Victor Gyökeres

Cloud7 said:
Sometimes I genuinely feel like I’m watching a different Hojlund to the one that people post about on here. The one on the caf is one hell of a player
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yup, true. Hojlund was exciting for exactly one game and that was his first cameo against Arsenal and just because we were comparing him to a Martial that didn‘t want to be on the pitch. He‘s a terrible striker, his hold up play is horrific and he‘s nowhere near the level that we should aim for if we want to be anywhere near a title soon.
 
Cloud7 said:
Sometimes I genuinely feel like I’m watching a different Hojlund to the one that people post about on here. The one on the caf is one hell of a player
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Same here. I don’t get the hype.

I really hope he comes good because he seems like a good lad and puts hard work on the pitch. Right now he is not looking like what we thought of him when we signed him.
 
Red the Bear said:
Wasn't one condition of amorim's signing be him have less control over our transfer strategy compared to the bygone?

Sure, he may have promised to not raid his former club but is it his call to make to begin with ? It's a shity thing to do but he should technically have plausible deniability in case of such an outcome.
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The clubs probably have a gentleman’s agreement to abide by it.

We’ve a pretty good relationship with Sporting, I don’t think we’ll want to break the relationship when they’re one of the few clubs that don’t try to screw us for every penny.
 
croadyman said:
Who should we sign to lead line?
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I don’t watch nearly enough football outside of United these days to answer that question. If there was an Aguero or Rooney type out there, them perhaps? If you’re asking about qualifies, then I would say someone with very good acceleration, able to use their body well, has good movement and is able to at least do something on their own.

At this point in time, Hojlund does not have good acceleration, does not use his body well, does not have good movement and doesn’t really do anything on his own. Like for example in the Newcastle match, there was a moment sometime in the first half where Isak picked up the ball somewhere near our RB position, and he started running infield, feinted past two of our defenders and then got a shot off. The shot didn’t come to anything, but something as basic as that is not too much to expect from the striker leading the line for us, I don’t think?

And my post wasn’t meant to be about who we should sign anyway, just that people post a lot of things that see in Hojlund that I do not see in the slightest.
 
AlexUTD said:
Are you serious?
Højlund would run circles around Delap .
Delaps top speed is 28 km/h and Højlunds is 35 km/h.
Højlund has a much higher ceiling than Delap and is a complete forward. How you cab say he is very limited compared to Delap is just mind boggling.
The guy just need some fecking service infront of goal.
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I was not talking about speed, but his hold up and other aspects are much better..Hojlund just backs off I to people and falls down currently. All strikers need service but Haaland and Hojlund types need to more than the Gyokeres/Delap types who get more involved in the play.
 
elmo said:
The clubs probably have a gentleman’s agreement to abide by it.

We’ve a pretty good relationship with Sporting, I don’t think we’ll want to break the relationship when they’re one of the few clubs that don’t try to screw us for every penny.
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A fair argument, better to maintain our warm relationship.
 
croadyman said:
So you don't think we need another striker?
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Of course, we need 2 good strikers. Zirkzee is not a 9.
Joseunited said:
Bit if a disservice to Drlap there.Have you watched him?He knows how to lead the line even in yhat Ipswich team.He can hold the ball up meaning he actually has good control of the ball,is good at running with it.Has 7 in the league
At the moment Hojlund cannot bring others into play because he's not leading the line,at all so he'll never get any fecking service.
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gulli_G said:
I was not talking about speed, but his hold up and other aspects are much better..Hojlund just backs off I to people and falls down currently. All strikers need service but Haaland and Hojlund types need to more than the Gyokeres/Delap types who get more involved in the play.
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Delap is neither particulary quick and is one of the worst passers of the ball in the league with 58% pass completion rate. He would fail at a big club.

Højlunds hold up play is better than you guys give him credit for and he can bring in others into play with smart flicks of the ball, that is not something ive seen Delap do.

Something i see Delap do, is to get into stupid altercations with the other teams players every match, seems like a massive cnut to be honest.
 
AlexUTD said:
Of course, we need 2 good strikers. Zirkzee is not a 9.


Delap is neither particulary quick and is one of the worst passers of the ball in the league with 58% pass completion rate. He would fail at a big club.

Højlunds hold up play is better than you guys give him credit for and he can bring in others into play with smart flicks of the ball, that is not something ive seen Delap do.

Something i see Delap do, is to get into stupid altercations with the other teams players every match, seems like a massive cnut to be honest.
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I don't think so.
 
TheRedDevil2019 said:
Won't make any difference what so ever.

I'm happy to eat humble pie if proven wrong.

However, whilst the rest of the side functions about as good as a game on FC 25 with a ping of 150ms

Gyökeres won't offer anything different besides being more clinical from the very generous 2 chances a game he'll get( that's on a good day!!)

