25 Players Out

[golden_blunder]

I should have clarified. That's the stat from Sporting mentioned in the video. 25 out in Amorim's first season between sales and loans

I don’t think it’s gonna happen at United as they’ve already invested money just last summer. I could envisage maybe 10-12 outgoings this coming window, especially if you’d assume that with Heaton, Evans, Lindelof and Eriksen that’s 4 already

 

[engie92]

How Ruben Amorim was able to fix Sporting in only one summer

I know a few posters, especially the one Sporting fan on here summarized this back when we first hired Amorim. This is a pretty good recent video refresher and even more important for anyone that wasn't aware of the club turnover at Sporting.

There's a table at the end highlighting players that United should move on from without any sentimentality and honestly, it does feel like another 25 out would not be the worst decision for Amorim.

I've got no sentimentality left. I wish we could see the tear down start at the top with the Glazers and INEOS. But if it's at least the squad then that's better than continuing the same old boom bust cycle of incremental changes and knee jerk bandages.

Video is well made, well explained and overall could give us some hope.

Anyway, I would rate this video on same level as videos "Why is XYZ (insert any name from last 3 seasons) perfect signing for Manchester United.

Positive things could be current form of Antony, Rashford and overall players we sold (McTominay, Fred) so teams shouldn't be afraid of buying players from United (price tag is different story)

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

25 players out is never going to be doable at Utd, we’ll struggle to get 5 or 6 out considering are wage structure. The players coming the end of their contracts will leave plus Casemiro and maybe Rashford and Antony that’s the best we can hope for. Which would be alright imo. It’s all about the incomings then, we simply cannot afford to get the recruitment wrong again.

 

[DOTA]

It technically could be done.

Get rid of every single first team player. If it's Casemiro being loaned to Brazil for a contribution of 20k a week and such so be it. If it's gardening leave, so be it. Younger highly rated players like Garnacho, Mainoo et al are loaned out without options to buy. Buy an entirely new squad of lower waged, less glamorous but hard working players. Bring back the highly rated younger players the next year in to a new culture.

It's tempting no? I mean, we'd probably get relegated but it's tempting...

 

[K Stand Knut]

That video really excites me.

No way in this page do United pull it off successfully. We’re a joke of a club and getting rid of they players specifically will be too hard to do

 

[Pav1878]

Can you sell players if they are injured. Doesn’t seem realistic this plan.

But I get the sentiment. I hope he can ship out a fair few and bring in the right ones.

 

[bosnian_red]

I disagree with this. The longer we hold onto these failed players the more money we are . We can get a fee for Hojlund even if it's a big loss. Bringing Jonathan David in on a free is unlikely to be worse. Also the fact that Antony and Rashford are having a good season on loan will probably influence someone to take a punt on Hojlund on the off chance the same thing happens.

With Casemiro, I'm sure we can get another player in. His wages are so high that you could Amortise a transfer fee and a players wages for a similar outlay to just his wages alone.

We need to forget about the PSR losses to some extent. We will not get back anything like we paid for Sancho, Antony, Casemiro and Hojlund. We have to accept the money has been wasted and try and be as smart as we can in our future dealers to offset this and if we do have to sell a youth player or two to improve our position then we should do so.

The reason you can't forget about PSR is because it directly limits your spending. Sure you can fix your cash on hand, but if you sell Hojlund at a loss, then we can sell less despite having more money.

 

[Ted Lasso]

25 players out is never going to be doable at Utd, we’ll struggle to get 5 or 6 out considering are wage structure. The players coming the end of their contracts will leave plus Casemiro and maybe Rashford and Antony that’s the best we can hope for. Which would be alright imo. It’s all about the incomings then, we simply cannot afford to get the recruitment wrong again.

Definitely a challenge. Wages seem to have been the sticking point on so many occasions. I am hoping on this occasion with Sancho, Antony and Rashford already out on loan that we have a good a solid start to managing those challenges. The 25 number with sporting did include several loans after all so seems consistent. Literally before this video I was wondering out loud who was the main reason for dumping Rashford

 

[JoseM4]

I'm grateful that we've seen so many players shown the door already. The big clear out we've already had has been great - long may it continue. Rashford, Sancho, Antony - I thought we'd be stuck with them for years to come.

