Trent Alexander Arnold

Put it this way: if he'd been playing for us all these years, with that level of performance and impact, the discourse around him would be "is he going to be the greatest right back ever" vs "is he already the greatest right back ever"

At Liverpool, it's "but he can't defend"

Disagree on him being a much lesser Marcelo, too. Think he's at that level
Yeah, the way he plays and what he does will have a spotlight of its own at Real whilst in the UK it's kinda, sorta acknowledged, but not really. I don't think he has the ability of a Dani Alves to elevate as some all-encompassing force, but I do think his every constructive action will be dissected and celebrated in a way he simply won't get in England. He is actually taken for granted here and the emphasis is most certainly on what he can't do rather than what he can.

Full-back is not a lauded position here, certainly not like how it is elsewhere on the continent and in South America, anyway.

Being on Marcelo's level, well, that's a bigger call than I would make. He's got to make more of a mark on the game outside of "just" passing for that to be true, for me also. All the greatest CB's are known for a plethora of attributes, and Trent doesn't have that at the moment. Marcelo combining with others and taking the p* as a FB puts him in very esteemed company.
 
I see there's scouse cnuts cribbing on twitter that Bellingham was tapping him up. :lol:

This would be fans of the same Liverpool who got caught tapping up Van Dijk and had to publically apologise and say they wouldn't sign him that summer
 
I see there's scouse cnuts cribbing on twitter that Bellingham was tapping him up. :lol:

This would be fans of the same Liverpool who got caught tapping up Van Dijk and had to publically apologise and say they wouldn't sign him that summer
The same Bellingham that Henderson was attempting to tap up for Liverpool. Good stuff.
 
Put it this way: if he'd been playing for us all these years, with that level of performance and impact, the discourse around him would be "is he going to be the greatest right back ever" vs "is he already the greatest right back ever"

At Liverpool, it's "but he can't defend"

Disagree on him being a much lesser Marcelo, too. Think he's at that level
Nah. He can't defend. A Marcelo could. He also hasn't been coached to improve his defending to be fair to him. Yet in the right team set up with protection behind and in front of him. It matters not at all. For he is unrivalled as a deep lying playmaking attacking asset from the right. Others in tje role tend to be like wingers. He is as creative as a natural 10 playing that deep. Its a unique profile in football history honestly.
 
Nah. He can't defend. A Marcelo could. He also hasn't been coached to improve his defending to be fair to him. Yet in the right team set up with protection behind and in front of him. It matters not at all. For he is unrivalled as a deep lying playmaking attacking asset from the right. Others in tje role tend to be like wingers. He is as creative as a natural 10 playing that deep. Its a unique profile in football history honestly.
Marcelo absolutely could not defend. Alexander-Arnold is a better defender than Marcelo was. Not only that, he also generally didn't particularly bother to in the first place. It mattered, at times, particularly with Mourinho, before he took his attacking game to a level were defending was simply no longer asked of him. Because he was the main attacking playmaker on a team that won 3 CL in a row. Just like TAA has been Liverpool's main playmaker for the past 8 years
 
Marcelo absolutely could not defend. Alexander-Arnold is a better defender than Marcelo was. Not only that, he also generally didn't particularly bother to in the first place. It mattered, at times, particularly with Mourinho, before he took his attacking game to a level were defending was simply no longer asked of him. Because he was the main attacking playmaker on a team that won 3 CL in a row. Just like TAA has been Liverpool's main playmaker for the past 8 years
Through out his entire career Marcelo at Real Madrid played his flank with zero defensive protection infront of him. Whilst expected to run the entire flank himself because the attacking player ahead of him was constantly cutting. That is how the myth of 'he can't defend' grew. Because he'd inevitable get caught upfield or out of position due to all the attacking he had to do and had to rely in sheer recovery pace to survive. TAA in comparison has always had protection. Yet he has still been piss poor defensively. There is no comparison.
 