Hojlund presses, is quick, has sound movement off the ball and feeds off scrapes. I'd focus on other areas personally.
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Gyokeres doesn’t just offer being more clinical than Hojlund, he would also offer better hold up play and far better physicality than Hojlund, which aspects we’re missing right now. Hojlund is still getting outmuscled easily by PL defenders which ruins the attacking transition.

Gyokeres plays like a complete striker in Amorim’s system. He made 10 league assists last season. So his contribution wasn’t just scoring goals but also create chances for others, can hold the ball due to his strength and balance, and can play link up play. At the moment Hojlund is struggling to do all of these in PL.
 
Not much help for us now, and we obviously need a new striker, but players of his «ilk» usually come good around 25. Very few target men make it at the highest level before 25.

We have the extreme examples of players like Drogba and Gyokeres who went from quite low levels to world class within a span of two seasons. But also players like Ivan Toney and Roberto Firmino who very few talked about at 22 or even 23. The most talented target man of this century IMO played at Ajax at 23. Lewandowski, whos game was a bit different at a younger age, played in Poland at Hojlunds age.

I’m not trying to argue that Hojlund will follow a similar path, but that it was probably a mistake getting him at this point.
 
andersj said:
Not much help for us now, and we obviously need a new striker, but players of his «ilk» usually come good around 25. Very few target men make it at the highest level before 25.

We have the extreme examples of players like Drogba and Gyokeres who went from quite low levels to world class within a span of two seasons. But also players like Ivan Toney and Roberto Firmino who very few talked about at 22 or even 23. The most talented target man of this century IMO played at Ajax at 23. Lewandowski, whos game was a bit different at a younger age, played in Poland at Hojlunds age.

I’m not trying to argue that Hojlund will follow a similar path, but that it was probably a mistake getting him at this point.
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Target man?

Højlund was billed as a smart, evasive player who used his speed and smarts to get clear of defenders. He never shows those traits for us, and even with his NT, he is preoccupied with the wrong things.

His career trajectory didn’t have him work toward being a target man, so I am surprised you say that.
 
Fortitude said:
Target man?

Højlund was billed as a smart, evasive player who used his speed and smarts to get clear of defenders. He never shows those traits for us, and even with his NT, he is preoccupied with the wrong things.

His career trajectory didn’t have him work toward being a target man, so I am surprised you say that.
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By who?

Basically everyone who knew him well said his movement were an area for improvement. There where made a superficial comparision to Haaland by media, but former coaches (from people at Copenhagen to Gasperini) said that his movement in and around the box needed to improve.
 
andersj said:
By who?

Basically everyone who knew him well said his movement were an area for improvement. There where made a superficial comparision to Haaland by media, but former coaches (from people at Copenhagen to Gasperini) said that his movement in and around the box needed to improve.
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Yeah but he has never billed as a target man, now or in the future. And in answer to your question: that was the billing coming from Italy and what he was in the Atalanta team to do. Never once seen or heard of him as a target man.
 
Fortitude said:
Yeah but he has never billed as a target man, now or in the future. And in answer to your question: that was the billing coming from Italy and what he was in the Atalanta team to do. Never once seen or heard of him as a target man.
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Ok. I’ve never, ever heard anyone describe him the way you did either. The billing coming from Italy? Gasperini litteraly said this was where he had to improve.
 
andersj said:
Ok. I’ve never, ever heard anyone describe him the way you did either. The billing coming from Italy? Gasperini litteraly said this was where he had to improve.
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Well that would be worrying because he is an awful target man. And I don’t use awful lightly. He literally looks like someone being forced to play the role, not someone working towards expertise at it.
 
Even a Gyokeres scoring 50% of this goals (circa 30), puts him in the top PL striker territory.
 
@andersj @Fortitude Hojlund was a high motor speed demon with great size, great shot off both feet, and a willingness to play for his teammates. A workhorse

He wasn't a target man, and yes, he did need to improve in his movement, but that's not to say his movement was bad. Part of it was also just figuring out when to play for a teammate and when to play for hinself
 
AlexUTD said:
Højlunds hold up play is better than you guys give him credit for and he can bring in others into play with smart flicks of the ball, that is not something ive seen Delap do.
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The issue with Hojlund's hold up play is that it's incredibly inconsistent. Occasionally he'll have a random match where he's very good at it, but most of the time he's decidedly poor and is so focused on physically battling with the defender that he makes it easy for the defender to win the ball.

The fact he does have the occasional match where he's very good at it does give hope that in the future it'll become a strong part of his game. But it's certainly not yet.
 
giorno said:
@andersj @Fortitude Hojlund was a high motor speed demon with great size, great shot off both feet, and a willingness to play for his teammates. A workhorse

He wasn't a target man, and yes, he did need to improve in his movement, but that's not to say his movement was bad. Part of it was also just figuring out when to play for a teammate and when to play for hinself
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Yeah, that’s what I got from his transfer thread, more a mover with pace than a target man, for sure.
 
