Why do we sign so many limited players?

El Jefe

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Dec 28, 2012
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This isn’t a thread to shit on our players as we have many of those already. I just find it a bit shocking how we have signed so many players who need specific roles in teams to be successful because of their limitations.

There are players that can play in many different systems and are adaptable to multiple styles of play. We seem to sign players who were good at their previous clubs in specific tactical roles and bring them over to do something they are totally unsuited to doing.


Mount - He was a system player at Chelsea who received the ball in half spaces on the turn to make quick passes and movement. We signed him with the intention of playing him as a CM alongside Bruno. He also played on the wing a lot for Chelsea, he’s almost exclusively played as a 10 or CM here.

Casemiro - One of the best DMs of all time and was known for playing in midfield trio who were close together with the role of winning the ball aggressively and passing to more creative CMs for buildup. Joins us and we ask him to cover large spaces on his own in midfield and become a playmaker from deep. While he’s shown more to his game here it makes all the sense in the world why Madrid limited his role on the ball.

Zirkzee - This is possibly the worst of them all because almost everyone highlighted it. A false 9 that is being played as a number 9 in a team that has been consistently goal shy. I watched a detailed video of his time at Bologna and he was so deep in most of the reel with up to three or four players being ahead of him at times. We are playing him as the further up than he’s used to and relying on him to be a goal scorer when he isn’t that.

Ugarte - A box to box energetic tough tackling midfielder who is now being asked to perform the role of DM and receiving the ball in front of the back four. He’s a player whose own manager in his last club had zero trust in his ability on the ball and we are asking him to receive and distribute the ball in such a dangerous position.

Every team signs players that suit their system but we seem to be signing system players that don’t fit our system.

Are there any other players in our team that fall into this category?
 
I've thought it for a long time. The speed and physicality of signings should be a bare minimum.

Zirkzee looks slow, Ugarte looks slow, De Ligt looks slow.

We ended the game with Casemiro and Eriksen in central midfield again.

Mainoo and Fernandes going deeper in the Euros could explain why they don't look anywhere near fit enough yet this season. But Spurs looked sharper all over the pitch.

3 centre backs of Van De Venn, Romero and Dragusin shows how good their recruitment has been. Udogie and Porro are good athletes too. They ate up Garnacho, Zirkzee and Hojlund today. Only Rashford showed some ability to run in behind today.

Ugarte and Mainoo were passengers in midfield. It's not just Ten Hag that has to answer questions on recruitment any more.
 
Hojlund, one dimensional runner into space behind, not much ability with back to goal.

AWB, a savant at slide tackles, mediocre all round game.

Licha, super footballer, but slow and non existent in the air.
 
Our recruitment has been a disaster for well over a decade. We just constantly buy players, for huge money, with major fundamental flaws.

Sadly it doesn’t look to be getting any better under the new regime. No matter how much PR
work they’ve done to try and convince us all this is a new era with better structure.

So far they’ve brought a defender who can’t run to partner our other defender who can’t run, a midfielder who can’t pass and a striker who can’t score. Absolute genius that.
 
Yeah I've pointed this out for years. It's baffling. I'd include Bruno in that list of limited signings. Our scouts rejected him in the summer of 2019 for being sloppy in possession but we signed him anyway. It's forgiveable if he was always played as a forward, since he's so clearly not a midfielder due to his various limitations. It was funny seeing Sporting fans having an argument about where he played for them the other day on Reddit. One was convinced he got 50 goal contributions in a season from midfield and some other Sporting fan corrected him saying he was playing basically just behind Bas Dost. The same talks about exactly where he plays continue for us. All I know is he's not an 8, yet he regularly plays there?
 
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Because players aren't perfect, and poor managers expose their weaknesses while great ones mask them.

I'd bet you, if Haaland was here - his lack of all-round would be made into a massive issue. If Kane was here, his lack of pace would've been a massive issue. Trent's poor defensive work would be far more heavily criticised. Even prime Lionel Messi would've been a problem here for his lack of pressing, size or whatever else people think he lacks.

Perfect players don't exist. That's why managers and coaches exist. To magnify a players strengths, hide their weaknesses and make the collective perform better than the sum of its parts.

I feel like people here treat managers like artists or architects who should be given the tools to deliver an art piece. The best managers in the world are pragmatic engineers who make things work with what they have.
 
El Jefe said:
Every team signs players that suit their system but we seem to be signing system players that don’t fit our system.
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Do we have a system? I think if we had something identifiable in place, it would be a lot easier to make successful transfers.
 
