A Foundation has been built

Rojofiam said:
How is that a fact? It's just an opinion some fans agree with, and some don't.

Yes, I do think they're absolutely good enough to be mainstays in our team even if we become PL and CL contenders within the next 2/3 years.
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both players do not take care of possession enough.

for the bolded part

with our current XI:
Rashford - Hojlund/Zirkzee - Garnacho/Amad
Mainoo - Ugarte - Bruno
Dalot - Martinez Deligt - mazouri
Onana

for which possession do you think we should buy and replace to make us a title challenger in 2 years?
 
Desert Eagle said:
From De gea , Maguire, Lindelof, AWB, Mctom and Wout to

Onana, De Light, Martinez, Mazraoui, Ugarte and Zirkzee.

On a technical and footballing level we have improved. Let's not get into bashing the former players (and some still here) but I think when you look at things like passing, close control, football IQ, the second group is clearly better.

Even if ETH gets sacked at the end of the year, we have a decent young team that is headed in the right direction.

This is without mentioning the likes of Amad,Mainoo, Yoro, Rasmus and Garnacho.

A foundation has been built.
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Well, you are simply way too optimistic. Onana is a good goalkeeper with silly mistakes. Martinez is very injury prone, you simply cannot rely on him , apparently he won't be able to play a whole season, never. Ugarte... Who knows? You talk about someone who played only minutes for the club but completely failed to get decent amount of playtime in Paris, not a good sign. Zirkzee is good in passing but we needed a scorer, and he isn't one of them. Mazraoui, well for 15 million he seems to be a good signing but defensively he is pretty limited. And anyway, talking about De Ligt, Mazraoui, Zirkzee and Ugarte after only a few (mostly poor) matches or few minutes as a "new foundation" is simply recklessness nothing else, sorry.
 
JeffFromHK said:
both players do not take care of possession enough.

for the bolded part

with our current XI:
Rashford - Hojlund/Zirkzee - Garnacho/Amad
Mainoo - Ugarte - Bruno
Dalot - Martinez Deligt - mazouri
Onana

for which possession do you think we should buy and replace to make us a title challenger in 2 years?
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It's impossible to answer this, because so much depends on how our players perform this season, how effective ETH's tactics will be, and will he even be manager at the start of next season.
 
Rojofiam said:
It's impossible to answer this, because so much depends on how our players perform this season, how effective ETH's tactics will be, and will he even be manager at the start of next season.
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come on, we are on football forum and we need to make judgments based on limited information available (you made a judgment that Bruno and Rashford fit our possession based tactics and Wirtz isn't an upgrade on Bruno anyway). How can you not have an opinion on whether our squad is good enough for a title challenger? Is it because the answer "bruno and rashford are our weak spots under the possession based tactics that need to be upgraded upon") is too obvious you wanna dodge that question?

a game is not won until the final whistle, so we can never predict scorelines?
we never know if a player until the player has finished his career here, so we can never suggest football transfers for the club as fans?
 
I think we are starting to see foundations being laid not just with the squad, but also with our football. We obviously crapped the bed versus Liverpool, but I thought the Brighton performance was encouraging (many disagree) and the Palace performance was an extension of that.

The shape is better. We are winning a lot of second balls. Creating more chances. Controlling the football. Game IQ seems to be improving.

It's far too early to get carried away of course. We miss far too many good chances. We still have periods where we lose focus, and we need to show that we can do it against the better sides, but I'm seeing progress. It feels like instances I've seen with United and several other clubs in the past where this might be the season where the team develop a lot and take that step up to being a really good side.
 
JeffFromHK said:
come on, we are on football forum and we need to make judgments based on limited information available (you made a judgment that Bruno and Rashford fit our possession based tactics and Wirtz isn't an upgrade on Bruno anyway). How can you not have an opinion on whether our squad is good enough for a title challenger? Is it because the answer "bruno and rashford are our weak spots under the possession based tactics that need to be upgraded upon") is too obvious you wanna dodge that question?

a game is not won until the final whistle, so we can never predict scorelines?
we never know if a player until the player has finished his career here, so we can never suggest football transfers for the club as fans?
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I didn't realize that was the question you asked me. No, we're not title contender level yet, but that isn't because of Bruno or Rashford.
 