I wanna know what happened to the version of Hojlund we saw against Brentford a few months back.

The one that rather than tussling with defenders and getting nowhere for 90 mins, was coming slightly deeper, dragging defenders out of line and caused havoc with his flicks and turns.



He seemed full of confidence that day but hasn’t been able to build on that evidently. Maybe it’s to do with Amorim’s system in terms of where he wants his striker to be and to move, but admittedly we also weren’t seeing this version of Hojlund much before either.
 
giorno said:
@andersj @Fortitude Hojlund was a high motor speed demon with great size, great shot off both feet, and a willingness to play for his teammates. A workhorse

He wasn't a target man, and yes, he did need to improve in his movement, but that's not to say his movement was bad. Part of it was also just figuring out when to play for a teammate and when to play for hinself
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I think if you ask anyone who saw Gyokeres
at Brommapokkarna they would have said that this was his game too at 19. But he was not even close to Serie A (like Hojlund) at that stage. Even Allsvenskan clubs showed very little interest in him.

And at 22, the same age as Hojlund today, he was so bad only the worst teams in Championship showed any interest in him. Swansea quickly he gave up on him. He was so bad that Brighton had no problems selling him for nothing to Coventry. I think his hold up play have developed a lot at Sporting. I’m not sure it will be good enough in the PL, but his other attributes probably will.

I think this trajectory is the case for several players like Gyokeres. Drogba became a much better target man during his time at Chelsea. Even Lukaku, with all his limitations, is way better today than at Man Utd in this part of his game.
 
MadDogg said:
The issue with Hojlund's hold up play is that it's incredibly inconsistent. Occasionally he'll have a random match where he's very good at it, but most of the time he's decidedly poor and is so focused on physically battling with the defender that he makes it easy for the defender to win the ball.

The fact he does have the occasional match where he's very good at it does give hope that in the future it'll become a strong part of his game. But it's certainly not yet.
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I agree on the inconsistent part.
Not always easy for young players to be consistent, especially in a twam where even the senior players also lack consistancy and fail to help and lead the way and when the team do not click i think the burden weighs en heavier on them.
 
daba said:
I wanna know what happened to the version of Hojlund we saw against Brentford a few months back.

The one that rather than tussling with defenders and getting nowhere for 90 mins, was coming slightly deeper, dragging defenders out of line and caused havoc with his flicks and turns.



He seemed full of confidence that day but hasn’t been able to build on that evidently. Maybe it’s to do with Amorim’s system in terms of where he wants his striker to be and to move, but admittedly we also weren’t seeing this version of Hojlund much before either.
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Spot on mate. I wondered the exact same thing following that game. Bizarre he showed it then and never since.
 
Fortitude said:
Target man?

Højlund was billed as a smart, evasive player who used his speed and smarts to get clear of defenders. He never shows those traits for us, and even with his NT, he is preoccupied with the wrong things.

His career trajectory didn’t have him work toward being a target man, so I am surprised you say that.
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I've never heard this before.
 
I don't normally go on YouTube highlights but I did watch a lot of his goals and what I liked was he doesn't over think anything he just plays of instinct and bang it's in. May not work for us as many haven't but I can't see why he wouldn't.
 
TheRedDevil2019 said:
Won't make any difference what so ever.

I'm happy to eat humble pie if proven wrong.

However, whilst the rest of the side functions about as good as a game on FC 25 with a ping of 150ms

Gyökeres won't offer anything different besides being more clinical from the very generous 2 chances a game he'll get( that's on a good day!!)

Hojlund presses, is quick, has sound movement off the ball and feeds off scrapes. I'd focus on other areas personally.
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Hopefully this idea a better striker wouldn’t make any differences dies a death after that first half
 
I missed this thread being bumped when Gyokeres went silent for 4 or 5 games in the portuguese league in the last 2 months
 
Amorim will certainly push for him. He was the most outstanding player in Amorims system and Amorim is very particular about his system!
 
Zed is not dead said:
I missed this thread being bumped when Gyokeres went silent for 4 or 5 games in the portuguese league in the last 2 months
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He never went silent for 4 or 5 games. His longest games without a goal was 3 games. 1 game was during Amorim’s last game, and only 2 games after Amorim left, which was against arsenal & Santa Clara. Since then, he had 6 goals and 1 assist in 7 games.
 
Zed is not dead said:
I missed this thread being bumped when Gyokeres went silent for 4 or 5 games in the portuguese league in the last 2 months
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First, its not true. The thread has always been bumped on a fairly regular basis. Second, what's your point ? Its clear we need a striker and so why wouldn't we discuss an inform striker in the transfer forum
 
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