Players out on loan may be back and with us for years to come.

 

[DarkLord1984]

Players out on loan may be back and with us for years to come.

Yes, but there's more of a chance that they won't come back if they do well at their loans. We can only hope.

 

[Apokalips]

How Ruben Amorim was able to fix Sporting in only one summer

I know a few posters, especially the one Sporting fan on here summarized this back when we first hired Amorim. This is a pretty good recent video refresher and even more important for anyone that wasn't aware of the club turnover at Sporting.

There's a table at the end highlighting players that United should move on from without any sentimentality and honestly, it does feel like another 25 out would not be the worst decision for Amorim.

I've got no sentimentality left. I wish we could see the tear down start at the top with the Glazers and INEOS. But if it's at least the squad then that's better than continuing the same old boom bust cycle of incremental changes and knee jerk bandages.

I'm in the same boat, I'd love to see a tear down starting with the Glazers and INEOS. I just want us to be debt free and have good, ambitious owners. I'd love the vast majority of this squad cut, I'd only really care to keep Dorgu (just joined), Yoro, Mainoo, Garnacho, Amad, Bruno plus young players like Collyer, who have not had much chance yet. I don't think I'd care much if anyone else got sold although I'd keep some like De Ligt and Mazraoui too as they're good players and new, everyone else has had enough time or just not worth it. I never want to see us make decisions like signing an unproven kid to be our number 1 striker, giving them the number 9 shirt and effectively throwing away 2 seasons, I want us to get back to the days of adding a Berbatov to an existing squad of Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez - aggressively strengthening and deepening from a position of strength.

Realistically we won't sell that many, but I would like us to ship off a big chunk and bring in real quality to turn most of those players here into backup/rotation options, they'd be viewed in a much better light in that role similarly to how Maguire is not as offensive to fans because he is not relied upon as guaranteed first choice and captain.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

No need for that big a cull, we just need to replace…..

Onana - Sell
Maguire - Sell
Lindelof - Give away
Evans - Free
Dalot - Sell
Malacia - Sell
Eriksen - Free
Casemiro - Give away
Antony - Sell
Sancho - Sell
Rashford - Sell
Zirkzee - Sell

Dame quite a few!

 

[JoseM4]

No need for that big a cull, we just need to replace…..

Onana - Sell
Maguire - Sell
Lindelof - Give away
Evans - Free
Dalot - Sell
Malacia - Sell
Eriksen - Free
Casemiro - Give away
Antony - Sell
Sancho - Sell
Rashford - Sell
Zirkzee - Sell

Dame quite a few!

Add Luke Shaw & Mason Mount to the list.

If reporting is to be believed, Mainoo wants out based on his unrealistic salary demands.

Villa have the option to buy Rashford for 40M but it’s unlikely to be exercised if they fail to qualify for the CL.

 

[2 man midfield]

I’m just wary of us doing this, it not working out with Amorim and then having to do exactly the same for the next manager. But what’s the alternative? He needs his players.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

Add Luke Shaw & Mason Mount to the list.

If reporting is to be believed, Mainoo wants out based on his unrealistic salary demands.

Villa have the option to buy Rashford for 40M but it’s unlikely to be exercised if they fail to qualify for the CL.

Yeah I kept them two of the list cause I doubt anyone takes them on a free at the minute to be honest.

 

[Ted Lasso]

No need for that big a cull, we just need to replace…..

Onana - Sell
Maguire - Sell
Lindelof - Give away
Evans - Free
Dalot - Sell
Malacia - Sell
Eriksen - Free
Casemiro - Give away
Antony - Sell
Sancho - Sell
Rashford - Sell
Zirkzee - Sell

Dame quite a few!