Breathe, eat and drink that positivity nonsense all you guys want, but with ETH, you can have the elite in all 11 positions on the pitch and the team would still be useless.... He needs to go!
 
SungSam7 said:
We really cling on to positivity. Yeah the ages look great, but really.... Klopp was playing attractive football with Liverpool in half the time and I'm sure less money spent ffs.
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It’s what this fanbase does the best. Half of them wanted to give a proven failure of a manager a 3rd season at this club. When the new season inevitably is a write off after 5 games they have nowhere to hide so instead start writing fictional lore on how he has laid the foundations for future generations.

The jury is still out on all of his signings. Chances are most of them are more deadwood rather than part of some great foundation.
 
Foundation?
We will lose against Spurs and Villa.
Then what Foundation are we talking about ?
 
These threads make us look like Clowns. RAWKish level of delusion. Half of the squad won't survive the next manager so there goes any debate about foundation.
 
We've definitely built a foundation- a foundation of mediocracy.

We have maybe 3 players in our squad that clubs like Madrid and City would look at and say 'yeah, we'd have liked to have had that guy.'

Yoro, Mainoo, and Garnacho are players that could probably develop into world class players if they were developed properly and surrounded by other world class talent.

That's it. Everyone else in our squad are players that major clubs either would reject or have rejected.
 
There is progression in the build up from staff in place above the manager and the profile of player and wages paid out is correct. The fact we have a manager after two seasons is still asking for patience from the fans is ridiculous. Obviously this wasnt an Ineos appointment and the fact they did a review and judged keeping him, because no one was available who was better.
This doesnt mean they rated him that highly, it meant a top manager or an up and coming manager with good vibes wasnt available. Apparently Tuchel wanted a year off and McKenna wanted to stay loyal to Ipswich.
Once they pick their manager to implement their vision, then we can see if we are improving.
 
The_Midfielder said:
Foundation?
We will lose against Spurs and Villa.
Then what Foundation are we talking about ?
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Apparently on a footballing level we’ve improved according to OP. That seems to be the basis of having a foundation, whatever that means.
 
The new manager will inherit the likes of Amad, Garnacho, Rasmus, Yoro, Maz etc

Ineos needs to hire someone willing to get rid of Bruno and Rashford and build around the others otherwise we will just repeat the loop.
 
Desert Eagle said:
The new manager will inherit the likes of Amad, Garnacho, Rasmus, Yoro, Maz etc

Ineos needs to hire someone willing to get rid of Bruno and Rashford and build around the others otherwise we will just repeat the loop.
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they did just hire a bunch of "football people" above the manager, they are the ones that need to get rid of Rash, Bruno, Casemiro etc.
 
Šjor Bepo said:
they did just hire a bunch of "football people" above the manager, they are the ones that need to get rid of Rash, Bruno, Casemiro etc.
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Yeah it's concerning that they instead signed off on an extension for both ETH and Bruno when they are arguably our two biggest issues.
Samid said:
Apparently on a footballing level we’ve improved according to OP. That seems to be the basis of having a foundation, whatever that means.
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The footballing talent we have has improved. We still need to get rid of the manager and Fraudnandes but the new manager will be stepping into a much better situation than ETH did.
 
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The Boy said:
Overly harsh, the team has changed massively in the last 3 years and how they play has definitely changed as well, it developed massively in that first season, you must be able to see the difference between the team that lost 4-0 to us in his first league game to the team that drew 0-0 with Palace on Saturday.

As for "any manager worth their salt should make do" you're taking last season out of context massively. It was a poor season by United standards, but set against the backdrop of the club possibly being sold, no one knowing their future at Man Utd from the tea ladies to the manager, that has a huge effect.

