improve. It's good that Fergie know and admit it ( not smokescreen please, it's just too obvious to deny ) .. .