We simply do not score goals at crucial periods. Every game becomes a struggle because we simply can't out teams away. That's why I can't see any form of a winning run.
Top 4 race 2016/17
- Thread starter Yorkeontop
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran are here to talk about a frustrating 2 points dropped at Crystal Palace. They then discuss the regeneration of Old Trafford. Finally, Nik is joined by special guest Michael Statham from the Football Oranje podcast - who gives us a more in depth look at our EL opposition FC Twente, and then runs through the (many) Dutch connections currently at United.
The worst thing about today is that Liverpool dropped points, and 1 of Spurs or City at the least is going to drop points. We don't fecking capitalise ffs. Stoke should be a formality and it would've been if we could actually finish.
Really nice run of games coming up, if we aren't in the top 4 at the end of them then I'll be worried, until then I think we'll make it comfortably, we are playing well.
5th or 6th, the 4th place is a bit utopic now
Too many squads above
Too many squads above
I think if there's any hint of us staying in the title race, Poch will prioritise the league big time (as he did last season).
Tbh, until the end of April.....our fixtures are looking very nice after today.
We have Sunderland away, Boro at home, Liverpool away, Stoke at home, Everton at home, Palace away, Saints at home, Burnley away, Swansea away, Watford and Boro at home and Leicester away.
We have Hull away last game.....but the three games sandwiched inbetween that run and Hull is....Arsenal at home, West Ham away, Man Utd home. A stinker of a run, especially if we're in the EL still.
I still think you guys are not at all out of the CL places via the league tbh. We've all gone through one bad run or another during the season, no reason why a team above you won't do the same in the upcoming weeks.
Things change very very quickly in football....
Let's see how the Spurs - City game pans out. We still have a good run of games coming up, and if we can put another winning sequence together, I think we will look back on a stoppage time draw against Stoke as a good point.
That's not really an answer to my post. I used to say that the league never lies, in response to people who told me that Fergie's Utd team (in its latter years before his retirement) wasnt that good). I still believe this, teams generally finish where they deserve (outside freak seasons like last year), and where their quality takes them. 38 games means there's too many for fluke finishes to happen regularly. Why do you think we've finished 7th, 4th, 5th, and now looking down the barrel at another 4 to 6th finish? Are we really that good?
That's exactly what I'm saying. Form isn't a permanent construct - it changes, sometimes radically over relatively short periods. 16 games is a long time for form to change (probably more than once) for any of the top 6 clubs.
If our finishing continues to be as bad as it has been recently then we aren't going to make top 4. Which is extremely frustrating as IMO we are the best team in the league.......other than at finishing.
We have a terrible record at Stoke so as shit as it feels right now it may not be a bad point in the grand scheme of things. It's still the dropped points at home that have put us where we are.
We will finish 5th or 6th. Not convinced by Mourinho, making too many errors
The season is only about 60% complete so there's really not rational basis to conclude we are going to finish where we are today. Some times (like last year) all the big clubs have off years, sometimes (like this one) they are all in it at the top of the table. There are too many variables at work to conclude we are not that good
I hope you or Chelsea win the league. Only Ok options left.
Problem with us will be that with EL coming up, Jose can't afford to rest players as at the moment we look to be out of top 4 and our fixtures after round 28 are horrible. There's no way any team can cope with that without dropping points and we can't drop too much more at all. We need two teams to lose points + need to finish ahead of them, same amount won't do because of our GD.
Absolutely bottling the opportunity to get ourself within a hair's breadth of top 4 two weeks in a row.
Looks like we're still mentally as fragile as we've been since Fergie left. Truly depressing.
Looks like we're still mentally as fragile as we've been since Fergie left. Truly depressing.
A draw today would be delightful.
We should prioritize the Europa League and that's been my view for a long time now. The simple fact is that it looks much easier to win that tournament given the teams in it than finishing above two of Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, City and Spurs.
We won't get top 4 when we can't finish our chances.
With respect, I still dont think that addresses the point im making. There is a rational basis - we have the worst chance conversion in the top 6, the lowest goals, and the only team relying on two 35 year olds. There arent too many variables - forget about other teams' performance, we were average last year when (as you note) the other big teams were crap, and we still havent really moved on from that; our average finish over the last 3 years is 5th, so there is a definite reason to conclude that we'll finish thereabouts. Remember, even under LVG we had runs of 5-6 wins, before going on a winless streak.