Liverpool have a player in waiting who is a much more all rounded FB. Bradley will take to it like a duck to water. Good going forward and in defence.

He won’t bring TAA crosses or free kicks, but who would?

I think he’s nailed on to leave. RM don’t make bids unless they are confident. TAA has already said that he’s been there 20 years and would like a new challenge
 
Marcelo absolutely could not defend. Alexander-Arnold is a better defender than Marcelo was. Not only that, he also generally didn't particularly bother to in the first place. It mattered, at times, particularly with Mourinho, before he took his attacking game to a level were defending was simply no longer asked of him. Because he was the main attacking playmaker on a team that won 3 CL in a row. Just like TAA has been Liverpool's main playmaker for the past 8 years
VVD has been Liverpool’s playmaker during that period. He’s far more central and important to their passing system than TAA has ever been. TAA has a world class delivery and that’s where it ends really. He doesn’t have any sort of intuition for controlling tempo and the limitations of his passing become more and more evident the more central he tries to play.

It’s daft to suggest a player that’s passing is limited to the game being played in front of him is in some way their “main playmaker”
 
Through out his entire career Marcelo at Real Madrid played his flank with zero defensive protection infront of him. Whilst expected to run the entire flank himself because the attacking player ahead of him was constantly cutting. That is how the myth of 'he can't defend' grew. Because he'd inevitable get caught upfield or out of position due to all the attacking he had to do and had to rely in sheer recovery pace to survive. TAA in comparison has always had protection. Yet he has still been piss poor defensively. There is no comparison.
Throughout his entire time at Real Madrid, our opponents attacked down his flank because he'd be nowhere the action. When it comes to 1vs1 duels, he'd get flattened by Philip fecking Lahm. His sense of positioning was nonexistent. He absolutely, 100% was not a defender, at all. It is not a myth, he really couldn't defend

And he had as much cover behind him as TAA. Sergio Ramos was a beast, and so was Casemiro. Those 2 essentially had to carry our defence on their shoulders by themselves, with Keylor Navas' help
 
VVD has been Liverpool’s playmaker during that period. He’s far more central and important to their passing system than TAA has ever been. TAA has a world class delivery and that’s where it ends really. He doesn’t have any sort of intuition for controlling tempo and the limitations of his passing become more and more evident the more central he tries to play.

It’s daft to suggest a player that’s passing is limited to the game being played in front of him is in some way their “main playmaker”
He's been their main chance creator for years. The "attacking" part was implied
 
He's been their main chance creator for years. The "attacking" part was implied
Only he hasn’t? Salah is lightyears ahead of him for that. He’s currently 13th in EPL assists this season with 4.

Last season he was Liverpool’s 7th highest assister with 4.

The season before he was 2nd behind Salah and the same the season before that.
 
Only he hasn’t? Salah is lightyears ahead of him for that. He’s currently 13th in EPL assists this season with 4.

Last season he was Liverpool’s 7th highest assister with 4.

The season before he was 2nd behind Salah and the same the season before that.

No hes not, there are other measures to judge creativity apart from assists and TAA ranks highly in all of them, Salah isn’t light years ahead of him creatively, there isnt a single player in the PL who is and you have about 5 years + of data that argues this, as well as the eye test.
 
Put it this way: if he'd been playing for us all these years, with that level of performance and impact, the discourse around him would be "is he going to be the greatest right back ever" vs "is he already the greatest right back ever"

At Liverpool, it's "but he can't defend"

Disagree on him being a much lesser Marcelo, too. Think he's at that level

Right the hype or Marcelo compared to Trent is a good reason why someone would say he’d be making a good decision for his career to go to Madrid, you’ve got people arguing against you a Madrid fan that Marcelo was a good defender, what Barca and Madrid do for a players profile no other club in the world can do for them.
 
VVD has been Liverpool’s playmaker during that period. He’s far more central and important to their passing system than TAA has ever been. TAA has a world class delivery and that’s where it ends really. He doesn’t have any sort of intuition for controlling tempo and the limitations of his passing become more and more evident the more central he tries to play.