On top of that an unnaturally large injury list, no manager just sails through that and makes do, they all struggle, we saw the same for RDZ, for Klopp in fact I can't think of one manager that just carries on despite injuries to key players. Half of the football world thinks Arsenal will win the premier league now because of Rodri's injury, but no one is saying that despite his huge squad and unlimited funds Pep is suddenly a shite manager. Losing key players means results suffer.

ETH has certainly made some bad decisions and mistakes along the way, but he's also made good ones that are often ignored. He's not the shit manager a lot of posters here seem to think he is, though he hasn't shown himself to be one of the all time best either.
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This is mental. As are loads of other posts on the first page.
 
redcucumber said:
This is mental. As are loads of other posts on the first page.
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That's a WUM post. He has based his entire argument around a result that didn't happen (4-0 vs Brighton) and compared it to a completely arbitrary 0-0 against relegation candidate Palace to prove that we've somehow improved.

We lost 2-1 to Brighton back then and did the same now. We beat Klopp's Pool 2-1 in the third game. This time in the same game we got our asses handed to us by the new bloke who didn't even sign anyone in the summer. We were shite back then and we are even worse right now. Anyone claiming we've improved is trolling.

Opposition fans him to stay. They want United to fail. I don't blame them. Shame they're allowed to troll freely on here though.
 
Where is the foundations now lads, where is the positivity. The only positive I can take personally from this season is if he is sacked early!
 
SungSam7 said:
Where is the foundations now lads, where is the positivity. The only positive I can take personally from this season is if he is sacked early!
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look at the 1st page. It’s like a nightmare, someone actually saying Eric won’t be able to see the fruits of his labour and other chap saying how he is re shaping the squad, all after beating a measly Barnsley and scoring a nada against Crystal Palace. And all of them are seasoned posters.

This foundations are basically sandcastles built on a beach, waiting to be wiped away by the tide.
 
ohhrooney said:
look at the 1st page. It’s like a nightmare, someone actually saying Eric won’t be able to see the fruits of his labour and other chap saying how he is re shaping the squad, all after beating a measly Barnsley and scoring a nada against Crystal Palace. And all of them are seasoned posters.

This foundations are basically sandcastles built on a beach, waiting to be wiped away by the tide.
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:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

I know, but its because last season we would have struggled against the likes of Barnsley in a cup game. That is the standard we have set ourselves, never mind winning just 3 games in our last 11.... our mission this season was to beat a league 1 side with ease. Feck the rest of the season now.
 
SungSam7 said:
Where is the foundations now lads, where is the positivity. The only positive I can take personally from this season is if he is sacked early!
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The foundations are in the players that will be here after ETH:

Mainoo, Garnacho, Yoro, Maz, Rasmus etc

It's a much better situation than a new manager coming into an ageing team that has no young talent. We still need quality but I maintain my opinion that just based on the playing staff, we have improved and built a foundation. Now with a good manager we could really start building on top of the foundation.
 
But y
Desert Eagle said:
The foundations are in the players that will be here after ETH:

Mainoo, Garnacho, Yoro, Maz, Rasmus etc

It's a much better situation than a new manager coming into an ageing team that has no young talent. We still need quality but I maintain my opinion that just based on the playing staff, we have improved and built a foundation. Now with a good manager we could really start building on top of the foundation.
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But we can't be positive about them as long as this fool is in charge, these are the development years. They can't be wasted under this clown.

INEOS need to get a grip now. To be honest, I seriously think ETH wants out and he's trying his best to get the boot. He can not be this bad! Like this is Ian Dowie level of bad.
 
Desert Eagle said:
Yeah it's concerning that they instead signed off on an extension for both ETH and Bruno when they are arguably our two biggest issues.


The footballing talent we have has improved. We still need to get rid of the manager and Fraudnandes but the new manager will be stepping into a much better situation than ETH did.
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And when the next manager also considers "Fraudnandes" and Rashford crucial players, it will be another professional manager who does not know any better than RedCafe experts, am I right?
 
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