We did the damage to ourselves in the awful 11 game run from September to December where we only won twice.
The way we have played since has been great but we're having to play as though we're in a title race to try and make up all that lost ground. Draws to Liverpool and Stoke are not terrible results in the grand scheme of things.
Since the early terrible run the gap has come down from 9 to at worst 4 and at best 3 after this weekend, although we'd probably like it to be 4 with a City win or draw as that would keep the teams above nicely bunched up.
The way we have played since has been great but we're having to play as though we're in a title race to try and make up all that lost ground. Draws to Liverpool and Stoke are not terrible results in the grand scheme of things.
Since the early terrible run the gap has come down from 9 to at worst 4 and at best 3 after this weekend, although we'd probably like it to be 4 with a City win or draw as that would keep the teams above nicely bunched up.
some of you lot need a good talking to. we have gained a point Liverpool and will have either gained a point on one of city or spurs or if it draws at least neither have extended their lead on us. it's a long season and plenty more games to play.
What does Ibra and Carrick being 35 have to do with anything ? It seems you're ignoring their contributions by casually dismissing them by age. Zlatan just scored 50 goals last year and is on par with the league's best strikers this season. Carrick is also in fine form so I think we can safely dismiss their ages as credible variables to assess our play. We need more goals from midfield, so perhaps you can have a look at the likes of Pogba, Herrera, Mkhi and others.
Arsenal will win tomorrow
A Spurs win would make the draw seem better for us.
It's liverpool who should be kicking themselves tonight, not us.
It's liverpool who should be kicking themselves tonight, not us.
Arsenal will probably win tomorrow so we'll be 4 points behind 4th.
How is today on Mourinho? We missed way too many chances again, he can't score the goals for us. 2nd half we went for it again bringing on only attack minded players, one replacing our DM.
Yep.
At the start of today if someone said 1 point closer to Pool we would have taken it.
They look like they are bottling it and they have chelsea next.
so a draw between city and spurs suits us best ?
long term yes, as you never know where both will finish on points.
My gut feeling right now is we won't make the top 4. Our finishing is terrible and I just think too often have we had the chance to take advantage of a rival fecking up and we never do it.
We're still in the race though so you never know. And there's always the winning the Europa League possibility too.
We're still in the race though so you never know. And there's always the winning the Europa League possibility too.
How is that bad? Surely it's a good thing.
I didn't mean it's bad that they dropped points, I meant it's bad that they dropped points and we didn't make the most of the opportunity. Okay at least we drew and gained a point on Liverpool and co, but really it should be all 3.
Well yeah of course, but all things considered, when we calm down after this bad result it won't seem as such a disaster.
It's not a disaster, but it's a big wasted opportunity. It's not like previous games at Stoke in years gone by. We dominated them fully and we ourselves dropped the other 2 points. On reflection of the way the game played out, it's a big miss. We still have big teams to go play yet. We need to put these teams away to give ourselves some leeway against the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs and City; the latter 3 of which we go away to.
Sure but we have done alot lately to amend for our mistakes this season, taking 20 from 24 points since december. This is just one of those games that have to happen sooner or later. You can't expect to win every single game.
It's not just 'one of those games though' is it? Nor does it have to happen. In fact it has happened way too many times, to just be 'one of those days'. It actually happened vs Stoke at home in the reverse fixture. The pattern of the game has usually been the same, us failing to finish our myriad of chances and one or two players choosing to have absolutely stinkers costing us.
I don't doubt we're making progress, but we are plateauing due to our poor finishing which hasn't improved. Even during our winning run we were usually scoring no more than 2 goals, whilst maybe conceding 1. All while creating a host of chances. It was fine then when we were winning, but we need to be better now. I'm not expecting to win every game and I implied so in my last post. Wins in games like today, would give us a bigger cushion against the top teams when we go to play them. If the team drastically improves the conversion rate, the scenario will equally change drastically.
I think he'd be happy with Liverpool dropping points because he's a Chelsea fan.How you doing mate
In fairness, I don't think anyone thought Pool would lose today!
v Chelsea, a chance, but Swansea? At home? Incredible scenes
Well, if City hold on today, there's 3 teams just 4 points ahead of us.
Our run ahead is pretty favourable. People said that pre Stoke, but I think they'd somehow forgotten Stoke away hasn't been a given for a decade.
Losing today would have been a huge draw. Equalising in that fashion can spur us on.