It’s daft to suggest a player that’s passing is limited to the game being played in front of him is in some way their “main playmaker”
Key passes for game, Trent Alexander Arnold:

24/25 - 10th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
23/24 - 8th in the league (2nd at Liverpool behind Robertson)
22/23 - 11th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
21/22 - 2nd in the league (1st at Liverpool)
20/21 - 6th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
19/20 - 5th in the league (1st at Liverpool)

But he is not their playmaker? Van Dijk isn't even close in this stat, nor would you expect him to be.
 
Key passes for game, Trent Alexander Arnold:

24/25 - 10th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
23/24 - 8th in the league (2nd at Liverpool behind Robertson)
22/23 - 11th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
21/22 - 2nd in the league (1st at Liverpool)
20/21 - 6th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
19/20 - 5th in the league (1st at Liverpool)

But he is not their playmaker? Van Dijk isn't even close in this stat, nor would you expect him to be.

He is a really unique player and they will miss him dearly if he leaves. Not only does he create a lot of chances - either directly via his crossing or via the "hockey assist" pass of putting somebody through who then is in position to make a killer pass - he often does this from positions that would be non-threatening with the ball at the feet of another player. He makes pinpoint long passes in transition in spots where 99% of other fullbacks would either overhit or (more likely) just recycle the ball and he makes dangerous crosses from deep areas where the defense is accustomed to letting fullbacks have more time on the ball.

Its one thing to have a player who is good at chance creation out of situations that are inherently dangerous. Its another kind of weapon to have a player that creates chances out of situations that are generally not threatening. And this has knock on effects for the entire side. They can play three midfielders who aren't high level creators because they're getting chance generation out of the fullback role. And defenses have to adjust to account for Trent in ways that spread their second line wider, opening up more space in the middle.

I think he'll be devastating in Madrid with the speed and quality they have in the forward line.
 
Key passes for game, Trent Alexander Arnold:

24/25 - 10th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
23/24 - 8th in the league (2nd at Liverpool behind Robertson)
22/23 - 11th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
21/22 - 2nd in the league (1st at Liverpool)
20/21 - 6th in the league (1st at Liverpool)
19/20 - 5th in the league (1st at Liverpool)

But he is not their playmaker? Van Dijk isn't even close in this stat, nor would you expect him to be.

To be fair, key passing stats aren't the same as the playmaking which Pexbo is attributing towards VVD. Both are crucial to Liverpool in that sense (playmaking) but for different reasons.
 
Let's hope all these contract talks derails their season, fans are already getting angry.
 
To be fair, key passing stats aren't the same as the playmaking which Pexbo is attributing towards VVD. Both are crucial to Liverpool in that sense (playmaking) but for different reasons.
Exactly. I’ve already conceded he has a world class delivery and that’s going to reflect in key pass stats.

He has next to no impact on their control of play, recycling of the ball, tempo setting etc etc.

He’s just a world class crosser / Hollywood passer that speculates a tonne.
 
Exactly. I’ve already conceded he has a world class delivery and that’s going to reflect in key pass stats.

He has next to no impact on their control of play, recycling of the ball, tempo setting etc etc.

He’s just a world class crosser / Hollywood passer that speculates a tonne.
He has the third most touches in the team after Van Dijk and Gravenberch. Was the same last year. In 22/23 and 21/22, he had most touches, 20/21 he had second most touches, 19/20 he had most touches. So in that timeframe, never less than third most involved player on the ball, often the most involved, and getting that many key passes. So he doesn't spectate, he is involved in their play a lot - aka playmaker.
 
Exactly. I’ve already conceded he has a world class delivery and that’s going to reflect in key pass stats.

He has next to no impact on their control of play, recycling of the ball, tempo setting etc etc.

He’s just a world class crosser / Hollywood passer that speculates a tonne.