I wouldn't bat an eye. If we move even 7 or 8 players that's a major achievement

 

[48 hours]

Sounds like our injury list

 

[tjb]

I actually think we have a decent squad in a few areas, but due to injuries, adaptation and fit it doesn't look like it should quite yet. I think the most important thing for us with Amorim is making sure that every signing we get is athletic, regardless of whether they are signed for depth or to start.

I think his system is quite similar to Sir Alex' in the sense that athleticism and individual quality were important to take advantage of space. For me, this is why were always so adaptable when we had injuries, not because Brown, Butt and O'shea were class, but because to fit into the team temporarily, they needed to simply have great athelticism, giving Fergie the time to develop them.

The attacking players, like with Fergie, need to have the individual quality to take on players. This is why I think we can have a good level of turnover, as the system requires less of specific technicality, but demands a lot physically. Obviously the first xi and immediate squad players need to have a good combination of both.

 

[Dominos]

I'm grateful that we've seen so many players shown the door already. The big clear out we've already had has been great - long may it continue. Rashford, Sancho, Antony - I thought we'd be stuck with them for years to come.

I know that if Woodward and co were still in charge of football operations (cringe) we wouldn't be seeing anywhere near the player turnover that we have.

Rashford and Antony are not out the door, they're on loan. It will still be a big task to sell them in the summer.

Antony because we need to find someone to match his book value, and Rashford because he may ask for another loan so he can continue getting his 300k a week.

 

[DarkLord1984]

Rashford and Antony are not out the door, they're on loan. It will still be a big task to sell them in the summer.

Antony because we need to find someone to match his book value, and Rashford because he may ask for another loan so he can continue getting his 300k a week.

I'm aware they're still on our books, but trying to be optimistic about the fact that there's slightly more of a chance of them leaving now that they are out on loan.

 

[CloneMC16]

A lot of players people want to get rid of won't be going anywhere. Selling our players is difficult. All of them are overpaid and will never get anywhere near the contract they have here at any other club. They have no desire to leave. Too often, we have to wait until their contracts are actually up to get rid. Evans, Lindelof, and Eriksen's contracts are up, so they'll definitely leave. Sancho is almost certainly going to sign for Chelsea. Getting rid of a lot of the others is not going to be easy. Apart from those 4, I doubt we get rid of more than 4 others.

The club will almost certainly want to get rid of Casemiro, Shaw, Rashford, and Antony, but all 4 are unsellable.

 

[Tallis]

A lot of players people want to get rid of won't be going anywhere. Selling our players is difficult. All of them are overpaid and will never get anywhere near the contract they have here at any other club. They have no desire to leave. Too often, we have to wait until their contracts are actually up to get rid. Evans, Lindelof, and Eriksen's contracts are up, so they'll definitely leave. Sancho is almost certainly going to sign for Chelsea. Getting rid of a lot of the others is not going to be easy. Apart from those 4, I doubt we get rid of more than 4 others.

The club will almost certainly want to get rid of Casemiro, Shaw, Rashford, and Antony, but all 4 are unsellable.

I feel confident we can sell Antony. He has 6 G+A in 9 games for Betis now, I believe. Rashford is 50/50. Casemiro - we could do a loan where we pay half his wages and he only has 1 year on his contract.

Shaw and Mount will be very difficult to sell.

 

[OnceUponAFan]

25 players out is never going to be doable at Utd, we’ll struggle to get 5 or 6 out considering are wage structure. The players coming the end of their contracts will leave plus Casemiro and maybe Rashford and Antony that’s the best we can hope for. Which would be alright imo. It’s all about the incomings then, we simply cannot afford to get the recruitment wrong again.

5 are already certain to leave. Sancho, Lindelof, Eriksen, Heaton, Evans.

You'd expect Rashford, Antony and Malacia to leave too, at the very least on loan. Maybe Casemiro who has one year left on his contract.

That's 8/9 players straight away. We've cleared a good few out over the recent years so won't be as drastic as the 25 in one summer for Sporting but I think the changes on the squad will be similar as we had circa 15 leave last summer either permanently or on loan.