Yeah I think the same. When you add something to this team with a player with certain qualities you seem to subtract something important as well. I actually think this squad has a lot of talent and potential in it but it's still all over the place in terms of coherence and I'm not sure anyone knows what the best first eleven is.

We seem to have 4 players that look at their best when dropping into the 10 role (Mount, Bruno, Eriksen, Zirkzee,) , some good centre backs but none of them aside from Yoro are particularly quick, only two midfielders that are good at playing a possession game, a centre forward who looks a bit technically limited.
 
No Love said:
Do we have a system? I think if we had something identifiable in place, it would be a lot easier to make successful transfers.
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As shite as it is we do have a system. We’re the type of team that needs a CB like Van der Ven or a midfielder like Rice because of all the gaps we leave across the pitch.

You are right though because our system is so suicidal that the players needed to make it work are so rare.
 
Every player has limitations not just United players, the problem with us is that our current system just exasperates our player’s weaknesses.
 
The worst thing is that all of those players would flourish at other big teams while their players would flop. It has to be the manager. Ten Hag is dumber than a fecking Afghan hound.
 
Our scouting is bang average and our manager cannot seem to develop any of these players.
 
Spurs also have very limited players. Difference today was at least their 1-dimensional players were good at one thing they were supposed to be good at.
 
Funnily enough, Mazraoui has actually looked decent, and he's one of the cheaper players we've signed over the years.
 
CloneMC16 said:
Funnily enough, Mazraoui has actually looked decent, and he's one of the cheaper players we've signed over the years.
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Same with Eriksen, free transfer and done as well as many 50m+ players. Blind was also quite good for a while for less than 15m.
 
El Jefe said:
As shite as it is we do have a system. We’re the type of team that needs a CB like Van der Ven or a midfielder like Rice because of all the gaps we leave across the pitch.

You are right though because our system is so suicidal that the players needed to make it work are so rare.
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I hear you. For me, when I watch Utd I can’t see a system. Now, can I see a shape? Yes, of course. As we all know though, a shape and a system are two completely different things. Sadly, I can’t say I can see a truly defined system. It all just feels too haphazard, hopeful and disorganised for me to hang my hat on it.

It sounds obvious - and I’m not outlining anything that pretty much all of us know already - but if we could get something in place that we could confidently call a system, we would see an improvement in relation to some of the current players and prospective signings proving successful down the line.
 
Skills said:
Because players aren't perfect, and poor managers expose their weaknesses while great ones mask them.

I'd bet you, if Haaland was here - his lack of all-round would be made into a massive issue. If Kane was here, his lack of pace would've been a massive issue. Trent's poor defensive work would be far more heavily criticised. Even prime Lionel Messi would've been a problem here for his lack of pressing, size or whatever else people think he lacks.

Perfect players don't exist. That's why managers and coaches exist. To magnify a players strengths, hide their weaknesses and make the collective perform better than the sum of its parts.

I feel like people here treat managers like artists or architects who should be given the tools to deliver an art piece. The best managers in the world are pragmatic engineers who make things work with what they have.
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Amen.

It is understandable to be venting after a game and result like that of today. And the regime have provided more than enough material to be mad about. But as you say - the perfect players aren't out there - they get perfect when used correctly. Judging Mount is strange, given he was out most of last year. This year he played only when we didn't have a striker available. It is fine to call im injury prone, but I think it is a bit dodgy to act as if we could known for which role he has been picked. Same applies to Zirkzee - he is 20 ffs and made 3 matches in an overall rather dysfunctional team. The new players aren't worse fits than the ones before, there is no point making differences between them. ETH doesn't do a good job providing a stable system for players to flourish in - but at the same time some players really don't give him anything to work with - at least as long as we don't assume that he instructs players to lose battles all over the pitch, misplace passes, losing their heads.
 
Zirskee, Mount and Antony have ETH influence all over them. All three of them either weren't needed or aren't at the level required to play for Manchester United.

If you throw in the question marks over Ugarte and Hojlund you've got a hell of a lot of money wasted.

Zirskee in particular doesn't look nowhere near the level required to play for a top club, the odd flick and one touch isn't going to fool the paying fan. He isn't mobile enough, he doesn't move to create space for himself and to be honest at times I've noticed he's pretty lazy around the field as well. I honestly don't see a place for him in our side whatever role he plays I can just tell his miles out of his depth.
 
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