Gay. Have at it.
Black. Have at it.
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You up for pool tonight?.. Have at it
Black. Have at it.
White. Have at it
Asian. Have at it.
You up for pool tonight?.. Have at it
2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress
- Thread starter Raoul
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The People’s Republic of Blaggistan
I don't know if this has been posted but this is a fantastic response to an absurd question
I don't know what the medicare system is like in the US or how it works as I live in the UK.
So what is the particular benefit of medicare for all over other systems which provide universal coverage?
- universal
- free at the point of service (no deductibles, no copays, no premiums, no lifetime caps, etc)
- includes mental health services
- significant savings on administrative costs
- all money reinvested back into system (any system with private insurers by definition takes money out of the system and is less efficient)
Hopefully, people are aware that while they fight to be the best progressive, the true establishment candidate could easily get nominated. That is my fear this time around.
It going to be such a long and pointless 4 years if Warren wins.
Accountable Capitalism.
You could not make it up.
You could not make it up.
Maybe I'm reading that wrong but it doesn't seem like she's asking these guys to sign a non-binding pledge. Rather she's asking the companies that signed that pledge to support her reforms (ie her Accountable Capitalism Act) < Disclaimer: I haven't read it.
What is the economic system that you propose, Marl Karx?
you are so far behind I don't have the time....
Oh don't mind me, let it be for the other unenlightened souls here, what is your grand solution for the USA, if not capitalism ?
This is a pretty asinine question. You might not agree with the alternatives but it's not like they dont exist. Everyone posting in this thread has heard of socialism.
Oddly enough I've listened and read. Where did he advocate for the abolition of capitalism as a whole, something that your previous comment pointed to?
Sure. But what is understood as socialism in USA is just social democracy practiced in some European countries. They are still capitalistic and have private profit driven economies. As I said, if Bernie has claimed something of a grander scale, such as mass nationalisation, please point me to it.
tbf What Bernie is suggesting is not Socialism per se.
He is not talking of Nationalisation for example.
He is speaking of strongly regulating how Business is done so the ordinary person is not exploited or hurt.
Basically he is proposing working within the system except he proposes strong safety nets for everyone.
He certainly wants to remove the profit motive from Health Care. But that is a decision that Health Care is a human right.
I dont think Bernie has proposed it. But the initial exchange wasn't explicitly about Bernie.
I replied to Eboue.
There are two things on that thread.
A non binding agreement and An Accountable Capitalism Act which if passed Is binding.
If workers are allowed to elect 40% of the board, it would mean Union Representation at Board level.
But this is the DNC's Warren....so I am skeptical.
A non binding agreement and An Accountable Capitalism Act which if passed Is binding.
If workers are allowed to elect 40% of the board, it would mean Union Representation at Board level.
But this is the DNC's Warren....so I am skeptical.
Yeah, RD said 'Listen to Bernie' and that's why we reached this point. As for the alternatives , do you or do you not agree that historically they were tried, and they failed? For approximately 70 years this experiment was conducted in the most resource rich region on Earth. It was a resounding failure. Now the countries that still don't have a free market are (on top of my head ) North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba. There may be more, I dont claim this to be a complete list. I presume sanctions will be mentioned as some form of counter argument for why they are not doing exactly great. And I hope nobody thinks China is anything but capitalistic in the economic sense.
The biggest problem is, how do you motivate people to be creative?
I was referring to Warren's non binding pledge.
Capitalism in itself is about maximising profit.
If you are for that fine. You are a libertarian.
Once you start regulating how business is done, the pure profit motive is removed.
Personally I am not a fan of any label. I have nothing against people bringing innovative ideas and making money with that. But whatever business is done must not end up exploiting the worker and or hurting people and the environment.
Climate Change is a perfect example of everything that is wrong with unregulated Capitalism.
I don't think the initial pledge has anything to do with Warren. It's an independent pledge both created and taken by a group of CEO's calling themselves the "Business Roundtable". She's come in after the fact basically attempting to leverage their pledge into a political argument for why these companies ought to endorse her act. If you follow through her initial tweet she seems to have said this to them:
The profit motive certainly isn't removed if you regulate something. It still exists, except it has to operate under more stringent parameters.
I said the PURE profit motive.