Then there might be 2/3 the club look to sell on to make some money including Hojlund, Onana and Zirkzee.

We've bought Heaven, Dorgu, Leon, Chido, Ugarte, De Ligt, Yoro, Mazraoui, Kone. All of which I'd expect to be part of Amorim's future.

I expect us to buy another wing-back, at least 1 forward and a CM.

I hope we don't overpay and waste our funds on anyone.

 

[Ollie Derbyshire]

I wouldn't bat an eye. If we move even 7 or 8 players that's a major achievement

Agreed I’d had my fill of most on that list for sure.

 

[2 man midfield]

I think he’s shown in January that he can be ruthless. I just hope the club allow him to do what needs to be done. The longer it takes, the longer we’ll be watching square pegs in round holes.

 

[BorisManUtd]

Onana, Lindelof, Evans, Malacia, Eriksen, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

Not sure we'll be able to sell Casemiro. Definitely won't when it comes to Shaw who is just constantly injured. Mount is a big problem given we paid 55-60 million and he's on big wages and is injury-prone. Only bought him 2 years ago so given the whole PSR thing how much do we have to get for him so there's not a loss from his transfer?

Then there's Mainoo with his wage demands that could mean we sell him. Wouldn't like it but there are rumours. Dalot is a player that has a decent worth but shouldn't be more than backup option for wingback positions. Perhaps would work as RCB? Difficult to predict what happens with him.

Hojlund is similar to Mount in terms of fee and that they came same summer.

 

[RuudTom83]

United need to improve the first team but the expensive high earners on the bench/injured (not playing) are what is killing the squad.

Get rid of those and replace them with hungry talent from the championship.

Promote a few of the kids.

Spend most of the cash on a CF and the mood around Carrington will feel a lot better going into 25/26.

 

[simonhch]

Garnacho has been one of the most productive players in his age group, ranks really high in lots of important metrics for young wingers, has had loads of big moments already in his young career.

Hes having a tough season because the club is a mess. He was excellent the 2 seasons prior. He was absolutely key for us to winning the FA Cup, as was Mainoo. That's not something to ignore.

People writing these 2 u20 players off because the club is a disaster is fecking wild to me, honestly some of the worst takes I see on here when people don't realize that it's quite hard for a young player to do well when everything around him is self imploding.

Don’t even bother. There is so much commentary around our young players that defies logic. It’s really clear that such people have zero understanding of what it takes to develop young talent and how variable that development can be. If we listened to people like that, then virtually none of the greatest ever players to come through our academy would ever have made it. This whole debate is debunk, rinse and repeat around here. It’s a never ending and losing battle. There is virtually no strategic, common sense or holistic vision in the football forum.

 

[OleGunnar20]

Great video and I agree wholeheartedly that a big clear out is needed. The culture of fear and regression needs to be cut out, and only a big turnover of the squad will do this.

I'd move on: Onana, Bayindir, Lindelof, Evans, Maguire, Shaw, Malacia, Casemiro, Eriksen, Garnacho, Mount, Antony and Rashford - In an ideal world.

Leaving us with:

Keeper
Yoro - De Ligt - Martinez
RWB - Ugarte - Midfielder - Dorgu
Amad - Fernandes
Striker

Heaven, Dalot, Amass, Mainoo, Collyer, Zirkzee, Hojlund

Bring in 4 signings you'd expect to slot straight into the first 11. Promote youth and play it smart with free transfers and loans to bulk out the squad as is necessary after that.

With likely no European football to play next year this is the perfect year to properly tear up the squad and start from a fresh slate. This would go a massive way toward resetting the mentality and if we're smart, jump start us in the right direction.

I know people will accuse me of playing football manager, say it's impossible to move on that number of players etc, but it's clearly not if the will is there. Teams have done it in the past.

Of course it's almost certainly not going to happen to this extent, but I think the point made in the video linked is the right one - we can't tinker around the edges any longer, we're only going to slide in one direction.

What's really crazy is I could have added another couple of names to that list .. dire squad we've managed to assemble here for an absolute fortune. Madness.