He may not be that involved in controlling play (few FBs really are unless they're inverting like a Zinchenko) but he is very heavily involved in springing their transitions, which is a huge part of their game. Both the ability to play through balls or balls over the top to Salah, especially quickly after a turnover in Liverpool's half, and the threat of doing that (which gives other sides pause about attacking in numbers) are really important to Liverpool's play. Its not just his crossing.
 
Surely even the most rabid Liverpool fan can understand Real Madrid and Barcelona have a mystique and reputation on a different stratosphere to Liverpool?
TAA would be mad to pass up the chance of getting there for free. There's no chance in hell either would be after him if he was a 50-60m man.
 
Surely even the most rabid Liverpool fan can understand Real Madrid and Barcelona have a mystique and reputation on a different stratosphere to Liverpool?
TAA would be mad to pass up the chance of getting there for free. There's no chance in hell either would be after him if he was a 50-60m man.
On top of that aren’t FSG not giving him the bump he wants? With his age and what he’s done for the club for 7-8 years it’s not creating a terrible precedent for new signings considering how faithful, productive he has been for their champions league and premier league win (first in how many years for them)
 
It’s crazy that Liverpool may have to let him go on a free.
Mind you he has been there 20 years and can’t begrudge him a huge contract somewhere else if the club haven’t got him to sign a new contract.
Is probably a £50-60m player and at a good age.
 
He has the third most touches in the team after Van Dijk and Gravenberch. Was the same last year. In 22/23 and 21/22, he had most touches, 20/21 he had second most touches, 19/20 he had most touches. So in that timeframe, never less than third most involved player on the ball, often the most involved, and getting that many key passes. So he doesn't spectate, he is involved in their play a lot - aka playmaker.
He said “speculates” not “spectate” (though he does the latter occasionally, which has cost goals).
 
On top of that aren’t FSG not giving him the bump he wants? With his age and what he’s done for the club for 7-8 years it’s not creating a terrible precedent for new signings considering how faithful, productive he has been for their champions league and premier league win (first in how many years for them)
Even if they waggle a huge wage, he's 26 now, and signing on again for Liverpool probably kills the chance of getting to Madrid dead.

He's stated his (hilarious) aim of winning a Ballon d'or and he'll know the chance of that at Liverpool matches United's chances of coming top 4 this season. Whereas going to Madrid takes it up a slight notch.
 
Put it this way: if he'd been playing for us all these years, with that level of performance and impact, the discourse around him would be "is he going to be the greatest right back ever" vs "is he already the greatest right back ever"

At Liverpool, it's "but he can't defend"

Disagree on him being a much lesser Marcelo, too. Think he's at that level
That’s some gross overrating of TAA IMO. Fantastic with the ball at feet but suspect otherwise.
 
That’s some gross overrating of TAA IMO. Fantastic with the ball at feet but suspect otherwise.
Again, Marcelo was the same. He's a legend now and widely considered one of the very best LWB the game has ever seen
 
It’s crazy that Liverpool may have to let him go on a free.
Mind you he has been there 20 years and can’t begrudge him a huge contract somewhere else if the club haven’t got him to sign a new contract.
Is probably a £50-60m player and at a good age.
Not much Liverpool can do.
 
Again, Marcelo was the same. He's a legend now and widely considered one of the very best LWB the game has ever seen
The only similarity they have is they are wing/full backs albeit play on different sides of the pitch. Their style of play could not be more different.
 
Will scouse thugs be threatening him like they did with Gerrard to get him to stay?
Whilst i get the point, some United fans did the same to Rooney when it was rumored he was going to City.
 
Will scouse thugs be threatening him like they did with Gerrard to get him to stay?
I was wondering about that myself. I guess he's not as important to them as Gerrard was. Back then he was all they had. They've more world class players now.

Plus Gerrard wanted to move to Chelsea in Mourinho's first stint. That's not far from a direct move to us!