Right. Let me explain how my socialist , regulated and planned country, proud member of the Eastern Block and the Warsaw pact, dealed with the environment. There were tens of heavy industry factories built in an extremely short time span, with the grand slogan of 'industrialisation ' . That lead to several defaults in the years, but this a separate topic. What is important : these monstrosities spewed toxic chemicals 24/7. There was such an industrial town maybe 50km from my home city, and when the train stopped there , the air was so clean, I had to breathe through a wet handkerchief, because apparently too clean air is not good for you.
The liquid waste from this went directly into the local rivers. And you want to know the punchline ? After everything was produced, it turned out that nobody actually has a demand for it. But this kept going on for the next five year plan. Whatever was made was transported to another eastern block country, most often the USSR, and the majority of it dumped into some of their rivers. Because that was 'the plan', and the plan was never wrong, because the party is never wrong.
That's a non capitalistic planned economy for you.
So what you want is a B corp? I do try to keep an eye out for those, I’ve found a few for clothes, phone case, and coffee!
I liked the 40% workers representation part.
Though there is nothing about regulations.
What you bring up is nothing to do with Socialism.
You are describing a Totalitarian system, whatever they decided to call themselves.
That does not mean a Capitalist state is not guilty. That is the point.
You need regulations for anything we do that touches people and the environment we live in.
Here is the Reality Check.
Warren is a member of a party that is fully owned by Corporations, no matter how much you would like to deny it.
The very reason Sanders is talking of removing money from politics and therefore their influence.
That is where it needs to start. Rather than a pledge that is unworkable in reality.
Warren is a member of a party that is fully owned by Corporations, no matter how much you would like to deny it.
The very reason Sanders is talking of removing money from politics and therefore their influence.
That is where it needs to start. Rather than a pledge that is unworkable in reality.
There's a few, like a five year stay on the sale and transfer of newly acquired shares and board approval for political donations etc (75% approval required). Then there are the discressionary ones that the government would require for a company to be given a charter - that covers community rights and environmental protection. They could be strict or they could be fudged of course, but the idea has potential.
Copy of the full bill here: https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/senate-bill/3348/text
I agree. These would be good practices if put into law and is enforceable.
But that does not jive with what the current Democratic Party is doing.
She has agreed to bundle money for the party after her nomination from the corporations.
Do you think they will not expect something in return?
The skepticism arises from what she is saying and what she is doing being opposite to each other.
No worries.
I believe in Scandinavia they do have businesses that thrive.
Whatever system of government they have.
Except sanders and somewhat weirdly Gabbard, every one else is just corporatists.. Whatever that means.
I would say that’s social democracy. Different to democratic socialism in that it is not post-capitalist. For example in Sweden a big part of the economy is private sector (I think about 90%).
From what I learned when studying pol sci, that is the closest model to what Bernie Sanders advocates/closest ideology to what he espouses. He’s not a socialist or even a democratic socialist though he calls himself as much. I’m not sure if he’s being deliberate in that ‘mistake’ as a political tool or if he’s just misunderstanding what those labels mean. I tend to think it’s the latter but can’t see inside his head!
I agree in your support of the Scandinavian model. Not just compared to the US model but also countries like Ireland/UK (which we learned of as the Anglo-American model I think...it was 9 years ago so forgive me!)
I also wholeheartedly agree with you that we should care less about what’s in a label (and just ask what is effective), but we do, and as someone who enjoys definitions and classifications I guess I am part of the problem. However people do care so it’s important to be accurate. I think it’s unfortunate that people seem to ignore the science of political science from the perspective of describing ideologies or social/eco systems. People think it is a matter of personal opinion or perspective when it’s not. That allows the talking heads on Fox to spout their nonsense which itself feeds into this mistake. I have a conservative uncle who tells me Ireland is a socialist country, the EU is socialist etc. I pointed out why this not true. He first said “well to me it is,” which is utterly illogical as it’s not about oneself (anymore than I could say “you might call toast toast but to me it’s a banana”). The next day he texted me “correcting himself” by quoting Wikipedia and saying Ireland in fact is a social democracy. I said I wish!
I have rambled a bit here so back on track, when I see people say to Americans Bernie is a socialist, I find that annoying. “Well, they’re wrong if they think that” isn’t particularly satisfying an answer, and most people who say it disparagingly at least tend to not be interested in learning why it’s not accurate.
@Carolina Red would appreciate your thoughts on the more ‘academic’ stuff
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